Does being under supernatural control exonerate Eve of any sin?


French Patriot
+1 / -1
#1
Does being under supernatural control exonerate Eve of any sin?

Eve was unjustly punished because she was under supernatural control in a set of circumstances that God himself set up by putting Satan in Eden.

God put Satan in Eden to insure that Eve ate and gave him the power to deceive Eve. She could not resist God's power directed through Satan and thus Eve had no choice but to eat of the tree of knowledge. She, like the snake, were under supernatural control and thus innocent of any wrong-doing.

Eve fails the criteria of mens rea, Latin for evil intent,a fundamental requirement of secular and biblical law, and thus Eve was innocent of any wrong-doing.

No human judge in his right mind would have judged A & E the way God did as God set the conditions that insured that A & E also died from neglect and the locking away of the tree of life. That was murder.

Does being under supernatural control exonerate Eve of any sin?

Did Eve have free will while under supernatural control?

Regards
DL





































Last edited by French Patriot; Jan 31st, 2014 at 10:35 AM..
 
EagleSmack
+2 / -1
#2
Free Will.

THREAD CLOSED.

Meanwhile Enjoy these clips of Wildebeests crossing the Mara.

Wildebeest Crossing the Mara River - YouTube

Wildebeest crossing Mara river - YouTube

Gnu Crossing am Mara River - wildebeest crossing at the Mara-River - YouTube

Wildebeest Migration Mara River Crossing - YouTube
 
cj44
-1
#3
Frenchie, They truly had Free Will as Eaglesmack says. God gave them free will - legitimate free will.
By the way, A&E did not die of neglect. God actually clothed them (cared for them).
I think what we need to do is find out why you want to lynch God.
Now I am beginning to see why the wildebeest always appear.
 
L Gilbert
+5
#4
There's gnuthing gnu under the sun. C'mon, dudes, leave Frenchie P. alone. He's gotta have fun, too.
 
Spade
+6
#5  Top Rated Post
Quote: Originally Posted by L Gilbert View Post

There's gnuthing gnu under the sun. C'mon, dudes, leave Frenchie P. alone. He's gotta have fun, too.

Well said. Frenchie posts a riddle. Before Eve tasted of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, she was innocent. So, how could she commit the act of eating the fruit.

Mythbuster?
 
JLM
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by French Patriot View Post

Does being under supernatural control exonerate Eve of any sin?








How does any of this matter?


















 
Serryah
+2
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by Spade View Post

Well said. Frenchie posts a riddle. Before Eve tasted of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, she was innocent. So, how could she commit the act of eating the fruit.

Mythbuster?



Mind blown.

Sending you the bill, Spade.

Yours, Sister Serryah
 
L Gilbert
#8
lol Add interest and specify the damage in detail.
 
Serryah
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by L Gilbert View Post

lol Add interest and specify the damage in detail.

LOL - That could be dangerous describing detail.
 
DaSleeper
+1 / -1
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by EagleSmack View Post

Free Will.

THREAD CLOSED.

Meanwhile Enjoy these clips of Wildebeests crossing the Mara.

Wildebeest Crossing the Mara River - YouTube

Wildebeest crossing Mara river - YouTube

Gnu Crossing am Mara River - wildebeest crossing at the Mara-River - YouTube

Wildebeest Migration Mara River Crossing - YouTube




































 
Walter
#11
I see Cheese Eating Surrender Monkey Patriot is at his Christianphobic best today. God bless'm.
 
MHz
#12
No, repenting the sin would take the sin away as would taking a trip to the grave.
Judas was free from his sin when he repented, he couldn't forgive himself though so he suicided himself. I just hope the rope broke his neck before the branch broke and caused him to fall over a cliff to boot.
 
French Patriot
-1
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by cj44 View Post

Frenchie, They truly had Free Will as Eaglesmack says. God gave them free will - legitimate free will.
By the way, A&E did not die of neglect. God actually clothed them (cared for them).
I think what we need to do is find out why you want to lynch God.
Now I am beginning to see why the wildebeest always appear.


You begin to see he cannot think. Good.


Instead of animals he should use something like this.


Women Part 1 - YouTube


But that would not suit his evil intent. Enough of idiots.


-----------------------


Can you have a free will or do a free choice when a huge threat like death is hanging over one of the choices?
Are coercion, threats and commands not things that nullify free choice?



I agree that God clothed them by doing the first killing on earth. In the myth that is. Note how Adam is blamed for that instead of the real perpetrator.


The thing is though, oven after that, God still deliberately kept A & E from the tree of life and cause the death of A & E.


That would be murder in todays courts.

Regards
DL

Quote: Originally Posted by JLM View Post

How does any of this matter?













































Look at that link above then ask your wife what other myth has been used so well over time to denigrate and discriminate against women.
It continues even today.


Most men do not care as they profit from the status quo and most have poor morals and do not fight for the rights of women.


The fact that you have to ask adds to my position.


Regards
DL




































 
lone wolf
+1
#14
She said NO again, huh?
 
DaSleeper
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by French Patriot View Post



Regards
DL






































































































































































































 
Goober
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by French Patriot View Post

Does being under supernatural control exonerate Eve of any sin?

Eve was unjustly punished because she was under supernatural control in a set of circumstances that God himself set up by putting Satan in Eden.

God put Satan in Eden to insure that Eve ate and gave him the power to deceive Eve. She could not resist God's power directed through Satan and thus Eve had no choice but to eat of the tree of knowledge. She, like the snake, were under supernatural control and thus innocent of any wrong-doing.

Eve fails the criteria of mens rea, Latin for evil intent,a fundamental requirement of secular and biblical law, and thus Eve was innocent of any wrong-doing.

No human judge in his right mind would have judged A & E the way God did as God set the conditions that insured that A & E also died from neglect and the locking away of the tree of life. That was murder.

Does being under supernatural control exonerate Eve of any sin?

Did Eve have free will while under supernatural control?

Regards
DL

Its the code 86?
;/r uu;usyrilggfdf;'gd'oi0pr'e[fo[9y89853upreighjkj;wp00496'po4tiugj'klg'gggklkjhgfw uiruqeglr hgiv ibuiiiiiiiiii9u8p0y8yooooooooooooooooyup8ysupy;zhj ;u'upu fmnbrtvpsortmsbo;sr oto t;or;otmatnv;mtro7atuu49895[07[bn79mbambv[9ntv08'm[zt'an[t8atvat000-3-0r48[mtn47vt4[0n9b;;btmatbans79nb78rtr
 
Spade
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by Serryah View Post



Mind blown.

Sending you the bill, Spade.

Yours, Sister Serryah

Cheque's in the mail!
Your brother,
Spade
 
cj44
#18
Frenchie,
I think I will play along to see if we can bring this business to some sort of resolve.
Ok. So, yah da da, blah de blah, God according to you is evil and you "prove" it here because God didn't stop Eve from gobbling down the apple nor did he stop Satan. If God be God, and if he be a "good" god he should stop all evil and never allowed any evil. Well....that is about as far as I can go with this notion. I don't agree with your opinion, I think you underestimate the capacities God gave Adam & Eve. He did not revoke those capacities when he saw them about to take a very wrong turn. Anyway,
WHAT IS YOUR POINT???? I thought you were an atheist? Why do you have it out for the Biblical God.

Ahhh.. I recant for a moment. Well, I recant in part. I will grant you that you have a valid question in there somewhere. Why did God allow things to unfold as he did? Why did he not prevent all the "evil". Why did he not end the "experiment". What sort of God is this? Well, these are valid questions.
 
GreenFish66
+1
#19



Forbidden-Eden(F-Eden)


Eden.
Heaven Above.
Help Us;
Save This Love.

Raven.
Eye's Above.
Save us;
From The Forbidden One-1.

________________________

Wasn't it Eve who tempted Adam?

Damn Women are always to blame...Instigate everything...Pure EVIL!..The Ultimate Temptation.
Last edited by GreenFish66; Feb 1st, 2014 at 06:06 PM..
 
Serryah
+1
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by Spade View Post

Cheque's in the mail!
Your brother,
Spade

Thank you.

At least I don't have carpets.

Sister Serryah
 
French Patriot
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by cj44 View Post

Frenchie,
I think I will play along to see if we can bring this business to some sort of resolve.
Ok. So, yah da da, blah de blah, God according to you is evil and you "prove" it here because God didn't stop Eve from gobbling down the apple nor did he stop Satan. If God be God, and if he be a "good" god he should stop all evil and never allowed any evil. Well....that is about as far as I can go with this notion. I don't agree with your opinion, I think you underestimate the capacities God gave Adam & Eve. He did not revoke those capacities when he saw them about to take a very wrong turn. Anyway,
WHAT IS YOUR POINT???? I thought you were an atheist? Why do you have it out for the Biblical God.

Ahhh.. I recant for a moment. Well, I recant in part. I will grant you that you have a valid question in there somewhere. Why did God allow things to unfold as he did? Why did he not prevent all the "evil". Why did he not end the "experiment". What sort of God is this? Well, these are valid questions.



Yes they are.


First. A & E did not sin as it is a virtue to ignore really dumb commands to stay in ignorant bliss and quite stupid. Not even bright enough to know you are naked.


Second. God, even if A & E did sin, over reacted and murdered them through neglect and locking away what would keep them alive. The tree of life.


I am not an atheist. I am a Gnostic Christian and we have traditionally judged that the Christians are quite immoral in their beliefs.


I offer the reasons why and Christians are not refuting anything as they cannot.


I am sure you have noticed that here. They bitch a lot but cannot refute anything I say as iut is all true and moral.


Regards
DL

Quote: Originally Posted by GreenFish66 View Post




Forbidden-Eden(F-Eden)


Eden.
Heaven Above.
Help Us;
Save This Love.

Raven.
Eye's Above.
Save us;
From The Forbidden One-1.

________________________

Wasn't it Eve who tempted Adam?

Damn Women are always to blame...Instigate everything...Pure EVIL!..The Ultimate Temptation.



Tempted! You mean saved from being a moron for all of his life.


Without the knowledge of good and evil, one has the knowledge of almost nothing.


Regards
DL
 
cj44
#22
Frenchie, Why do you call yourself a gnostic Christian. Why use the word Christian?
 
L Gilbert
+1
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by cj44 View Post

Frenchie, Why do you call yourself a gnostic Christian. Why use the word Christian?

"Gnosticism is primarily defined in a Christian context.[6][7] In the past, some scholars thought that gnosticism predated Christianity and included pre-Christian religious beliefs and spiritual practices argued to be common to early Christianity, Neoplatonism, Hellenistic Judaism, Greco-Roman mystery religions, and Zoroastrianism (especially Zurvanism). The discussion of gnosticism changed radically with the discovery of the Nag Hammadi library and led to a revision of older assumptions. To date, no pre-Christian gnostic texts have been found,[8] and gnosticism as a unique and recognizable belief system is typically considered to be a second century (or later) development.[9]" - wiki
 
DaSleeper
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by eaglesmack View Post

free will.

Thread closed.

Meanwhile enjoy these clips of wildebeests crossing the mara.

wildebeest crossing the mara river - youtube

wildebeest crossing mara river - youtube

gnu crossing am mara river - wildebeest crossing at the mara-river - youtube

wildebeest migration mara river crossing - youtube


bump!
 
darkbeaver
+1
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by L Gilbert View Post

"Gnosticism is primarily defined in a Christian context.[6][7] In the past, some scholars thought that gnosticism predated Christianity and included pre-Christian religious beliefs and spiritual practices argued to be common to early Christianity, Neoplatonism, Hellenistic Judaism, Greco-Roman mystery religions, and Zoroastrianism (especially Zurvanism). The discussion of gnosticism changed radically with the discovery of the Nag Hammadi library and led to a revision of older assumptions. To date, no pre-Christian gnostic texts have been found,[8] and gnosticism as a unique and recognizable belief system is typically considered to be a second century (or later) development.[9]" - wiki

When it comes to dealing with forces that lie in the super-realm of the intangible, the immeasurable, the imperceptible and unknowable, science has nothing to say. Hence science and religion part company at the point where, in such terms as have come into usage to express the concepts, the phenomena with which science can deal, the physical, pass into the category of the metaphysical. Here, in a loose form of expression, is where science drops out of the competition and religion steps in.
119
With regard to the world of the metaphysical, the spiritual, the mystical, science is simply, and from its basic nature, justifiably agnostic. It declares that it has no ground for certitude in exploring that "upper" region. It knows of no laws, no certain principles governing the play of forces in that area of consciousness. The phenomena are undependable and unpredictable, not to say lawless, whimsical, sporadic, bizarre and irregular. Science does not deny categorically that they are real in their domain, valid as experience and authentic, possessing genuine values. But it forswears any judgments upon them because it, as said, lacks the means of verification. Religion is not its province.
Therefore its field of investigation is confined to the lower half of the scale of vibrational energies lying below the mid-point at which man injects his budding self-consciousness into the process, a region which, as our earlier thesis asserted, is the area of the operation of Godís subconscious mind. The phenomena of that domain, being under the rulership of the cosmic mentality, manifest invariable regularity, certitude and predictability. So science confines its scrutiny to nature, whose activities can be studied with the assurance of dependable knowledge. Here the operation of law can be discerned.THE ULTIMATE CANON OF KNOWLEDGE
 
L Gilbert
+1
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by darkbeaver View Post

When it comes to dealing with forces that lie in the super-realm of the intangible, the immeasurable, the imperceptible and unknowable, science has nothing to say. Hence science and religion part company at the point where, in such terms as have come into usage to express the concepts, the phenomena with which science can deal, the physical, pass into the category of the metaphysical. Here, in a loose form of expression, is where science drops out of the competition and religion steps in.

119
With regard to the world of the metaphysical, the spiritual, the mystical, science is simply, and from its basic nature, justifiably agnostic. It declares that it has no ground for certitude in exploring that "upper" region. It knows of no laws, no certain principles governing the play of forces in that area of consciousness. The phenomena are undependable and unpredictable, not to say lawless, whimsical, sporadic, bizarre and irregular. Science does not deny categorically that they are real in their domain, valid as experience and authentic, possessing genuine values. But it forswears any judgments upon them because it, as said, lacks the means of verification. Religion is not its province.
Therefore its field of investigation is confined to the lower half of the scale of vibrational energies lying below the mid-point at which man injects his budding self-consciousness into the process, a region which, as our earlier thesis asserted, is the area of the operation of Godís subconscious mind. The phenomena of that domain, being under the rulership of the cosmic mentality, manifest invariable regularity, certitude and predictability. So science confines its scrutiny to nature, whose activities can be studied with the assurance of dependable knowledge. Here the operation of law can be discerned.THE ULTIMATE CANON OF KNOWLEDGE

I agree, but all things considered, without such things as facts and evidence that point to a conclusion, anything can be concluded and anything that leads to this sort of conclusion is supposition and conjecture.
 
Sal
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by L Gilbert View Post

I agree, but all things considered, without such things as facts and evidence that point to a conclusion, anything can be concluded and anything that leads to this sort of conclusion is supposition and conjecture.

Is that really any different than say 3 scientists who examine the same set of experiments and reach 3 different conclusions. And then years later a 4th scientist comes a long with a new eye and realizes they were all wrong?
 
L Gilbert
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by Sal View Post

Is that really any different than say 3 scientists who examine the same set of experiments and reach 3 different conclusions. And then years later a 4th scientist comes a long with a new eye and realizes they were all wrong?

I swhat any different? Just plucking a supposition out of thin air and ever after acting as if it were fact? Yes because facts point to a certain conclusion, suppositions can suggest anything an imagination wants them to.
 
French Patriot
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by cj44 View Post

Frenchie, Why do you call yourself a gnostic Christian. Why use the word Christian?

Tradition and because as in the old days, Gnostic Christians believe that we were the true church of that day as we were not literalists and did not tie ourselves to the four gospels the then Orthodox church chose and that has so thoroughly been discredited.


The real Jesus, a man, was a Universalist, --- the same way Gnostic Christians were, --- and any God worth following will be a Universalist.


Catholic translates to universal and that means Universalism yet they never practiced it. Equality of the sexes either. Women were chattel.


Rome would not let Christianity rid itself of the carrot and stick mentality, heaven and hell, of that day.


It was always us and them and that is why Christians killed us and burned our scriptures when Constantine bought the church.


Regards
DL

Quote: Originally Posted by Sal View Post

Is that really any different than say 3 scientists who examine the same set of experiments and reach 3 different conclusions. And then years later a 4th scientist comes a long with a new eye and realizes they were all wrong?


You are saying that science is self-correcting. I agree.


You seem to show it as less than a benefit while that is one of it more beneficial aspects.


No religion self-corrects. They just ignore draconian laws and continue to worship barbarian Gods.


Regards
DL
 
cj44
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by French Patriot View Post

Tradition and because as in the old days, Gnostic Christians believe that we were the true church of that day as we were not literalists and did not tie ourselves to the four gospels the then Orthodox church chose and that has so thoroughly been discredited.


The real Jesus, a man, was a Universalist, --- the same way Gnostic Christians were, --- and any God worth following will be a Universalist.


Catholic translates to universal and that means Universalism yet they never practiced it. Equality of the sexes either. Women were chattel.


Rome would not let Christianity rid itself of the carrot and stick mentality, heaven and hell, of that day.


It was always us and them and that is why Christians killed us and burned our scriptures when Constantine bought the church.


Regards
DL




You are saying that science is self-correcting. I agree.


You seem to show it as less than a benefit while that is one of it more beneficial aspects.


No religion self-corrects. They just ignore draconian laws and continue to worship barbarian Gods.


Regards
DL

Frenchie, if you don't "tie" yourself to the 4 gospels, then how do you come to know Jesus? If you banish the book, then where is your source.