U.S. relay team loses gold medal after eight years


#juan
#1
The U.S. men's 4x400-metre relay team, including, from left, Antonio Pettigrew, Calvin Harrison, Michael Johnson and Alvin Harrison, celebrates after winning the gold medal at the Summer Olympics in Sydney. (Thomas Kienzle/Associated Press)The International Olympic Committee has retroactively disqualified the entire U.S. team that won the men's 4x400-metre relay at the 2000 Olympics in Sydney, stripping the team of its gold medals because one member, Antonio Pettigrew, admitted using performance-enhancing drugs.
"A decision on reallocating the medals and diplomas of those affected by these decisions will be made at a future meeting of the IOC executive board," the IOC said Saturday in a statement issued in Beijing.
It was the fourth gold and sixth overall medal stripped from the 2000 U.S. track contingent in eight months for the use of performance-enhancing drugs.
In May, Pettigrew admitted injecting human growth hormone and

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/story/2008/...y.html?ref=rss
 
#juan
#2
That is sad because the whole team loses the medal because of one guy.
 
Kreskin
#3
According to Ben Johnson, practically everyone at that level does some illegal performance enhancing drug. They just don't get caught. How the heck else does someone become that strong and fast? Eating Wheaties? I doubt it. So now they'll hand over the medals to others who didn't get caught.
 
#juan
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by Kreskin View Post

According to Ben Johnson, practically everyone at that level does some illegal performance enhancing drug. They just don't get caught. How the heck else does someone become that strong and fast? Eating Wheaties? I doubt it. So now they'll hand over the medals to others who didn't get caught.

Makes me wonder why we should even bother watching. I always suspected that Carl Lewis was taking something. It's become such a high tech thing that nobody bothers with simple anabolic steroids anymore. That growth hormone and blood packing was the new "super dope" a few years ago. I'm sure there are others already out there. You just have to take something they are not yet testing for.
 
Kreskin
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by #juan View Post

Makes me wonder why we should even bother watching. I always suspected that Carl Lewis was taking something. It's become such a high tech thing that nobody bothers with simple anabolic steroids anymore. That growth hormone and blood packing was the new "super dope" a few years ago. I'm sure there are others already out there. You just have to take something they are not yet testing for.

I read somewhere today that a couple of the other teammates were caught at a different event. Only Johnson has not been caught. Like you said, it's all a game of staying ahead of the testing curve.
 
gopher
#6
Very disturbing. But if we can go this far back to redress a wrong, let's take away the medals unfairly earned by Russian, East German, and Chinese athletes who cheated all those years ago.
 
Kreskin
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by gopher View Post

Very disturbing. But if we can go this far back to redress a wrong, let's take away the medals unfairly earned by Russian, East German, and Chinese athletes who cheated all those years ago.

Ya really. Anything given to an East German should be revoked without further review.
 
#juan
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by gopher View Post

Very disturbing. But if we can go this far back to redress a wrong, let's take away the medals unfairly earned by Russian, East German, and Chinese athletes who cheated all those years ago.

Right on gopher

The Russians and the East Germans were miles ahead of the west in sports doping. Blood packing was something the Russians did for years and it couldn't be detected until somebody defected to the west with the information.
 
scratch
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by #juan View Post

Right on gopher

The Russians and the East Germans were miles ahead of the west in sports doping. Blood packing was something the Russians did for years and it couldn't be detected until somebody defected to the west with the information.


Hey juan,

Have you ever known of those who eventually didn't get caught?
 
#juan
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by scratch View Post

Hey juan,

Have you ever known of those who eventually didn't get caught?

Here is a good bit of info about that problem.:

http://www.stanford.edu/~learnest/cyclops/dopes.htm
 
talloola
#11
Yeah, what's the point of watching with any genuine thoughts of admiration for any
of them, and I always think of the one's who have 'never' taken anything, no one will
ever know who they really are, because we don't trust any of them now, or do we
know who they are, cause they came last, or near last. whatever, I don't take them
serious any longer, I'll just watch, and enjoy the sports I like, cause I like it and that is all,
and whoever wins, I will say "Yeah right".
 
scratch
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by talloola View Post

Yeah, what's the point of watching with any genuine thoughts of admiration for any
of them, and I always think of the one's who have 'never' taken anything, no one will
ever know who they really are, because we don't trust any of them now, or do we
know who they are, cause they came last, or near last. whatever, I don't take them
serious any longer, I'll just watch, and enjoy the sports I like, cause I like it and that is all,
and whoever wins, I will say "Yeah right".


You nailed it. Not really true competition now. Just show boating!
 
gopher
#13
The Chinese cheated like hell in the girls gymnastics competition by having underaged kids in it.

If doping is a crime, this should be as well.
 
Kreskin
#14
The entire ex Soviet block should lose every medal it won between about 1960 and 1990.
 
Risus
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by #juan View Post

Makes me wonder why we should even bother watching. I always suspected that Carl Lewis was taking something. It's become such a high tech thing that nobody bothers with simple anabolic steroids anymore. That growth hormone and blood packing was the new "super dope" a few years ago. I'm sure there are others already out there. You just have to take something they are not yet testing for.

With all the cheating and doping going on, maybe its time to do away with the olympics. It certainly isn't just about the athletes any more.
 
coldstream
#16
Most doping is actually not supportable on an individual basis. It is program based. It requires the collusion of coaches, training partners, team doctors, suppliers of doping agents, scientific labs, testing authorities. They form a sealed 'cell' in terms of maintaining secrecy, enforced by the fact that they are all culpable and stand to lose jobs, endorsements, reputations... as well as being banned, having results disqualified and in some cases face criminal charges.

They have elaborate systems of avoiding detection, using the latest drug products which are always one step ahead of detection. They also have their own testing facilities and will withdraw from meets 'due to injury' if it appears they will test positive. They provide each other with essential moral support and rationale... it just evens the playing field, everyone else is doing it, i'm doing this for my family, or my country, not my self.. ad nauseum..

The only way to get control of the situation is to hold everyone that can be identified in the cell responsible for the others actions. Team disqualifications.. but also sanctions against coaches, sports federations, professional and criminal sanctions against suppliers and doctors.. .Even national associations should be sanctioned if they fail to aggressively prevent doping. They are all responsible. U.S. Track and Field has been particularly notorious in fudging its testing enforcement.

It takes money to support a doping program which means that the most egregious cheating occurs in the highly payed, high profile sports. Ben Johnston, in a recent interview stated he suspects that the 100M dash is still riddled with cheaters, 20 years after his disgrace. Some think its possible that no one has raced sub 9.90 (or more) clean in the history of the event. I will be watching that event, the related relays.. and a lot of others.. especially in athletics.. with a healthy skepticism that i'm watching a clean competition.
Last edited by coldstream; Aug 15th, 2008 at 09:55 AM..
 
darkbeaver
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by coldstream View Post

Most doping is actually not supportable on an individual basis. It is program based. It requires the collusion of coaches, training partners, team doctors, suppliers of doping agents, scientific labs, testing authorities. They form a sealed 'cell' in terms of maintaining secrecy, enforced by the fact that they are all culpable and stand to lose jobs, endorsements, reputations... as well as being banned, having results disqualified and in some cases face criminal charges.

They have elaborate systems of avoiding detection, using the latest drug products which are always one step ahead of detection. They also have their own testing facilities and will withdraw from meets 'due to injury' if it appears they will test positive. They provide each other with essential moral support and rationale... it just evens the playing field, everyone else is doing it, i'm doing this for my family not my self.. ad nauseum..

The only way to get control of the situation is to hold everyone that can be identified in the cell responsible for the others actions. Team disqualifications.. but also sanctions against coaches, national federations, professional and criminal sanctions against suppliers and doctors.. .Even national associations should be sanctioned if they fail to aggressively prevent doping. They are all responsible. U.S. Track and Field has been particularly notorious in fudging its testing enforcement.

It takes money to support a doping program which means that the most egregious cheating occurs in the highly payed, high profile sports. Ben Johnston, in a recent interview stated he suspects that the 100M dash is still riddled with cheaters, 20 years after his disgrace. Some think its possible that no one has raced sub 9.90 (or more) clean in the history of the event. I will be watching that event, the related relays.. and a lot of others.. especially in athletics.. with a healthy skepticism that i'm watching a clean competition.

Exactly, at that level I doubt if there is a clean competition. These athelets do not deserve our respect, many of them are spoiled celebrity wannabees and will cheat steal and lie to get to the top and that kind of ambition is not a virtue, it's a sickness.
 
coldstream
#18
There was an interesting interview of the CBC last night with Victor Comte. The person who supplied Marion Jones with the synthetic steroid that propelled her to all the Golds in Sydney. She has since been stripped of them and sent to jail for lying to authorities about it. He estimated that as many an 2/3 of the top athletes in the most high profile sports are on dope.. like the 100M Dash.

He also said the drug course they use is to build up that strength is from October to December, when little testing is done, and then they run clean the rest of the year, knowing the effects will last at least through the competive season and the Olympics. Steroids are only detectable in the immediate aftemath of usage, so clean tests don't mean they are clean. Jones tested clean something like 160 times.

This innovation of retroactively removing medals is a good development. Frankly a window of 4 years on either side of the event should apply. If you're caught on dope not only are you suspended for 4 years out, but all the medals and results you won for 4 years prior are removed as well, on the fair assumption you were cheating then too. Impose that and start rigorous testing in the 4th Qtr and you'll have a powerful disincentive to cheat.

There are some signs i've noted to that indicate cheating. 1. Dramatic improvements in performance, late in one's career. 2. Association with other cheaters, both in an official and personal capacity, often in drug infested programmes. 3. Cheaters often have turbulent personal lives, although this is hard to guage. There is a private cost in cheating and presenting a false image to the world. If you cheat in your vocation, chances are you cheat in everything else as well.

There are some very prominent athletes, in swimming (NOT Michael Phelps) and in Track and Field who are on dope, and milking the crowd for cheers, and sponsors for money, all on false pretences.
Last edited by coldstream; Aug 18th, 2008 at 01:42 PM..
 
Zan
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by coldstream View Post

This innovation of retroactively removing medals is a good development. Frankly a window of 4 years on either side of the event should apply. If you're caught on dope not only are you suspended for 4 years out, but all the medals and results you won for 4 years prior are removed as well, on the fair assumption you were cheating then too. Impose that and start rigorous testing in the 4th Qtr and you'll have a powerful disincentive to cheat.

I agree - but I think it should be taken a bit further. All medal winners should be tested immediately after their win - with the 4 year window applied. Why is testing still done randomly when abuse is known to be so prevalent?
 
EagleSmack
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by gopher View Post

The Chinese cheated like hell in the girls gymnastics competition by having underaged kids in it.

If doping is a crime, this should be as well.

For once we agree! Did you see the Chinese "Women's" Gymnastic team get thier medal! What a farce. They said they were 16! They were 8 to 11 it seemed to me. Not even CLOSE to 16! They will lose that medal after the Olympics for sure.
 
lone wolf
#21
I wonder how much doping and dirty tricks happened in 1936?
 
gopher
#22
World's GREATEST athlete:








Bryan Clay!

# 1 !!!
 
gopher
#23
I want those gymnastics Gold medals back and real soon, too!!
 

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