The hereafter..life after death ..science study reveals


Goober
#1
Largest study into near-death experiences discovers awareness may continue even after the brain shuts down | National Post

LONDON — There may be a small amount of life after death, scientists believe.

The largest ever medical study into near-death and out-of-body experiences has discovered that awareness may continue even after the brain has shut down completely.

It is a controversial theory which has, until recently, been treated with widespread skepticism.

Scientists at the University of Southampton spent four years examining more than 2,000 people who suffered cardiac arrests at 15 hospitals in the U.K., U.S. and Austria.

They found that nearly 40% of those who survived described some kind of “awareness” during the time when they were clinically dead before their hearts were restarted.

One man even recalled leaving his body entirely and watching his resuscitation from the corner of the room.

Despite being unconscious and “dead” for three minutes the 57-year-old social worker from Southampton, recounted the actions of the nursing staff in detail and described the sound of the machines.

“We know the brain can’t function when the heart has stopped beating,” said Dr. Sam Parnia, a former Southampton University research fellow now based at the State University of New York, who led the study.

“But in this case conscious awareness appears to have continued for up to three minutes into the period when the heart wasn’t beating, even though the brain typically shuts down within 20-30 seconds after the heart has stopped.

“The man described everything that had happened in the room, but importantly, he heard two bleeps from a machine that makes a noise at three-minute intervals.

“So we could time how long the experienced lasted for.

“He seemed very credible and everything that he said had happened to him had actually happened.”

Of 2,060 cardiac arrest patients studied, 330 survived and 140 said they had experienced some kind of awareness while being resuscitated.

Although many could not recall specific details, some themes emerged.

One in five said they had felt an unusual sense of peacefulness while nearly one third said time had slowed down or speeded up.

A higher proportion of people may have vivid death experiences, but do not recall them due to the effects of brain injury or sedative drugs on memory circuits

Some recalled seeing a bright light; a golden flash or the sun shining.

Others recounted feelings of fear or drowning or being dragged through deep water. In addition 13 per cent had felt separated from their bodies and the same number said their senses had been heightened.

Dr. Parnia believes many more people may have experiences when they are close to death but drugs or sedatives used in the process of resuscitation may stop them remembering.

“Estimates have suggested that millions of people have had vivid experiences in relation to death but the scientific evidence has been ambiguous at best.

“Many people have assumed that these were hallucinations or illusions but they do seem to correspond to actual events.

“And a higher proportion of people may have vivid death experiences, but do not recall them due to the effects of brain injury or sedative drugs on memory circuits.

“These experiences warrant further investigation.”

Dr. David Wilde, a research psychologist at Nottingham Trent University, is compiling data about out-of-body experiences in an attempt to discover a pattern which links each episode. He hopes the latest research will encourage new studies into the controversial topic.

Most studies look retrospectively, 10 or 20 years ago, but the researchers went out looking for examples and used a really large sample size, so this gives the work a lot of validity.

“Most studies look retrospectively, 10 or 20 years ago, but the researchers went out looking for examples and used a really large sample size, so this gives the work a lot of validity.

“There is some very good evidence here that these experiences are actually happening after people have medically died,” Dr. Wilde said.

“We just don’t know what is going on. We are still very much in the dark about what happens when you die and hopefully this study will help shine a scientific lens onto that.”

The study was published in the journal Resuscitation.

Dr. Jerry Nolan, editor-in-chief at Resuscitation, said: “Dr. Parnia and his colleagues are to be congratulated on the completion of a fascinating study that will open the door to more extensive research into what happens when we die.”
 
Twila
+2
#2
Near death is not the same as life after death...without oxygen the brain will die in 4-6 minutes.

Quote:

But in this case conscious awareness appears to have continued for up to three minutes into the period when the heart wasn’t beating, even though the brain typically shuts down within 20-30 seconds after the heart has stopped.

I think the writer is using error of omission to sell articles. The brain doesn't fully shut down. That would be death. Therefore it's still active and can still imagine.
 
Goober
#3
Quote: Originally Posted by Twila View Post

Near death is not the same as life after death...without oxygen the brain will die in 4-6 minutes.



I think the writer is using error of omission to sell articles. The brain doesn't fully shut down. That would be death. Therefore it's still active and can still imagine.




This I believe is the study- poached from another board.

http://www.alphagalileo.org/AssetVie...CultureCode=en

a b s t r a c t
Background:
Cardiac arrest (CA) survivors experience cognitive deficits including post-traumatic stress
disorder (PTSD). It is unclear whether these are related to cognitive/mental experiences and awareness
during CPR. Despite anecdotal reports the broad range of cognitive/mental experiences and awareness
associated with CPR has not been systematically studied.
Methods:
The incidence and validity of awareness together with the range, characteristics and themes
relating to memories/cognitive processes during CA was investigated through a 4 year multi-center
observational study using a three stage quantitative and qualitative interview system. The feasibility
of objectively testing the accuracy of claims of visual and auditory awareness was examined using spe-
cific tests. The outcome measures were (1) awareness/memories during CA and (2) objective verification
of claims of awareness using specific tests.
Results:
Among 2060 CA events, 140 survivors completed stage 1 interviews, while 101 of 140 patients
completed stage 2 interviews. 46% had memories with 7 major cognitive themes: fear; animals/plants;
bright light; violence/persecution; deja-vu; family; recalling events post-CA and 9% had NDEs, while 2%
described awareness with explicit recall of ‘seeing’ and ‘hearing’ actual events related to their resusci-
tation. One had a verifiable period of conscious awareness during which time cerebral function was not
expected.
 
WLDB
#4
Yeah they did it on people who's hearts have stopped. Their brains were still functioning. Thats not dead. Now if they manage to bring back a person who's brain has shut down completely, well then there may be something interesting regardless of if the person was 'self aware' during that period.
 
darkbeaver
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by Twila View Post

Near death is not the same as life after death...without oxygen the brain will die in 4-6 minutes.
I think the writer is using error of omission to sell articles. The brain doesn't fully shut down. That would be death. Therefore it's still active and can still imagine.

The meat is not the mind.


Is Consciousness More than the Brain? | Interview with Dr. Gary Schwartz
October 2, 2014 by B Talbott
Today, perhaps the ultimate unsolved mystery of human life is: how and why does consciousness exist? Although some scientific literature still acknowledges that the question remains open, the overwhelming consensus among neuroscientists today is that the brain alone creates conscious experience. … Continue reading →
 
damngrumpy
#6
Near death is experiencing a near shutdown not a total shutdown and there in lies
the difference. The only way we will know is if someone fully dies and at some
point comes back after a week to real death and speaks out even then it would have
to be proven life after death scientists are really closet creationists or of some religious
belief system. The are proving on conclusion rather than exploring the what if and the
real issue what happens open mindedly
 
Goober
+1
#7
Anyone read the study before going into a set mind set?
“But in this case conscious awareness appears to have continued for up to three minutes into the period when the heart wasn’t beating, even though the brain typically shuts down within 20-30 seconds after the heart has stopped.

“The man described everything that had happened in the room, but importantly, he heard two bleeps from a machine that makes a noise at three-minute intervals.

“So we could time how long the experienced lasted for.

“He seemed very credible and everything that he said had happened to him had actually happened.”

Of 2,060 cardiac arrest patients studied, 330 survived and 140 said they had experienced some kind of awareness while being resuscitated.

Although many could not recall specific details, some themes emerged.

One in five said they had felt an unusual sense of peacefulness while nearly one third said time had slowed down or speeded up.
 
Tonington
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by Twila View Post

Near death is not the same as life after death...without oxygen the brain will die in 4-6 minutes.

The brain will start to die at that point, but not fully. People can be resuscitated long after that, especially if their core temperature has been brought down.

After a heart attack, I'm not surprised that the brain could retain some functions. Nerve impulses can still take place. I see dead fish at work twitch all the time when we're taking samples, and long after euthanasia.

Those nerve impulses require oxygen, and even though the heart is no longer pumping, there's going to be oxygen in the blood that surrounds all your bodies tissues, not just oxygen but electrolytes, signalling molecules, etc, etc. The sudden jolt of the heart starting and getting things working again, who knows what that does.

I wouldn't go so far to call it life after death...but there's a whole lot we don't know.
 
Twila
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by Goober View Post

Anyone read the study before going into a set mind set?
“But in this case conscious awareness appears to have continued for up to three minutes into the period when the heart wasn’t beating, even though the brain typically shuts down within 20-30 seconds after the heart has stopped.

I did read it. I disagree with what their saying about the brain shutting down within 20-30 seconds. It doesn't. You loose conciousness, but your unconcious mind is still working. It's still registering what's going on around it. Like a coma patient. It's near death is only the time before you die. You haven't actually died and therefore any experience is while living...

6 functions of the subconcious mind
Quote:

Six functions of the unconscious mind
1 memory bank
The unconscious is link the store room of the mind all memories are store by association and every memory we have is stored there. Some of these memories are hard to retrieve consciously and others are easy. We can get access to these memories using hypnotic regression techniques. Some of these memories maybe real events and others may be fantasy or misinterpretation.

2 Controls bodily functions
the unconscious keeps a check on the body and tries to keep it in balance so that we are not to hot or cold it tells us when we need to eat drink go to the toilet it protects us by monitoring our immune system and sympathetic nervous system it contracts and relaxes our muscle when we move with out even have to think about it.

3 Seat of emotion
The emotions we feel are generated by our unconscious and then we get a feeling at the unconscious level. If we have two conflicting emotions the strongest one will always win

4 seat of imagination
Imagination will always over come will power. Your imagination can work for you or against you if you do not learn how to use it in the right way.

5 Stores habits
We go through a process of learning that take us through unconscious incompetence, conscious incompetence, and conscious in competence, conscious competence and unconscious competence. Once we go through these stages an activity becomes a habit.

6 Directs our energy
the unconscious mind will direct energy to were ever it is told to this could be good or bad because the unconscious mind does not have a way to know which is which it just chooses the easiest way to possible to direct the energy. It carries out orders with out thinking about it and

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington View Post

The brain will start to die at that point, but not fully. People can be resuscitated long after that, especially if their core temperature has been brought down.

After a heart attack, I'm not surprised that the brain could retain some functions. Nerve impulses can still take place. I see dead fish at work twitch all the time when we're taking samples, and long after euthanasia.

Those nerve impulses require oxygen, and even though the heart is no longer pumping, there's going to be oxygen in the blood that surrounds all your bodies tissues, not just oxygen but electrolytes, signalling molecules, etc, etc. The sudden jolt of the heart starting and getting things working again, who knows what that does.

I wouldn't go so far to call it life after death...but there's a whole lot we don't know.

oh right. Like people who've suffered hypothermia.

The muscles will twitch with electrical impulse too. I've seen meat contract when given a jolt. It's possible adrenaline amplifies electrical impulses causing twitching.

Soya sauce causes octopus muscles to contract.

Warning: this video can be disturbing. The octopus IS dead though
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxQmOR_QLfQ
 
Tonington
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by Twila View Post


oh right. Like people who've suffered hypothermia.

Also, we should note that these survivors, were receiving CPR. Their bodies are receiving a lot of intervention to bring them back, including hormones, oxygen, and most importantly, compression to bring circulation to the heart and brain.
 
Cliffy
+3
#11  Top Rated Post
Quote: Originally Posted by Goober View Post

Of 2,060 cardiac arrest patients studied, 330 survived and 140 said they had experienced some kind of awareness while being resuscitated.

People confuse awareness and consciousness with brain function. They are not necessarily the same thing. The body runs on two separate systems, one automatic and another requires the brain to give it commands: the heart and stomach act independent of thought but walking and eating require active commands from the brain. The heart, for example has its own form of consciousness and acts independent of the brain, You cannot will it to act. You must will your hand to act though. Everything in your body, down to the molecular level has its own form of consciousness and your whole body's consciousness is the sum total of all those independent forms of consciousness plus something more - thought.

It is the old story about the man who ducks to pick up something from the ground just as an arrow misses him and imbeds in a tree in front of him. His brain is not aware of the arrow headed his way but his body was. In a near death experience, the brain and heart may not be functioning but the consciousness of the body is. The real question is: what happens to that consciousness after the entire body stops functioning? The brain is a computer that receives and stores data, much like a hard drive. Some people have been known to be brain dead but their body is still alive or can be kept alive with machines.

We have all met people in our lives who for all intents and purposes were brain dead but still somehow function out in the world. We may even have one or two who post on these forums (no I won't name names). The point is, the brain is not the seat of consciousness, the entire body is.
 
JLM
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by Cliffy View Post

People confuse awareness and consciousness with brain function. They are not necessarily the same thing. The body runs on two separate systems, one automatic and another requires the brain to give it commands: the heart and stomach act independent of thought but walking and eating require active commands from the brain. The heart, for example has its own form of consciousness and acts independent of the brain, You cannot will it to act. You must will your hand to act though. Everything in your body, down to the molecular level has its own form of consciousness and your whole body's consciousness is the sum total of all those independent forms of consciousness plus something more - thought.

It is the old story about the man who ducks to pick up something from the ground just as an arrow misses him and imbeds in a tree in front of him. His brain is not aware of the arrow headed his way but his body was. In a near death experience, the brain and heart may not be functioning but the consciousness of the body is. The real question is: what happens to that consciousness after the entire body stops functioning? The brain is a computer that receives and stores data, much like a hard drive. Some people have been known to be brain dead but their body is still alive or can be kept alive with machines.

We have all met people in our lives who for all intents and purposes were brain dead but still somehow function out in the world. We may even have one or two who post on these forums (no I won't name names). The point is, the brain is not the seat of consciousness, the entire body is.


Good post, Cliffy. I think those people who you mention are brain dead for all intents and purposes are known as politicians, and the ones in this forum are the various Bible freaks who I won't name (their names appear above the scripture that are copied and pasted) -
 
Cliffy
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by JLM View Post

Good post, Cliffy. I think those people who you mention are brain dead for all intents and purposes are known as politicians, and the ones in this forum are the various Bible freaks who I won't name (their names appear above the scripture that are copied and pasted) -

A friend of mine says politicians have to hand in their brain in at the door when they enter parliament and put it back in the skulls when they leave. Sometimes, if they stay too long, sometimes their brains get lost.
 
JLM
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by Cliffy View Post

A friend of mine says politicians have to hand in their brain in at the door when they enter parliament and put it back in the skulls when they leave. Sometimes, if they stay too long, sometimes their brains get lost.


I tend to agree with that, Politicians right from day one do what they are told. Every jurisdiction has "big money" and that's where the orders come from.
 
Blackleaf
#15
Many people have reported floating above their body when they are dead. They see themselves lying on, say, the hospital bed down below, dead. This has happened when they are actually dead for a few minutes (people have actually died and been resuscitated) and, according to doctors, there should be no brain activity at all.

And there is overwhelming evidence that this floating above the body DOES occur, because the person often sees something which they wouldn't have seen had they just been imagining it or lying. I remember once hearing about a woman in hospital who had actually been dead for a few minutes, a period of time when it was impossible for her to hallucinate anything, but during the time she was dead she remembers floating above her physical body near to the ceiling in the hospital room. She was so high up that she rememebred that, for some reason, there was a boot lying on top of a cupboard in the room. It was impossible to see the boot from ground level. When she was rescusitated she told the doctors there was a boot on top of the cupboard, and when the doctors checked it was actually there. There was no other way the woman could have known that the boot - which somebody, for some reason, had thrown onto the top of the cupboard - was on the cupboard.

Another example is a man who came into the hospital already blue from a lack of oxygen. The hospital staff spent 90 minutes trying to resuscitate him, using artificial respiration, heart massage and defibrillation, before they could move him to intensive care where he was remained in a coma for a week with brain damage. But when the patient regained consciousness, he was able to describe events that occurred around him while he was brain damaged and out of his body. This veridical evidence comes from a coronary-care-unit nurse who reported the veridical out-of-body experience of the comatose patient:

During a night shift an ambulance brings in a 44-year-old cyanotic, comatose man into the coronary care unit. He had been found about an hour before in a meadow by passers-by. After admission, he receives artificial respiration without intubation, while heart massage and defibrillation are also applied. When we wanted to intubate the patient, he turns out to have dentures in his mouth. I remove these upper dentures and put them onto the crash car. Meanwhile, we continue extensive CPR. After about an hour and a half the patient has sufficient heart rhythm and blood pressure, but he is still ventilated and intubated, and he is still comatose. He is transferred to the intensive care unit to continue the necessary artificial respiration. Only after more than a week do I meet again with the patient, who is by now back on the cardiac ward. I distribute his medication. The moment he sees me he says:

"Oh, that nurse knows where my dentures are."

I am very surprised. Then he elucidates:

"Yes, you were there when I was brought into hospital and you took my dentures out of my mouth and put them onto that car. I t had all these bottles on it and there was this sliding drawer underneath and there you put my teeth."

I was especially amazed because I remembered this happening while the man was in deep coma and in the process of CPR. When I asked further, it appeared the man had seen himself lying in bed, that he had perceived from above how nurses and doctors had been busy with CPR. He was also able to describe correctly and in detail the small room in which he had been resuscitated as well as the appearance of those present like myself. At the time that he observed the situation he had been very much afraid that we would stop CPR and that he would die. And it is true that we had been very negative about the patient's prognosis due to his very poor medical condition when admitted. The patient tells me that he desperately and unsuccessfully tried to make it clear to us that he was still alive and that we should continue CPR. He is deeply impressed by his experience and says he is no longer afraid of death. Four weeks later he left hospital as a healthy man. ( Dr. Pim Van Lommel )

http://www.near-death.com/experiences/research11.html
Last edited by Blackleaf; Oct 8th, 2014 at 06:18 AM..
 
darkbeaver
#16
Life after death?Yes of course. Death is a new begining of life, you will reincarnate untill your tax load has been met. Death is not the escape you had hoped for. Hang on, be obstinant, avoid the low hanging fruit, reach for the higher stuff, claw your way into the future.
 

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