Ontario short changed $1.2 Billion in federal transfers


mentalfloss
#1
Ontario short changed $1.2 Billion in federal transfers

OTTAWA - A forthcoming new report from the parliamentary budget officer is expected to show Ottawa is shortchanging Ontario to the tune of $1.2 billion under the current system of equalization payments, The Canadian Press has learned.

The report on how the federal government provides financial support to the provinces and territories for such things as health and social programs appears to confirm what Ontario has long suspected — only more so.

The $1.2 billion figure was provided by a source familiar with the report, to be released Thursday, who provided details on condition of anonymity because the report had not yet been made public. Details of how the parliamentary budget office reached its conclusions were not immediately available.

During the election campaign that delivered Premier Kathleen Wynne a majority government last week, the provincial Liberals accused Ottawa of slashing Ontario's latest share of equalization payments by $641 million.

The Harper government has long insisted Ontario was receiving its fair share, based on the performance of the province's economy.

Finance Minister Joe Oliver, who happened to be taking part in a video teleconference Wednesday with his provincial counterparts, said he does not believe there's a fiscal imbalance.

The issue did not come up during the brief meeting, which was Oliver's first with the provincial finance ministers since he was named to the post in March. Disparities between provincial and federal numbers are often "exaggerated," he said.

"We just recently came to an agreement on those numbers; we're not cutting back," he added, noting that transfers had increased by 55 per cent to $65 billion since the federal Conservatives came to power in 2006.

Oliver described the meeting as cordial, even hinting that he was making peace with Ontario's Liberal government. While he may disagree with them on key economic issues, the voters have spoken, he said.

He did say, however, that he disagrees with Ontario's budget, which raises taxes and the province's already substantial $12.5-billion deficit, as well as a plan to create an add-on to the Canada Pension Plan.

"The new government ran on their budget, they were elected, they are entitled in a democracy to implement their platform," he said.

"We have a certain policy and maybe this isn't the time to emphasize differences."

Oliver related the same sentiment on the issue of CPP enhancement, saying if Ontario wants to go it alone Ottawa won't try to stop them, although he said he expressed reservations about what he estimated would be a $3.5-billion price tag.

Ontario and P.E.I. have lead a provincial push to enhance the Canada Pension Plan, but the federal government has said the economy is too weak to saddle employees and employers with higher premiums.

In an email response, Ontario Finance Minister Charles Sousa said he plans to go ahead with the plan that was endorsed by the voters on June 12.

"We hope that they come to the table on a transit strategy, investment in the Ring of Fire (mineral extraction project in northern Ontario) and retirement income security," he said.

Harper government ministers have been critical of Ontario's Liberal government in the past — particularly during the latest campaign.

Oliver went so far as to say deficits and debt levels in Ontario and Quebec — Canada's two most populous provinces — were holding back Canada's economic growth.

He made clear, however, that his government intends to go in a different direction by lowering taxes, likely starting next year after it tables the first surplus budget in almost a decade.

"After we balance the budget the No. 1 priority will be further tax relief," he said. "(Canadians) understand that taxes stifle prosperity, hurt businesses and kill jobs."

The federal Conservatives are expected to introduce some form of income splitting for families with young children next year, fulfilling a 2011 campaign pledge to bring in the $2.5-billion tax relief measure once the deficit was eliminated.

PBO to show Ontario out $1.2B from transfers - Cranbrook Daily Townsman (external - login to view)
 
captain morgan
Bloc Québécois
#2
Ain't equalization grand?
 
petros
+1
#3
The same amount that was squandered.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#4
That's okay.... Ontario decides whether Harper stays in next election 'cuz Quebec doesn't want him. Na-na-na-naa Na-na-na-naa Hey-hey hey Good-bye
 
captain morgan
Bloc Québécois
#5
That'll fix everything
 
petros
#6
Will somebody else change the formula?

I'd gladly invest in a full 4 lane wide shoulder highway across Northern (it's actually western) Ontario. It would make for easy access to the multi pipeline oil and gas corridor built along side.

Incredible resources are sitting in waiting that could put things in the black for all of Canada but it's landlocked without decent infrastructure.
 
captain morgan
Bloc Québécois
+3
#7  Top Rated Post
Ontario needs to get off its *** and develop out the ring of fire resources... But in the meantime, I don't believe that anyone will have any luck re-gigging equalization. In fact, I believe the entire arrangement is coming to some kind of close in the near future. Getting it going again will require buy-in from all the provinces... I'm guessing that you'll see a lot of talk about each province standing up on it's own rather than continually expecting cash from the have provinces.

Hell, look at Ontario, probably the biggest net contributor and now can't catch a break, meanwhile, the BCs of the world piss and moan about economic development, vow to stall the development and pipeline process and still feel entitled to equalization
 
JLM
No Party Affiliation
+1
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

Will somebody else change the formula?

I'd gladly invest in a full 4 lane wide shoulder highway across Northern (it's actually western) Ontario. It would make for easy access to the multi pipeline oil and gas corridor built along side.

Incredible resources are sitting in waiting that could put things in the black for all of Canada but it's landlocked without decent infrastructure.

Yep, I think a lot of wealth could be unlocked in the Canadian Shield without disturbing a hell of a lot or buggering up the environment.
 
petros
+1
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morganView Post

Ontario needs to get off its *** and develop out the ring of fire resources... But in the meantime, I don't believe that anyone will have any luck re-gigging equalization. In fact, I believe the entire arrangement is coming to some kind of close in the near future. Getting it going again will require buy-in from all the provinces... I'm guessing that you'll see a lot of talk about each province standing up on it's own rather than continually expecting cash from the have provinces.

Hell, look at Ontario, probably the biggest net contributor and now can't catch a break, meanwhile, the BCs of the world piss and moan about economic development, vow to stall the development and pipeline process and still feel entitled to equalization

Allowing Provinces or residents to invest in each other without Feds getting in the way would be a good thing.

SPP paid 15.77% last year with an average of 8.91% over the last 5 years. I have no issues with someone from Nova Scotia investing in SK and making a great return. It spreads wealth within Canada and keeps wealth in Canada.
 
mentalfloss
#10
So I guess all those years Alberta was getting equalization payments, we should have just told the province to stfu if they didn't get their fair share for one year.
 
captain morgan
Bloc Québécois
#11
You are such a clown
 
mentalfloss
#12
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morganView Post

Ontario needs to get off its *** and develop out the ring of fire resources... But in the meantime, I don't believe that anyone will have any luck re-gigging equalization. In fact, I believe the entire arrangement is coming to some kind of close in the near future. Getting it going again will require buy-in from all the provinces... I'm guessing that you'll see a lot of talk about each province standing up on it's own rather than continually expecting cash from the have provinces.

Hell, look at Ontario, probably the biggest net contributor and now can't catch a break, meanwhile, the BCs of the world piss and moan about economic development, vow to stall the development and pipeline process and still feel entitled to equalization

The most populous part of Ontario balks at the idea of swampland and mosquitoes (who, this year, seem bigger and more vicious than in times past) because their world ends somewhere around Barrie. Another factor is in the people who were left alone on that useless tundra simply because it was of no use to the lumber barons of the day. Seems rather odd that the person doing constructive negotiation with the affected bands was so reviled by corporate Ontario
 
taxslave
No Party Affiliation
+3
#14
If Ontario hadn't destroyed their manufacturing industry they would not be in this position.
 
B00Mer
Republican
+3
#15
Ontario screws with Alberta and we may take former Alberta Premier Ralph Klein advise.

“Let the eastern bastards freeze in the dark.”


 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#16
Spoken from "Texas" with his tail between his legs
 
B00Mer
Republican
+1
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslaveView Post

If Ontario hadn't destroyed their manufacturing industry they would not be in this position.

That had a lot to do with Free Trade..

However, their tax rate for corporations, and cost of doing business in that province has pushed a lot of companies to other provinces or right out of the country.

Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

Spoken from "Texas" with his tail between his legs

Really, I own a few Canadian companies and building a restaurant in Alberta, Canada.

Most of my family currently live in Onterrible, and run successful small businesses.

Also, I was born in Onterrible..

So my opinion of Onterrible is valid.. more than others, that have never lived there, or have family living there.. and yes, sadly my family are all ultra Liberals... I keep trying to show them the errors of their ways...
 
taxslave
No Party Affiliation
+3
#18
Free trade could have been extremely good for Ontariowe if they had not been so greedy collectively. High taxes and fees by multiple layers of government, high unit labour costs brought on by out of tough unions and repressive environmental laws all added up to be non competitive. Much like sawmills in BC. It is possible to kill the goose that laid the golden egg.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#19
All you really have to do is read up on the Darlington Nuclear Power project to see how money was tossed about in Ontario. Right now, I can show you four grade separations around Lindsay - all built during 1960-62 - over empty railbeds. One of them separated Kent St (date stamped 1961) from a railway that, for all intents and purposes, became surplus with the opening of the St Lawrence Seaway

Quote: Originally Posted by B00MerView Post

That had a lot to do with Free Trade..

However, their tax rate for corporations, and cost of doing business in that province has pushed a lot of companies to other provinces or right out of the country.



Really, I own a few Canadian companies and building a restaurant in Alberta, Canada.

Most of my family currently live in Onterrible, and run successful small businesses.

Also, I was born in Onterrible..

So my opinion of Onterrible is valid.. more than others, that have never lived there, or have family living there.. and yes, sadly my family are all ultra Liberals... I keep trying to show them the errors of their ways...

Really, I don't care. You'd explode if I gave the long version
 
B00Mer
Republican
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

Really, I don't care. You'd explode if I gave the long version

nah, just wouldn't bother wasting my time on it... better things to do that read a long winded rant, blaming others for the problems created by the residents of Onterrible.
 
petros
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

So I guess all those years Alberta was getting equalization payments, we should have just told the province to stfu if they didn't get their fair share for one year.

Are you high?
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by B00MerView Post

nah, just wouldn't bother wasting my time on it... better things to do that read a long winded rant, blaming others for the problems created by the residents of Onterrible.

Yeah the residents. What end do you poop from?

JFYI: Harper was from Toronto
 
B00Mer
Republican
+1
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

Yeah the residents. What end do you poop from?

Yeah residents... who votes in the Government in power?? Or is Onterrible a Monarchy?



What you need to do is vote in a Government that is business friendly.

Friggin tax and spend liberal governments are sinking Onterrible.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#24
We had that - from 1943 to 1985 and from 1995 to 2003 - though to whose business they were friendly is anyone's guess. Hell, one of them was so business-friendly he sold provincial assets at dimes-for-dollar values
 
petros
#25
Who much is a pack of smokes in ON or a dozen beer?

Is there room?

$17 for a pack in MB.
 
Locutus
#26
a billion dollars is nothing, just ask mentalfloss.
 
petros
#27
Only 40 years to pay back @ $2 a year without interest.

Cheeeeeeeap.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#28
Dunno.... Don't drink and get smokes on rez
 
B00Mer
Republican
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

Dunno.... Don't drink and get smokes on rez



...and you promote tax evasion and are pissed when members criticize your Province.. you're part of the problem.

Nuff Said.
Last edited by B00Mer; Jun 19th, 2014 at 11:28 AM..
 
mentalfloss
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by LocutusView Post

a billion dollars is nothing, just ask mentalfloss.

It's about where that money is lost.

The gas plant scandal amounts to a minimal increase on hydro bills. These transfers could go toward investments into the economy.

If Whodat were in power, I'm sure he would frame it exactly the same way instead of being Harper's pawn.

Maybe that last but should have been in purple.
 
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