US living in 'fantasy land' over Iraq

Machjo

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 19, 2004
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I could see the US losing all its allies though. but I can also see it become a new kind of world leader afterwards as it realizes its mistakes and rejoins the world community of nations. After all, while half of americans are rednecks, many are also very progressive-minded. And if that group should rise up out of the ashes of Iraq in the end, the US could actually become a positive force for a renewed world community in the future. Your thoughts?
 

missile

House Member
Dec 1, 2004
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The signs seem to indicate that American civilization is in the decline that befalls all -the Greek,the Roman,the British. I don't see the destruction of America,tho.
 

Reverend Blair

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Apr 3, 2004
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RE: US living in 'fantasy

It depends what you mean by destruction. All of the imperialist countries of the past are still around. I don't think the US is suddenly going to break into pieces with parts joining Canada and parts becoming some sort of theocracy or something.

I think the US is headed for a major crash though...a failing of their economy driven by a world that no longer wants their dollar and is tired of their colonialism.

I do think that they will lose most of their influence on the world stage. Right now that influence is propped up by a huge economy and a huge military. The economy is in trouble though...massive debt, trade deficits, a reliance on old technologies for energy, etc. have put them in a position where they are very vulnerable.

The military simply cannot exist to the extent it presently does without the wealth that economy provides. How many military people are going to stick around without paycheques? How are all of those expensive programs and toys going to be paid for?

What would I like to see happen? Moving from free trade to real fair trade policies...using trade agreements to raise the standard of living in developing nations...would do a great deal to mitigate trade deficits. Getting rid of the massive subsidy programs would save billions every year. Developing alternative energies would free up billions to drive a real economy. The military, if it isn't out getting involved in every skirmish in every country where there's an oil well or pipeline, can be cut considerably.

So what do I think the US needs to do to save itself? Quit trying to be a 19th century unilateral imperial power and become a 21st century multilateral nation.
 

Rick van Opbergen

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Sep 16, 2004
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Reverend Blair said:
It depends what you mean by destruction. All of the imperialist countries of the past are still around. I don't think the US is suddenly going to break into pieces with parts joining Canada and parts becoming some sort of theocracy or something.
With "destruction" (maybe a bit over the top to use) I mean what you explained in the rest of your post; as in, major decline, moving from the world most powerful nation to a shadow to what it was.
 

Mooseskin Johnny

Electoral Member
Dec 23, 2004
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Because of the distortion of time, we tend to think that the Roman Empire fell quickly. Not true. The decline took a couple of centuries. Moreover, the church moved in and took its place.

The American decline probably started with Vietnam, but I don't expect to see the US collapse in my lifetime. I do expect to see the America I grew up in frittered away over time. There is a very real chance that full blown Fascism will replace American democracy. That will give the illusion of returning greatness, but will actually speed up the decline.