Solving Canada's Problems


Cannuck
No Party Affiliation
+1
#1  Top Rated Post
As a fire officer, service tech and one with extensive management of complex systems, I find there is little if any effective problem solving in our political arena. Disjoint incremental approach to problem solving seems to be the strategy of the day and it is causing far more problems than it solving. So, I got to thinking....what if we used a proven proper and effective problem solving technique (like the incident command P-POST system) and see how it pans out. For those not familiar with the anachronism, P-POST stands for Problem - Priorities, Objectives, Strategies, Tactics. When a problem arises (and it is determined what the actual problem is) the first step to note the priorities. This, I believe, is our biggest problem in Canada. We have no big picture priorities. These priorities are an essential part of the process as they are what is used to set objectives and develop strategies and most importantly, they don't change . I've been thinking about it for a while and given that Canada is a democracy, the country's priorities should be something that the majority can agree on. Remember, these are big picture goals and they shouldn't be contradictory. So, let me know what you think.

Some of my priorities:

Equality of all citizens
Bottom up approach to governance
Value for taxes
 
petros
#2
Canada has problems?
 
CDNBear
#3
Quote: Originally Posted by Cannuck View Post

As a fire officer, service tech and one with extensive management of complex systems, I find there is little if any effective problem solving in our political arena. Disjoint incremental approach to problem solving seems to be the strategy of the day and it is causing far more problems than it solving. So, I got to thinking....what if we used a proven proper and effective problem solving technique (like the incident command P-POST system) and see how it pans out. For those not familiar with the anachronism, P-POST stands for Problem - Priorities, Objectives, Strategies, Tactics. When a problem arises (and it is determined what the actual problem is) the first step to note the priorities. This, I believe, is our biggest problem in Canada. We have no big picture priorities. These priorities are an essential part of the process as they are what is used to set objectives and develop strategies and most importantly, they don't change . I've been thinking about it for a while and given that Canada is a democracy, the country's priorities should be something that the majority can agree on. Remember, these are big picture goals and they shouldn't be contradictory. So, let me know what you think.

Good idea. Another would be to implement LEAN manufacturing, which could be applied to gov't services, as a product, and in all levels of gov't bureaucracy.

Quote:

Equality of all citizens

Could you clarify this for me? It would seem to be contradictory to your generalized views, and lumping of all First Nations people, or as you refer to them "leeches at the gov't tit"into one common erroneous notion, where the law should only protect the legal rights of non Natives and the legal findings that protect Natives are, in your opinion, wrong. Compounded by a less then limited understanding of or knowledge of any treaty or history thereof. Which of course isn't really equality for all citizens, unless you are prone to moral relativism and not logical consistency.
Quote:

Bottom up approach to governance

Sounds interesting, can you expand on that?
Quote:

Value for taxes

Now there's something I can throw my full support behind, and a something LEAN manufacturing would help attain.
Last edited by CDNBear; Mar 13th, 2011 at 11:48 AM..
 
Cannuck
No Party Affiliation
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post


Could you clarify this for me? It would seem to be contradictory to your generalized views, and lumping of all First Nations people into one common erroneous notion, where the law should only protect the legal rights of non Natives and the legal findings that protect Natives are, in your opinion, wrong.

It's not contradictory to my generalized view. I'm lumping all first nations people in with Canadians. If they don't want to be Canadians then their equality and legal right within Canada is irrelevant.

Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post

Sounds interesting, can you expand on that?

No, I have no interest in discussing this with you any further given your comment, "Compounded by a less then limited understanding of or knowledge of any treaty or history thereof" it's pretty clear you aren't really interested in discussion and instead want to play more of your silly games. Raise the maturity level a tad and then i might be inclined to answer more of your questions.
 
Durry
+1
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by Cannuck View Post

As a fire officer, service tech and one with extensive management of complex systems, I find there is little if any effective problem solving in our political arena. Disjoint incremental approach to problem solving seems to be the strategy of the day and it is causing far more problems than it solving. So, I got to thinking....what if we used a proven proper and effective problem solving technique (like the incident command P-POST system) and see how it pans out. For those not familiar with the anachronism, P-POST stands for Problem - Priorities, Objectives, Strategies, Tactics. When a problem arises (and it is determined what the actual problem is) the first step to note the priorities. This, I believe, is our biggest problem in Canada. We have no big picture priorities. These priorities are an essential part of the process as they are what is used to set objectives and develop strategies and most importantly, they don't change . I've been thinking about it for a while and given that Canada is a democracy, the country's priorities should be something that the majority can agree on. Remember, these are big picture goals and they shouldn't be contradictory. So, let me know what you think.

Some of my priorities:
s

It's pretty obvious your paid by the Government, can't get a job done unless you have a process to follow.

Why don't you tell the Libs, Iggy, that he should follow the P- POST approach If he wants to get elected. During the election campain he can tell everybody he is following the P-POST approach in governing this country. That should get him elected !! Lol !!
 
CDNBear
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by Cannuck View Post

It's not contradictory to my generalized view. I'm lumping all first nations people in with Canadians. If they don't want to be Canadians then their equality and legal right within Canada is irrelevant.

I beg to differ. The very basis of the comment that their equality and legal right within Canada is irrelevant . Only strengths my opinion that you do not support equality. The Crown is subject to equally applying the law to its citizen and people with whom they have binding contracts, or there is no equality.

Quote:

No, I have no interest in discussing this with you any further given your comment, "Compounded by a less then limited understanding of or knowledge of any treaty or history thereof" it's pretty clear you aren't really interested in discussion and instead want to play more of your silly games.

That is a statement of fact, as exampled by our previous discussions and highlighted in you continued belief all First Nation are one in the same. The only thing I can take from your apparent distress, is that the truth hurts.

Besides that, wouldn't your erroneous argument that my perceived generalization of Muslims, is wrong. While you generalize all Natives, be a logical inconsistency?

Quote:

Raise the maturity level a tad and then i might be inclined to answer more of your questions.

The fact that you call my maturity in to question, when I simply put forward polite opinion and facts, only shows that it isn't I that has the maturity problem Cannuck. Isn't that tantamount to challenging someones cognitive or comprehension skills? Wouldn't that be a logical inconsistency on your part? Those are rhetorical questions Cannuck, I already know the answers are yes and yes.

But I digress, if you aren't up to a mature discussion, and haven't the ability to adequately defend your position, then I bid good day and you can have a private pity party.

I wait for someone else whose posts contain a measure of maturity and fortitude to carry on this discussion with.
 
Cannuck
No Party Affiliation
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by Durry View Post

Why don't you tell the Libs, Iggy, that he should follow the P- POST approach If he wants to get elected.

They already do. The problem is that their "priority" is getting elected and not governing the country. As for "working for the government" systems analysis and management have nothing to do with the public or private sector and everything to do with increasing complexities of the systems we manage (well, at least the systems I manage....I have no idea what you do)


disjointed incrementalism: Definition from Answers.com

Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post

I wait for someone else whose posts contain a measure of maturity and fortitude to carry on this discussion with.

Bu-bye. Thanks for coming
 
petros
#8
I can think of a great example of something that disappoints me as a Canadian.

The wife an I want to build a new house on the farm and leave the city for good so we've been looking at various floor plans, materials, and building techniques such as modular and interlocking log.

Odds are high that our end choice is a Finnish design using Russian pine milled and packed into a seacan in beautiful Changzhou.

Quote: Originally Posted by Cannuck View Post

They already do. The problem is that their "priority" is getting elected and not governing the country.
Bu-bye. Thanks for coming

The TV show called Canada. Thanks for tuning in.
 
CDNBear
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by Cannuck View Post

Bu-bye. Thanks for coming

No need to thank me Cannuck. I enjoy pointing out peoples lack of knowledge on subjects they write blowhard posts about, ripe with logical inconsistencies and bigoted generalizations.

I find it entertaining.

Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

I can think of a great example of something that disappoints me as a Canadian.

The wife an I want to build a new house on the farm and leave the city for good so we've been looking at various floor plans, materials, and building techniques such as modular and interlocking log.

Odds are high that our end choice is a Finnish design using Russian pine milled and packed into a seacan in beautiful Changzhou.

Are there no modular home manufactures in Canada Petros?
 
petros
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post

Are there no modular home manufactures in Canada Petros?

We toured a factory in Steinbach MB and all I can say is they can keep their OSB and drywall. We'll take the Finnish/Russian/Chinese 15mm solid log for $66K less on a 2400sqft home.

I may love my country but I'm not financially stupid.
 
gerryh
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post


Are there no modular home manufactures in Canada Petros?


of course there are, but petros doesn't like anything about Canada.
 
CDNBear
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

We toured a factory in Steinbach MB and all I can say is they can keep their OSB and drywall. We'll take the Finnish/Russian/Chinese 15mm solid log for $66K less on a 2400sqft home.

So let me get this straight...

You can order a prefab log home from around the world and get it for $66K less?

Are there no duties on that?

How can a timber resource Nation like Canada not be competitive in this market?

Quote:

I may love my country but I'm not financially stupid.

I wouldn't fault you for it.

Quote: Originally Posted by gerryh View Post

of course there are, but petros doesn't like anything about Canada.

I don't get that impression Gh. I do however get the impression he has no love for the powers that be. No matter the stripe.
 
Durry
+1
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

We toured a factory in Steinbach MB and all I can say is they can keep their OSB and drywall. We'll take the Finnish/Russian/Chinese 15mm solid log for $66K less on a 2400sqft home.
.

Yeah but, they probably not using the P-POST method !!! Lol. !!
 
CDNBear
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by Durry View Post

Yeah but, they probably not using the P-POST method !!! Lol. !!



Perhaps P-POST and beam?
 
Durry
+1
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post



Perhaps P-POST and beam?

Oh yeah, your right, Omg, I completely overlooked this type of construction technique.
I should have used the P-POST method before I spoke !!! Lol !!
 
Trotz
Bloc Québécois
#16
Bad enough to have two governments and two bureaucracies in each province, I say we shut down Ottawa. Shutting down the Federal Government has worked well in Belgium.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

We toured a factory in Steinbach MB and all I can say is they can keep their OSB and drywall. We'll take the Finnish/Russian/Chinese 15mm solid log for $66K less on a 2400sqft home.

I may love my country but I'm not financially stupid.

Have you checked out these guys?

Log Homes and Cabins < 1867 Confederation Log Homes
 
Cannuck
No Party Affiliation
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by Trotz View Post

Bad enough to have two governments and two bureaucracies in each province, I say we shut down Ottawa. Shutting down the Federal Government has worked well in Belgium.

I don't mind the idea of a weaker national government but I think that would fall under objectives or strategies. I think the priority would or could be a government more responsive to individual needs. A strong federal government may or may not be able to do that.
 
CDNBear
+1
#19
A true politician in the making, how to use so many words, while saying nothing at all.

Gov't service suits you.
 
Trotz
Bloc Québécois
#20
So true, if only we could send the no-platform politicians back to the states. That means Ignatieff and Harper
 
petros
+1
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post

So let me get this straight...

You can order a prefab log home from around the world and get it for $66K less?

Are there no duties on that?

How can a timber resource Nation like Canada not be competitive in this market?

Duties are GST.

Exactly Bear how the hell can logs from around the world be cheaper be milled and shipped cheaper? If they had Saskatchewan spruce or fir available at a competitive prices, as high of quality, with a 60 year warranty then of course I'd scoop it up.


gerryh what makes you think I'm hateful towards Canada when I'm doing the exact samething Canadian politicians and corporations get praised for?

There is no loyalty anymore in the world of international politics and finance.

Perfect example is: US people bail out GM to secure jobs and the manufacturing asset of a manufacturing base as big a GM but GM takes the people's money and ****s off to build a plant in China where they will out sell and out employ the US market on money and jobs that could have stayed within the US and Canada.

Yup. I'm evil hateful all right.

Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolf View Post

Have you checked out these guys?

Log Homes and Cabins < 1867 Confederation Log Homes

Google all you want but come back with a pricelist or two and find me one that is under $90K like the one we found. Yeah we looked at several Canadian ones from Revelstoke and Golden areas and another in Canmore and another near Merrit

I'm cheap of course I've depleted the CDN sources including the one you posted above.

Do you think that the extra $66K will be spread around to theose who did all the work and gave up their natural resource or just line the pocket of some guy sitting in Vancouver or Calgary or Regina?
 
CDNBear
#22
So what was the final cost, bottom line, taxes and construction included?
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Google all you want but come back with a pricelist or two and find me one that is under $90K like the one we found. Yeah we looked at several Canadian ones from Revelstoke and Golden areas and another in Canmore and another near Merrit

I'm not the salesman. Do your own legwork. I just happen to know people at the company - but not the ones who'll spoonfeed you - and the quality of construction.
Last edited by lone wolf; Mar 13th, 2011 at 02:13 PM..
 
petros
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post

So what was the final cost, bottom line, taxes and construction included?

Total living area
2318 sq.ft. / 208.44 sq.m.
Main
1261 sq.ft. / 113.4 sq.m.
1st level
1057 sq.ft. / 95.04 sq.m.
Width
36' 0" ft / 10.8 m
Depth
35' 0" ft / 10.5m
Ridge height from top of foundation
31' 0" ft / 9.318 m
Bedrooms
4
Full baths
2
kictch
1
Bonus space
1
Garage type
1
Foundation type
basement
Exterior wall
6X 6
Loaded quantity
1 set 20" container
1 set 40HQ container
Price
90060USD


Add GST/PST and $4500 - $5000CDN for CN intermodal FOB Changzhou CN to Port of Prince Rupert to Yorkton SK and then dropped off on the farm 70km further.

Construction labour, geo-thermal and extension to a feild stone foundation will be done by myself and family. I own a zoom boom for moving and stacking bales and my own drills for the geo-thermal. My bros and bro inlaws are in trades and it's time for big bro to cash in on a lot of IOUs

So there it is. If anyone can find me CDN interlocking log for cheaper and with same 60 year warranty and easy self assembly
please PM me.

If you want to see a pdf with floor plans and photo of finished product PM me.
 
CDNBear
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Total living area
2318 sq.ft. / 208.44 sq.m.
Main
1261 sq.ft. / 113.4 sq.m.
1st level
1057 sq.ft. / 95.04 sq.m.
Width
36' 0" ft / 10.8 m
Depth
35' 0" ft / 10.5m
Ridge height from top of foundation
31' 0" ft / 9.318 m
Bedrooms
4
Full baths
2
kictch
1
Bonus space
1
Garage type
1
Foundation type
basement
Exterior wall
6X 6
Loaded quantity
1 set 20" container
1 set 40HQ container
Price
90060USD


Add GST/PST and $4500 - $5000CDN for CN intermodal FOB Changzhou CN to Port of Prince Rupert to Yorkton SK and then dropped off on the farm 70km further.

Construction labour, geo-thermal and extension to a feild stone foundation will be done by myself and family. I own a zoom boom for moving and stacking bales and my own drills for the geo-thermal. My bros and bro inlaws are in trades and it's time for big bro to cash in on a lot of IOUs

So there it is. If anyone can find me CDN interlocking log for cheaper and with same 60 year warranty and easy self assembly
please PM me.

If you want to see a pdf with floor plans and photo of finished product PM me.

Expect a PM shortly.

My only questions are, do they have offices in Canada where warranty claims can be made? And how exactly would warranty work be done on a log home?

You can't exactly just take apart someones house to replace a rotten log, can you?
 
taxslave
Free Thinker
+1
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by Cannuck View Post

As a fire officer, service tech and one with extensive management of complex systems, I find there is little if any effective problem solving in our political arena. Disjoint incremental approach to problem solving seems to be the strategy of the day and it is causing far more problems than it solving. So, I got to thinking....what if we used a proven proper and effective problem solving technique (like the incident command P-POST system) and see how it pans out. For those not familiar with the anachronism, P-POST stands for Problem - Priorities, Objectives, Strategies, Tactics. When a problem arises (and it is determined what the actual problem is) the first step to note the priorities. This, I believe, is our biggest problem in Canada. We have no big picture priorities. These priorities are an essential part of the process as they are what is used to set objectives and develop strategies and most importantly, they don't change . I've been thinking about it for a while and given that Canada is a democracy, the country's priorities should be something that the majority can agree on. Remember, these are big picture goals and they shouldn't be contradictory. So, let me know what you think.

Some of my priorities:

Equality of all citizens
Bottom up approach to governance
Value for taxes

Admirable goals. We could start with the simple things like fixed election dates so politicians could spend at least one week during their tour of duty doing the country's business and not preening for the next election.
Take away the power militant government unions have to prevent change.
Fix the income tax system to make it fair and simple.
Financially penalize politicians and bureaucrats that cheat and lie.
Thats probably all the ruling class could take in one go.
 
CDNBear
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslave View Post

Take away the power militant government unions have to prevent change.

I'd do away with Gov't unions, period. With todays courts setting precedents, and legislation, in labour relations, pay equality and worker safety. They have long since outlived their usefulness.

Quote:

Financially penalize politicians and bureaucrats that cheat and lie.

I would actually suggest severe prison terms, on crimes in breach of trust.

Quote:

Thats probably all the ruling class could take in one go.

You think they could take that alone, without there heads exploding?
 
Cannuck
No Party Affiliation
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslave View Post

Admirable goals. We could start with the simple things like fixed election dates so politicians could spend at least one week during their tour of duty doing the country's business and not preening for the next election.

I'm not sure if fixed election dates are the answer. Look south of the border. US elections seem to take 2 years. I'd be more inclined to support term limits. One term then move on. Again though, this is more on the level of strategy. I guess the priority would be to make a system that refreshed itself more often.

Quote: Originally Posted by taxslave View Post

Take away the power militant government unions have to prevent change.

I don't believe unions are preventing change. I believe the system makes change undesirable and the union is but one part of it.

Quote: Originally Posted by taxslave View Post

Fix the income tax system to make it fair and simple.

Simple I agree but I fair? I'm sure my idea of fair and Paul Martin's idea of fair are two different things. Before we could make it fair, we would have to define fair.

Quote: Originally Posted by taxslave View Post

Financially penalize politicians and bureaucrats that cheat and lie.
Thats probably all the ruling class could take in one go.

That would happen if we had a bottom up approach to political management.
 
petros
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post

Expect a PM shortly.

My only questions are, do they have offices in Canada where warranty claims can be made? And how exactly would warranty work be done on a log home?

You can't exactly just take apart someones house to replace a rotten log, can you?

Escrow payment. If something is missing payment is held.

I sent you the basics but would have to email more.

Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolf View Post

I'm not the salesman. Do your own legwork. I just happen to know people at the company - but not the ones who'll spoonfeed you - and the quality of construction.

Thank you for the link. I'll add them to my list.
 
CDNBear
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Escrow payment. If something is missing payment is held.

I sent you the basics but would have to email more.

Thanx bud. I'll look at it in a bit.
 

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