Trudeau’s nitrogen policy will decimate Canadian farming

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
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taxme

Time Out
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The original version of that is the Pope and the Queen. The Queen says "Watch, I can make every Englishperson in the crowd go mad with joy with one little movement of my hand." She waves, and half the crowd goes nuts. The Pope says "I can make every Irishperson in the world go mad with joy with one little movement of my hand," and slaps her.

I will bet that when you were born the doctor looked at you and slapped your mother's face instead. :ROFLMAO:
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
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Getting off of Taxme’s mom, & back to the thread topic….

May I throw in the most rhetorical of rhetorical questions. Did Guilbeault, or Deputy Prime Minister Chrystia Freeland, or Prime Minister Justin Trudeau himself, convene meetings with actual farmers and their families before bringing in these measures?

Did any or all of them — via government jet, Pearson is such a bore these days — drop in to Weyburn, or Redvers, or Red Deer or — this is the real challenge — Fort McMurray, to ask the people whose lives and jobs are at stake under this fixation with the Trudeau brand of “climate action,” what they might have to say? Did they test their “law” with the people who have to live with it? The question is its own answer.

As always I must ask — and I know people do not like to be reminded of this question — whether, if farming were as important in Quebec as it is in Saskatchewan, a Trudeau government would issue, arbitrarily, the same mandate? If Ontario was the oil province of Canada, would there not be pipelines going in every direction of the compass?


Which leads me to another point. We are in a two-tier Confederation. Perhaps even a three-tier one.

Quebec is a solidly protected singular independent-in-all-but-name entity. It is as close to being a sovereign nation as one can be while still wearing provincial brocade.

Ontario with its population and wealth, and being the centre of finance, communications and parliamentary seats, is a king among barons. The Atlantic provinces — a mere addendum, worth a fly-by but essentially, each on their own, without real force or voice in the Confederation. And British Columbia, sometimes a player, more often a spectator of Ottawa’s distant machinations.

Back to the central point. Where in a Confederation does the power lie for a national government to target, assault and injure the central economic concerns of certain provinces on a say-so? These edicts, measures, bans — call them what you will — keep coming down, as if such great national issues merely require, to take effect, a photo-op besides some tree, with a cluster of nodding ministers behind the PM. And we’re supposed to accept them. (???)

Our country, under this imperative mindset, is unwittingly toying with its own fragmentation.
 

Nick Danger

Council Member
Jul 21, 2013
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Back to the central point. Where in a Confederation does the power lie for a national government to target, assault and injure the central economic concerns of certain provinces on a say-so? These edicts, measures, bans — call them what you will — keep coming down, as if such great national issues merely require, to take effect, a photo-op besides some tree, with a cluster of nodding ministers behind the PM. And we’re supposed to accept them. (???)
A lot of it comes down to the individual's perception of the climate challenges that face us. For the most part, those railing against measures to reduce GHG emissions rely on a short term cost/benefit position, while those in support take a longer view of the hazards we face, a view that the first group likes to ignore or dispute.
 

pgs

Hall of Fame Member
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A lot of it comes down to the individual's perception of the climate challenges that face us. For the most part, those railing against measures to reduce GHG emissions rely on a short term cost/benefit position, while those in support take a longer view of the hazards we face, a view that the first group likes to ignore or dispute.
Great let’s cut down our food supply to save the world . You will eat bugs and be happy .
 

Nick Danger

Council Member
Jul 21, 2013
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Great let’s cut down our food supply to save the world . You will eat bugs and be happy .
But there are ways that productivity and emission reduction can be had at the same time. Why do people gravitate away from that to the "We're killing the farmers" crap ? Isn't saving the world a worthwhile project, or is it more important to have lots of money in the short term ?
 

pgs

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 29, 2008
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But there are ways that productivity and emission reduction can be had at the same time. Why do people gravitate away from that to the "We're killing the farmers" crap ? Isn't saving the world a worthwhile project, or is it more important to have lots of money in the short term ?
Saving the world Is a non starter , the world isn’t going anywhere . We humans and the rest of nature have been adapting since the Big Bang and we will continue to adapt to whatever is thrown our way . Starving our population will not stop the changing climate from changing . It will however make the rich richer , are you not against them ?
 

Nick Danger

Council Member
Jul 21, 2013
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"Starving the population." Sensationalist bullshit. Crop yields can be maintained with lower use of nitrogen fertilizer and improved stewardship. Not all farmers are on the "You're killing us boat".
 
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petros

The Central Scrutinizer
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"Starving the population." Sensationalist bullshit. Crop yields can be maintained with lower use of nitrogen fertilizer and improved stewardship. Not all farmers are on the "You're killing us boat".
Improved stewardship? Why? How and where are agronomists failing?
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
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"Starving the population." Sensationalist bullshit. Crop yields can be maintained with lower use of nitrogen fertilizer and improved stewardship. Not all farmers are on the "You're killing us boat".
Improved stewardship? Why? How and where are agronomists failing?
Maybe the reductions to be had have already been made, but the measurement is using a political yardstick (based upon politics) instead of a scientific one (based upon reality)???
 
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petros

The Central Scrutinizer
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Maybe the reductions to be had have already been made, but the measurement is using a political yardstick (based upon politics) instead of a scientific one (based upon reality)???
If "nitrogen" fertilizers were single source and single method of application this would be far easier to understand. Essentially its cuts to certain types of nitrogen fertilizer rather than a flat out cut to N.

The nagging question is what will the cost be to producers to use acceptable alternatives to urea and ammonia for example? How will moisture management be dealt with? Can we get importers go along with rotations? Will secondary markets open that strictly cater to biofuels grown without high input costs as food grade oil seed crops? Etc

The picture is far bigger than just a flat cut to N.
 

Taxslave2

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Aug 13, 2022
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TurdOWE will never go for that. It won’t hurt anyone in the west. Quebec farmers, like the cement plants will get an exemption for being in Quebec.
 

The_Foxer

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If he were serious and actually cared and this was anything more than politically driven optics - he would have worked out the details of the 'how' BEFORE announcing the amount.

And given that we've just learned his mandates for travel were NOT science based we have every reason to believe he's imposing this figure as an arbitrary number based on politics without concern for its impact on farmers or food availability or cost.
 
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taxme

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Your mom.

Now did I ever bring your mom into any of our not so interesting conversations? You chosen Marxists really like to stoop very low. Typical of your chosen ilk. Would you like me to call your mom a whore? Just asking? :unsure: