Global Warming - Wind Farm Killed by US Congress

Karlin

Council Member
Jun 27, 2004
1,275
2
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http://www.truthout.org/issues_05/121505EC.shtml

A great start, a certain reduction in greenhouse gasses emissions.

Economically sound, profitable, less intrustion than oil rigs.

This viable project that would be the kind of answer we need to slow global warming, the biggest threat to our way of life, is thrown out for reasons that are not valid.

The suspicious reason behind the rejection is the threat to Big Oil's complete domination of our energy use profile.

The reason given:
"The amendment, offered by Representative Don Young, Republican of Alaska, would prohibit new offshore wind facilities within 1.5 nautical miles of a shipping lane or a ferry route."

- is that windmills too close to shipping lanes would be a problem, despite Britain's experience of using 500 meters as the buffer distance required for safety.

So its pure FLUFF.
Facing the reality of global warming should be easy for an Alasakan, whose constituency could be flooded by rising tides , and whose weather is allready seeing the biggest changes of anywhere in the world. [an Alaskan Senator submitted the amendment.]

Obviously, he is there, as a USA Senator from Alaska, on the basis of Big Oil putting him there. And the reasons for continuing to reject these solutions to global warming is evidence of the larger conspiracy to heat up the planet, or whatever it is they are trying to accomplish!! [domination of the world]


LINK to many many more Global Warming articles:
http://www.truthout.org/environment.shtml
including these -
"Christmas Is Damaging the Environment"
"Thousands of Firms Could Stop Reporting Emissions"
"US Attacked on Its Climate Stance"
"How the Wind Could Be Our Best Weapon against Global Warming"
 

jimmoyer

jimmoyer
Apr 3, 2005
5,101
22
38
68
Winchester Virginia
www.contactcorp.net
The installation would consist of 130 turbines in a grid that would occupy 24 square miles in the sound. Each tower, with its turbine and blades, would rise 420 feet above the water. The developer, a private company called Cape Wind Associates, says the turbines could produce three-quarters of the electricity now used on Cape Cod, Martha's Vineyard and Nantucket.

----------------------------------------------

Wait a minute Karlin. Think about that.

120 turbines occupying 24 square acres rising 420 feet
high on Cape Cod ???

Holy bejeeezus, this would hardly be the place for
the wind industry to do it there !!

Give me a break, the resistance to such a monster
is hardly coming from the oil industry.

It's coming from NIMBY, not in my backyard.

And guess what?

That's legitimate to question the motives of the
wind industry in placing it in a tourist area, a fishing area
and right in the heart of the Kennedys who champion
many environmental strategies.

I wonder what such a strategy of setting up the
opposition is supposed to accomplish?

Karlin, your bias, is often well placed, but, man, the
details of this venture are glossed over, and the
opposition just might have a legitimate argument
against it.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
RE: Global Warming - Wind

The oil industry has been fighting the wind industry since the very start, Jim. They started out in the late 1980s quoting numbers from the 1950s. The didn't do it honestly of course...it was their first recognizable attempt at an astro-turf. After that they started the whole thing about wind generators killing birds. They've played up the noise factor, lied about the energy generated, used the wildlife/marine life scare tactic several times, cited security concerns since 9-11, and just generally done everything possible to make sure that alternative energies aren't given a chance.

If there's major objections to a wind farm in the US or Canada, it comes from the oil industry.

The NIMBY thing isn't much of a factor in this case, though there is little doubt that somebody in the oil industry has been working to stir up that particular sentiment. Logically though, the people in Cape Cod would benefit more from clean energy from wind turbines than they would suffer from having a wind farm off-shore that would not only supply their needs, but turn a profit selling to larger markets.
 

jimmoyer

jimmoyer
Apr 3, 2005
5,101
22
38
68
Winchester Virginia
www.contactcorp.net
I don't find this particular site of Cape Code to be a
good example of what you are talking about.

Also I don't find it strategically smart to give
the anti-environmentalists the weapons
to start attacking the enviroment
champions in the Kennedy backyard.

And the tourist industry there and the Kennedys
there are doing a lot more to fight it.

This is just smash mouth politics where nothing
gets accomplished.

We need to help the wind industry but it ain't gonna
happen if they go about it this way.
 

Calberty

Electoral Member
Dec 7, 2005
277
0
16
I'm a strong environmentalist but also a keen birdwatcher. Answers are not always simple. There's intelligent discussion on the pros and cons of many widfarms and their impact on the environment (despite the conspiratorial hysteria of R. Blair...evil oil comapanies...wooooh....)

There is currntly a proposal for an extensive sytsem of wind turbines on ridges in the Appalachia of the Eastern USA. Ecological groups, birdwatchers, etc. are opposing it on the bases that these ridges are the migration route for not thousands but millions of birds each year. These birds could be killed in unprecedented numbers. The same issue has arisen elsewhere where these wind farms have been proposed...

An open mind to environmnetal solutions should be kept. Simplistic answers are often not so simplistic.
 

jimmoyer

jimmoyer
Apr 3, 2005
5,101
22
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68
Winchester Virginia
www.contactcorp.net
Well Reverend Blair has already insisted you bird
watchers are simply misled by the evil oil industry
and that these huge turbines will have no effect.


The Reverend Blair :
-------------------------------------------------------------
"After that they started the whole thing about wind generators killing birds. They've played up the noise factor, lied about the energy generated, used the wildlife/marine life scare tactic several times...."
---------------------------------------------------------------

The environmentalists need to work with others
better and this strategy will help their programs
succeed.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
RE: Global Warming - Wind

I brought it up because they were found to be behind the rumours from the start. It was all documented years ago.

Wind farms are in extensive use elsewhere, including a large off-shore installation off the coast of Holland. Bird-kill is not a real factor. It does happen, but the numbers are extremely low. Magnitudes lower than bird kills caused by burning fossil fuels.

I'd suggest that it is Calberty with ill-informed support of a half-assed and already debunked fear that is suffering from conspiratorial hysteria. Actually, in his case it's more of a constipational hysteria.
 

Calberty

Electoral Member
Dec 7, 2005
277
0
16
Environmental groups are also opposed to a proposed 500 plus series of 'bird choppers' slated along the Alleghenie hawk and eagle migration route in Pennsylvania. Sensitive radar was placed at only one proposed wind generator locale (only 1 of 500!) and on one foggy day just over 2400 birds would have went through the spinner. On average about 30% of those birds would have been migrating birds of prey (largely Canadian!).
 

Calberty

Electoral Member
Dec 7, 2005
277
0
16
Here ar a list of some the 'radical' groups against windfarms in Massachusetts.

The American Humane Society, Massachusetts Audubon Society, the International Fund for Animal Welfare, and the International Wildlife Coalition.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
Environmental groups are also opposed to a proposed 500 plus series of 'bird choppers' slated along the Alleghenie hawk and eagle migration route in Pennsylvania. Sensitive radar was placed at only one proposed wind generator locale (only 1 of 500!) and on one foggy day just over 2400 birds would have went through the spinner. On average about 30% of those birds would have been migrating birds of prey (largely Canadian!).

That's not the same as a coastal wind farm, first of all. Second of all, that has not been the experience at other installations, Calberty. The birds avoid the towers and fins quite effectively, going above or around them. The result is a minimal kill rate...lower than is caused by present technologies producing the same amount of power.

The result is that you will kill more birds with your opposition to wind power than wind farms will. You'd be far better off looking at measures to go along with wind farms that will protect birds than yelling and screaming that you don't want wind farms.

Or is the idea of a lot of birds choking on coal smoke where you can't see them less distressing to you than a small number of birds getting hit by windmills in the open?
 

jimmoyer

jimmoyer
Apr 3, 2005
5,101
22
38
68
Winchester Virginia
www.contactcorp.net
Perhaps the wind industry would do better to
quietly talk and reason in a less confrontational way
to all of these groups who have what they think to be
legitimate doubts.

Perhaps they can continue to build on relationships
that encourage trust and understanding ?

I've seen many a good idea die for lack of building
a network of long term relationships.
 

Karlin

Council Member
Jun 27, 2004
1,275
2
38
Thanks for taking this subject seriusly everyone.

Jim's objections are duly noted... but I gotta say, when I've seen windmills, and windfarms, I am totaly mesmerised ...
- they are frikken beautifull !!

Thats not just because they are energy "not from oil", but rather their motion, the grace of their lines, the way they find the wind direction and bend to it like a dance of Greek Gods.

Really, I am smitten, and many others agree with me.
I would still say that the objections to them, esp on their esthetics, must be some kind of propaganda , 'cuz they are beautifull.

----------- ETC:

interesting Windtale - Denmark's Export Jackpot :
As a result of the government jump-starting the wind industry in the 1980s, Denmark now benefits from exporting $3 billion worth of wind turbines annually, making it the nations largest export commodity.
Denmark has become the global leader in the manufacture of wind turbines. The nations internal industry is strong, as well, with 21 percent of its electricity derived from wind in 2003, the highest capacity per capita in the world. Denmark's success in wind development was jump-started with the implementation of a generous subsidy available to wind turbine installations in 1979.
http://www.altenergy.org/AEI/5

K - gee, Canada is missing the boat...

\

And just to keep the importance of being serious about this topic, here is a species extinction update:
Global warming threatens millions of species
http://www.newscientist.com/channel/earth/climate-change/dn4545

Sorry, I know that is off-topic...
Karlin
 

jimmoyer

jimmoyer
Apr 3, 2005
5,101
22
38
68
Winchester Virginia
www.contactcorp.net
Windmills may be beautiful, but let's say you have
to clear a whole mountainside to put these
beautiful monsters up.

It will and SHOULD take a lot
of backround, behind-the-scenes work for the Wind
Industry to get the locals to approve, and to just
dismiss in an egotistical way the local's objections
as just brainwashing by the oil industry is too
simplistic and wrong-headed of the environmentalists.

No doubt the oil industry will certainly feed poison
into the argument, but NIMBY (not in my backyard) really
do have legitimate concerns all of their own, and
they won't take kindly to some superior know-it-all
shoving it down their throats.

I've seen an industrial park get voted down by the
people here when it meant jobs and revenue and
now what they got are more McMansions that raise
too little revenue, causing a burden on
governmental services ---- and why? Because
the developer did not work with the people and
when he lost he got this other project through the
backdoor and feels no respect for the people who should
have taken the first deal.

No one was right in how they went about this.

But they were all right in condemning each other.
 

Jo Canadian

Council Member
Mar 15, 2005
2,488
1
38
PEI...for now
 

Karlin

Council Member
Jun 27, 2004
1,275
2
38
Bird well-being as a reason to stop development of Wind Farms is just a cynical ploy by the Fossil Fools. If they were concerned about birds, "their own back yard" [of crude oil] needs to be cleaned up first.
Such blatant bullsh*t is consistent with the Fossil Fools' disregard for nature and our dependance on it.

Many of us value nature over economics - economies come and go but underlying them all is the natural resources and basic life provisions we all depend on. Money means nothing without the pure air water and food nature has allways provided us with, all of which are under serious threat from the Fossil Fools.

Do you disagree that this is the "larger picture"?


---- Birds:

“We should be taking a look at the most significant threats associated with bird mortality,” said Adrienne Esposito, CCE Executive Director. “Reducing fossil fuel emissions is the best thing we can do to protect the birds, and wind energy can displace a significant amount of energy produced from fossil fuels,” continued Esposito.

When comparing the limited impact that properly placed wind turbines have on birds to the problems associated with fossil fuels, consider the following:

* Up to a half million birds were killed in the Exxon Valdez oil spill off Alaska.
* The largest source of mercury pollution in the US is fossil fuel power plants, which contaminate fish and ultimately poison the birds that eat them.
* Sulfur emissions from fossil fueled powered plants contribute to acid rain deposition, which destroys bird habitat, and in some areas, deprives birds of much needed calcium rich foods which have been found to impair their ability to lay healthy eggs.
* Fossil fuel emissions contribute to global warming. In a report issued last year by the American Bird Conservancy, it was predicted that in a few decades most state birds would no longer be natives to those states because of global warming.

http://tinyurl.com/7kqy7 [same link posted earlier]