As requested, Canadian Poverty v. Foreign Aid

[LittleRunningGag]

Old'nUgly requested a thread split on this topic. A discussion about comments made by Jon, regarding foreign aid:

Canadian tax dollars should be spent on solving poverty in Canada. When the issue of poverty is solved in Canada, I will have no problem with giving out money to other countries.

Who's definition of poverty, Jon? By the Ethiopian definition, every Canadian lives like a king, even the homeless ones. Or do we have one definition for Canadians, and one definition for the rest of the world.

 

[JonB2004]

RE: As requested, Canadia

I really don't have a problem giving out foreign aid, seriously. But I think that we need to focus a bit more on the problem here at home with the rising amount of homeless people and the amount of low-income families. My family has lived on welfare. Its not enough. It needs to be increased so that families can make ends meet.

 

[DurkaDurka]

RE: As requested, Canadia

I suggest that instead of giving people more "welfare" that we instead spend money on training these people to have some sort of skill. Welfare is supposed to be a short term fix for people down on their luck, not a career.

 

[LittleRunningGag]

RE: As requested, Canadia

Exactly. Innovation is always better than simply proping up a broken system with more money.

 

[JonB2004]

RE: As requested, Canadia

Yes, the government could spend the money to reduce tuition fees so that people could go to university and have a career.

 

[DurkaDurka]

Re: RE: As requested, Canadia

Yes, the government could spend the money to reduce tuition fees so that people could go to university and have a career.

All the things you suggest equate to tax hikes. I had to take student loans to for my college, like lots of people do. Also, you don't need to go to a university to have a career.

 

[missile]

If, as I have read, 90% of the world's people have no access to computors, phones[no electricity].. then we cannot declare our nation a poor one. The current government position on foreign aid seems to me to be the correct one; withholding funds to certain nation states for political purposes[as in Palestine].

 

[LittleRunningGag]

RE: As requested, Canadia

Like I said, considering the fact that every Canadian has access to clean drinking water and at least one meal a day (soup kitchens), every Canadian is better off than the average African. There are people in the world that never see a drop of clean drinking water in their lives. Who is more deserving of aid?

 

[Finder]

I like the former Conservative PM of Ontario, Mike Harris plan on "Workfare". However the plain as it was proposed was flawed as the jobs which these people were going to do were under paid with little to no training and undesirable by any companties. I think taking Mike Harrises plan and changing it slightly to make it more of a co-op with large private and public corperations of 10-20 hours a week of actual work in an enviroment which will train these people and give them skills (instead of things like garbage picker), and have then do workshops and job training and searching for at least another 20 hours a week would work a lot better then Harris's orginal plan and the current system we have now. However with that plan I think Welfare should be raised and things like single mothers and disabilities should be looked into of course.

Of course many extreme right wingers and Union leaders will be against this plan. But I think a strong PM would push it threw anyways.


Edit:

On aiding other nations..... I believe Canada should take care of itself first but we should donate a certain amount of our welth to the right projects around the world. But we should try to keep track of the funds and how the funds are being used and how well they work. We just can throw money into the air and go (AID) and then feel good about ourselve and not see whats happening with that money. But yeah we should give somewhere around 1% GDP as aid.

 

[JonB2004]

Re: RE: As requested, Canadia

Like I said, considering the fact that every Canadian has access to clean drinking water and at least one meal a day (soup kitchens), every Canadian is better off than the average African. There are people in the world that never see a drop of clean drinking water in their lives. Who is more deserving of aid?

Well, it is quite obvious that the Africans are more deserving of aid. But I hate to see low-income people in one of the richest countries in the world. I'm sure no country will ever be poverty-free, but we can at least attempt to further reduce it in Canada. Think about it like this. If the government invests money to massively reduce poverty in Canada, there will be more people off social assistance, and working paying taxes to the government. That means that the money being used on social assistance and all the new tax dollars could be used for foreign aid.

 

[notme01]

There are people in the world that never see a drop of clean drinking water in their lives. Who is more deserving of aid?

CANADIAN FIRST yes we have people in Canada that are called street people and do not have the pleasure of clean water or a roof over their heads because our government and fellow citizens are too busy in being good samaratins (hypocrites) to other nations or even immigrants to our country to show off that they can do it at the expense of our POORS

 

[LittleRunningGag]

RE: As requested, Canadia

Bullspit! There are water fountains in every major city (where the homeless tend to be) delivering clean drinking water to everyone. There are shelters and soup kitchens everywhere.

So most of our homeless population can get at least one meal a day, clean drinking water, and shelter for the night.

Explain why Canadian citizens deserve our aid more. What makes Canadians so much more important (better) than people living in much poorer areas of the world?

 

[notme01]

because we are in this country and it is our fellow citizens that are in need that is more than enought for me

charity begin at home

 

[I think not]

Re: RE: As requested, Canadia

Explain why Canadian citizens deserve our aid more. What makes Canadians so much more important (better) than people living in much poorer areas of the world?

I mean really your reasoning could be applied in reverse. I would venture to guess Canadians should be taken care of simply by virtue of contributing directly into your society.

In addition much of the assistance in Canada I assume will go to people that will eventually stand on their own two feet, whereas in Africa (only an example) much of the aid is "LOST" and very little of it gets to where it's supposed to go and for iits intended purpose.

 

[notme01]

well said i think not

 

[I think not]

Let me just clarify something, I think it is to the best interest of everyone to help impoverished countries, but the entire "system" needs a major overhaul, as it stands now, international aid is a big bureaucracy more intent on keeping itself going than helping the poor. That is that sad truth of it.

And there are positive results from international aid.

 

[notme01]

And there are positive results from international aid.

wow where and when did it happen and at what expenses of the giving country

 

[I think not]

There are positive results, you can see it with the amount of clean drinking water available today compared to 10 years ago. Again though, most of the money is "lost". If you are interested to learn a bit more about it in depth, you can read: The Lords of Poverty by Graham Hancock, it's a bit outdated but definately still applicable.

 

[notme01]

i will look up that book but i still say charity begins at home

 

[Nikki]

Re: RE: As requested, Canadia

Yes, the government could spend the money to reduce tuition fees so that people could go to university and have a career.

They already pay for more then half the tutition. There are always ways to get money for school. If you are living on welfare you would probably qualify for student loans and fanancial aid scholorships. If you are going to go this route make sure you actually make a career for yourself or you will never be able to pay back your loan money.

As for the government spending more money hear at home I do tend to agree with you that the government needs to spend more money at home. However I also think that helping other countries is important and I think we could help out more.I guess the question I must ask myself is "When do we say the government has spent enough?" I no matter what there will always be someone who says "The government does not spend enough."

I agree with LRG, our homeless people in Canada live much better then people in Africa. At least here in Canada they have access to clean drinking water and one meal a day.