Is Canada ready for the coming electric vehicle revolution?


captain morgan
#691
Regardless of the end product being perfected, the underlying bottle-neck in this endeavor relates to power storage tech (batteries) absolutely needing to be significantly advanced, the necessary (power distr) infrastructure being in place and reliable sources of electricity above and beyond base load being available.

To be perfectly frank, this is like going forward in constructing and perfecting the internal combustion engine before having any gasoline to power that ICE
 
petros
#692
The Graphene Revolution dude. Batteries made from coal. It takes our entire world to the next level in so many aspects.

Our current digital tech is now antiquated.

I'm truly looking forward to it.
 
captain morgan
#693
I don't disagree, however, until a functioning prototype is tabled, nothing will have changed in that realm
 
captain morgan
+1
#694
What with the last Tesla that exploded into a fireball, I should think that they would be all over battery technology
 
spilledthebeer
#695
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan View Post

What with the last Tesla that exploded into a fireball, I should think that they would be all over battery technology


Any LIE-beral can tell you that the definition of insanity is to compulsively doing the same thing over and over again- in vain hope of some other outcome!

And yet Toronto Silly Hall LIE-berals are entering into their THIRD CONTRACT for electric buses! The first two contracts having been disasters might scare off a Conservative but as we know- from an earlier post- actually written by a LIE-beral- the "fear centre" the part of the LIE-beral brain that controls things like impulsiveness and blind optimism is much smaller than normal in other humans- hence the willingness of Toronto fools to waste more gravy on electric toy vehicles!

The ONLY good thing we can say about this latest Silly Hall stupidity is that they only bought 3 buses this time- so they are learning- VERY SLOWLY!

For the lovers of electric toy buses and trucks here is a refresher course on how LIE-berals are being suckered out of OUR money by slick talking creeps who are selling LIE-berals the modern day equivalent of a machine to turn lead into gold :

For those who think that a LIE-beral created electric car business might somehow be good for us- I offer up this older article as rebuttal. With some comments of my own in brackets):

TTC hybrid bus batteries losing their power

Globe and Mail/ Jeff Gray Toronto City Hall Reporter/ Published May 16, 2008
Updated March 27, 2017

The box-like batteries on top of the Toronto Transit Commission's brand new and premium-priced hybrid electric-diesel buses are lasting only half as long as their manufacturer promised.

(So there is the first LIE- that electric vehicles will be reliable!)

They were supposed to last five years, but about a third of the lead-acid battery cells in use in the current fleet of 275 hybrids - which started arriving in 2006 - have already worn out, Gary Webster, the TTC's chief general manager, said in an interview.

(And why use lead acid batteries instead of lithium? Lets guess and suggest that lead-acid will not hold as large a charge as lithium but it will hold it longer- such as when a device is only intermittently used- and lead-acid is probably more resistant to cold than lithium!)

The battery failures come on top of TTC testing that has shown the buses are producing just half the expected fuel savings, using just 10 per cent instead of 20 to 30 per cent less diesel than a conventional bus, although TTC officials expect this number to improve.

(So there is there next LIE! The usual extravagant promises of advertisers that LIE-berals want us to swallow- along with the cost over runs!)

Still, Mr. Webster defends the decision to buy the Orion VII hybrids - which cost $734,000, compared with $500,000 for a conventional bus. He says the TTC and the manufacturer, Daimler Buses North America, are trying to sort out the battery problem, which is covered by the warranty and not costing the TTC money.

(OH! TYPICAL LIE-beral value for money- a fifty percent higher price and drastically reduced performance- what a BARGAIN! And sadly it’s a better deal than electric cars which cost TWICE as much as gas cars!)

"We think the hybrid bus is a good bus. That's the bottom line for us. It's got some issues, absolutely," Mr. Webster said. "... We think we're going to address these issues."

(And others think Webster is dreaming in technicolour about fixing a mess created by inadequate technology being asked to go beyond its natural capacity!)

By year's end, the TTC will have 564 hybrid buses - making up about a third of its bus fleet - with much of the cost of buying them covered by the federal and provincial governments in funding that mandated buses using alternative fuels. Within five years, close to half of the TTC's fleet is scheduled to have hybrid engines.

(AS I have said before- THE ONLY REASON WE HAVE an electric vehicle “industry” is due to LIE-beral bribery of that business! Every time LIE-berals meddle in business for political reasons- huge bills and public failure follow!)

But Adam Giambrone, the city councillor who chairs the TTC, said the battery problems mean the jury is still out on whether the buses were a good investment: "We're still formulating our opinion on the hybrids."

(The jury is “still out” regarding the busses says Giambrone? CLEARLY ONLY LIE-berals are on that jury! Tax payers HAVE decided already! Giambrone later got fired as TTC chair and the David Miller govt that supported him was defeated in a subsequent election!)

He said the hybrid engine could be a "transitional technology" and that down the road, electric buses could come onto the market, or the TTC could, on busier routes, even return to using trolley buses - powered by overhead wires like streetcars - which it abandoned in the 1990s.

(Apparently “transitional technology ” is LIE-beral speak meaning “ we will go ahead with this mess regardless of public disgust and we will ignore public opinion for selfish political reasons!)

Mr. Webster said yesterday that New York has had some similar problems with its fleet of Orion VII hybrids.

(In other words- TTC brass KNEW there would be trouble with the vehicles due to reports from New York City- and yet they chose to forge ahead anyway- buying vehicles that cost FIFTY PERCENT MORE than older vehicles and with the new vehicles seriously lacking in mechanical reliability! This is political meddling on a fantastic and utterly disgraceful scale! The ONLY defense LIE-berals offer us is this: “don’t worry- we are dreaming of a brighter future in which we MAY do better in some future time”!)

But Jake Keyes, a spokesman for Daimler, which runs the former Orion Bus Industries plant in Mississauga where the buses are partly manufactured, said the battery problem was specific to Toronto's buses and has not occurred with its other hybrid buses running in New York and San Francisco.

(The battery problem is unique to Toronto? How so? Did TTC ask for technical changes? Or did Daimler make changes on its own to reduce the price to make the busses more appealing for the Toronto market- did they make battery changes that made unique trouble for Toronto busses? Sounds like public relations advertising and B.S. artists are hard at work to protect LIE-berals and electric vehicle image here!)

The company's newer models include a different, lithium-ion battery that Mr. Keyes said lasts longer, but Mr. Webster said the TTC is not convinced the new battery will fix its problem.

"... We've said to them, 'Happy to consider it, but you've got to prove to us these things actually function,' " he said.

(Proof is very definitely needed at this time! Especially as lithium batteries likely cost more than lead-acid? But that is a hallmark of “emerging” technology- up selling the dis-satisfied customer with new and improved promises until either the customer gives up and shops elsewhere or the company producing the technology goes bankrupt!)

(And here it is ten years on since the first battery busses went into operation- anybody curious how many are still on the road? LIE-berals do not say! And yet we STILL operate electric street cars that are over 50 years old!)

It is common for transit agencies to run into kinks with new vehicles, and the TTC has had problems before, including with vehicles running on compressed natural gas that it bought from Orion Bus Industries in the 1990s.

It has had to scrap 50 of those buses and convert another 50 to diesel, after engine problems, potentially leaky gas tanks and other complaints.

(TTC brass have dealt with and been RIPPED OFF by Orion in the past? AND still TTC bought the latest B.S? Just how bankrupt is Toronto that they would close their eyes and blindly forge ahead secure in the knowledge that it is ONLY federal transfer funding they are WASTING on shaky Orion promises?)

The TTC blames its hybrid buses' fuel-economy problems on the fact that they are being used more on suburban high-speed routes, where hybrid engines are less efficient.

(And NOBODY thought to ASK if suburban high speed routes were suitable for these delicate electric busses with their myriad mechanical shortcomings?)

Once more of the buses are running on stop-and-go congested routes downtown, Mr. Webster says, their fuel economy numbers should go up as the bus can rely more on the electric power it creates with its regenerative braking system.

(IN other words Rube Goldberg just took over management of the faulty and over delicate machinery! HAHAHAHA!!! Busses are supposed to go where the passengers are- NOT where its handy for limited technology to operate! But this IS the LIE-beral version of reality- in socialist eyes it’s the stupid passengers who line up in wrong places that are behind the bus failures! It is NOT the fault of weak and limited technology- so LIE-berals will INSIST!)

The fuel-economy problems, which likely cost the TTC $1.3-million this year, are a small part of what is expected to be a massive rise in diesel costs as a fixed-price contract for fuel runs out at the end of this year.

The TTC estimates that its fuel bill could go to $97-million next year from $65-million this year, and Mr. Webster has said the transit agency may even consider a "fuel surcharge" for riders.

(IN other words TTC took a desperate gamble- betting on the battery busses with their KNOWN limitations in hope that the busses would perform better in Toronto than in New York! This is the usual LIE-beral dilemma- the price of fuel is rising and public tolerance for socialist spendaholics is fading- while socialist politicians NEED more gravy for their Hog allies! So they ganlbed and bought huegly expensive busses in desperate hope that they could save some fuel costs and thus have gravy to pass on to Hogs!)

(And there is ALL of LIE-beral policy and planning in a nutshell- just as self proclaimed and staunch LIE-beral supporter Peter Newman said in his book “When The Gods Changed” that details LIE-beral political fortunes after the Chretien era! LIE-beral pal Newman told us the modern LIE-beral party had no significant values, no real policy, no guiding pricniples or morals- all they now have is a huge lust for power and a conviction they are entitled to be the ruling power! This is why LIE-berals can shrug off the costs of all manner of financial disasters they have thrown on us! LIE-berals are convinced they ARE ENTITLED to over rule us whenever they feel like it! And anybody who disagrees is some sort of racist! Based on current evidence the future will NOT be battery powered!)
 
Cannuck
#696
Too long and boring to read
 
petros
#697
Someday you'll pound out Shakespeare but in the mean time, want a banana?
 
spilledthebeer
#698
Quote: Originally Posted by Cannuck View Post

Too long and boring to read

And what does that matter to you- your literacy skill is so low you surely cannot own a car or even a license!

Just keep riding your battery buses- the driver will call out the street names for you so you will know where you are!
Here is some more information on the Metrolinx fiasco that Ontari-owe LIE-beral transportation minister Steven Del Duca is trying to sort out-if Metrolinx Hogs will only admit the truth. I present the column by Chris Blizzard on the subject along with some comments of my own in brackets):

Metrolinx arrogant and out of touch. By Christina Blizzard, Queen's Park Columnist. First posted: Monday, August 01, 2016 03:14 PM EDT | Updated: Monday, August 01, 2016 03:19 PM EDT. (Toronto Sun files)

UP Express subsidy under fire as Metrolinx chairman called government review 'unwelcome'.

Arrogant. Out of touch. Thin-skinned. Out of control. How else can you describe Metrolinx, the troubled agency that was supposed to take transit decisions out of the hands of politicians? They were supposed to be arm’s length in order to make informed and rational decisions about transit.

Clearly, from an e-mail obtained by Toronto Sun political bureau chief Shawn Jeffords, they’re anything but.

The Metrolinx tail is wagging the political dog. The agency that’s supposed to be working for us and accountable through Transportation Minister Steven Del Duca is apparently telling the minister what he can do with his oversight and scrutiny.

Over the last few years, Jeffords has worked tirelessly to hold Metrolinx accountable through a series of freedom-of-information requests that have exposed scandals such as their sponsorship boondoggle, where Metrolinx purchased tickets to sporting events.

(As I have said before-Metrolinx is a TYPICAL LIE-beral creation that thinks it is grossly entitled-and only too happy to share the gravy with other like minded Hogs!)

Without knowing the nature of Jeffords’ story, Metrolinx President and CEO Bruce McCuaig sent an e-mail to Chair Rob Prichard.

“The story might focus on some of the people who have used the tickets and their links to the Liberal party,” McCuaig wrote on Aug. 15, 2013, days before the story was published. It was wild speculation and demonstrates a sensitivity bordering on paranoia about the story.

In fact, Jeffords focused on the program, making no mention of any party links.

In a story in Tuesday’s edition of the Sun, Jeffords has unearthed a letter from Prichard — chair of the high-profile law firm Torys — suggesting intervention by Del Duca is “unwelcome.”

Del Duca had ordered a review of Metrolinx in the wake of devastating revelations by the Sun’s Antonella Artuso about the ludicrous cost of UP Express uniforms and other costly blunders by the agency.

(Again-I point out that Metrolinx Hogs are convinced of their ENTITLEMENT!)

“The minister did speak to me in advance to alert me to his intentions, which I appreciated,” Prichard says in the March letter.

“He did substantially soften and constrain the breadth of his intervention in response to those discussions over the last three days.”

He also talks about “rehearsing” issues from the sponsorship scandal, “which we long ago fixed, but still attract media and Question Period attention.” I think he meant rehashing.

Are you kidding me?

(Yeah, I think Prichard said it right the first time when he spoke of REHEARSING! Its always best for LIE-berals to get their story straight BEFORE meeting the media rather than doing it DURING a media scrum in front of the world!)

A cabinet minister tries to hold an agency with a spotty history of competence to account, and he’s persuaded to scale back that review by the chief cheerleader for Metrolinx.

(It was former LIE-beral premier Dalton McGinty who warned us it was time for LIE-berals to start picking economic WINNERS and LOSERS in Ontari-owe-right after he was elected to that second term! And Wynne-bag seems to be following the McGinty pattern CLOSELY-and we know who the winners are in LIE-beral land!)

So the review has been watered down. From being a meaningful accountability exercise, it’s now merely a whitewash to placate opposition critics and the media. Prichard has completely undermined the review. It absolves him of any suggestion of wrongdoing before the inquiry’s even started.

According to the Sunshine List, Prichard makes $146,000 for his part-time job. McCuaig makes $361,000.

For that kind of money, we should expect better.

Metrolinx has been plagued with these kinds of fiascoes since its inception in 2006.

It has been the focus of numerous auditors’ reports, yet nothing gets better.

In 2012, then auditor-general Jim McCarter reported the cost of delivering the Presto smart card to Toronto-area commuters had nearly tripled to $700 million and said it might be the most expensive such card in the world.

(I wonder how auditor McCarter got away with making such a statement about the costly Presto card while auditor Bonnie Lysyk got called ignorant when she pointed out the flaws in the Ontari-owe- not so- Smart Meters? As the LIE-beral generated economic storm washes over the province we can expect ever meaner comments by LIE-berals as they seek to deflect blame for their fiscal tax and spend madness!)

Metrolinx claims the costly presto card readers are now running well-in spite of earlier complaints but a March 2017 test by City tv reporters found that 5 of 7 card readers at one randomly chosen station were broken! And the situation was not much improved a week later in another test!)

And he warned that over-charging for the UP Express would result in sluggish uptake by passengers. He was correct on all accounts — but ignored by Metrolinx.

Now, thanks to Jeffords. we know why: the transportation ministry is taking its marching orders from the agency it’s supposed to be managing.

Enough’s enough. It’s time to clean house at Metrolinx and get some managers in there who are accountable to their political bosses. Because if they’re not accountable to them, they’re not accountable to us — the taxpaying, transit-taking public.

(I say we should face the truth here: Metrolinx is a TYPICAL LIE-beral creation staffed by people who BELIEVE they are ENTITLED to be at the top of the Sunshine LIST of high govt earners! The one good thing about Metrolinx is this” they have COMPLETED THEIR WORK and they can be DISBANDED! FIRED! CANNED! They have studied our transit system six ways from Sunday and produced all manner of plans ranging from `pie in the sky` to sensible and logical and since there IS NO MONEY TO BUILD ANYTHING-there is NO reason for MORE STUDIES! KILL METROLINX NOW! Forget the govt `review`-we all know it will be a whitewash anyway-just DUMP THE PIGS!)

(The worst of it is this transit mess has tentacles that run in all directions. Lie-beral prime minister Trudope-he of the nice hair and weak fiscal understanding- gave Toronto Transit Commission about 155 Million dollars this spring for `repairs` to TTC system. And as we know federal LIE-berals are desperate to KEEP union votes in Quebec-and several govts have pumped hundreds of millions of dollars into Bombardier Quebec-the company that just happens to be years behind on its contract to supply TTC with new streetcars and subway cars. Things got so bad TTC wanted to SUE Bombardier because of all the extra costs they were incurring. But that was before the 155 million LIE-beral gift-should we ask if TTC has been BRIBED not to embarrass Bombardier and LIE-beralsby launching a lawsuit? Just how much careless contract handling can Cdns really afford?)
 
pgs
#699
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Someday you'll pound out Shakespeare but in the mean time, want a banana?

Well he is a bit of a monkey so he probably does .
 
OpposingDigit
#700
Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry
About 279,000 barrels a day of fuel won’t be needed this year
China adds a London-sized electric bus fleet every five weeks
China had about 99 percent of the 385,000 electric buses on the roads worldwide in 2017, accounting for 17 percent of the country’s entire fleet. Every five weeks, Chinese cities add 9,500 of the zero-emissions transporters—the equivalent of London’s entire working fleet, according Bloomberg New Energy Finance.
By Jeremy Hodges
April‎ ‎23‎, ‎2018
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...e-oil-industry
 
pgs
#701
Quote: Originally Posted by OpposingDigit View Post

Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry
About 279,000 barrels a day of fuel won’t be needed this year
China adds a London-sized electric bus fleet every five weeks
China had about 99 percent of the 385,000 electric buses on the roads worldwide in 2017, accounting for 17 percent of the country’s entire fleet. Every five weeks, Chinese cities add 9,500 of the zero-emissions transporters—the equivalent of London’s entire working fleet, according Bloomberg New Energy Finance.
By Jeremy Hodges
April‎ ‎23‎, ‎2018
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...e-oil-industry

We have had electric buses in Vancouver since the 1950’s , what took them so long ?
 
petros
+2
#702
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan View Post

I don't disagree, however, until a functioning prototype is tabled, nothing will have changed in that realm

Samsung phones are already using coal sourced graphene batteries.

Quote: Originally Posted by pgs View Post

We have had electric buses in Vancouver since the 1950’s , what took them so long ?

A roll of foil tossed over the wires makes for a spectacular light show.
 
Hoid
#703
Ford cutting the sedan in favor of the SUV. It makes sense. The sedan market is where Ford struggles so they can keep their truck division which is their bread and butter and get out of the sector where they are getting hammered.
 
spilledthebeer
#704
Quote: Originally Posted by OpposingDigit View Post

Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry
About 279,000 barrels a day of fuel won’t be needed this year
China adds a London-sized electric bus fleet every five weeks
China had about 99 percent of the 385,000 electric buses on the roads worldwide in 2017, accounting for 17 percent of the country’s entire fleet. Every five weeks, Chinese cities add 9,500 of the zero-emissions transporters—the equivalent of London’s entire working fleet, according Bloomberg New Energy Finance.
By Jeremy Hodges
April‎ ‎23‎, ‎2018
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...e-oil-industry


Oh the HORROR of complicated economics! China is a MAJOR producer of lithium so it stands to reason they would exploit it s much as possible! Especially as they would otherwise have to purchase oil at world markets and that would be COSTLY for them! Its all
about currency manipulation and balance of trade deals!

AS long as China sells a lot of stuff to the world and buys very little they can keep their economy rolling! Remember- they MUST buy massive shipments of food for their population- no matter the price- or starvation will result!

China has a massive problem- they have a tiger by the tail and do not know how to let go! Their population has become adjusted to and are demanding rising living conditions- govt expects a regular 8-10 percent expansion of productivity to keep things running smoothly- and the world economy does not have room for that kind of expansion! If things go badly wrong in China economically there may be another revolution! Certainly bad economic results in China will result in a huge erosion of the rule of law!

One has only to think of the "melamine" scandal of some years back in which Chinese milk producers added the chemical melamine to milk to raise profits and killed off thousands of people- mostly babies- who drank the tainted milk!

One may also have a look at the long list of Chinese products that have been exported west only to be discovered to be contaminated in various ways - metal products with lead, toxic paints, chemicals in food, etc!

TVO played a nice documentary on how Tilapia fish and Shrimp are farmed in China- with large ponds stocked with FOOD right next to farm fields with locals praying huge volumes of fungicide and insecticide on fields - with the water in fish ponds clearly being heavily washed with over spray!

China is POOR and China will easily slip back into 19th century Imperial style chaos if govt does not keep a very tight grip!

So there IS SOME LOGIC in China having a large fleet of electric buses- it is better for China to have electric buses than to have NO buses- happily we Cdns DO HAVE CHOICES!

What people like Hoid are IGNORING IS THAT DO NOT CHOOSE TO MAKE LIE-BERALS RICH WHILE WE STARVE!
 
Gilgamesh
#705
Quote: Originally Posted by Hoid View Post

Ford cutting the sedan in favor of the SUV. It makes sense. The sedan market is where Ford struggles so they can keep their truck division which is their bread and butter and get out of the sector where they are getting hammered.

My last Ford was a 1989 Taurus. I have never bought another Ford and I never will.

Mazda-->Acura-->Subaru.
 
captain morgan
#706
Their trucks are nice but i'll stick with GMC
 
JLM
#707
Quote: Originally Posted by Gilgamesh View Post

My last Ford was a 1989 Taurus. I have never bought another Ford and I never will.

Mazda-->Acura-->Subaru.

In the past 40 years I've owned an F 150 and 3 F 250s. Not too many problems, after the first one, the F 150! The extra bucks for the 250 is money well spent.
 
petros
#708
Not really. An F150 runs circles around an F250 from 20 years ago.

With a V6 yet not the 5.4 (351).
 
JLM
#709
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Not really. An F150 runs circles around an F250 from 20 years ago.

With a V6 yet not the 5.4 (351).

F 250 has a has a lot more hauling capacity. My 1977 F 150 was a Windsor 351.
 
petros
+1
#710
Quote: Originally Posted by spilledthebeer View Post

Oh the HORROR of complicated economics! China is a MAJOR producer of lithium so it stands to reason they would exploit it s much as possible!

Lithium car batteries are months from being antiquated and besides, Canada has far bigger deposits of lithium sitting in waiting.


This is what happens when labour costs are unsustainable.

Quote: Originally Posted by JLM View Post

F 250 has a has a lot more hauling capacity. My 1977 F 150 was a Windsor 351.

3200lb cargo and 12,200lb towing isn't enough for you?

Are you pulling a camper trailer or are you towing a motorhome to the lake?
 
IdRatherBeSkiing
#711
Quote: Originally Posted by Hoid View Post

Ford cutting the sedan in favor of the SUV. It makes sense. The sedan market is where Ford struggles so they can keep their truck division which is their bread and butter and get out of the sector where they are getting hammered.

Electric SUVs of course? *chuckle*
 
petros
#712
What makes station wagons with big tires and all wheel drive so appealing?
 
Bar Sinister
#713
Quote: Originally Posted by IdRatherBeSkiing View Post

Electric SUVs of course? *chuckle*


You're dead on:
Ford also said it was making “a full commitment” to alternative propulsion engines, including adding hybrid-electric powertrains to company icons such as the F-150 and the Mustang.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/fo...ans-2018-04-25
 
IdRatherBeSkiing
+1
#714
Quote: Originally Posted by Bar Sinister View Post

You're dead on:
Ford also said it was making “a full commitment” to alternative propulsion engines, including adding hybrid-electric powertrains to company icons such as the F-150 and the Mustang.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/fo...ans-2018-04-25

I don't think they understand who is buying those vehicles.
 
JLM
#715
Quote: Originally Posted by Hoid View Post

China launches the the NIO ES8 a 7 seater electric SUV.

It costs $65 K usd - half the price of a Tesla.

China is said to be considering an outright ban on gas powered cars within the next ten years or less - just like everyone else.

Hey Hoidy- Just answer the question in post # 70!
 
taxslave
#716
Quote: Originally Posted by Bar Sinister View Post

You're dead on:
Ford also said it was making “a full commitment” to alternative propulsion engines, including adding hybrid-electric powertrains to company icons such as the F-150 and the Mustang.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/fo...ans-2018-04-25

Alternative does not necessarily mean battery electric. GM is building trucks for the US army that are fuel cell rather than battery. THere is also a push for CNG which has better range than electric.
 
captain morgan
#717
A better range than electric and far easier to find a fuel station
 
spilledthebeer
#718
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan View Post

A better range than electric and far easier to find a fuel station

Here is an older article reminding us yet again that LIE-beral business skills are such they cannot run a chip truck at a profit- not even if you gave them the potatoes for free!

Question of the day:

How the hell can you build a bridge in northern Ontario that buckles when it gets cold?

A new bridge, which opened in November in Nipigon, buckled in the cold over the weekend, severing the Trans-Canada Highway, essentially splitting the country in two.

What went wrong? Well, perhaps the province should have handed the engineering to a Canadian company familiar with the temperatures in the North.

While Sandro Perruzza, CEO of the Ontario Society of Professional Engineers (OSPE), cautions it’s early in the investigation, he noted the engineers for the project are based in Spain.

“It’s all speculation at this point,” he said.

“The engineering company that was hired to do this is based out of Spain, so do they have the experience and knowledge to design a bridge in the cold weather we have in Canada that they don’t have in southern Europe?” he said in a phone interview Monday.

Engineering giant Ferrovial, based in Madrid and part of the same company that owns Hwy. 407, was responsible for the engineering. The $106-million project is the first cable-stayed bridge in Canada.

“When it was designed, were the design specifications put forward that would meet the requirements of the weather?” Perruzza asked.

He said the issue is not so much how cold it is, but how quickly it can get cold in northern Ontario, where temperatures can fluctuate by 10C or 15C from one day to the next.

“It’s the rate of how quickly it gets cold, and can the material expand and contract quickly?” he says.

“If a Canadian engineering company is doing the work, they would take those things into consideration and the design would account for that.”

Sources say municipal politicians in northern Ontario have long been concerned about the material used for the bridge. According to a PowerPoint presentation on the Ontario Good Roads Association website, while the pre-cast deck, towers and structural steel were all sourced in Canada, the cables came from Spain and the expansion joints were manufactured in China.

That raises questions about whether those materials were made to standards that would withstand the Canadian winter.

Perruzza says the OSPE advocates for a qualification-based selection process so that when contracts such as this are awarded, in addition to awarding it to the lowest bidder, the government also looks at how qualified all the people in that bid are in doing these type of projects.

“Canadian suppliers would have all have experience in supplying this kind of equipment and these types of materials that are tested in these types of environments,” he says.

A spokesman for the Ministry of Transportation says broken bolts were at fault.

“Uplift occurred at the northwest corner of the structure due to broken bolts at a bearing connection. Our engineers are on site and continue to investigate. At this point, it’s too soon to say if cold weather was a factor,” adds Annemarie Piscopo.

Whatever happened, this is deeply troubling. This is the government that’s selling Hydro One to pay for infrastructure. Are we really getting value for money? When you put money into the Ontario Retirement Pension Plan, the government has vowed to spend it on infrastructure.

Is that how you want your pension invested — in bridges where vital parts are imported from China? Why not just cut to the chase and pick them up at the Dollar Store? What could possibly go wrong?

Look, we don’t yet know what went wrong. But, we really shouldn’t be looking to Madrid or China to find out what happened in Nipigon.

NIPIGON RIVER BRIDGE

The same company that owns Hwy. 407 built the Nipigon River Bridge. Ferrovial International Inc. is owned by Cintra Infraestructuras Internacional S.L. — a wholly owned subsidiary of Ferrovial S.A., which owns 43% of Hwy. 407. Cintra Infraestructuras is the largest shareholder of 407 International Inc., which operates Hwy. 407 under a 99-year lease from the Ontario government.
This is not the first Ontario highway disruption that involves engineers and architects from Spain. Girders on Herb Gray Parkway, near Windsor, did not meet the standards of the Canadian Highway Bridge Design Code. That project was built by a Spanish-led consortium, the Windsor Essex Mobility Group.

WHAT THE POLITICIANS SAY

Premier Kathleen Wynne:

“It is the lifeline in terms of product and transportation in northwestern Ontario and as people have said, it connects east to the west.

“It’s very concerning to me and we’ll get to the bottom of it and make sure it doesn’t happen again.”

Michael Mantha, NDP MPP for Algoma Manitoulin:

“Right now, the Liberal government’s infrastructure plan for northern Ontario seems to be: ‘Drive through the United States.’”

Nipigon Mayor Richard Harvey:

“We opened the community centre. People opened their homes to anyone who needed a place to stay and said, ‘bring your kids over.’ Churches put on breakfasts. People brought food for anyone who needed it. Everyone takes it in stride.”

christina.blizzard sunmedia.

(And did LIE-berals ever find out WHY the bridge FAILED so swiftly? Probably they did get answers but in typical LIE-beral fashion they have CHOSEN NOT to share the shameful explanation with the public!)
 
captain morgan
#719
Quote: Originally Posted by spilledthebeer View Post

(And did LIE-berals ever find out WHY the bridge FAILED so swiftly? Probably they did get answers but in typical LIE-beral fashion they have CHOSEN NOT to share the shameful explanation with the public!)

They could find those answers really fast... All they need to do is call up their close buddies that they awarded the contracts to

PS - no need to yell
 
spilledthebeer
#720
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan View Post

They could find those answers really fast... All they need to do is call up their close buddies that they awarded the contracts to

PS - no need to yell

I am not yelling- I am making sure that semi literate graduates of the dismal LIE-beral Ontari-owe education system- such as Cannuck- and the utterly addled Bar Silly Sister take my points clearly!

Besides- it only seems fair to make points this way- after all- LIE-berals have so often robbed us and taxed us outrageously so they can reward their friends that it seems proper to me to do things that annoy them from time to time!