C.u.p.e

Avro

Time Out
Feb 12, 2007
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Oshawa
Maybe they just don't give a damn because the Union is going to do what the Union wants to do no matter what the membership says. I have seen too many power trippy unions. Teamsters come to mind big, bold and ugly...

Am I wrong for believing people are members of a Union - but they are NOT the Union?

Wolf

I repeat, the union is comprised of employees and eveything that they do is voted on.

Even look at the name of CUPE

Canadian union of public employees.

The people are the union the leaders of the union are put there by them and any and every policy is voted for by the employees, in fact the union leaders are also employees, ours is a locksmith.

Avro
 

triedit

inimitable
To the original poster (Karrie???), I have a question. If you walk up to your employer, and as a stand alone person, ask to be hired at your current salary, WITH ALL OF YOUR CURRENT BENEFITS, what do you think would happen?
That's exactly what I did. I offerd to teach a course. No money was discussed

That's right, you'd be laughed at, and you'd be offered the least that the employer thinks you would take. Or they'd hire the next person who would take it. There's always somebody who will work for less. No pension? No vacation?
I work 4.5 hours per week. There are no bennies. No pension, no vacation, nada. And I am at the lowest end of the pay scale because I've only been there a year. Im quite happy with that. In fact, I'd still do the job for half what they pay me.
 

Kreskin

Doctor of Thinkology
Feb 23, 2006
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About 25 years ago I erroneously accepted a nomination for shop steward where I worked. What a joke that was. The staff were a bunch of unproductive space wasters (I was likely one of them). Once a month or so the union boss would come out and we'd meet with the executive. The union guy would talk about the membership like they were angels from heaven whom the execs should be ever so grateful for. The grievances would be presented. They were fighting things like a warning letter to a janitor caught sleeping (more like passed out). The place eventually closed because it was unmanageable.
 

Niflmir

A modern nomad
Dec 18, 2006
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Unions have a quite important place in society as can be learned by tracing their history. In recent times the freedom to associate in such a manner has been whittled down and the association itself has come under much fire. Canada shows signs of this when one looks at currently decreasing levels of non-wage benefits, such as employer sponsored medical insurance or RRSP's. Our unions have lost power and our employees are losing benefits.

Many people complain that unions are outdated because of globalization: the company can just move the business to a more union-hostile nation. This highlights how union's have failed to keep with the times: multinational corporations vs. locally organized unions = no power in the hands of the unions. Unions need to associate across borders and demand more labor mobility and equal treatment of employees regardless of factory locations. A corporation seeking to market its products in North America should not be allowed to manufacture in locations where association is not permitted amongst workers. "We'll just move the company to Mexico," signifies the need for stronger unions in Mexico, not weaker unions in Canada.

There are always anecdotal stories about unions protecting a lazy worker just as there are always stories about non-unionized employees being terrorized by management. This of course simply represents a typical over reaction to free-riding. Unions too are guilty of overreacting to free riding, since a union is merely one form of association, it should never be mandatory: one should want to join for the good of the cause rather than the obligation of some contract.

Employees whose jobs are based on commission provide a good example of the vulnerability of non-unionized employees. If a traffic accident, such as a falling tree or a running moose, were to leave a commissioned worker unable to work, and if said worker was the sole provider of their[sic] family, that would be a tragedy. Many unions seek to provide such fundamental assistance to people, who due to their lone career, are vulnerable to job loss.

In Canada, unions have achieved some of this at the provincial and national level. The universal health coverage we do have is due to the lobbying of unions starting from Saskatchewan. The minimum wage can be viewed as a union related issue also.

Again, I would like to highlight how the major drawback is the contractual obligation of union membership. This is of course a protection clause, meant to stop the employer from implementing policy to punish unionization, but there are better mechanisms.

Apologies for the rant level of that post.
 

TenPenny

Hall of Fame Member
Jun 9, 2004
17,466
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Location, Location
Interesting that many people have been ranting about how useless unions are, yet many people also are upset at the way protestors at, say, the G8 meetings are treated. Pepper spray? Police 'infiltrating' the crowd, trying to stir up violence?

That would never happen during a labour dispute in modern Canada, would it?

Hmmm.
 

karrie

OogedyBoogedy
Jan 6, 2007
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bliss
Interesting that many people have been ranting about how useless unions are, yet many people also are upset at the way protestors at, say, the G8 meetings are treated. Pepper spray? Police 'infiltrating' the crowd, trying to stir up violence?

That would never happen during a labour dispute in modern Canada, would it?

Hmmm.

I don't get what police tactics during protests (of any sort), has to do with whether or not unions as individual entities (rather than one labor board) are still needed in this day and age.
 

Niflmir

A modern nomad
Dec 18, 2006
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Leiden, the Netherlands
I don't get what police tactics during protests (of any sort), has to do with whether or not unions as individual entities (rather than one labor board) are still needed in this day and age.

Employers still have more bargaining power than an individual employee. Employee's only hopes are to unionize. Unions need presence at the national level to sway national and international labour laws. Their presence at this level is being averted in an undemocratic fashion, which ultimately reaffirms the superiority of employer bargaining power over employee bargaining power. :(
 

IdRatherBeSkiing

Satelitte Radio Addict
May 28, 2007
14,682
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Toronto, ON
I think that Unions served a very important purpose in the past.

However, I think the conditions they fought for and won are now basically entrenched in Canada's labour laws. Their purpose now seems a bit redundant and counter-productive IMHO.
 

lone wolf

Grossly Underrated
Nov 25, 2006
32,493
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In the bush near Sudbury
Interesting that many people have been ranting about how useless unions are, yet many people also are upset at the way protestors at, say, the G8 meetings are treated. Pepper spray? Police 'infiltrating' the crowd, trying to stir up violence?

That would never happen during a labour dispute in modern Canada, would it?

Hmmm.

If the "Law" decides you're not going to assemble, they're going to see to it you don't assemble. It doesn't matter if you're the suit-and-tie crowd (like when the OPP stormed striking gov't workers at Ontario Legislature) hard-hat crowd, or the peace-pipe-and-ponytail crowd. Power is power.

Essentially, Union-up and lawyer-up mean the same thing. If there really was truth and fairness on one side, you wouldn't need the other. Comes right down to the same battle we see in here - right vs left.

Wolf
 
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DaSleeper

Trolling Hypocrites
May 27, 2007
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Northern Ontario,
 

Jack_Of_Spade

Nominee Member
Mar 31, 2011
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Im not sure where to post this so here it is....

How did I become a member of CUPE? I don't pay dues, I don't have a membership card, etc, but they tell me that because I teach for the TDSB I'm automatically a member.

How can that be?

IN most union agreement it is your right to refuse membership that includes teachers union. Union has become a bad word what you are apart of is a colective agreement voted on by the majority of employee . You can refuse to be part of this but be warn . Although employers act like they realy care about you you can be certain that when they decide to lay poeple off the poeple not protected by the colective agreement and senority included in it are the first to go. The colective agreement also protects you against employer intimidation and harasment. If your a women or a minoraty you are covered under the canadian harasment legislation but if your a non etnic male (white) you are not included under this policy.
 

Cannuck

Time Out
Feb 2, 2006
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Alberta
You are not a member of CUPE, you are a member of the teachers federation which is a seperate union than CUPE which covers support staff such as janitors, maintainence, educational assistants and cafeteria staff.

If you don't want to be a member of the union then attend a meeting and proppose decertification or get employed in a private school.

People go on and on about how the unions have all this control over it's members when in reality they are more democratic than our own governments.

Is this the same Avro? I guess maybe I was right when I said he was probably punted from a job and the union wouldn't back him up.
 

DaSleeper

Trolling Hypocrites
May 27, 2007
33,676
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Northern Ontario,
Is this the same Avro? I guess maybe I was right when I said he was probably punted from a job and the union wouldn't back him up.

The very same who is also a member of C.U.P.E
And rants against unions to JLM8O

Well I have been a full member of CUPE for over a decade and have never recieved one phone call or letter mail from them.....not once.
I repeat, the union is comprised of employees and eveything that they do is voted on.

Even look at the name of CUPE

Canadian union of public employees.

The people are the union the leaders of the union are put there by them and any and every policy is voted for by the employees, in fact the union leaders are also employees, ours is a locksmith.

Avro
 

DaSleeper

Trolling Hypocrites
May 27, 2007
33,676
1,665
113
Northern Ontario,
You didn't answer my question.

What a shock.:roll:

Plus the unions are comprised of employees and they are the ones who decide when to strike so don't give me this dictatorship nonsense.

Interesting as I am a member of the same union and get no calls wanting support for anything, perhaps you are lying.

You will have to decide what comes first then, being part of a union with no obligation at all to do anything for it or your teaching.

If people want to take the course there is a market for it.

Irony