USA - Russia another cold war?


B00Mer
#1
USA - Russia another cold war?



US Defense Secretary James Mattis’ first official visit to Eastern Europe smacks somewhat of the cold war-era. The US are considering deploying a missile battery system in the region ahead of NATO exercises this summer.

Mattis has called Russian missile deployment in the Baltic region ‘destabilising’ and U.S. allies are jittery about Russian and Belarussian war games scheduled for September. They could involve up to 100,000 troops and include nuclear weapons training.

The drills could see Russian troops near the borders of Poland, Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia.

In what could be seen as an indirect message to the Kremlin, Mattis met with Lithuanian President Dalia Grybauskaite, who is openly critical of Vladimir Putin.

Russia has also deployed missiles in Kaliningrad, its enclave on the Baltic Sea. It said the deployment was part of routine drills, but U.S. officials worry that it may represent a permanent upgrade.

“I believe that you who have withstood oppression can most keenly savor freedom and have never taken it for granted or looked away when it is threatened,” announced Mattis.

“Even in the face of a neighbor next door shredding trust, Lithuania has nonetheless contributed to the NATO-led mission far away in Afghanistan. And it has continued to provide capable trainers for the counter-ISIS mission in Iraq.”

American Patriot ground-to-air batteries are mobile devices designed to intercept tactical ballistic missiles, cruise missiles and planes.
Mattis refused to say whether Lithuania had demanded that they be deployed permanently.

It seems that Donald Trump no longer plans to withdraw from NATO or to reduce their role in the Atlantic alliance.

Tensions have been on the rise since Moscow installed Iskander nuclear-capable-missiles in Kaliningrad last year. The move troubled the enclave’s NATO-member neighbours.

source
 
Cliffy
+3
#2  Top Rated Post
Not likely:

USA Today Reveals Trump’s Empire Was Built With Money From The Russian Mafia

The strange fixation that United States President Donald Trump has with Russia and President Vladimir Putin is gradually being explained by investigative journalists, and the details being reported are painting a very surreal picture.
On March 28th, American newspaper USA Today published an eye-opening report that was put together following a review of court documents, public records and consultation with Ken McCallion, a former U.S. Attorney. The investigative report comes to the sordid conclusion that Trump may be hiding his tax returns not because of the outrageous deductions and loopholes he has taken advantage over many years; while this could be considered to be outrageous, it would pale in comparison to the alleged connections to Russian organized crime that USA Today claims to have uncovered.
The sordid state of affairs is centered on nearly a dozen individuals with whom Trump has done business. These are either Russian citizens or businessmen from countries that were former Soviet republics. These individuals have suspicious ties to the Russian Mafiya and to the Kremlin. The level of involvement with Trump ranges from purchasing Trump Tower condos to actually developing properties and lending money to the Trump organization and brand, which the U.S. President still owns.
As can be expected, these new developments do not bode well for Trump, who is currently the target of an investigation by the FBI about potential collusion between Russian operatives and the political campaign that resulted in the election of the most controversial President the U.S. has ever seen.


USA Today Reveals Trump


They own his a$$.
 
Twila
+1
#3
Think trumps been "bought" by Russia?
 
MHz
#4
The war already happened, Syria was the proving grounds. Russia can detect and expose all of the US false flag incidents that are used to justify all the wars since WWII. A task Americans should be doing themselves.
You can't fight a war when your high altitude missile strikes can be traced back to the launch point nor can you hope to win when 50% of your best stealthy weapons are intercepted before the low altitude hardware is moved in. In the Victory Parade it was the stuff in white in case you want a look at what low altitude defenses are like.
That about sums it up. Israel is going to have to go to plan b and that means working with the locals in the area know as 'greater Israel'. Lots less real money but they can still be a part of the project through their planning skills. Skills that don't work in the Political sector but work just fine in the business end using the banking recommendations already considered to be laws that govern the use of usury.

The plan a was not nearly as generous to the locals as every cent was supposed to go to the ones funding the projects. I assume we all know just who that would be at this time in the history books.

Quote: Originally Posted by Twila View Post

Think trumps been "bought" by Russia?

I think NATO is in a hopeless situation because Russ has that whole sea behind Crimea in which to hide underwater missiles that are now in place. They would be fast enough to be un-stopable, I'm pretty sure Putin knows who to hit first and the KGB tracks people like that so the right home would be hit.
Exactly who is going to fight once the head had been removed? NATO missed their opportunity, I hope they know a sinking ship when they see one.

Does anybody have a total for what the taxpayers on both sides of the Cold War coughed up for the whole cost of a war that never saw any of the expensive hardware used and when a war does happen it is fought with bombs made up of vaporized jet fuel. If the whole war was a false flag then all that cast (that could have been spent by the taxpayers) went straight into the coffers of the same ones that were billing the world for the whole costs of both World Wars. At some point their credit card is going to have to be trimmed back and the money returned to the ones it was stolen from.
 
Murphy
+2
#5
Economically speaking, a cold war is the cat's ass. The munitions industry employs thousands in the US and Russia. Any fighting usually takes place in a third world nation, with the US and Russia supplying whatever 'splosives and guns each side needs. A few advisors from both countries usually are sent in to keep an eye on things, give advice and act as a go between for the two governments.

Of course, the US and Russia must continue to threaten each other in public. This is de rigueur. The constant bickering between the two countries keeps most of their respective populations cowed and suggests to the rest of the world that one country or the other is a threat to world peace.

It's wonderful theatre and a great way to keep things from going over the top.

Remember MAD? Mutually Assured Destruction? Remember how the US and Russia said that they would get rid of their stocks of nuclear wpns? Well, they did, sort off. They got rid of old stock and made more. But wait, they weren't supposed to do that, were they? Well duh, rules are for you and me, not countries. At least, not big countries. Neither side is going to divest itself of nukes. That's just stupid. The other side will have them and that leaves you vulnerable.

It's a game, sort of like chess, only with bones.

Turtle positions everybody! Remember 'Duck and Cover'? We used to call it 'turtle positions' too. Even though this is a US made civil defense film, we saw stuff like this in school. We also used to listen to the emergency test on television every day. Many cities and towns tested their emergency siren every week.

[youtube]120wGLgCTkg[/youtube]
 
Bar Sinister
#6
Russia hasn't got the muscle to face the US. In terms of military spending it has fallen to third place behind China. Per capita even Canada spends more money on its military. And economically the situation is even worse. At the height of the Cold War the USSR had the second highest GNP in the world. Now it ranks 12th, falling behind nations like Canada and south Korea.

What Russia can do it use the internet to post fake news to attempt to manipulate US politics, but now that the Americans have caught onto that trick it is probably going to be less effective in the future. Demonstrations along the borders of weak nations like Estonia might be annoying, but Russia is far from being able to do more than supply rebel movements as the situation in Ukraine illustrates. Any kind of active military action would suck so much money out of its already struggling economy that it would face complete economic collapse.
 
Murphy
#7
It doesn't need the muscle it had years ago. It still has nukes and the capability to launch them. That's all it needs. GNP means nothing. The game isn't played the same as it was in the 1950s and 1960s. But the games continue.
 
Bar Sinister
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by Murphy View Post

It doesn't need the muscle it had years ago. It still has nukes and the capability to launch them. That's all it needs. GNP means nothing. The game isn't played the same as it was in the 1950s and 1960s. But the games continue.

Nuke are a dead end. No nation has used them since 1945 and it is unlikely any nation will. And GNP does matter. No nation can project a global presence without it. Right now Russia's global influence is limited to border states. Just as in many other things, the military runs on money - lots of it.
 
Murphy
+1
#9
It's not the nuke itself. It's the threat of using them.

Remember those wpns of mass destruction? Iran's nuclear buildup? Whether real or imagined, there was sufficient worry to react. You just need a reason. The threat of nukes got the world rolling. The UN ordered inspection teams etc. But what is the UN? Nothing of importance. Still, the world wanted the nukes found and taken out of Iran.

Arms sales, including electronics and nuclear material are "tightly controlled", yet nations still get them. This isn't the 1950s when the USSR was giving away firearms and ammunition to small nations who supported Communism. It's gone uptown. You pay for 'splosives and tech now. More so than in the past. For example, the Saudis purchased a bunch of Chinese made short and medium range missiles. They paid big bux for the privilege. There's serious money to be made from arms sales on all levels. Support and spare parts is also a money maker.

At any rate, conflicts will continue in small places. Money can be made. Anger can be vented. But nothing terrible happens, whatever the outcome.

Threats still make the world go round.

Just one last consideration.

Why did Trump order the MOAB dropped on Afghanistan? It was because if he had dropped it on Damascus, where it should have landed, there would have been consequences. Small, impoverished countries will continue to be used by both sides to play their games.

Why were Tomahawks launched against a small potatoes base of little strategic importance? It was because if he had dropped them on Damascus, where they should have landed, there would have been consequences.

And what reaction did we see from Russia, the UN or anyone else? Words. Just like the Cold War.

Nothing has changed. The games continue.
Last edited by Murphy; May 12th, 2017 at 12:46 AM..
 
MHz
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by Murphy View Post

Economically speaking, a cold war is the cat's ass. The munitions industry employs thousands in the US and Russia. Any fighting usually takes place in a third world nation, with the US and Russia supplying whatever 'splosives and guns each side needs. A few advisors from both countries usually are sent in to keep an eye on things, give advice and act as a go between for the two governments.

Of course, the US and Russia must continue to threaten each other in public. This is de rigueur. The constant bickering between the two countries keeps most of their respective populations cowed and suggests to the rest of the world that one country or the other is a threat to world peace.

It's wonderful theatre and a great way to keep things from going over the top.

Remember MAD? Mutually Assured Destruction? Remember how the US and Russia said that they would get rid of their stocks of nuclear wpns? Well, they did, sort off. They got rid of old stock and made more. But wait, they weren't supposed to do that, were they? Well duh, rules are for you and me, not countries. At least, not big countries. Neither side is going to divest itself of nukes. That's just stupid. The other side will have them and that leaves you vulnerable.

It's a game, sort of like chess, only with bones.

Turtle positions everybody! Remember 'Duck and Cover'? We used to call it 'turtle positions' too. Even though this is a US made civil defense film, we saw stuff like this in school. We also used to listen to the emergency test on television every day. Many cities and towns tested their emergency siren every week.

The world should hope this place is as close as you get to your insane version of the perfect world. That only works for a long time if they have the right to come to your house and act like they have been trained to. Suddenly help would be needed by the two-faced hybrocrats that currently are the blessed by the World Bank. You can tell them by the unlimited debt they are allowed to pile up. It might take the citizens 250 years to pay it back but the bank will try to get every cent.
 
Murphy
#11
You're an idiot. Where did I say that this was my "insane version of a perfect world"? I will type slowly, so you understand.

This is what the world does. Munitions manufacturing is big business. Playing with small nations is SOP. Okay? I did not decide that this is the way the games will be played.

The world bank and marching into my house aren't my concern. I cannot influence high finance. WRT the weapons themselves, I do not hold any secrets, patents, or inside knowledge, so I doubt that they will bother me. Wherever these crazy figures and ramblings of yours come from, you should leave them there and not declare them to the world. The black ops people will take you out for telling their secrets...

Now, as others have said in the past, and I will too, take your medication. You really need it.
 
MHz
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by Murphy View Post


Nothing has changed. The games continue.

That's not true, they are operating on plans that were drawn up 100 years ago. People are able to talk more and the more that happens the more lies show up for what they really are. The revolutions in the past came from the university section and those were radical revolts. The liars backed down before it became a mob. If the mainstream media doesn't cover it then it didn't happen doesn't work like it did for Vietnam and similar wars.

The rumor has it that 2/3 of the US Military budget is spend exerting control over the oil-fields, for big business interests that are fully controlled by the World Banks. Another little stab in the back for the American taxpayers, not even a special occasion.
 
Murphy
#13
Your delusional IMO. When people like yourself rant and rave, it suggests a loose connection with reality or a bad drug or alcohol problem.

Argue with the other patients. You can design a rocket ship that will take you and the rest of the unhinged to the moon to live. It's quiet there. The voices in your head won't have to shout so loud to be heard.
 
MHz
#14
Not one point in your rant would be considered to be the right way to run a sane country. The karma for the unsolicited killing of others is usually your own society suffering the same fate, starting from the inside. In our case in innocent ploy we have been playing for some time isn't as real as we promote. That also means the nations or groups that are promoted as being our enemy are probably not as bad as they are made out to be. We are more dangerous than we admit so that even means what we say cannot be trusted. You must see lots to be proud of in there but I don't and never have so it is unlikely my mind is going to change.
You can keep putting liars up on pedestals all day long, there is a never ending supply. These day they don't last very long before they are exposed as such.
 
Murphy
#15
I've wasted too much time on you. Ignored.
 
Bar Sinister
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by Murphy View Post

It's not the nuke itself. It's the threat of using them.

Remember those wpns of mass destruction? Iran's nuclear buildup? Whether real or imagined, there was sufficient worry to react. You just need a reason. The threat of nukes got the world rolling. The UN ordered inspection teams etc. But what is the UN? Nothing of importance. Still, the world wanted the nukes found and taken out of Iran.

Arms sales, including electronics and nuclear material are "tightly controlled", yet nations still get them. This isn't the 1950s when the USSR was giving away firearms and ammunition to small nations who supported Communism. It's gone uptown. You pay for 'splosives and tech now. More so than in the past. For example, the Saudis purchased a bunch of Chinese made short and medium range missiles. They paid big bux for the privilege. There's serious money to be made from arms sales on all levels. Support and spare parts is also a money maker.

At any rate, conflicts will continue in small places. Money can be made. Anger can be vented. But nothing terrible happens, whatever the outcome.

Threats still make the world go round.

Just one last consideration.

Why did Trump order the MOAB dropped on Afghanistan? It was because if he had dropped it on Damascus, where it should have landed, there would have been consequences. Small, impoverished countries will continue to be used by both sides to play their games.

Why were Tomahawks launched against a small potatoes base of little strategic importance? It was because if he had dropped them on Damascus, where they should have landed, there would have been consequences.

And what reaction did we see from Russia, the UN or anyone else? Words. Just like the Cold War.

Nothing has changed. The games continue.

Certainly there has been an effort to reduce the number of nuclear weapons in the world and to prevent others from acquiring them, however that noes not refute the fact that nuclear weapons for all their destructive potential, are probably the most useless weapons ever invented.

The reason for this is the fact that such weapons can only be safely used against a nation that does not have them due to the fear of nuclear retaliation, but such an act would bring down the condemnation of the world on the user, probably including its own citizens.

In any case that does not change the fact that modern Russia is nowhere near the global threat it was during the Cold War. It is a nation essentially governed by organized criminals and corrupt bureaucrats, with an economy dependent on a single resource, oil. In addition its population is only 50% of the number it had as the USSR, and young Russians are leaving the country in droves in search of a better life elsewhere. The country is really a spent force still trying to play superpower and longing for the good old days when it actually was one.
 
Curious Cdn
+2
#17
No wonder Trump wants to break up NATO. He has been told to do so by those who own his sorry ass.
 
Danbones
#18
soros the nazi hates both nato and trump
loves the great CC though

(works for free!...that's VALUE!)

Quote:

but such an act would bring down the condemnation of the world on the user, probably including its own citizens.

...yes, ever since hiroshima...
 
Curious Cdn
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by Danbones View Post

soros the nazi hates both nato and trump
loves the great CC though

(works for free!...that's VALUE!)


...yes, ever since hiroshima...

... babbling incoherently, yet again ....
 
Danbones
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by Bar Sinister View Post

Nuke are a dead end. No nation has used them since 1945 and it is unlikely any nation will. And GNP does matter. No nation can project a global presence without it. Right now Russia's global influence is limited to border states. Just as in many other things, the military runs on money - lots of it.

Hiroshima To Iraq - 61 Years Of Uranium Wars A Suicidal, Genocidal, Omnicidal Course
Hiroshima To Iraq - 61 Years Of Uranium Wars A Suicidal, Genocidal, Omnicidal Course

do you do any reading or thinking before you post?


Quote: Originally Posted by Curious Cdn View Post

... babbling incoherently, yet again ....

Hey stoopid! hows it going on the DI ( lol, welfare!) list?
leg fall off yet?

WE are not going to ask you if you do any reading or thinking before you post
...we saw the response time on the last one
we already know the answer is NOPE!
 
lone wolf
#21
Who needs nukes? Thermobaric leaves the land livable - when everything grows back, that is
 
Murphy
#22
Nukes instill fear. That makes them valuable. That's why countries like Israel, Iran, China, NK, etc. keep building them.

WRT other kinds of explosives, should a city, say Damascus for example, have a few non-nuclear big blast bombs dropped on it, and the devastation was impressive, it won't lessen anyone's opinion of the power and destructive capability of nukes. These other bombs would add to the fear because of what they can do. But we haven't seen any used on a city yet.

So it wouldn't only be nukes that cause worry. There would be additional ways to eliminate lots of people and their habitat. There is the advantage of no fallout, but nukes will be around for a while. I wouldn't give up my uranium shares quite yet.
 
monty1
#23
Russia and China are standing in the way of US march to empire. Demonization of Russia/Putin is the method being used to get Russia out of the way. And a US missile 'offense' system on the Korean peninsula is the method being used to intimidate China right now.

There was a window of opportunity opened for the US when the Soviet Union fell. That window has now been slammed shut. And besides that to make matters even worse, Obama screwed up the PNAC plan when he signed on with Putin for the deal to get rid of Syria's chem/bio weapons. Also, Obama got his country involved in the peace deal with Iran and now the US legitimacy for it's planned war has been blown.
 
pgs
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by monty1 View Post

Russia and China are standing in the way of US march to empire. Demonization of Russia/Putin is the method being used to get Russia out of the way. And a US missile 'offense' system on the Korean peninsula is the method being used to intimidate China right now.

There was a window of opportunity opened for the US when the Soviet Union fell. That window has now been slammed shut. And besides that to make matters even worse, Obama screwed up the PNAC plan when he signed on with Putin for the deal to get rid of Syria's chem/bio weapons. Also, Obama got his country involved in the peace deal with Iran and now the US legitimacy for it's planned war has been blown.

U.S. march to Empire , OK . Best go back to mom's basement and play with your dolls .
 
Murphy
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by pgs View Post

U.S. march to Empire , OK . Best go back to mom's basement and play with your dolls .

Yeah,I thought that was funny too.

 
Bar Sinister
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by Danbones View Post

Hiroshima To Iraq - 61 Years Of Uranium Wars A Suicidal, Genocidal, Omnicidal Course
Hiroshima To Iraq - 61 Years Of Uranium Wars A Suicidal, Genocidal, Omnicidal Course

do you do any reading or thinking before you post

Your usual rubbish answer. The post was clearly intended to be about thermonuclear war. The use of deleted uranium weaponry hardly compares. But what else would I expect from you except your usual misinterpretation of the facts?
 
Curious Cdn
#27
So, Putin and Trump are going to meet together at another summit in Paris on Nov.11th 2018.

http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/put ... li=AAggFp5

Apparently, they are to meet in an old rail car in the Forest of Compiègne where Vladimir Putin will bring some documents for the POTUS to sign.
 
MHz
#28
What does it mean when Putin says, 'there won't be time to repent' when nuclear war is the topic?
 
MHz
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by Curious Cdn View Post

Apparently, they are to meet in an old rail car in the Forest of Compiègne where Vladimir Putin will bring some documents for the POTUS to sign.

Really, surrender of the US of A or ones that Putin has already signed??



Remembrance Day in a country that had turned tail in every war since 1815 when Napoleon was told to 'take a dive' so the 'home team' could buy the English Stock Market for 'pennies on the million dollar stocks'
 
Torch light
#30
These American and Russian are playing with nuclear fire!