Sex diverts our attention from Iraq and torture


Avro
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#1
There were more important things than the Spitzer spectacle going on last week

By --

There are few more riveting spectacles than the public exposure and humiliation of a major hypocrite. So it was with New York State's fallen governor, Eliot Spitzer.

As a former prosecutor Spitzer relentlessly crusaded against financial, political and moral malefactors, including those involved in prostitution cases. Some saw him as a future presidential candidate.

Watching this modern Savonarola exposed dallying with outrageously priced call girls suggests there is indeed natural justice -- except, of course, for the humiliation inflicted on his brave, loyal wife.

U.S. media has overflowed with silly commentary by feminists and shrinks about "why did he do it." He did it because he was a typical man, genetically programmed to lust after multiple sexual partners. As the old saying goes, if a man isn't thinking about sex, his mind is wandering.

Too many Americans still have adolescent views of sex and marriage.
Europeans, by contrast, shrug off men's need to stray as normal and acceptable, provided it is done discreetly. Powerful, busy men such as Spitzer who have no time to court and romance women resort to prostitutes for simple physical release.

However ruthless, self-serving and hypocritical Spitzer was about prostitution, he was doing one good thing: Going after Wall Street's crooks and fraudsters largely responsible for the current financial crisis.

Spitzer's downfall this week unfortunately obscured two far more important events.
Saddam and al-Qaida

First, the White House refused to release an exhaustive Pentagon review of 600,000 Iraqi documents that found no evidence that Saddam Hussein had any links with al-Qaida.
This al-Qaida connection was the second big lie propagated by the Bush White House to justify invading Iraq. So successfully was it spread by the administration and tame media, that on the eve of the 2003 U.S. invasion of Iraq, 80% of Americans blamed Saddam for 9/11.

A small, al-Qaida affiliate appeared in Iraq only as a result of the U.S. invasion. But most misled Americans still believe they are fighting Osama bin Laden's men in Iraq. No wonder the White House is trying to suppress the Pentagon study.

Spitzer's pillorying also masked another profoundly shameful act. On Tuesday, 188 Republicans in the House of Representatives voted to uphold President George Bush's veto of a Democratic-sponsored bill to ban the CIA from using torture to interrogate enemy detainees. Their party-line vote was strong enough to prevent the 225 Democrats who voted to overturn the president's veto from achieving the required two-thirds majority.

Republicans now have become the party of torture. Never has the Grand Old Party sunk so low. Those great Republicans, Lincoln, Eisenhower and Reagan, must be weeping in their graves.

Among tortures America now routinely inflicts on captives: Water torture, near suffocation, beatings, confinement in cramped positions, sleep and sensory deprivation, freezing rooms, ear-splitting noise, mock executions, psychotropic drugs, food laced with excrement and, of course, water-boarding.

Condoning torture

The White House and Republicans claim none of these is really torture. Republicans just love euphemisms. These tortures are merely "enhanced interrogation." Overthrowing foreign governments is "regime change;" assassination, "taking them out." George Orwell warned such double-talk was the hallmark of totalitarian regimes. Even the KGB did not use all these tortures.

The president and his party are violating American and international law, and UN agreements against torture.

Their sanction of torture, and its apotheosis in the Guantanamo gulag, have disgraced America's name around the globe and will continue to haunt the United States for decades to come. Captured American soldiers now know what to expect.

Presidential candidates Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama and John McCain -- the latter a torture victim -- all properly condemn the White House for promoting torture. But McCain, who should know better, fudges, saying he won't restrict the CIA to interrogations in the Army Field Manual, which bans most forms of real torture. That is ominous.

The Spitzer follies should not distract us from the Bush administration's continuing violations of American and international law, and the values America used to hold dear. Nor ally Ottawa's slide in the same illegal direction.

http://www.torontosun.com/News/Colum...020051-sun.php
 
CDNBear
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#2
Hear hear!!!

I posted this at another site...

Quote:

All four dailies in Tdot today, printed papers with the '*****' that sank Spitzer on the cover page.

What the ****!!!???

The man that will replace Spitzer, a blind black man, set up in life with two adversities from the get go. A man that ran the New York Marathon and will now succeed Spitzer, gets an honourable mention on later pages.

Nope, he doesn't deserve the front page, not that American Politics should, but the high priced tart that sank a Guv is.

Wow, how journalism has died.

It got one reply.

But as much as I hate Margolis, he makes a valid point.
 
Kreskin
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#3
This case goes a lot deeper than just someone having sex with hookers, though. Those rings are known to be fronts for money laundering. Does everyone really pay $1000-3000 per hour for sex? Some do I'm sure. PT Barnum has a theory on that. But there would be many cases where money flows through like legitimate transactions for payment on other illegal affairs. When the bank reported multiple transactions from one source going to this payee, the federal authorities investigated and found it was coming from the governor of New York. For all they knew it was extortion money or payoff money. It still could be something a lot more than sex before this is all done with.

So when would be a good time to make this public? Every day someone is reporting something on Iraq, the economy, etc. It's easy to connect this with any current event on any day and point to it as diverting attention.

To say this was part of yet another conspiracy, I don't buy it.
 
Avro
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#4
Quote: Originally Posted by KreskinView Post

This case goes a lot deeper than just someone having sex with hookers, though. Those rings are known to be fronts for money laundering. Does everyone really pay $1000-3000 per hour for sex? Some do I'm sure. PT Barnum has a theory on that. But there would be many cases where money flows through like legitimate transactions for payment on other illegal affairs. When the bank reported multiple transactions from one source going to this payee, the federal authorities investigated and found it was coming from the governor of New York. For all they knew it was extortion money or payoff money. It still could be something a lot more than sex before this is all done with.

So when would be a good time to make this public? Every day someone is reporting something on Iraq, the economy, etc. It's easy to connect this with any current event on any day and point to it as diverting attention.

To say this was part of yet another conspiracy, I don't buy it.

Who said anything about a conspiracy?
 
Avro
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#5
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBearView Post

Hear hear!!!

I posted this at another site...

It got one reply.

But as much as I hate Margolis, he makes a valid point.

How many replies did the Spitzer thread get?

It is not so much about bad journalism as it is about what people will tune into and what they don't, in America sex sells newspapers, Bush gaffs don't.

Hate Margolis? That's a bit harsh, is it because he supported Pinochet who transformed Chile into a prosperous country and rid it of dictatorial socialists?

I disagree with him on some issues but I don't hate him, I'd use that word with people like Hitler and Stalin but not Eric.
 
karrie
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#6
Using the number of posts in the thread, as an illustration of our attention to the issue is impossible.


It's not like that thread was focused on Spitzer. We veered way off into other avenues of discussion and were talking about our personal lives.

We don't do that with threads regarding the Iraq war. We don't goof around and crack jokes about affairs, we don't veer off into tangents about how it parallels our personal lives. Which threads are actually getting more concentrated attention, more respect? Which are actually getting honest input and views? And which are just getting trite jokes?
 
Avro
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#7
Tell me Karrie, did you even know about this report from the pentagon?

Be honest.
 
karrie
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#8
Quote: Originally Posted by AvroView Post

Tell me Karrie, did you even know about this report from the pentagon?

Be honest.

Yes, I did. It struck me as 'news that's not news' frankly. Just proof of what many suspected all along.
 
Kreskin
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#9
Quote: Originally Posted by AvroView Post

Who said anything about a conspiracy?

Sorry, I misread the original post. Still, a state governor was repeatedly and secretly sending large sums of money through a network associated with money laundering. It is news, whether we think the Iraq war or Bush's torture crusade needs more headlines or not.
 
Avro
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#10
Quote: Originally Posted by KreskinView Post

Sorry, I misread the original post. Still, a state governor was repeatedly and secretly sending large sums of money through a network associated with money laundering. It is news, whether we think the Iraq war or Bush's torture crusade needs more headlines or not.

Sure it's news but not 24/7 with nothing on what the Pentagon had to say about Iraq which has led to the deaths of a few hundred thousand people needlessly.
 
Avro
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#11
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

Yes, I did. It struck me as 'news that's not news' frankly. Just proof of what many suspected all along.


Just proof what we already know....oh well....better luck next time....just forget about it.

Now let's move on to some sex and don't you worry your pretty little heads about that torutre buisness either, if you don't think about it never happened just like the war.
 
karrie
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#12
Quote: Originally Posted by AvroView Post

Just proof what we already know....oh well....better luck next time....just forget about it.

Now let's move on to some sex and don't you worry your pretty little heads about that torutre buisness either, if you don't think about it never happened just like the war.

my point exactly.... you seem to be basing your view of how seriously people take something, with how many posts it gets on the forum. Just because it sparks more inane chatter doesn't make it a more important topic in ANYone's eyes.
 
RomSpaceKnight
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#13
Read "The Fall of the Roman Empire". Emperors at the time used gladatorial sports and personalities to deflect the mobs attention away from the decay of the empire.
 
cranston36
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#14  Top Rated Post
It doesn't distract me.
Sex is good for procreation and keeps the skin clear.
If properly done it increases communication considerably.
 
zoofer
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#15
Do people actually waste time reading Eric Margolis's far lefty stuff?
Don't they have vacuuming and dishes to do?
 
Toro
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#16
I think it has more to do with the "new" sensationalism of the Spitzer story and the fact that there is both nothing new in Iraq and that things are getting a bit better.
 
MikeyDB
#17
Hey Zoofer...

If George Bush were bright enough to write...and anyone was fooled into thinking he had anything to say to anyone worth reading....

You'd be the only one reading his column now wouldn't you?



Seriously now, for those who cling desperately to the myth of "honest politicians" this Spitzer nonsense must be a heartbreaker.....
 
YukonJack
Conservative
#18
"If George Bush were bright enough to write...and anyone was fooled into thinking he had anything to say to anyone worth reading...."

Hey, genius!! GW Bush was a successful twice elected Governor of the State of Texas.

He was twice elected United States President.

And you, - obviously nothing more than a deformed intellectual dwarf - have the nerve to make the stupid statement you did. I pity you. And all your likeminded soul-mates of yours.
 
Cliffy
Free Thinker
#19
And you would be the other person reading Dubbya's rantings.
 
YukonJack
Conservative
#20
Cliffy, you and MikeDB are not bright enough to read anybody's "rantings".

Not bright enought read, PERIOD.
 
Cliffy
Free Thinker
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#21
I can read enough to know that this thread has been dead for over a year and that the person you are putting down hasn't posted here in almost that long.
 
commonsense
+1
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by YukonJackView Post

"If George Bush were bright enough to write...and anyone was fooled into thinking he had anything to say to anyone worth reading...."

Hey, genius!! GW Bush was a successful twice elected Governor of the State of Texas.

He was twice elected United States President.

And you, - obviously nothing more than a deformed intellectual dwarf - have the nerve to make the stupid statement you did. I pity you. And all your likeminded soul-mates of yours.


You don't seriously think that Bush was anything more than Cheney's puppet now, do you?
 
karrie
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#23
hi commonsense... you might find that when you resurrect a thread more than a year old, you might not get a lot of replies to your post. I just wanted to warn you so you don't feel slighted if no one replies. Have a good day!
 
bluebyrd35
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#24
[QUOTE=YukonJack;1089562]"If George Bush were bright enough to write...and anyone was fooled into thinking he had anything to say to anyone worth reading...."

Hey, genius!! GW Bush was a successful twice elected Governor of the State of Texas.

He was twice elected United States President.

And you, - obviously nothing more than a deformed intellectual dwarf - have the nerve to make the stupid statement you did. I pity you. And all your likeminded soul-mates of yours.[/QUOTE)
.......................

And yup, that genius points out the mental acuity of those who vote him in!! But wait a minute, wasn't there a whole hoopla about those voting machines in Florida one election (and it seems I remember Jed, his brother was governor there at the time) Also the second term more irregularities in Ohio.
 
EagleSmack
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#25
Quote: Originally Posted by bluebyrd35View Post


And yup, that genius points out the mental acuity of those who vote him in!! But wait a minute, wasn't there a whole hoopla about those voting machines in Florida one election (and it seems I remember Jed, his brother was governor there at the time) Also the second term more irregularities in Ohio.

There was... when the Democrats tried to steal the election.

Those voting machines seemed to work PERFECTLY when Obama got in. Funny huh?
 
bluebyrd35
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#26
LOL you may believe that but I was living in Florida at the time and I know you are WRONG. And yes, the machines probably do work properly now. The scrutineers know exactly what to look for now. Fool me once........well you know the saying, I am sure.
Last edited by bluebyrd35; Aug 6th, 2011 at 08:18 AM..
 
CDNBear
+1
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by bluebyrd35View Post

LOL you may believe that but I was living in Florida at the time and I know you are WRONG. And yes, the machines probably do work properly now. The scrutineers know exactly what to look for now. Fool me once........well you know the saying, I am sure.

Got any proof?

Or are we supposed to go on your say so again?
Last edited by CDNBear; Aug 6th, 2011 at 08:49 AM..
 
EagleSmack
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#28
Quote: Originally Posted by bluebyrd35View Post

LOL you may believe that but I was living in Florida at the time and I know you are WRONG. And yes, the machines probably do work properly now. The scrutineers know exactly what to look for now. Fool me once........well you know the saying, I am sure.

Oh yeah... living in Florida during the election makes you an expert?

Fool you once huh? Whenever the Republicans win a Presidential Election the US Liberals accuse them of stealing the election. All the way back to Carter vs Reagan and the "October Surprise" fantasy the liberals concocted.

I will bet right now, the next Republican Presidential victory, they will be accused of stealing the election.
 
bluebyrd35
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+1
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by EagleSmackView Post

Oh yeah... living in Florida during the election makes you an expert?

Fool you once huh? Whenever the Republicans win a Presidential Election the US Liberals accuse them of stealing the election. All the way back to Carter vs Reagan and the "October Surprise" fantasy the liberals concocted.

I will bet right now, the next Republican Presidential victory, they will be accused of stealing the election.

..................
Apparently a better expert than you!! You've got that backwards, the only way the Rethuglians (very apt description I take no credit for) get elected is through skullduggery!! Just look at the mess they have just landed the country & world in and they are not even in power!! Oh but hey,I bet you approved of how the Rethuglians put the country/world into crisis mode, over raising a debt ceiling........remembering, this was to pay for monies already spent.....and NOT for future spending. Furthermore, it was raised at least 10 times without all this crap in the recent past mostly by the Rethuglians themselves.

Geez, did you miss that bit about the rich still getting those great tax breaks and the military budget not touched?? The medicare to cover the working poor and middle class, social security are on the chopping block. Are the taxes going up on these groups as well?? I missed that.

Because of the way the media works in the US, the news is very local. Every single aspect of a local case is examined adnauseum and is scarcely given mention elsewhere, so yes I am an expert on what happened in that election in Florida.

[QUOTE=CDNBear;1459246]Got any proof?

Or are we supposed to go on your say so again?[/QUOTE)


YUP!! Want to prove me wrong, you do the research and this time I will do the shredding in your manner.
 
CDNBear
Avatar
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by bluebyrd35View Post

YUP!! Want to prove me wrong, you do the research...

You don't understand how this works do you? Not a great surprise or anything.

I posted a thread on the HBO special, Black Box Voting. A topic that prompted me to contact Elections Canada and voice my concerns with electronic voting.

I'm well aware of electoral issues in the States.

But again, you're making claims, without documentation.

I was just curious if you could back up this claim, better than your others.

Quote:

... and this time I will do the shredding in your manner.

Thanks for admitting I shredded your other silliness.

That's a great big first step for your credibility.
Last edited by CDNBear; Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:42 AM..
 

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