Why disbelievers deny the Next Life


selfsame
#1
The Next Life is an essential principle of belief: the belief in God and in the Next Life.

Deniers of the Next Life are of many kinds:
>> Some atheists deny the existence of God and deny the Next Life.
>> Some believe in God, but do not believe in the Next Life.
>> Others believe in the Next Life, but does not believe in God.

Moreover, believers about the Next Life are also of many kinds:
>> Some think the Next Life is in the grave.
>> Others say the Next Life is spiritual not material.
>> Still some believe that the body will be resurrected.
>> While others believe the body will not be resurrected.

The thing that prevents most of people from believing in the Next Life is that they think that the Next Life means the body of the dead, after dying, then decaying ... will be resurrected; therefore, they say this is impossible and they don't believe in the Next Spiritual Life.

While in fact, the Next Life is spiritual not material, and the body will decay and will not be resurrected once again, but the soul will depart from the body and will go to the soul worlds or the Afterlife; i.e. following man's death, his body will die, while his soul will leave the body and will be transmitted to the Next Afterlife to live forever and will not die again.

Quran 40: 59, which means:
{59. The hour [of death] is [inevitably] coming; there is no doubt about it [when We will punish the guilty souls according to their deeds]; yet most of people believe not [in the existence of souls.] d}
.................................................. ......

d The meaning: The associaters deny the ‘sending of souls to the Next Life’, because they think it means that bodies will be resurrected following their death and decaying, but it is not like what they imagine.

In fact at the hour of death, We send the souls from the bodies to the Barzakh world [or the Afterlife or the world of souls], and they will be in Our grip, and We shall severely punish them if they are disbelievers; while if the soul is a believer, We shall mildly punish him, then he will gladly go to his family in Paradise.

The interpretation is by Mohammed-Ali Hassan Al-Hilly.
 
Ron in Regina
+1
#2
Disbelievers in What? Which disbelievers? Those that
disbelieve in an afterlife, or those that disbelieve the
words in the Koran, or those that disbelieve the words
in the Koran as interpreted by Mohammed-Ali Hassan
Al-Hilly?

Please, tell us more about how others think, that don't
believe exactly as you think, as interpreted by
Mohammed-Ali Hassan Al-Hill.
 
selfsame
#3
The answer to your denial is in the first post. Read it carefully.
 
Ron in Regina
#4
Of what? Denial of an Afterlife? Of which?
 
Ludlow
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by selfsame View Post

The answer to your denial is in the first post. Read it carefully.

It is not possible to teach a person who already knows it all. This is your virus Selfslime. you are a know it all and no one or nothing can possibly break through your wall of ignorance.
 
MHz
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by selfsame View Post

The Next Life is an essential principle of belief: the belief in God and in the Next Life.

Deniers of the Next Life are of many kinds:
>> Some atheists deny the existence of God and deny the Next Life.
>> Some believe in God, but do not believe in the Next Life.
>> Others believe in the Next Life, but does not believe in God.

Moreover, believers about the Next Life are also of many kinds:
>> Some think the Next Life is in the grave.
>> Others say the Next Life is spiritual not material.
>> Still some believe that the body will be resurrected.
>> While others believe the body will not be resurrected.

The thing that prevents most of people from believing in the Next Life is that they think that the Next Life means the body of the dead, after dying, then decaying ... will be resurrected; therefore, they say this is impossible and they don't believe in the Next Spiritual Life.

1Co:15:32:
If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus,
what advantageth it me,
if the dead rise not?
let us eat and drink;
for to morrow we die.

You may have missed the most important reason that people remain faithless. Obviously the persecution shown against Muslims would be a good reason not to convert to that religion and the Christian version is in shambles because there are so many different doctrines, Jewish is a closed community so new members not welcome for the most part. (paid allies are more than welcome)

The Bible promotes one resurrection to the form we have at the moment with the exception that it is a gloriified body so it is immortal even when denied water or food. These people will enter the new earth in that condition, 120 years old if you live inside New Jerusalem and 20 years old if you live outside of the City, and the ones that have children in the new earth have until they are 120 to do that as they do not have children after they have a glorified body. The new earth is a time of learning about good and evil and how the universe 'works' as that is what the new earth will become. Earth will be the City and the Courtyard for when people come together for feasts related to God, New Jerusalem will be busy all the time as it will host the same things it did in the OT with the exception of blood sacrifice as the offering Cain brought will be the one accepted fot the eternity that the new earth lasts for.

Quote: Originally Posted by selfsame View Post

While in fact, the Next Life is spiritual not material, and the body will decay and will not be resurrected once again, but the soul will depart from the body and will go to the soul worlds or the Afterlife; i.e. following man's death, his body will die, while his soul will leave the body and will be transmitted to the Next Afterlife to live forever and will not die again.

That is a different doctrine than the Bible promotes as some people enter the Kingdom of God without the body tasting death, that will be the norm in the new earth as people change from being an eternal being (needing food and water to remain breathing) to an immortal person who has no need for water or food to remain alive) The body will be without the imperfection that people in this world experience.

Quote: Originally Posted by selfsame View Post

Quran 40: 59, which means:
{59. The hour [of death] is [inevitably] coming; there is no doubt about it [when We will punish the guilty souls according to their deeds]; yet most of people believe not [in the existence of souls.] d}
.................................................. ......

d The meaning: The associaters deny the ‘sending of souls to the Next Life’, because they think it means that bodies will be resurrected following their death and decaying, but it is not like what they imagine.

In fact at the hour of death, We send the souls from the bodies to the Barzakh world [or the Afterlife or the world of souls], and they will be in Our grip, and We shall severely punish them if they are disbelievers; while if the soul is a believer, We shall mildly punish him, then he will gladly go to his family in Paradise.

The interpretation is by Mohammed-Ali Hassan Al-Hilly.

No sins follow any person into the new earth or all people would still be sinners as none are without sin in this earth.

Ro:3:10:
As it is written,
There is none righteous,
no, not one:

The ones that get to teach people are the ones that are alive for the 1,000 year period and their reward is that in the new earth they get to live inside the city (New Jerusalem) and the ones they 'have authority over' are the ones that come alive only at the Great White Throne event. They teach those 'newbies' what they learned during the 1,000 year reign as taught to them by the 24 Elders for Re:4 and both groups will continue to learn all through the New Earth as will the ones they teach.

Re:5:10:
And hast made us unto our God kings and priests:
and we shall reign on the earth.

No explanation of the verses necessary.

1Co:15:51:
Behold,
I shew you a mystery;
We shall not all sleep,
but we shall all be changed,
1Co:15:52:
In a moment,
in the twinkling of an eye,
at the last trump:
for the trumpet shall sound,
and the dead shall be raised incorruptible,
and we shall be changed.

The dating in Isaiah:65 is based on a baby being called an 'infant' until they are 20 years old, then they are called a child (of God) for the next 100 years (living as a married person) and at the age of 120 God judges then according to the determination made in Ge:6 and no sinners will be found so all people will be given the 'chaged body' without going to the grave. That would be when travel through the universe would be the norm for all individuals.
Last edited by MHz; Mar 19th, 2016 at 06:21 PM..
 
Ludlow
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

1Co:15:32:
If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus,
what advantageth it me,
if the dead rise not?
let us eat and drink;
for to morrow we die.

You may have missed the most important reason that people remain faithless. Obviously the persecution shown against Muslims would be a good reason not to convert to that religion and the Christian version is in shambles because there are so many different doctrines, Jewish is a closed community so new members not welcome for the most part. (paid allies are more than welcome)

The Bible promotes one resurrection to the form we have at the moment with the exception that it is a gloriified body so it is immortal even when denied water or food. These people will enter the new earth in that condition, 120 years old if you live inside New Jerusalem and 20 years old if you live outside of the City, and the ones that have children in the new earth have until they are 120 to do that as they do not have children after they have a glorified body. The new earth is a time of learning about good and evil and how the universe 'works' as that is what the new earth will become. Earth will be the City and the Courtyard for when people come together for feasts related to God, New Jerusalem will be busy all the time as it will host the same things it did in the OT with the exception of blood sacrifice as the offering Cain brought will be the one accepted fot the eternity that the new earth lasts for.


That is a different doctrine than the Bible promotes as some people enter the Kingdom of God without the body tasting death, that will be the norm in the new earth as people change from being an eternal being (needing food and water to remain breathing) to an immortal person who has no need for water or food to remain alive) The body will be without the imperfection that people in this world experience.


No explanation necessary.

1Co:15:51:
Behold,
I shew you a mystery;
We shall not all sleep,
but we shall all be changed,
1Co:15:52:
In a moment,
in the twinkling of an eye,
at the last trump:
for the trumpet shall sound,
and the dead shall be raised incorruptible,
and we shall be changed.

The dating in Isaiah:65 is based on a baby being called an 'infant' until they are 20 years old, then they are called a child (of God) for the next 100 years (living as a married person) and at the age of 120 God judges then according to the determination made in Ge:6 and no sinners will be found so all people will be given the 'chaged body' without going to the grave. That would be when travel through the universe would be the norm for all individuals.

All those biscuits and no gravy.
 
MHz
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by Ludlow View Post

It is not possible to teach a person who already knows it all. This is your virus Selfslime. you are a know it all and no one or nothing can possibly break through your wall of ignorance.

That's not true, I can already see some modification in his posts. You are too ignorant (about God) to pick up big points let alone the finer ones. 'Time to step back from the keyboard, Pilgrim.' (in best John Wayne accent)
 
selfsame
#9
Most people do not believe in the sending to the Next Life, because they think that the body is to be resurrected; therefore, they deem such thing most improbable, but the true thing is not like what (most Muslims, Christians, Jews and others think):

In other words, most Muslims, Christians, Jews and others are wrong:

But in fact the body will not be resurrected, because it is useless, while the true man is the soul or the spirit, which will go to the world of souls or the Afterlife:

Quran 36: 77-83, which mean:

[Ubayy, the son of Khalaf al-Jumahi came to the Prophet – salam to him – carrying by his hand a rotten bone, and said: “You claim that your Lord resurrect the dead, but who can bring this back as it was!?” and he smashed it with his hand!
Therefore, this aya was revealed:]


77. Do not man [: the associater] see that We created him from scanty [seminal] fluid a , and that he b has become a manifest opponent?

78. And he tells Us an example [of the decayed bones] and forgets about his own creation [that he was created from seminal fluid]; he says: "Who can revive the bones when they are decayed!?"

79. Say [Mohammed, answering him]: "He revives them, That Who created them at the beginning [from seminal fluid]; He is All-Knowing about everything in the creation." c

80. Who made for you fire out of the green tree, that you may kindle fire out of it. d

81. Therefore, is not [God], Who created the heavens and the earth, All-Able to create the like of them? Yes, indeed; He is the Creator [of everything], the All-Knowing.

82. His command, when He intends [to create or destroy] anything, is to say to it “Be", and it is [as He intends.] e

83. So glory be to Him f Who owns all things, and to Him you [all] shall be returned [after death.]
.................................................. ...........

a So as such will We restore the rotten bones into seminal fluids out of which We create the fetus in the womb of the mother, then they will be born, then they will grow to become human beings like themselves.

The indication of this is His saying – be glorified – in this soora 36: 81, which means:
(Therefore, is not [God], Who created the heavens and the earth, All-Able to create the like of them? Yes, indeed; He is the All-Creator, the All-Knowing.)

In addition, God – be glorified – said in the Quran 17: 99, which means:
(Have they not seen that God Who created the heavens and the earth is Able to create the like of them?
Moreover He has appointed for them a term, of which there is no doubt; yet the wrong-doers refuse anything but to disbelieve [and deny the truth.]
)

The meaning: God – be glorified – can make a field or a garden on those graves, and such bones will be the manure for the trees which will absorb them from the earth. And so there will form fruits on such trees, out of which men will eat to become seminal fluid in their bodies. Afterwards, this seminal fluid will go to the womb of mothers by means of the sexual intercourse, then they will become fetus, then they will be born, grow and become human being like them.
I myself [the interpreter Mohammed Ali Hassan] saw many graveyards have now become a farm, houses or shops.

b He means: Ubayy, the son of Khalaf.

c So God – be glorified – did not emphasize on the resurrecting, but He said: If He likes He can resurrect them. This is confirmed by His saying – be glorified – in the Quran 80: 21-22, which means:
(Then He causes him to die, then to be buried in a grave. Then if He wills, He may resurrect him.)
Then He – be glorified – said in the following aya, which means:
(No, [He wills not to resurrect him; because] he has not carried out [the duties, to] which He has commanded him.)

d It means: you take wood for fuel.
In the past they used to kindle the fire from trees in two ways; that was when they had not the match sticks; so they had special trees: some of them called the tree of the ‘Murkh’ and the other the tree of the ‘Ifar’.
Therefore, when they wanted to kindle fire, they struck a stick from the first tree with a stick from the second tree, and on their friction, the fire would kindle as does the match stick inflame.
The second way: They took some of the tree bark, put it on their trigger, and struck the trigger with the pebbles and so sparks would issue between the pebble and the iron piece and so the tree bark would inflame, of which they would kindle their fire-wood.
That which they put on the trigger for burning was called ‘Quw’. This ‘Quw’ might also be made from melon crust, as was also made from cotton after mixing it with some substances aiding the inflammation.

e The meaning: Nothing of the creation or destruction may be difficult to Him.

f This is to exalt Him above having any disability.


The interpretation is by Mohammed-Ali Hassan Al-Hilly.
Last edited by selfsame; Mar 19th, 2016 at 06:30 PM..
 
MHz
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by Ludlow View Post

All those biscuits and no gravy.

Dust to dust. You are a city unto yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFy8K2J9WrA

M'r:6:11:
And whosoever shall not receive you,
nor hear you,
when ye depart thence,
shake off the dust under your feet for a testimony against them.
Verily I say unto you,
It shall be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment,
than for that city.
 
selfsame
#11
For more details see this link:
http://www.quran-ayat.com/man/index.htm
 
Ron in Regina
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by selfsame View Post

Most people do not believe in the sending to the Next Life, because they think that the body is to be resurrected; therefore, they deem such thing most improbable, but the true thing is not like what (most Muslims, Christians, Jews and others think):

In other words, most Muslims, Christians, Jews and others are wrong:....

Buddy, tell us more about how we think, or about how you
think we think, as interpreted by Mohammed-Ali Hassan Al-Hilly!

In your vast experience of thinking outside of your box, tell us
all how we think and why? Tell us why most Muslims, Christians,
Jews and others are wrong in the way they think & believe, if they
don't think & believe like you, as interpreted by Mohammed-Ali
Hassan Al-Hilly.
 
Ludlow
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

That's not true, I can already see some modification in his posts. You are too ignorant (about God) to pick up big points let alone the finer ones. 'Time to step back from the keyboard, Pilgrim.' (in best John Wayne accent)

Go ahead and post a few more pages that no one will read your highness oh great potentate of copy and paste. Then when you're finished, take your pills.
 
Angstrom
+1
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by Ludlow View Post

It is not possible to teach a person who already knows it all. This is your virus Selfslime. you are a know it all and no one or nothing can possibly break through your wall of ignorance.

He knows blind faith.

He's a good example of how easily humans can be brain washed into believing anything, if you start them early enough.
 
Dexter Sinister
+2
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

That's not true, I can already see some modification in his posts.

That might be wishful thinking, his is not a mind that can be changed by evidence or reason. He's not as threatening and angry as he was in his original persona here, but he's still shoveling out the same stuff from the same stable... on second thought, pumping might be a better metaphor, it's too thin to shovel.
 
Ludlow
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by Angstrom View Post

He knows blind faith.

He's a good example of how easily humans can be brain washed into believing anything, if you start them early enough.

There's gotta be more to it than that. Any reasonably logical human being has to look at the evidence of the religion and ask questions. Just like in Christianity there has to be questions in people minds about the tainted history of that religion. What is this psychological grip on the minds of people who live in denial and fear of the truth. What are they afraid of?
 
Twila
+1
#17
what a muddle of pud that was.



The attempt by a believer to say why we don't believe is laughable.

So, this must be selfsames attempt to pull us non believers into a conversation,discussion or debate.

As a NON believer, I am in a greater position to tell you WHY I don't believe in life after death or an afterlife.

pssshhh!
 
Ludlow
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by Twila View Post

what a muddle of pud that was.



The attempt by a believer to say why we don't believe is laughable.

So, this must be selfsames attempt to pull us non believers into a conversation,discussion or debate.

As a NON believer, I am in a greater position to tell you WHY I don't believe in life after death or an afterlife.

pssshhh!

Pud? What you mean by Pud?
 
Angstrom
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by Ludlow View Post

There's gotta be more to it than that. Any reasonably logical human being has to look at the evidence of the religion and ask questions. Just like in Christianity there has to be questions in people minds about the tainted history of that religion. What is this psychological grip on the minds of people who live in denial and fear of the truth. What are they afraid of?

Being stoned to death and outcastes from their own families? What else.
 
Ludlow
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by Angstrom View Post

Being stoned to death and outcastes from their own families? What else.

True.
 
MHz
+1
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by Ludlow View Post

Go ahead and post a few more pages that no one will read your highness oh great potentate of copy and paste. Then when you're finished, take your pills.

It would be a done deal long before you made a post that had some actual content to it.

Quote: Originally Posted by Ludlow View Post

Pud? What you mean by Pud?

Perhaps it is you is who is off the rails and needs to slow down. lol Think 'mud' and reread her words.
 
Ludlow
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

It would be a done deal long before you made a post that had some actual content to it.


Perhaps it is you is who is off the rails and needs to slow down. lol Think 'mud' and reread her words.

All we are saying,,,is give therapy a chance".

Get in touch with your inner child and,,,,take your pills.
 
MHz
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by Dexter Sinister View Post

That might be wishful thinking, his is not a mind that can be changed by evidence or reason. He's not as threatening and angry as he was in his original persona here, but he's still shoveling out the same stuff from the same stable... on second thought, pumping might be a better metaphor, it's too thin to shovel.

Wrong, the part about the authority of the Torah and Bible is different as he is no longer insisting that that one Prophet is greater than another. The topic of the new earth is also a change as missing it was the main theme before that.
Your grasp of the books isn't all that stellar either so should you be throwing stones at how far others are along that route?
 
Twila
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by Ludlow View Post

Pud? What you mean by Pud?

Puddle of mud. His post was the usual muddied beyond logic post.

What a muddle of pud...all muddled.

k, might be an island thing...
 
MHz
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by Ludlow View Post

All we are saying,,,is give therapy a chance".

Get in touch with your inner child and,,,,take your pills.

Perhaps what needs to happen is for you to grow up and quit trying to be the centre of attention on a thread that you are clueless about.

Quote: Originally Posted by Twila View Post

Puddle of mud. His post was the usual muddied beyond logic post.

What a muddle of pud...all muddled.

k, might be an island thing...

You should have let him stew a bit. IMO
 
Ludlow
#26
No you do
 
MHz
#27
Way to show my point by doing such a childish post Too funny really.
 
Ludlow
+1
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Way to show my point by doing such a childish post Too funny really.

I know you are but what am I ?
 
MHz
#29
Troll, did I not mention that yet?
 
Ludlow
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Troll, did I not mention that yet?

Play much poker there Maynard?
 

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