Wind farms: the monuments to lunacy


Locutus
#1
But all the cool kids are doing it mom.


These pointless monstrosities will continue to proliferate until the Government sees sense.


Three separate news items on the same day last week reflected three different aspects of what is fast becoming a full-scale disaster bearing down on Britain. The first item was a picture in The Daily Telegraph showing two little children forlornly holding a banner reading “E.On Hands Off Winwick”.

This concerned a battle to prevent a tiny Northamptonshire village from being dwarfed by seven 410-foot wind turbines, each higher than Salisbury Cathedral, to be built nearby by a giant German-owned electricity firm. The 40 residents, it was reported, have raised 50,0000 from their savings to pay lawyers to argue their case when their village’s fate is decided at an inquiry by a Government inspector.

In the nine years since I began writing here about wind turbines, I have been approached by more than 100 such local campaigns in every part of Britain, trying to fight the rich and powerful companies that have been queuing up to cash in on the vast subsidy bonanza available to developers of wind farms. Having been the chairman of one such group myself, I know just how time-consuming and costly such battles can be. The campaigners are up against a system horribly rigged against them, because all too often – although they may win every battle locally (in our case we won unanimous support from our local council) – in the end an inspector may come down from London to rule that the wind farm must go ahead because it is “government policy”.



I long ago decided that there was little point reporting on most of these individual campaigns, because the only way this battle was going to be won was by exposing the futility of the national policy they were up against. My main aim had to be to bring home to people just how grotesquely inefficient and costly wind turbines are as a way to make electricity – without even fulfilling their declared purpose of reducing CO2 emissions.

Alas, despite all the practical evidence to show why wind power is one of the greatest follies of our age, those who rule our lives, from our own politicians and officials here in Britain to those above them in Brussels, seem quite impervious to the facts.





more...


Wind farms: the monuments to lunacy that will be left to blot the landscape - Telegraph



very related:

Wind farm paid 1.2 million to produce no electricity


The amount is ten times greater than the wind farm's owners would have received had they actually generated any electricity.

The disclosure exposes the bizarre workings of Britain's electricity supply, prompting calls last night for an official investigation into the payments system.

The 1.2 million will go to a Norwegian company which owns 60 turbines in the Scottish Borders.

The National Grid asked the company, Fred Olsen Renewables, to shut down its Crystal Rig II wind farm last Saturday for a little over eight hours amid fears the electricity network would become overloaded.





more...


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/ene...ectricity.html
 
windowsillsound
#2
I see it sort of like paying 200$ for a nintendo entertainment system in 1989, and getting a much better console 20 years later, again becoming cheaper over time.
 
Kakato
+3
#3  Top Rated Post
Get used to it,too bad the future scares some folks so much.Funny how it's mainly environuts that allways try and stop wind farm projects but mainly when it's on their land.We have a huge wind farm here in southern Alberta and cant build or plant them fast enough.They are a clean source of energy and leave a tiny enviro footprint.Sometimes I think some people like to just whine about everything if it involves change.
 
s_lone
+3
#4
From what I read it seems the problem is not wind farm technology itself but the stupid way the British seem to be managing it.
 
wulfie68
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by Kakato View Post

Get used to it,too bad the future scares some folks so much.Funny how it's mainly environuts that allways try and stop wind farm projects but mainly when it's on their land.We have a huge wind farm here in southern Alberta and cant build or plant them fast enough.They are a clean source of energy and leave a tiny enviro footprint.Sometimes I think some people like to just whine about everything if it involves change.

Part of the issue with wind farms has been and always will be location.

The original post mentions 470' turbines. I wouldn't want to live near that: its a mountain. I can't blame other people for not wanting to live beside that either. It would be in the same realm as someone building a refinery or landfill site near you. if it can be done in an industrial setting, then well and good, but I can totally understand a village wanting to fight something like that going in too close to them. Noise pollution and aesthetics DO matter when it comes to property value...
 
Kakato
#6
For sure,they should have consulted with Alberta,we are the energy experts.I work with the guys on the transmission side of the grid and also know the two fellows from California who started Albertas wind farms and they also ran the big wind farms in palm springs.They are a money maker.
 
petros
+1
#7
Wind farms in SK are nicely placed at both borders when cruising the #1....

It is only windy along highways?
 
Kakato
#8
First thing you see on highway #3 to the coast while entering the rocky mountains is hundreds of turbines.I didnt like it at first but you get used to it.They didnt plant any near the trans canada though as thats banff and we dont want all the tourists to see that now do we?
 
captain morgan
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by Kakato View Post

Get used to it,too bad the future scares some folks so much.Funny how it's mainly environuts that allways try and stop wind farm projects but mainly when it's on their land.We have a huge wind farm here in southern Alberta and cant build or plant them fast enough.They are a clean source of energy and leave a tiny enviro footprint.Sometimes I think some people like to just whine about everything if it involves change.

At this point in time, the economics for wind/solar energy do not make sense unless there are large gvt subsidies involved. What this means is that the tech needs to be ramped-up to the point where these facilities can stand on their own and then we'll see a more wholesale acceptance.
 
Kakato
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan View Post

At this point in time, the economics for wind/solar energy do not make sense unless there are large gvt subsidies involved. What this means is that the tech needs to be ramped-up to the point where these facilities can stand on their own and then we'll see a more wholesale acceptance.

They do just fine here without subsidies.As far as technical they dont get much more tech then these.
 
captain morgan
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by Kakato View Post

They do just fine here without subsidies.As far as technical they dont get much more tech then these.


We'll have to wait and see on the tech side, it seems that every industry is evolving very fast as each day goes by.

As far as gvt subsidies are concerned, to the best of my knowledge, all of the wind facilities that I am familiar with have a guaranteed minimum rate (provided by gvt) for the KWH produced. That said, if they sell into the market for less, the gvt tops-up the compensation.
 
Kakato
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan View Post

We'll have to wait and see on the tech side, it seems that every industry is evolving very fast as each day goes by.

As far as gvt subsidies are concerned, to the best of my knowledge, all of the wind facilities that I am familiar with have a guaranteed minimum rate (provided by gvt) for the KWH produced. That said, if they sell into the market for less, the gvt tops-up the compensation.

i'll ask the experts today as im assisting them in getting the triple 7 power line into B.C. rec'd out and re energized so we dont have to keep relying on very expensive B.C. hydro for our power here while the line is on the ground.
 
petros
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan View Post

At this point in time, the economics for wind/solar energy do not make sense unless there are large gvt subsidies involved. What this means is that the tech needs to be ramped-up to the point where these facilities can stand on their own and then we'll see a more wholesale acceptance.

There are trade barriers and exclusive marketing **** going on but don't worry Algonquin is the leader and will be for quite sometime especially in the exporting and developing of third world S. America.

GO GR$$N!!
 
captain morgan
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by Kakato View Post

i'll ask the experts today as im assisting them in getting the triple 7 power line into B.C. rec'd out and re energized so we dont have to keep relying on very expensive B.C. hydro for our power here while the line is on the ground.


I'll see if I can dig up some info on the guaranteed rate scenario and shoot it your way
 
taxslave
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by s_lone View Post

From what I read it seems the problem is not wind farm technology itself but the stupid way the British seem to be managing it.

Britian has an essentially socialist government which explains the gross ineptitude in managing what is a free and clean resource.
In B.C. we have a bunch of ecoterrorists protesting potential wind farms on the grounds that they will block the view and lower property values. These same people are also complaining about the high cost of taking the ferry to their little island and want the government to subsidize it even more.
 
petros
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslave View Post

Britian has an essentially socialist government which explains the gross ineptitude in managing what is a free and clean resource.
In B.C. we have a bunch of ecoterrorists protesting potential wind farms on the grounds that they will block the view and lower property values. These same people are also complaining about the high cost of taking the ferry to their little island and want the government to subsidize it even more.

Little island? Oh come on you can say Saltspring it's still legal to out the eco-fascists....for now.
 
EagleSmack
#17
A big story here in Massachusetts is "Cape Wind". It is a proposed windfarm off Hyannis that will bring clean energy to Cape Cod. Ted Kennedy fought against this as well as many of the well-to-do of Cape Cod as it is where they sail their yachts... right off the Kennedy Compound.

I bet they wouldn't mind if the Wind Farm was located off the coastal cities of New Bedford and Fall River.

Green energy is great as long as the wind farms aren't in their backyard.

AND the energy rates are going to climb once "Cape Wind" becomes operational. Green energy doesn't mean cheap energy.
 
Bar Sinister
+1
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by s_lone View Post

From what I read it seems the problem is not wind farm technology itself but the stupid way the British seem to be managing it.

True enough. It appears the problem is that the wind farms are producing electricity that Britain does not really need rather than the technology of wind power itself. In fact, it might be argued that the wind farms are working well enough for the Brits to shut down a few of their polluting thermal plants or dead end nuclear installations.

This quote from the article pretty much says it all regarding wind power.

RenewableUK, the industry trade body, said wind farms were not the only sources of energy to be occasionally paid to be shut down. A spokesman said: "Wind turbines are generating a great deal of clean, green energy the problem is that the National Grid simply doesn't have the capacity to take it all in.


This shows that we urgently need the National Grid to be upgraded to cope with the extra electricity that the wind industry is generating with increasing efficiency."
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gopher
+1
#19
Quote:

Wind farm paid 1.2 million to produce no electricity

A few million given to wind farms pales in comparison to the billions given in subsidies to the wealthy oil barons every year:

Rep. Tim Scott defends fairness of giving billions in oil subsidies to Exxon: “Fair is a relative word” | ThinkProgress

Bear in mind also that often these subsidies are paid and depletion allowances granted for non existent oil wells. To be consistent, pols from both parties should put an end to all such subsidization.
 
shadowshiv
+1
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by Kakato View Post

For sure,they should have consulted with Alberta,we are the energy experts.I work with the guys on the transmission side of the grid and also know the two fellows from California who started Albertas wind farms and they also ran the big wind farms in palm springs.They are a money maker.

A money maker? I don't think that's the case in Ontario.
 
SLM
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by shadowshiv View Post

A money maker? I don't think that's the case in Ontario.

Probably because Dalton got in on it.
 
Cannuck
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by wulfie68 View Post

Part of the issue with wind farms has been and always will be location.

The original post mentions 470' turbines. I wouldn't want to live near that: its a mountain. I can't blame other people for not wanting to live beside that either. It would be in the same realm as someone building a refinery or landfill site near you. if it can be done in an industrial setting, then well and good, but I can totally understand a village wanting to fight something like that going in too close to them. Noise pollution and aesthetics DO matter when it comes to property value...

My local municipality is looking at millions in tax revenue from these wind farms. I'll take two turbines if it means I don't have to pay property tax. That village probably doesn't get to see any revenue from these thing (I'm not sure how it works in the UK) and that may be part of the problem.
 
petros
#23
Long before there was steam there was wind energy.....
 
EagleSmack
+1
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Long before there was steam there was wind energy.....

Don't forget hydro!


 
dumpthemonarchy
#25
According to the link below, Geothermal is commercially viable in 24 countries around the world. So why are we pursuing wind power? Wind power takes subsidies everywhere. Iceland uses it.

Geothermal Power | BC Sustainable Energy Association
 
karrie
+1
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by dumpthemonarchy View Post

According to the link below, Geothermal is commercially viable in 24 countries around the world. So why are we pursuing wind power? Wind power takes subsidies everywhere. Iceland uses it.

Geothermal Power | BC Sustainable Energy Association

Because we can't go with ONE option moving forward from petroleum. We need to scavenge.
 
dumpthemonarchy
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

Because we can't go with ONE option moving forward from petroleum. We need to scavenge.

We already use other sources such as natural gas and coal. Business likes it when the greens go nuts over wind and solar because biz gets handouts, those independent private corporations like free money too.

Says here, according to the Geological Survey of Canada, that western Canada has enough geothermal to supply the country with one million times its current electrical consumption. We could supply our current electricity needs with about 100 new plants which produce no significant GHGs, and would be profitable. And no need for rare earth minerals either which wind power requires, minerals which China is hoarding is right now.

B.C., Canada sitting on 'massive' store of geothermal energy: Report
 
taxslave
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Little island? Oh come on you can say Saltspring it's still legal to out the eco-fascists....for now.

Actually it was Quadra. Lots of teachers live there and work in Campbell River. Also Susuki has a summer mansion there.
 
bill barilko
#29
Wind works on a small scale in some places that I do know-it usually blows like hell on that reef.

This is a small island in the Vava'u Achipelago Kingdowm og Tonga

 
dumpthemonarchy
#30
Grouse Mountain in Vancouver has a big windmill at the peak, which you can see from the city. I don't On a small scale wind seems fine, on a large scale it is beginning to resemble a Fighter jet program.

In this article below, they talk about BC being self sufficient in energy by 2016 and they hope wind power makes a contribution. Starting with one windmill! What propaganda.

Grouse Mountain wind turbine hooked up - British Columbia - CBC News
 

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