'A national disgrace'

I think not

Hall of Fame Member
Apr 12, 2005
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Canadian Press
Published: Monday, July 03, 2006

Furious veterans are renewing their demands that the National War Memorial be guarded to protect it against "disgusting" assaults after young men were caught urinating on it during Canada Day festivities.

A retired major snapped digital pictures of several people relieving themselves on the monument around 11 p.m. on Saturday, as thousands poured into the streets following the fireworks.

Most cheered and laughed when they were photographed using the memorial as a toilet on the nation's birthday.

"I think it's a national disgrace," said Dr. Michael Pilon, 63, a retired major with the Royal Canadian Dental Corps.

"It's absolutely disgusting -- absolutely disgusting," said Bob Butt, the director of communications for the Royal Canadian Legion.

"The tomb is a sacred place, the area surrounding it is consecrated as a graveyard. It's the same as if you went in and urinated on someone's grave."

The offending photos will serve as ammunition to renew the Legion's fight to protect the monument, he vowed.

Since the Unknown Soldier's remains were repatriated from France in 2000, the Legion has repeatedly asked the RCMP and city police to post guards at the memorial, at least in the summer when there is more activity on the streets, Mr. Butt said.

They were told there is not enough manpower to do so. Police patrolling the general area are supposed to keep an eye on the monument, but the perpetrators are usually long gone by the time police arrive to deal with any problems.

Dr. Pilon has also contacted several politicians and government agencies to ask that the National War Memorial be protected, to no avail.

Last year on Canada Day, he observed many people sitting and drinking on the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier, but when he reminded them about the young soldier's grave, most were apologetic.

He noticed things becoming rowdier late at night, with several people pouring drinks on the tomb in a misguided, intoxicated tribute to the man lying below.

In early June, Dr. Pilon sent e-mails to the offices of Premier Dalton McGuinty, Mayor Bob Chiarelli, the National Capital Commission and others, identifying himself as a veteran and requesting someone guard the memorial this year.

He got no response.

Although he was "very offended" by those he caught urinating on the monument, he is more angry about the lack of action from politicians.

"You're not going to be able to control how many drunks there are out there, but keep them away from the area and have a (security) presence," Dr. Pilon said, suggesting the memorial should be cordoned off with a small fence and a plaque to explain the significance of the site.

Les Peate, 77, a Korean War veteran and the national president of the Korea Veterans Association, said ignorant behaviour is an unfortunate exception to the "pretty overwhelming" respect younger generations typically show for veterans.

"I feel very sorry that there are just a few of these idiots, a very small minority, doing this," he said.

Mr. Peate was part of the committee responsible for bringing home the remains of the Unknown Soldier. Although there was some concern at the time about placing the tomb in such an exposed downtown location, he has not heard of any problems with it until now.

"It's really saying something for our society if there's a need to put police there around the clock," he said.

The photos of the young men urinating were captured the same day Prime Minister Stephen Harper and Gov. Gen. Michaelle Jean attended a wreath-laying ceremony -- the first held at the War Memorial on Canada Day -- marking the 90th anniversary of the battles of the Somme and Beaumont-Hamel.

Mr. Harper described the ceremony as "very, very moving," and paid special tribute to the Canadian troops currently serving in Afghanistan.

"We want a special remembrance for them today because, obviously, they're probably doing more to make Canada proud these days than any group of Canadians," he said.

Sgt. Monique Beauchamp, a spokeswoman for the RCMP, said the force works in partnership with Ottawa police and the various government agencies who organize Canada Day to patrol the festivities, but there are no specific measures to protect the war memorial.

"I wish we could be everywhere and take care of every single incident, but the important part is to make sure people have a safe place to enjoy the fireworks and then be on their way home safely," she said.

Attempts to reach the politicians and agencies contacted by Dr. Pilon were not successful last night.

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=dfaae499-b7ae-4f6d-8190-b1fed9077bdb&k=55262
 

DurkaDurka

Internet Lawyer
Mar 15, 2006
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That is a disgusting act, the guy actually had the nerve to strike a pose for the camera as well.

Perhaps they should electrify the base of it, that would teach these animals a lesson.
 

Simpleton

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Jun 17, 2006
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Re: RE: 'A national disgrace'

DurkaDurka said:
That is a disgusting act, the guy actually had the nerve to strike a pose for the camera as well.

Perhaps they should electrify the base of it, that would teach these animals a lesson.

Don't you watch that program on the Discovery Channel? Not enough current would travel up the urine stream to complete a circuit and shock the offender. Also, the urine stream is often lacking in continuity, so there would be very little chance of shocking your pee-pee (penis).

In other words... Myth Busted!
 

Champloo

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Jun 29, 2006
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Personally, I don't know why anyone would care. I can only hope that my grave is important enough to be peed on when I die.
 

#juan

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Aug 30, 2005
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It is not a "national disgrace"

We are talking about a few useless twats who obviously don't know, or care, what that memorial means to most Canadians. For every dickhead that wants to urinate on the memorial, there are a hundred thousand or so who want to keep it a sacred place where we remember those who died. These idiots should be locked up for a while and then be given toothbrushes and soap and water to clean up their mess.
 

Simpleton

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#juan said:
It is not a "national disgrace"!

We are talking about a few useless twats who obviously don't know, or care, what that memorial means to most Canadians. For every dickhead that wants to urinate on the memorial, there are a hundred thousand or so who want to keep it a sacred place where we remember those who died. These idiots should be locked up for a while and then be given toothbrushes and soap and water to clean up their mess.

I agree. I wouldn't lock the bastards up in jail though. That would be letting them off easy.

Anybody caught urinating on the monument, should be sentenced to one year of clean up detail. They should have to spend sixteen hours every weekend for an entire year, cleaning the monument by hand. That's two eight hour days every weekend. With no hoses, power washers, or anything else that would make the job easier.

As for me, the only national monument I've ever urinated on, was an ATM machine at a Canada Trust branch. :lol:
 

#juan

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Aug 30, 2005
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When Diefenbaker scrapped the Arrow

I promised myself I would piss on him or his grave wherever it was. Alas, I haven't done it yet. There was a new statue of Dief in the Parliament building grounds when my wife and I were there two years ago. I thought that would be a reasonable proxy but I never got around to it. :wink: :lol:

Peeing on an ATM machine is a more than reasonable response. :p
 

Simpleton

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#juan said:
When Diefenbaker scrapped the Arrow

I promised myself I would piss on him or his grave wherever it was. Alas, I haven't done it yet. There was a new statue of Dief in the Parliament building grounds when my wife and I were there two years ago. I thought that would be a reasonable proxy but I never got around to it. :wink: :lol:

Peeing on an ATM machine is a more than reasonable response. :p

Don't know how reasonable it was, but it was there... and I did have to pee...
 

tamarin

House Member
Jun 12, 2006
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"These idiots should be locked up for a while and then be given toothbrushes and soap and water to clean up their mess."
I could go for that. The goofs involved are not representative of the great majority of Canadians who are mindful of and thankful for what the memorial represents.
 

Dexter Sinister

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Oct 1, 2004
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A few morons pissing on a monument is hardly a national disgrace. It's just a few morons pissing on a monument. A disgraceful act, certainly, by disgraceful and disgusting people who oughta be pissed on themselves, but it's not like all 30-something million of us pissed on it. That would be a national disgrace.

I've spent several very thoughtful hours on two occasions at that monument, reflecting on the reasons why it exists, and I'd hate to see it cordoned off and/or a security detail around it that prevents access. People need to be able to walk around it, touch it, feel it, sit in its shadow and contemplate the events that put it there. That's why it's there. Morons we will always have with us, and if that monument becomes no longer accessible to us because of them, it just means the morons win.

I'd *really* hate that.
 

Kreskin

Doctor of Thinkology
Feb 23, 2006
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This is bloody silly. The Legion wants to to protect the monument. With what, a garden hose? For crying out loud, lighten up. I'm sure the boys at the legion have a few drunken stories of their own.
 

I think not

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Apr 12, 2005
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Dexter Sinister said:
A few morons pissing on a monument is hardly a national disgrace. It's just a few morons pissing on a monument. A disgraceful act, certainly, by disgraceful and disgusting people who oughta be pissed on themselves, but it's not like all 30-something million of us pissed on it. That would be a national disgrace.

I've spent several very thoughtful hours on two occasions at that monument, reflecting on the reasons why it exists, and I'd hate to see it cordoned off and/or a security detail around it that prevents access. People need to be able to walk around it, touch it, feel it, sit in its shadow and contemplate the events that put it there. That's why it's there. Morons we will always have with us, and if that monument becomes no longer accessible to us because of them, it just means the morons win.

I'd *really* hate that.

Bravo Dex, very well said, as usual.
 

Mogz

Council Member
Jan 26, 2006
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Personally, I don't know why anyone would care. I can only hope that my grave is important enough to be peed on when I die.

There are those of us in society that care because that large chunk of cold stone, and the remains of the man burried at it's base, represent the huge sacrifice the men and women of generations before us have made for this Nation. Anyone that has ever been to Ottawa, and stood in the shadow of this massive tribute to courage, honour, and dedication to duty, cannot help but be moved by the poignant act of remembrace it implies. Then again, the same people who would urinate on such a symbol, would probably have no idea what i'm talking about. I myself could never, even for large sums of money, deface a representation such as the National War Memorial. How could I? I would in essence be urinating on the memory of the men who died defending this Nation from American incursion in 1812. The men who died walking the sunbaked landscape of The Free Orange State of South Africa in 1900. The lads who were mowed down by German Machinegun fire at Ypres, The Somme, Vimy Ridge, and Passchendaele. The boys who went ashore at Dieppe and were massacred, the ones who landed in Sicily, the ones who patrolled the Atlantic, and the ones who jumped in to Normandy in 1944. The Patricia's who fought off hordes of Chinese at Kapyong during the Korean Conflict. The countless men and women who've served overseas, Peacekeeping, Peacemaking, or some hybrid thereof; from The Golan Heights to Cyprus, from Vietnam to Somalia, from Rwanda to Bosnia. Even today, the men and women who're serving half-way around the World in Afghanistan, putting their lives on the line for an ungrateful Nation that doesn't understand why they're doing what they're doing. Most importantly, for me at least, those boys who haven't come home from Afghanistan, or if they did, missing limbs, that I know well; MCpl Paul Franklin, and Cpl Randy Payne (rest in peace). How could I sully a piece of Canadian heritage? I couldn't, nor can I abide individuals who do, who live under the blanket of the very freedom and liberty that those who've fallen have provided. Over 100,000 Canadian men and women have been killed in the service of this Great Nation, and they deserve to rest in peace, not have some ingrates pissing on our show of remembrance to them.

Before I close, a little anecdote about urination on a memorial. Last fall, I was in Kingston on a course for a few months. I'd just returned from Afghanistan, and the memory of serving in a war zone and seeing coalition members blow to pieces was still very fresh in my memory. Myself and a fellow course mate, ran in to another buddy (from a previous course) at Smijies Bar in Kingston. He was loaded, dangerously so. We decided to help him back to the base (getting a cab was impossible), so we started the long walk from Princess Street. At one point, you cross a bridge over a part of the Rideau Canal, and directly on the other side is the Royal Military College of Canada. Jutting out on a peninsula is a memorial for all RMC graduates who have been killed in the line of duty. My buddy (from the previous course) declared is intention to urinate on the monument. I was appaled, as was my friend, considering all three of us were soldiers. The 3rd soldier became adament that he was going to "piss all over that f.ucker". At first I thought he was jesting, but then it became clear he was going to do it. So I told him it wasn't happening. He became violent, and long story short I ended up beating down a good buddy (he was drunk so it wasn't too hard). We then drug him back to his barracks on the McNaughton side of the base and got him in to bed. The next day, around 2 in the afternoon, he called me and said he was sorry for how he acted. He had no idea what came over him, and couldn't fathom (now that he was sober) why he'd even think of defacing a war memorial. To my surprise he thanked me for beating the crap out of him, it "put things in perspective". While the whole situation isn't funny, it does go to show that alcohol CAN influence people to do stupid things. However, with that said, being drunk isn't a permit to act like a jerk, something my friend found out the hard way.
 

cdn_bc_ca

Electoral Member
May 5, 2005
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I'm not at all surprised that this happened... kids nowadays have no respect for anything except themselves. Canada is fast becoming a "me first" society.
 

Mogz

Council Member
Jan 26, 2006
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Re: RE: 'A national disgrace'

cdn_bc_ca said:
I'm not at all surprised that this happened... kids nowadays have no respect for anything except themselves. Canada is fast becoming a "me first" society.

How very true.
 

aeon

Council Member
Jan 17, 2006
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I don't see any problem with this, they didnt destroyed anything, peeing isnt dangerous, and more importantly those soldiers who are dead, fought for freedom, in fact they fought for the freedom of those who can pee where and when they want.


"It's absolutely disgusting -- absolutely disgusting," said Bob Butt, the director of communications for the Royal Canadian Legion.

Les Peate, 77, a Korean War veteran and the national president of the Korea Veterans Association, said ignorant behaviour is an unfortunate exception to the "pretty overwhelming" respect younger generations typically show for veterans.

"I feel very sorry that there are just a few of these idiots, a very small minority, doing this," he said.


I am sorry , but those who are ignorants and idiots, are those who support this stupid war on the witches, i mean terror, and supports war based on a lie, which is a real disgrace.