A Zen view of faith and religion.

[Cliffy]

In other words, a person who is fanatic in matters of religion, and clings to certain ideas about the nature of God and the universe, becomes a person who has no faith at all.

But the attitude of faith is to let go, and become open to truth, whatever it might turn out to be.

Faith is a state of openness or trust.

But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.

You don't look out there for God, something in the sky, you look in you.

Alan Watts

To me, this is a much more benevolent way to view the spiritual. In Zen there is no reward or punishment, just a way of being, of living in the moment. It is more about being conscious of what is going on, of being present. Life is for living from one moment to another, not preparing for an afterlife, not living in fear of reprisal from a deity that is separate from you.

 

[Socrates the Greek]

In other words, a person who is fanatic in matters of religion, and clings to certain ideas about the nature of God and the universe, becomes a person who has no faith at all.

But the attitude of faith is to let go, and become open to truth, whatever it might turn out to be.

Faith is a state of openness or trust.

But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.

You don't look out there for God, something in the sky, you look in you.

Alan Watts

To me, this is a much more benevolent way to view the spiritual. In Zen there is no reward or punishment, just a way of being, of living in the moment. It is more about being conscious of what is going on, of being present. Life is for living from one moment to another, not preparing for an afterlife, not living in fear of reprisal from a deity that is separate from you.

reward or punishment, is the yard stick (measuring tape) for keeping people morally calibrated. We humans are spiritual beings, free to embrace any idea of God fit to satisfy our minds. The problem is that many want to dictate what God is good for the next guy. I like my God, we have a good understanding together, he lives me alone and never denigrates me, and I do the same for him. Rule of thumb don’t do to others what you don’t want done to you.

 

[CDNBear]

But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.

Alan Watts

I couldn't agree more.

To me, this is a much more benevolent way to view the spiritual. In Zen there is no reward or punishment, just a way of being, of living in the moment. It is more about being conscious of what is going on, of being present. Life is for living from one moment to another, not preparing for an afterlife, not living in fear of reprisal from a deity that is separate from you.

You know, you can have both eh?

Rule of thumb don’t do to others what you don’t want done to you.

Sadly, so many preach this, yet haven't the ability to live by it.

 

[Cliffy]

I couldn't agree more.

You know, you can have both eh?

Not sure what you mean - live in the moment and fear god? Prepare for the afterlife in the moment?:?::-|

 

[CDNBear]

Not sure what you mean - live in the moment and fear god? Prepare for the afterlife in the moment?:?::-|

Living in a state of Zen, and still looking forward to an after life, or even belief in a specific faith, are not mutually exclusive. Just because you believe in one, doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't believe in another. In some cases, they can walk hand in hand, symbiotic even.

You wouldn't believe how many Christian Buddhists I know.

 

[Cliffy]

Living in a state of Zen, and still looking forward to an after life, or even belief in a specific faith, are not mutually exclusive. Just because you believe in one, doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't believe in another. In some cases, they can walk hand in hand, symbiotic even.

You wouldn't believe how many Christian Buddhists I know.

I find Buddhism and Catholicism quite similar. Zen I find less dogmatic, more open to encompassing any path we choose. I find it fits quite nicely with native spirituality. The happy hunting grounds sounds much more appealing to me than playing a harp on a cloud.

 

[CDNBear]

I find Buddhism and Catholicism quite similar.

On deeper thinking, I can see that. Only one is less restricting then the other. To avoid a sh!t storm with the resident bible thumper, I'll leave it at that, lol.

Zen I find less dogmatic, more open to encompassing any path we choose.

My point exactly.

I find it fits quite nicely with native spirituality.

Which is why I use the all encompassing term "Zen" to describe my personal experiences and my personal embracing of a more traditional form of Native Spirituality.

The happy hunting grounds sounds much more appealing to me than playing a harp on a cloud.

I'm glad I wasn't drinking coffee when I read that, just the contrast alone, made me laugh.

And I agree. One is seemingly boring, while the other excites me. But then again, to someone who loves the Harp. The reverse could be observed.

 

[Socrates the Greek]

I couldn't agree more.

You know, you can have both eh?

Sadly, so many preach this, yet haven't the ability to live by it.

Cool thing you do...

 

[CDNBear]

Cool thing you do...

Can you elaborate on that?