Major search underway for missing Titanic wreck submarine

petros

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For subs, COPV is new. This is the first submersible built that way.

Sure it is.

It made 3 previous trips. That's not exactly "several". James Cameron has made 30 trips to the Titanic and came back every time. How? Because he used tested, known tech in a vessel that was properly certified.

Except this isn't really a cylinder. There's no even distribution of pressure with that goofy tapered tail.
View attachment 18568

It's probably cheaper than what's going to happen next. They also cheaped out by not having the submersible independently certified by the very organization that was created to certify subs and submersibles after the US navy lost 2 subs. That makes the build entirely suspect. In fact one former passenger stated the interior had a jerry-rigged look about it.

I doubt it will be anytime soon.

Yeah, because deep-sea submersible tech is such brand new technology.

Yep, and nobody got imploded while they were down there, even back in 1960.
Pressure vessel is a pressure vessel.

I heard 5 trips to Titanic. They done other drops at depth repeatedly.

Its's a cylinder. The tail is an exterior feature to reduce drag and facilitate in the spiral descent and in ascent. The sub the sub used to go to Marinas was a tear drop shaped vessel.

They had waivers with zero liability. Only the company can be sued not the estate of the owner/operator. The company sits at the bottom of the Atlantic.

Canadian Navy/Govt made a huge score. They'll collect the debris for analysis and have treasure trove of data that didnt cost anything beyon SAR and recovery. We'll make money off this shit.

Didnt you just say it was a a unique design and composition for a submersible?

Back in 1960 in the tear drop with a tether?

Its all new 63 years later.
 

petros

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Been sort’a following this story when time permits. Got a weird question.

Currently the story is this sub popped on it’s decent about two hours into its trip, but days later they where talking about banging noises every 1/2 hour on the 1/2 half hour…who or what was that?
Whale farts.
 

Jinentonix

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Pressure vessel is a pressure vessel.
And a poorly built pressure vessel is a poorly built pressure vessel.
I heard 5 trips to Titanic. They done other drops at depth repeatedly.
And yet in 2018 the company fired an employee for raising genuine safety concerns. Both James Cameron and Bob Ballard had an opportunity to see the Titan and neither of them were particularly confident in it and warned about it. And those guys know a LOT about submersibles.
Its's a cylinder. The tail is an exterior feature to reduce drag and facilitate in the spiral descent and in ascent. The sub the sub used to go to Marinas was a tear drop shaped vessel.
No, it really wasn't.
They had waivers with zero liability. Only the company can be sued not the estate of the owner/operator. The company sits at the bottom of the Atlantic.

Canadian Navy/Govt made a huge score. They'll collect the debris for analysis and have treasure trove of data that didnt cost anything beyon SAR and recovery. We'll make money off this shit.

Didnt you just say it was a a unique design and composition for a submersible?

Back in 1960 in the tear drop with a tether?
Uh not quite. This is The Trieste from 1960. A) There's no "tear drop". and B) The Titan wasn't a tethered vessel.
1687564173494.png

 

Wise

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"They had waivers with zero liability. Only the company can be sued not the estate of the owner/operator." - Interesting. More law insanity. No liability but implosion will be the cause of death of all. Now, nothing stops people from making Youtube videos where they call the company owner/operator bad names and insults. Defamation, maybe not.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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"They had waivers with zero liability. Only the company can be sued not the estate of the owner/operator." - Interesting. More law insanity. No liability but implosion will be the cause of death of all. Now, nothing stops people from making Youtube videos where they call the company owner/operator bad names and insults. Defamation, maybe not.
Have no fear. There will be lawsuits.
 

IdRatherBeSkiing

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Been sort’a following this story when time permits. Got a weird question.

Currently the story is this sub popped on it’s decent about two hours into its trip, but days later they where talking about banging noises every 1/2 hour on the 1/2 half hour…who or what was that?
Long lost Titanic survivors.
 

TheShadow

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Jinentonix

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A tapered cylinder just like James Cameron's unit as seen below. Go figure.

View attachment 18574


A Korean cylinder.

View attachment 18575
And both of those submersibles were built by people that actually knew what the fuck they were doing. Both were PROPERLY certified and neither of them have carbon-fibre hulls. Also, Cameron's trips in his submersible were all solo trips. He also wasn't charging $250,000 a head to take a trip in something that was sketchy as fuck.
Ocean Gate had ALL kinds of warnings from people who have forgotten more about submersibles than Stockton Rush had ever learned, but those warnings were ignored by a fucking idiot with an ego bigger than the Titanic.

Looking at the Korean submersible you posted, it even looks more robust than the Titan. But what is truly amazing is the Titan actually managed more than one trip. The fucking glass in the viewport window was only rated to 1300m by the manufacturer.

And then there's this. Titanic sub: Safety concerns raised about missing submersible - BBC News
 

petros

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Thats great. Whats your point? There arent carbon fibre pressure vessels? Thats all I said is that they exist. Youre the one who hit the ditch and floored it trying to get out. Speed kills.
 

Ron in Regina

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Not that I know what I’m talking about, but it does look suspicious. If the carbon fibre wrap inside the titanium hull was irrelevant it wouldn’t be there, and if it wasn’t, popping screws through it probably wasn’t a great idea.
 
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spaminator

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Wife of pilot in fatal sub implosion descended from couple who died on Titanic, report says
Author of the article:Associated Press
Associated Press
Published Jun 22, 2023 • 1 minute read

NEW YORK — The wife of the man piloting the OceanGate tourist submersible when it imploded during this week’s dive to the Titanic wreckage site is a descendant of a wealthy couple who died when the ocean liner sank in 1912.


Archival records show that Wendy Rush, the wife of OceanGate CEO Stockton Rush, is the great-great-granddaughter of Isidor and Ida Straus, The New York Times reported Thursday. Straus was a retailing magnate who co-owned Macy’s department store.


Born Wendy Hollings Weil, Wendy Rush wed Stockton Rush in 1986, according to their wedding announcement. The Times said it could not immediately reach Wendy Rush for additional comment.

The U.S. Coast Guard announced Thursday that Stockton Rush and the other four men aboard the submersible died when the craft imploded this week in the North Atlantic.

Isidor and Ida Straus have become known for a Titanic story about reportedly choosing to go down together on the sinking ship, arm in arm. Survivors said Isidor Straus would not get on a lifeboat while women and children were still waiting to be rescued, and his wife of four decades declared she would not abandon her husband.



Director James Cameron immortalized a fictionalized version of their story in his 1997 movie about the tragedy, which shows a shot of an older couple embracing in bed as waters rise.

The newspaper said Wendy Rush is descended from one of the Strauses’ daughters, Minnie. She married Dr. Richard Weil in 1905 and their son, Richard Weil Jr., Wendy Rush’s grandfather, was later president of Macy’s New York.

Isidor Straus’ body was found at sea several weeks after the disaster, according to New York Times archives. Ida Straus’ remains were not recovered.
 

spaminator

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Sub disaster puts spotlight on another extreme venture: Space tourism
Author of the article:Bloomberg News
Bloomberg News
Loren Grush
Published Jun 23, 2023 • 4 minute read

Commercial space travel shares plenty of similarities with deep sea tourism: wealthy customers, tight spaces, far-flung destinations and waivers that clearly warn people they’re risking death by embarking on unregulated vehicles.


As the world dissects what went wrong with the doomed OceanGate submersible vessel, the craft’s lack of safeguards is raising alarms. The founder of the deep-sea tour group once called safety a “pure waste” and industry peers flagged the potentially “catastrophic” results of his “experimental” approach to ocean exploration.


Submersibles like the Titan are subject to little safety oversight, even less so when they’re in international waters. A similar regulatory regime — or lack of one — governs commercial human spaceflight. And while the private space industry hasn’t seen a disaster on the scale of the OceanGate fiasco, the risks are there.

“There’s a strong concern that not having those safety regulations is going to mean some fly-by-night, shady operations that result in customers being injured or potentially killed,” said Brian Weeden, director of program planning for the Secure World Foundation, a space sustainability nonprofit pushing to curb space junk and for better space traffic management, among other things.


Under current US law, the Federal Aviation Administration can’t impose safety standards on commercial spacecraft that carry people to space. That may change as soon as later this year, unless the current law is extended.

Read More: Titanic Tour Leader Loved Risk and Called Safety a ‘Pure Waste’

Commercial passengers who strap into a vehicle operated by Elon Musk’s SpaceX, Virgin Galactic Holdings Inc. or Blue Origin LLC — the only companies that currently provide space tourism flights — do so under an “informed consent” framework. That means they acknowledge that the government has not certified commercial ships for safety and that “participation in space flight may result in death, serious injury, or total or partial loss of physical or mental function.”


SpaceX, however, developed its Crew Dragon passenger capsule under NASA’s safety requirements, as the company uses the vehicle to send the agency’s astronauts to the International Space Station.

Virgin Galactic declined to comment and Blue Origin and SpaceX did not respond to requests for comment.

This informed consent regime began in 2004 with the Commercial Space Launch Amendments Act, which imposed a regulatory moratorium on the FAA over commercial space for eight years. Congress has twice extended the moratorium over the years, but it expires again this October.

The FAA is taking preliminary action to develop a safety framework for commercial human spaceflight ahead of the moratorium expiring, a spokesperson told Bloomberg News. The agency is also updating its recommended practices for human spaceflight occupant safety and working to develop voluntary consensus standards.


The justification for the lack of oversight thus far is that the space industry is still in a “learning period,” much like commercial aviation in its early years. “There are those that fear that imposing government safety regulations early in the process is going to stifle the industry,” said Weeden.

The president of the Commercial Spaceflight Federation, an industry group representing commercial space companies that in 2015 lobbied to extend the moratorium, did not respond to a request for comment.

Though the FAA cannot impose safety standards, it is responsible for licensing all space launches and reentries. But it primarily ensures that any associated mishap won’t harm the environment or uninvolved bystanders and property.


The mechanics of space tourism differ substantially from those of commercial deep sea exploration. For one, Blue Origin and Virgin Galactic flights aren’t really in danger of being lost during a flight: They don’t actually achieve orbit, and gravity would swiftly bring them back to Earth. SpaceX sends its ships into orbit, but plenty of tracking technology exists to locate space objects if communication breaks down.

Space companies also perform numerous high-profile tests and often stress their commitment to safety. Though, the exact protocols and procedures can be somewhat opaque.

Mishaps have, however, happened. In July of 2021, when Virgin Galactic flew founder Richard Branson into space, the craft deviated from its intended flight path; and in 2014, a pilot died and another was seriously injured during a Virgin Galactic test flight. Just last year, a Blue Origin rocket meant for passengers crashed after its engine failed. No people were on board, and Blue Origin said the flight’s safety measures operated as designed during an emergency.


As space tourism evolves beyond quick trips, some argue it’s time to end the moratorium. SpaceX has already flown 12 commercial astronauts to orbit and the International Space Station. Axiom Space Inc., Vast Space LLC and Blue Origin are also working toward building their own commercial space stations that they want civilians to visit, in some cases, as early as 2025.

Even if the moratorium lifts, regulations would take time to draft and implement.

The industry should be proactive, said George Nield, the former associate administrator for Commercial Space Transportation at the FAA.

“I would love to see government, industry, academia all get together and see if we can put together something that everyone would agree to,” said Nield, who is now the president of Commercial Space Technologies, LLC. NASA has more than 50 years of experience flying people to space that could be used to inform some safety standards, he said.

If not, a high-profile accident could occur, prompting calls for hasty and heavy regulations.

“That would be very, very bad,” said Nield. “Because fast regulations are generally poor regulations.”
 

spaminator

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Teen passenger on voyage to Titanic was 'terrified' before trip
Author of the article:postmedia News
Published Jun 23, 2023 • Last updated 23 hours ago • 1 minute read

The teenage son of a Pakistani businessman felt “terrified” about the trip to explore the wreckage of the Titanic, according to a relative.


Azmeh Dawood, the older sister of Shahzada Dawood, said she was informed by a family member that her nephew, Suleman, was hesitant about making the journey to the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean.


“I am thinking of Suleman, who is 19, in there, just perhaps gasping for breath … It’s been crippling, to be honest,” Azmeh told NBC News in a phone interview from her home in Amsterdam.

Because the trip fell on the weekend of Father’s Day, the teen felt he needed to please his dad, Azmeh said.

She added her brother was “absolutely obsessed” about the Titanic and its lore from an early age.

On Thursday, OceanGate, the company behind the Titan expedition, announced all five passengers had died after the submersible ruptured and imploded due to the extreme pressure.


OceanGate CEO Stockton Rush, who was piloting the submersible, British billionaire Hamish Harding and French explorer and Titanic expert Paul-Henri Nargeolet also died.

Azmeh said it was agonizing to watch news coverage of the search for the missing men leading up to the tragic discovery of the submersible in pieces on the ocean floor.

“I feel like I’ve been caught in a really bad film, with a countdown, but you didn’t know what you’re counting down to,” she said. “I personally have found it kind of difficult to breathe thinking of them.”



In Pakistan, the Dawood-owned Engro Corporation, a fertilizer company, announced the deaths of the father and son early Friday.

“Our thoughts and prayers are with the Dawood family at this tragic time,” the statement said. “We extend our heartfelt condolences to the family, colleagues, and friends and all those around the world who grieve the unthinkable loss.”