For Canadians wishing to oppose the coming North American Union


whitestone7
#1
Hi People of Canada:

There is much information about the North American Union or Security and Prosperity Partnership on my website

My website is at:

http://whitestone7.110mb.com/index.html


By relegating this agreement to a series of treaties the are bypassing the need to include us in the agreements

I have made available a link to two websites that are opposing the (Security and Prosperity Partnership) S.P.P

one is to the website of Peter Julian NDP-MP for Burnaby-New Westminster

http://www.peterjulian.ca/page/527

and the other is to the Canadian Action Party's Petition website

http://www.canadianactionparty.ca/petition1.html

This is something that all North American people should get behind irrespective of boundaries

This is not an anti-american or anti-mexican or anti-canadian thing - it is about government not doing things in a manner that our respective constitutions tell us must be done

We voted them in - they did not vote to have us as constituents

They are there in public office as our guests not the other way around and their jobs can be given to someone else that will do things in a constitutional manner

Please if you think this is important - get involved - now is the time

I am not opposed to trade or immigration, but I am opposed to making it happen without our constitutional consent

I would encourage everyone in North America to contact their elected representatives - whether you agree or disagree - they need to know you know about this and that you want some oversight in Congress or Parliament

Thank you for your indulgence in this matter
Last edited by whitestone7; Jan 20th, 2008 at 01:00 PM..Reason: URL Changes
 
#juan
No Party Affiliation
#2
Harper doesn't have a mandate to get us into any kind of union. Canadians would have to vote on it....It won't happen..
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#3
Quote: Originally Posted by #juan View Post

Harper doesn't have a mandate to get us into any kind of union. Canadians would have to vote on it....It won't happen..

I really haven't learned enough about this.

What makes a vote on it necessary? And what would happen if they hurried it through without a vote?

Frankly, I'd feel better hearing what you just said, from Harper himself.
 
Toro
#4
NAU myths and facts

http://spp.gov/myths_vs_facts.asp

Most of the fears implied in the OP are myths.
 
Tonington
#5
Stronger economic unions are definitely a good thing, I can remember hearing some guy talk about Atlantica at a conference and he made very convincing arguments.
 
#juan
No Party Affiliation
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

I really haven't learned enough about this.

What makes a vote on it necessary? And what would happen if they hurried it through without a vote?

Frankly, I'd feel better hearing what you just said, from Harper himself.

Personally, I would rather hear it from the next Prime Minister....not Harper. The political and economic union mentioned in the OP could not come about without a majority of Canadians agreeing to it. Our constitution says at least that much.
 
china
Conservative
#7
#juan

Quote:

Our constitution says at least that much.

So what ? _our constitution also says something about not paying taxes to the federal government ,how true is that ?
 
Zzarchov
#8
Our charter of rights and freedoms also recognizes the supremacy of god, but we grant protections to atheism too. Paper is paper.

Does this mean the NDP will support armed icebreakers in the north to maintain our sovereignty against US claims?
 
Baxter Basics
#9
The (heads of the) corporations that are hosting and attending these private meetings, are so well-funded that they can and will buy their way into having this SPP in place.
 
Karlin
#10
juan and the other "why worry" crowd are just so naive!! The SPP will go through if the corporate sector wants it to go through.

Parliament need not be involved at all, and thats not a good thing.

Nice work whitestone7, at least I will encourage you to carry on with your petitioning against the SPP North American Union. In fact, I have written my MP [Alex Atamanenko] and requested that he bring up the issue in Parliament this fall and try to defeat the SPP agenda.

ETC - didja hear that PM Harper is delaying the start of parliament by one month? Maybe the SPP resistance is one of the reasons he is doing it. Less time in session seems to be a theme these days, it has happened in BC in recent years [and others?] That cannot be good for democracy, eh.
 
mabudon
#11
One month is hopefully not long enough to make this whole thing vanish. The SPP stinks to high heaven- if the Orwellian double-speak name ALONE isn't enough to make ya wonder, the events at the recent "summit" should have been a clear red-flag

I suppose some loud-mouth will come on here and say that the inquiry that is being pushed for is "unnecessary", but I really would like to see Harper and his clones step up to the "transparency and accountability" platform they laid in the last election- again, apologists will likely start screaming about the Liberals and what they did, but from my non-partisan view, pissing away a bunch of taxpayer money is not of the same magnitude as secretly signing away our rights as a country- having it done behind closed doors with little more than an "it was productive and we agreed on blah blah blah" soundbite to explain the significance of the proceedings is insulting at the LEAST

I ask to the "pooh pooh" types- if it IS "scaremongering" by some "leftist fringe", and IF it is nothing more than harmonization of regulatory standards, WHY THE HELL is it TOP F-ING SECRET?!?!?!?

Show me the goddamned documents, tell me the whole deal, and I can rest easy. Harper sure as HELL isn't planning an awesome surprise birthday party here, which would be the ONLY excuse for hiding something that has been presented as a routine trade agreement, no??
 
Tonington
#12
Perhaps it will be made an election issue, and the information will have to be released, or cooked up...
 
whitestone7
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by Toro View Post

NAU myths and facts

http://spp.gov/myths_vs_facts.asp

Most of the fears implied in the OP are myths.

I address the Myths vs. Facts webpage on my website at

http://whitestone7.110mb.com/Page7.html

They say the agreement was never signed but Former Prime Minister Martin says it was

The Myths vs. Facts Page is like a thief who stole my wallet - of course they say that they are not guilty
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#14
The thing is to try and stop this through the ballot box is futility itself. Look at the patriot act in the States as well as the ammendments and orders signed by the president, there is no democratic solution to NAU. It will be enacted through executive orders after the next terrorist attack, the Amero the police state the full integration of the three North American countrys all of it for the security of fascist Fortress North America. Any body who thinks they'll get to vote on weather or not they want a police state is dreaming, the question will never be put to the electorate. Just wait for the collapse of the American dollar. It's all for our own good you understand, it'll protect our democratic values and our precious way of life, whatever the hell that is.Oh yeah, stuff till you drop, have another cheeseburger, watch the game take the family to Disney World, don't be late for work. Heil Harper.
 
MikeyDB
#15
From the intercourse on this site it seems there are many Canadians who'd welcome a trade between the maple leaf and Ole Glory....

They will have their wish, not because they wish it were so but because as the needs of the many grow the needs of the few will be ignored. We have many contributors who embrace American policies now, we have armed American Coast Guard boats patrolling the Great Lakes, we have a "Prime Minister" playing lap-dog to the Whitehouse....learned it no doubt at the knee of Tony Blair....

Now perhaps the Kestone Kanadians serving and dying in Afghansitan have a chance of learning how to fight a war....it will only take an American corporal to bring fierceness a la Rambo....to the limp wristed Kanadians....

Just ask an American.....
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#16
Kanadians are polite, nice, considerate and more than stupid enough to believe in American nonsence, christ some think the yankee election will fix everything others believe we're being attacked by Al-Qaeda and Uncle Sama Bin Laffinatus. They huddle in thier closets frightenend by holly-wood fiction stupier than Independence Day or Dr Phils feel good garbage. It's all because of TV Mickey.
 
Lester
No Party Affiliation
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by darkbeaver View Post

Kanadians are polite, nice, considerate and more than stupid enough to believe in American nonsence, christ some think the yankee election will fix everything others believe we're being attacked by Al-Qaeda and Uncle Sama Bin Laffinatus. They huddle in thier closets frightenend by holly-wood fiction stupier than Independence Day or Dr Phils feel good garbage. It's all because of TV Mickey.


How true DB, The American media is just as fictional, nothing but a propaganda machine for the powers that be.
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#18
Mr Dressup ruined my life.
 
MikeyDB
#19
PeeWee Hermans looking for consolation too Beve.
 
Unforgiven
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by darkbeaver View Post

Mr Dressup ruined my life.

You wern't doing anything with it anyway!
 
EastSideScotian
#21
I dont think that will happen anytime soon....Maybe if Canada had a massive Economic issue...which doesnt look like it will happen...And we would vote on something like that...Chances are we would vote against it...unless ours lifestyle greatly depended on it.
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by EastSideScotian View Post

I dont think that will happen anytime soon....Maybe if Canada had a massive Economic issue...which doesnt look like it will happen...And we would vote on something like that...Chances are we would vote against it...unless ours lifestyle greatly depended on it.

Canada is welded to the American economy, where they go we will follow. No one will ever get to vote on NAU not American Canadian or Mexican, it will be enacted under executive order soon as the economy in the states collapses and the next north american terrorist attack takes place, then martial law, roundups of dissidents and good old fashioned police state fascism, all the orders and legislation are in place including the corporate militias (black water) and the concentration camps. Think I'm jokeing, just have to wait and watch the show, after the planned economic collapse. Soon as the market been completely raped Ka-boom, we're in Nazi-land, home of the true north stunned and owned.
 
EastSideScotian
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by darkbeaver View Post

Canada is welded to the American economy, where they go we will follow. No one will ever get to vote on NAU not American Canadian or Mexican, it will be enacted under executive order soon as the economy in the states collapses and the next north american terrorist attack takes place, then martial law, roundups of dissidents and good old fashioned police state fascism, all the orders and legislation are in place including the corporate militias (black water) and the concentration camps. Think I'm jokeing, just have to wait and watch the show, after the planned economic collapse. Soon as the market been completely raped Ka-boom, we're in Nazi-land, home of the true north stunned and owned.

Its unfortunate then that you see Canadians as people who would sit back and let all our freedoms go out the window...Iam sure there would be some action on that... What type I dont know....but Canadians ones who value what we are would do something about it....unless like I said our lifestyles depended on it....but as soon as our lifestyles are threatend then yes we will act accordingly..
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by EastSideScotian View Post

Its unfortunate then that you see Canadians as people who would sit back and let all our freedoms go out the window...Iam sure there would be some action on that... What type I dont know....but Canadians ones who value what we are would do something about it....unless like I said our lifestyles depended on it....but as soon as our lifestyles are threatend then yes we will act accordingly..

Like how? Most of armed forces are away over on the other side of the freakin planet phuckin -up life for Muslims, including our Navy which keeps the sea safe for Uncle Sam. I want my Army on my borders with loaded weapons pointing in the most likely direction of an attack, instead of shooting goatherds and getting killed by IEDs.
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by EastSideScotian View Post

Its unfortunate then that you see Canadians as people who would sit back and let all our freedoms go out the window...Iam sure there would be some action on that... What type I dont know....but Canadians ones who value what we are would do something about it....unless like I said our lifestyles depended on it....but as soon as our lifestyles are threatend then yes we will act accordingly..

Anytime you've got a problem with the kind of "Canadians that would sit back and let all our freedoms go out the window" you better know that it ain't me, but it is the corporate pigs and thier boot lickin politicians who've already sold us to Uncle Sam and the scum bag bankers. You won't have to wait to much longer to see what's what, just follow the money trail.
 
EastSideScotian
#26
I guess you will have to wait and see that your theroies are just that....

Also a North American Union means a stronger economy yes....Canada However will still be Canada...and Mexico will maybe Benifit....Though Id rather not Tie our Economey with the americans becuas eit has great potential...and we all know it...so iam pretty sure we want to keep it our own. Thats my Opinion however....Anything is possible I guess....but nothing is forsure.
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by EastSideScotian View Post

I guess you will have to wait and see that your theroies are just that....

Also a North American Union means a stronger economy yes....Canada However will still be Canada...and Mexico will maybe Benifit....Though Id rather not Tie our Economey with the americans becuas eit has great potential...and we all know it...so iam pretty sure we want to keep it our own. Thats my Opinion however....Anything is possible I guess....but nothing is forsure.

You better check the news, America is bankrupt and sinking into depression like a lead pelican. Thier economy is ten times ours, it'll suck us dry in a year, water, gas,oil, trees, air, land and every industry we haven't already given them. The only potential it has is to conduct virtually unrestricted war to steal everybody elses resources.
 
EastSideScotian
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by darkbeaver View Post

You better check the news, America is bankrupt and sinking into depression like a lead pelican. Thier economy is ten times ours, it'll suck us dry in a year, water, gas,oil, trees, air, land and every industry we haven't already given them. The only potential it has is to conduct virtually unrestricted war to steal everybody elses resources.

We arent going into ressesion they are...how does that harm us, we have other countries to trade with...and they will be begging for us to buy their crap still.

We still got all our stuff, and they still have and need to sell all the stuff we want...it doesnt hurt us a bit.so we buy their crap and then they turn aorund and buy our crap....see how that works..nothing will change for us....China is going to be the hurting ones in this ression not Canada...
 
Lester
No Party Affiliation
#29
China still has the rest of the world to sell to EU, Japan, India - if China has a hard time they will simply divest their 1 trillion dollars in U.S. securities that will start a panic sell off because no Country will want to be the last one holding the bag.
 
MHz
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by china View Post

#juan
So what ? _our constitution also says something about not paying taxes to the federal government ,how true is that ?

This is the latest article I have found on this subject.
http://www.freedomparty.org/consent/cons24_4.htm

The reason that this is useful to the OP is that the NAU is an issue that already has a process of how it has to be done in order for it be 'in effect'. It tells us that each Legislature has a certain process that has to be followed, with the NAU it brings in the clauses that deal with constitutional matters.
IE, the B.N.A. that was signed in 1867 as a starting point.

Voting by all the people has to be done for some issues. Anything to deal with changes to our constitution has to be taken to a referendum by all the people, that has never changed, nor can it be until there is a vote by all the 'common voters' saying referendums are now obsolete. It only takes an objection of 'a few' to bring any new law to a vote by all the voters. MP's, ect. get 1 vote each.

The NAU would seem affect our current constitution.

It changes the purpose of having 'elected people' if they take their advice from 'business' whose loyalty is to the share-holders and not the voters. Harper has already said {while in Mexico for a meeting} that this 'deal' would make 'businesses' the only ones 'advice on how to handle things' the "govt' would listen too. The chilling part were his words to the effect that steps would be taken to ensure that 'their advice would be followed', not something that any vote could affect.

If the NAU would make 'all voters' also 'a share-holder' then they (voters) would retain 'some input' into the direction any business would take.
In a transparent govt all things are discussed 'in public' before they can be acted upon, (decisions based on input from voters) . In a business 'board-room' the direction is made in 'secret', the meetings of anything NAU is held in secret, we don't even get a list of who attends, let alone anything that is discussed and what direction it is certainly headed. Since business is about 'profit' for only some and that come at somebody else's expense (share-holders vs without any shares). Winners and Losers.
I'm not sure why 'the people' should pay the salaries of somebody who 'takes their orders' from somebody else in a meeting that is kept secret from the ones paying them to be there.
The ones who vote in a person should be able to 'have them wired' so their conduct can be monitored by the ones who he has 'a say for' in some matters, not just the few sound-bites available these days but the whole of what was said during any meeting (or telephone call that was business related) or speeches, like a closed-door meeting.
 

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