what green dots?
Posts: 3,157 
October 12th, 2006, 07:50 AM
Canadian Wheat Board asks Ottawa to withdraw partial gag order
Canadian Press
Published: Wednesday, October 11, 2006
Canadian Wheat Board asks Ottawa to withdraw partial gag order
Canadian Press
Published: Wednesday, October 11, 2006
Quote:
stifle yourself, Edith.
WINNIPEG (CP) - The Canadian Wheat Board wants the federal government to withdraw a partial gag order that prevents the board from lobbying in support of its monopoly.
Adrian Measner, the board's chief executive officer, says the order creates an uneven playing field because there's nothing to stop the government from promoting its plan to open the board up to competition.
Agriculture Minister Chuck Strahl formed a committee last month to recommend ways to end the board's monopoly in western Canadian wheat and barley sales.
Last week, the government issued an order directing the board not to pay for any advertising, publishing or market research that supports retaining its monopoly.
The order also bans the board from paying a third party to lobby on its behalf.
Board chairman Ken Ritter says the wheat board hasn't funded any kind of lobbying since early September because it is in the midst of elections for half its board of directors.
Adrian Measner, the board's chief executive officer, says the order creates an uneven playing field because there's nothing to stop the government from promoting its plan to open the board up to competition.
Agriculture Minister Chuck Strahl formed a committee last month to recommend ways to end the board's monopoly in western Canadian wheat and barley sales.
Last week, the government issued an order directing the board not to pay for any advertising, publishing or market research that supports retaining its monopoly.
The order also bans the board from paying a third party to lobby on its behalf.
Board chairman Ken Ritter says the wheat board hasn't funded any kind of lobbying since early September because it is in the midst of elections for half its board of directors.
© The Canadian Press 2006
October 14th, 2006, 08:23 AM
OH, say it isn't so, is this the death throws of the "marketing board" system in Canada?
Please don't tease me, I was getting used to seeing milk flow by me while fishing in my favourite stream. All because some dairy farmer did not want to be penelized for over production.
The artificial inflation of the cost of wheat, eggs, milk and some produce has long since ment good business and job security for our socialist elite.
OH, say it isn't so, is this the death throws of the "marketing board" system in Canada?
Please don't tease me, I was getting used to seeing milk flow by me while fishing in my favourite stream. All because some dairy farmer did not want to be penelized for over production.
The artificial inflation of the cost of wheat, eggs, milk and some produce has long since ment good business and job security for our socialist elite.
October 14th, 2006, 09:33 AM
In the global use of wheat, it can be argued that the wheat board is useful, but if you simplify the issue, its existance does not bolster a free enterprise ideology.
Quoting BitWhys
True enough for the wheat pool, but the other marketing boards keep prices artificialy inflated, no?
Not that your question is to the point either, but I haven't seen anything to disprove the basic economics of the arrangement. Most of the feedback I get is just a rather predictable collection of moralisms.
In the global use of wheat, it can be argued that the wheat board is useful, but if you simplify the issue, its existance does not bolster a free enterprise ideology.
what green dots?
Posts: 3,157
October 16th, 2006, 05:12 AM
I'm not overly impressed with the free market ideology as it is. If the lowest possible price is society's end-game then WalMart is pretty well all we have to look forward to. Appealling to it as a justification for muzzling the Wheat Board doesn't make it any more attractive.
I'm not overly impressed with the free market ideology as it is. If the lowest possible price is society's end-game then WalMart is pretty well all we have to look forward to. Appealling to it as a justification for muzzling the Wheat Board doesn't make it any more attractive.
what green dots?
Posts: 3,157
October 16th, 2006, 05:14 AM
I'm not overly impressed with the free market ideology as it is. Appealling to it as a justification for muzzling the Wheat Board doesn't make it any more attractive. If the lowest possible price is society's end-game then WalMart is pretty well all we have to look forward to. In this particular case when it comes to pricing in the global scheme of things there are certainly bigger fish to fry. Judging by the "national debate" on the issue so far the Wheat Board has already been dragged out of the pool for filleting and the rest of the situation isn't even a factor.
I'm not overly impressed with the free market ideology as it is. Appealling to it as a justification for muzzling the Wheat Board doesn't make it any more attractive. If the lowest possible price is society's end-game then WalMart is pretty well all we have to look forward to. In this particular case when it comes to pricing in the global scheme of things there are certainly bigger fish to fry. Judging by the "national debate" on the issue so far the Wheat Board has already been dragged out of the pool for filleting and the rest of the situation isn't even a factor.
Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 4,995 
Location: Florida, Hurricane Central
Location: Florida, Hurricane Central
October 16th, 2006, 05:10 PM
The question is if its so wonderful, why not have it for all goods? Why just for farming?
It is difficult to argue that the marketing board system is not an inefficient mechanism that merely transfers wealth to farmers at the expense of everyone else. And the people whom are hurt most by it are the poor since the poor spend a higher percentage of discretionary income on food. Perhaps over the long run, the Wheat Board and the world supply of wheat levels out, but it certainly isn't the case for dairy. All you have to do is cross the border and compare prices of milk and cheese to see it in action.
It is not hard to see why marketing boards are so distorting.
If the price is set above the clearing price, then the deadweight loss to society is that upper triangle that borders the top horizontal line, running from the demand and supply curves to point P*.
The two arguments for marketing boards are that they reduce volatility and increase market power for the farmer, the latter being a more credible argument. Volatility can be reduced for the farmer by selling forward in the futures market. And farmers - if they wish - could join sellers groups to increase their market power.
My question to the Left is this - if a person has the freedom to get an abortion, why doesn't a person have the freedom to sell his own product?
Quoting BitWhys
I haven't seen anything to prove it either.
Not that your question is to the point either, but I haven't seen anything to disprove the basic economics of the arrangement. Most of the feedback I get is just a rather predictable collection of moralisms.
The question is if its so wonderful, why not have it for all goods? Why just for farming?
It is difficult to argue that the marketing board system is not an inefficient mechanism that merely transfers wealth to farmers at the expense of everyone else. And the people whom are hurt most by it are the poor since the poor spend a higher percentage of discretionary income on food. Perhaps over the long run, the Wheat Board and the world supply of wheat levels out, but it certainly isn't the case for dairy. All you have to do is cross the border and compare prices of milk and cheese to see it in action.
It is not hard to see why marketing boards are so distorting.
If the price is set above the clearing price, then the deadweight loss to society is that upper triangle that borders the top horizontal line, running from the demand and supply curves to point P*.
The two arguments for marketing boards are that they reduce volatility and increase market power for the farmer, the latter being a more credible argument. Volatility can be reduced for the farmer by selling forward in the futures market. And farmers - if they wish - could join sellers groups to increase their market power.
My question to the Left is this - if a person has the freedom to get an abortion, why doesn't a person have the freedom to sell his own product?
October 16th, 2006, 05:16 PM
I understand your position now, thanx for the clarification and education. It's more the "gag order" that has your attention.
In hind sight, I can see the unfair practice of that action.
Quoting BitWhys
I'm not overly impressed with the free market ideology as it is. Appealling to it as a justification for muzzling the Wheat Board doesn't make it any more attractive. If the lowest possible price is society's end-game then WalMart is pretty well all we have to look forward to. In this particular case when it comes to pricing in the global scheme of things there are certainly bigger fish to fry. Judging by the "national debate" on the issue so far the Wheat Board has already been dragged out of the pool for filleting and the rest of the situation isn't even a factor.
I understand your position now, thanx for the clarification and education. It's more the "gag order" that has your attention.
In hind sight, I can see the unfair practice of that action.
just special
Posts: 1,226
Location: not in Kansas anymore
Location: not in Kansas anymore
October 16th, 2006, 06:25 PM
The gag order is to keep the wheat board from spending millions of our dollars on an advertising campaign to justify thier existence. Hopefully the farmers ultimately decide for themselves,without being tossed in jail this time.
The gag order is to keep the wheat board from spending millions of our dollars on an advertising campaign to justify thier existence. Hopefully the farmers ultimately decide for themselves,without being tossed in jail this time.
what green dots?
Posts: 3,157
October 17th, 2006, 04:43 AM
Not that I mean to cherry-pick, but afa the first question goes, in a lot of ways, we do. There's certainly no shortage of oligarchicy within the industrial system. I suspect there are few products that reach the retail market without being influenced by the few somewhere in the supply chain. Its probably just not as obvious since their existence only requires unknowing cooperation, not deliberate organization.
Besides, what's left of the plutocrats will tell you if you're going to guarantee anything about a society a solid and diverse agricultural base is the place to start and these days I'm not one to disagree with them. Its not like people are abandoning the suburbs to take advantage of the killer farm programs. Not as individuals, anyways.
afa the last question goes, hell's bells if they really want to be "entrepenuers" then let 'em but I say they should have a well-informed debate on the issue followed by a plebicite instead of squeezing in an also-ran campaign promise so they can't go bitching they got shafted 15 years down the road when Big Business has grown to dominate the industry and the real subsidies kick in.
Quoting Toro
Hey Toros,
...
The question is if its so wonderful, why not have it for all goods? Why just for farming?...
...
My question to the Left is this - if a person has the freedom to get an abortion, why doesn't a person have the freedom to sell his own product?
The question is if its so wonderful, why not have it for all goods? Why just for farming?...
...
My question to the Left is this - if a person has the freedom to get an abortion, why doesn't a person have the freedom to sell his own product?
Not that I mean to cherry-pick, but afa the first question goes, in a lot of ways, we do. There's certainly no shortage of oligarchicy within the industrial system. I suspect there are few products that reach the retail market without being influenced by the few somewhere in the supply chain. Its probably just not as obvious since their existence only requires unknowing cooperation, not deliberate organization.
Besides, what's left of the plutocrats will tell you if you're going to guarantee anything about a society a solid and diverse agricultural base is the place to start and these days I'm not one to disagree with them. Its not like people are abandoning the suburbs to take advantage of the killer farm programs. Not as individuals, anyways.
afa the last question goes, hell's bells if they really want to be "entrepenuers" then let 'em but I say they should have a well-informed debate on the issue followed by a plebicite instead of squeezing in an also-ran campaign promise so they can't go bitching they got shafted 15 years down the road when Big Business has grown to dominate the industry and the real subsidies kick in.
what green dots?
Posts: 3,157
October 17th, 2006, 04:48 AM
Quoting wallyj
I'll assume that's not to say it isn't a gag order.
The gag order is to keep the wheat board from spending millions of our dollars on an advertising campaign to justify thier existence. Hopefully the farmers ultimately decide for themselves,without being tossed in jail this time.
Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 4,995
Location: Florida, Hurricane Central
Location: Florida, Hurricane Central
October 17th, 2006, 11:07 AM
I was looking at this on Google for a minute this morning. There were several economic studies done on the Wheat Board from 1993-1998. I didn't look at them but my guess is that you'll find support and criticism for the Wheat Board. My bet is that you'd find much less support for dairy.
Wheat and dairy have different dynamics since most of Canada's dairy production is consumed internally while wheat is exported. Thus, because wheat is more exposed to the world price while dairy is not, dairy will extract more economic rent from consumers.
I was looking at this on Google for a minute this morning. There were several economic studies done on the Wheat Board from 1993-1998. I didn't look at them but my guess is that you'll find support and criticism for the Wheat Board. My bet is that you'd find much less support for dairy.
Wheat and dairy have different dynamics since most of Canada's dairy production is consumed internally while wheat is exported. Thus, because wheat is more exposed to the world price while dairy is not, dairy will extract more economic rent from consumers.
