The History and Meaning of "Palestine" and "Palestinians"


MHz
#31
Quote: Originally Posted by Dexter Sinister View Post

No, I don't think I'll bother. Anyone whose reality is governed by a uniquely twisted understanding of texts written between two and five millennia ago isn't someone I'm going to accept information from, and anyone you agree with is likely to be just as wrong as you are.

Yes, . . . that has been known to be an obstacle a time or two. I'd rather have more answers than questions when it is all said and done and be avoided than have questions in a room where looking for answers is not encouraged but then that's just me
Too bad the banking solution comes 10 verses from the same book. I doubt by comments are going to bring down it down when it has survived for 100's of years

The blanket condemnation might include belief in gravity so try not to run over the event horizon. Making money and banking a public service is easier to do than bringing people back from the grave. We can easily do one but refuse to do it. There is no better proof that relief of the hazards of being poor is not even on the list of things that need fixing, the quality of life for the rich would not change as they cannot spend all they take in.

If I spent the same time with a similar book of a similar size I should be as familiar with the contents after a similar amount of time. If it is shorter then theology is not my 'strongest' subject. Mechanical design is also something that is something that I can visual in the same animation form once there is a starting point and a finish point. Presently that would be altering flax handling equipment into something that could handle hemp stalks bundled for transport by rail. That would mean clearing land that fits the guidelines for the strict guidelines (like elk strength fencing) and if you have to do that why not really landscape it to take full advantage of the location. That could mean south sloping land could be used but north sloping land lost production to a level that it should be avoided in that there is a lot of south sloping land to utilize. None of that has anything to do with reading and having an opinion of the bible. If it stops you from being able to visualize anything else I can write about then that is your loss not mine. If my opinion includes designs for thing like perpetual motion wheels or front-wheel drive choppers then I am still better of by being able to describe various designs with the pros and cons that some one line that is based on 'avoid because He believes in God' gets the attention.

Without it being a brag as I spent several years flipping through the pages looking for answers I can honestly say it is a lot more fun to be playing with answers instead. It was never a conversion mission so it could never be failed as each discussion usually led to something new.
Change the subject and who is in the discussion there are still new things coming as answers to a variety of 'questions'. For hemp production it might be automatic stooking at cutting time or rake 2x and then stook once the leaves are on the ground stopping weeds from starting. For the local area that gets clear-cut it could be an attractive ground cover to stop erosion untill the spruce crow taller than they are. Religion beliefs means limited open doors (thread) here.
The homesteaders will have to survive with the haywire fixes. If I can power the homestead by spinning up a wheel weighing a few tons with a cable I can pull with my truck when leaving (little faster than norm) What farmer would want to put the solar yard light in all the fence posts rather than the 1,00W yard light that covers 1,00sq ft at best. Homestead inventions should be front line items rather than what cab be salvaged at the local dump.
That might be the next industry in North America, luckily we buried a lot of stuff in the last few 100 years, time to go treasure hunting with something resembling eco-dredging. 22nd century machine going over material sorted and buried in the 1800's. Yukon gold would get the gold and the mercury and the arsenic and all the other 'goodies' left behind. Benign soil and all products sold to the business community. Old city dumps would be the areas that cities would mine.

Not that this place rates high on the discussion trail but even the few Jews I've chatted with will admit that if you are going to read an English Bible the one to read is the 1611KJV. Was it worth the 20 page discussion, sure. The bad part is I know that defining the 'land of the enemy' is the one point their argument comes up short. No need to exploit it, they already know it is short of being perfectly understood.

Chats would also have covered weather patterns of the ice ages. lol, as you can see I'm about as dangerous as 'we' come, if there was more than one, there isn't. For the record, I hope there is an ending coming shortly for a bankers plan for the area. I also know a repeat of Iran from 1953-1979 isn't going to work, shoveling in $1T for useful community projects will work though. Not one Govt has ever been overthrown by the people because they were 'too nice'.
 
grainfedpraiboy
+1
#32
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Zec:8:23:
Thus saith the LORD of hosts;
In those days it shall come to pass,
that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations,
even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew,
saying,
We will go with you:
for we have heard that God is with you.

You're lucky that your biblical quote is sort of relevant to the thread so I'll give you a pass on a STGTSWC quote......this time.

"Jewish Girl Blues" by Bradley Fish - www.bradleyfish.com - YouTube
 
Dexter Sinister
+4
#33
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

...The blanket condemnation might include belief in gravity so try not to run over the event horizon. Making money and banking a public service is easier to do than bringing people back from the grave. We can easily do one but refuse to do it. There is no better proof that relief of the hazards of being poor is not even on the list of things that need fixing, the quality of life for the rich would not change as they cannot spend all they take in.... [etc.]

I'd try to respond in detail to whatever it is you're arguing if I knew what it is, but I don't, so I can't. That word salad reads like you're drunk or stoned. The only point I got from it--and I'm far from sure about even this much--is that you're thinking I reject your information and arguments because you believe in god and I don't. That's really irrelevant, I reject them because they're wrong.
 
MHz
#34
Quote: Originally Posted by DaSleeper View Post

You recommend a 2 hour illuminati movie.......I'll pass....and I doubt you'll find many taker....

You are beyond stoopid......misspelled on purpose because it's a mile beyond stupid!

Jordan Maxwell and Admiralty Law is a tad dry I'll give you that, however it is the only place the BAR and the City of London are explained in any detail.
There is a 4hr one also. I listen to them more than sit and intently watch. This guy has an interesting out look on the OT. (1 to 4)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtBz...0A0322&index=3

Quote: Originally Posted by Dexter Sinister View Post

I'd try to respond in detail to whatever it is you're arguing if I knew what it is, but I don't, so I can't. That word salad reads like you're drunk or stoned. The only point I got from it--and I'm far from sure about even this much--is that you're thinking I reject your information and arguments because you believe in god and I don't. That's really irrelevant, I reject them because they're wrong.

The 'salad' was a short list of topics that I could cover in as much detail as the Bible. That you conclude something about how accurate my views would be on a different subjects when you have never heard them as we have never covered the short list.

Like I mentioned earlier I'm not aware I am missing anything important by not covering anything more than what is already under the bridge. Even the expanding earth theory has never explained how you can push crust that floars into a liquid that ins under so much pressure it is shooting up into the air to a great height. It doesn't matter if I even find a suitable answer as it might belong in the 'unanswered pile' for a long time to come.
Glad you are still kicking,
bye.
 
Blackleaf
#35
Palestine is merely a geographical region. Calling Palestine a country is like calling Western Europe a country; or the Levant a country. It has never existed as a nation state. Israel isn't even the only country which is situated in Palestine. Jordan does, too.

It's very noticeable that the pro-Palestinian/anti-Israel brigade do not know all this. They're very ignorant of the political history of the region and believe that Palestine was once a nation state until nasty Israel came along and "occupied" it. And if you try to tell them the truth, they'll just ignore you.
 
CDNBear
+1
#36
So anyways, Egypt has to clear a buffer zone to try and hinder tunnelling by Hamas and its criminal enterprises as well.

I wonder what else Israel did wrong this week.
 
SLM
+1
#37
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post


I wonder what else Israel did wrong this week.

They remained in existence. Duh!
 
CDNBear
+1
#38
Quote: Originally Posted by SLM View Post

They remained in existence. Duh!

My bad.
 
SLM
+1
#39
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post

My bad.

Everyday is let's hate Israel day now. Get with the program. Lol.
 
MHz
-1
#40
Quote: Originally Posted by SLM View Post

They remained in existence. Duh!

At least they know what to do to win the hearts and minds of this crowd and they appear to be the gift that keeps giving. The history of the brownshirts would have segments where bad is called good, no better example of that than this motley crew. (inquiring minds would want to know why none of you can ever find articles like this, I already have the answer to that one) This would the clay becoming the potter, works as well as any species jump in the past.
If something isn't acknowledged then it doesn't exist right? wow and I get a ring side-seat to see just who that works on, so far it is only the mindless and really who will miss them?

http://rt.com/news/201579-israel-gaza-border-crossing/
Israel has said it’s shutting the only two operating Gaza border crossings indefinitely. This comes a day after a projectile hit Israel from the strip, but caused no damage. Border closures threaten to isolate already devastated Gaza completely.
The move will affect both the Kerem Shalom and Erez border crossings, Haartez reported, quoting Israel’s defense establishment. The authorities have notified the Palestinians of the decision.
Meanwhile, the three other crossings into Gaza are still not operational and the passage from the area into Egypt – the Rafah crossing – remains closed.
From now on and until further notice, only critical humanitarian aid going into Gaza will be allowed via the Erez crossing.



Over 1.7 million Gazans isolated from the world after Israel, Egypt close crossings « Aletho News


Gaza has become an open-air prison after Israel decided to close two border crossings with Gaza, the army said on Sunday, after a rocket allegedly fired from the Palestinian enclave struck its territory.
The Israeli blockade comes a week after Egypt closed its border with Gaza. With all borders closed, more than one and a half million people in Gaza are now isolated from the outside world. They are prisoners inside the 360 square kilometers that make up the coastal Strip.
“The crossing points for people and goods, Erez and Kerem Shalom, have been closed until further notice except for humanitarian aid,” an army spokeswoman said.
She said that the measure was taken after a rocket fired from Gaza hit Israeli-occupied Palestinian territory on Friday, without causing any casualties or damage.
There was no claim of responsibility from any armed faction in Gaza. A military spokeswoman said forces were still searching for debris.


PHOTO OF SUSPECTED PALESTINIAN TERRORIST | Desertpeace
ERUSALEM (Ma’an) — Israeli forces in occupied East Jerusalem on Friday attempted to detain two Palestinian children, a two-year-old and a nine-year old, on suspicion of throwing rocks.Israeli soldiers were conducting a raid on the home of the Jaber family in the Silwan neighborhood in order to search for an individual suspected of throwing rocks at them from the roof, the family told Ma’an.When the soldiers ascended to the roof to detain the alleged culprit, however, they found a two-year-old named Mimati Asaad Jaber who was playing with his mother. While they were playing, apparently, a rock had fallen into the street below.
The boy’s grandfather, who was in the house during the raid, said that the boy was only playing and that he did not know there were soldiers in the street below the building when he tossed the stone.
Upon seeing the two-year-old with his mother, however, the Israeli soldiers shifted their attention to a nine-year-old member of the family nearby.

Europeans Are the Last People to Teach Israel Moral Lessons: Journalist | Analysis & Opinion | RIA Novosti
“While recognizing Israel's legitimate right to defend itself against any attacks, the EU underlines that the Israeli military operation must be proportionate and in line with international humanitarian law,” the EU Council said in a statement issued July 22. “The EU is particularly appalled by the human cost of the Israeli military operation in Shuja’iyya, and is deeply concerned at the rapidly deteriorating humanitarian situation,” the EU Council stressed.

Quote: Originally Posted by Blackleaf View Post

Palestine is merely a geographical region. Calling Palestine a country is like calling Western Europe a country; or the Levant a country. It has never existed as a nation state. Israel isn't even the only country which is situated in Palestine. Jordan does, too.

It's very noticeable that the pro-Palestinian/anti-Israel brigade do not know all this. They're very ignorant of the political history of the region and believe that Palestine was once a nation state until nasty Israel came along and "occupied" it. And if you try to tell them the truth, they'll just ignore you.

If any person has trouble putting the UN181 defined Arab lands on a map should that person should not be part of any discussion about anything anywhere. The Brits would be the masters at putting fine-print and loop-holes into contracts and treaties. The 'legal' hold is what is written in the Torah is it not? Do they have any proof that the land could be gifted to them by the physical owner. The book of wars would seem that there was some resistance to that 'coming home'. It is also no legally possible to claim something in reality as being yours if the only proof is a document that is thought of to be a collection of stories, by the same people that want the land. BTW Judism is a religious movement rather than a political one, the UN Human right documents are ones that the Muslim general population would readily adopt and history bears that out. It also bears out that the West is the ones holding back that transformation and that has to be agenda driven because people are not that stupid naturally. At least there are examples of how a single bad idea can be changed into the 'norm' in surprisingly few steps.

If $6B is raised in reconstruction how long would it take to spend it if this incident closes the border for that long (unknown length)? Any models of what the final product will be? I assume the Bedouin villages are part of the package, perhaps something in early gypsy only with ATCO 72 footers x 5 pulled by a D8 Camel. I assume the wandering foot syndrome is more to do with water than the need to travel in a migratory route.

I'd be more than happy to post articles like that if I could find some.
Last edited by MHz; Nov 2nd, 2014 at 11:29 AM..
 
CDNBear
+1
#41
Could you please ease up on the cut & paste, you're messing up the thread.
 
MHz
-1
#42
I can see why they don't call you eagle-eye, 'I'd be more than happy to post articles like that if I could find some.' I can see how news articles about the area would mess up the general theme. Is repetition of the same theme like that C & P thing you find so offensive?. Can you read the map defined in UN 181, not a terribly hard question, or at least it shouldn't be.

In that same document you don't want to read is a date by which independence has to be recognized by the UN. Earlier is fine but one cannot exist without the other. I can see how little details like that could mess up the direction you want to see the thread go. lol Carry on though, it isn't everyday I get to see a professional at being stupid at work, let alone one that is head of a 6-pac. Swat the weakest and the first to deflect that attack is the one that should have been the one at the start. So far you aren't very unpredictable.
You would be in a better position to compare how much better Gaza has it than any Indian you know from any Reservation. Palestine would be the area on the wrong side of a tall wall if you were to walk the land. Google earth is a decent mapping program, think the places mentioned in UN181 can still be found? That name is still up for grabs when defining nationhood at the UN. Gazanians just has no ring to it.
Last edited by MHz; Nov 2nd, 2014 at 01:02 PM..
 
DaSleeper
#43
no thank you
 
CDNBear
+1
#44
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

I can see why they don't call you eagle-eye, 'I'd be more than happy to post articles like that if I could find some.' I can see how news articles about the area would mess up the general theme. Is repetition of the same theme like that C & P thing you find so offensive?. Can you read the map defined in UN 181, not a terribly hard question, or at least it shouldn't be.

The bulk of your posts are insipid and idiotic, the repetition is merely a sub annoyance. Your cut & pastes, sometimes mess with the programming, I'm sure your limited cognitive skills will further prevent you from understanding exactly what I'm talking about.
 
MHz
-1
#45
Quote: Originally Posted by DaSleeper View Post

no thank you

You forgot the 'we interrupt this ......' part. This would be a lot easier if you guys just published a full list of documents and articles that can should never be referenced. I would go with 'whatever we say' but those updates are few and far in between, know what I mean?

Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBear View Post

The bulk of your posts are insipid and idiotic, the repetition is merely a sub annoyance. Your cut & pastes, sometimes mess with the programming, I'm sure your limited cognitive skills will further prevent you from understanding exactly what I'm talking about.

Your version of freedom is you talking and anybody not in agreement can shut up. That about sum your message up?
(forgetting the part that 6 bigger idiots backing you up is a sign of how solid your fantasy is)
 
CDNBear
+1
#46
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

You forgot the 'we interrupt this ......' part. This would be a lot easier if you guys just published a full list of documents and articles that can should never be referenced. I would go with 'whatever we say' but those updates are few and far in between, know what I mean?

No, no one knows what you mean. You babble more than you make sense.

We've argued these matters to the bitter end. You offer nothing new but different angles to the same responses, intermixed with more of your patented idiocy.

Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Your version of freedom is you talking and anybody not in agreement can shut up. That about sum your message up?

Nope, that's just what you think because you aren't bright enough to understand.
 
MHz
-1
#47
'You offer nothing new but different angles . . . ', no wonder I'm such a heretic. As for supporting your sanity as far as deductive reasoning, I rest my case.
 
CDNBear
#48
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

'You offer nothing new but different angles . . . ', no wonder I'm such a heretic. As for challenging you sanity as far as deductive reasoning, I rest my case.

You have no case, there is no sanity to your posts, and as for deductive reasoning, you haven't clue one what it is.
 
MHz
-1
#49
Really? Egypt over-blows a brick building and Israeli dome sensors picks up a brick that 'got away' and it 'matches' a certain shell so the borders get closed in all. How many times in a row is that, Vegas would bar this bunch. Fill the harbor building this and it becomes part of what country, Palestine or Israel? Some headlines have used the term, 'the west bank of Israel' and it's only an annex away from that. Gaza is different as she has access to international waters.

 
CDNBear
#50
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Really?

Yes, really.
 
BaalsTears
+1
#51
Palestine should be returned to its rightful owner, viz. the Roman Catholic Church.
 
#juan
+1
#52
There was a Palestine once:

Quote: Originally Posted by #juan View Post

There was a Palestine once:

 
Completelylegal
+3
#53
There's a real whiff of terra nullius here. You don't exist so this is ours now. We are all well acquainted with this line of argument, being major beneficiaries in these here parts.
 
darkbeaver
+1
#54
Oh the twisting of truth into thick knots made of fathoms of lies. Israel never existed and never will, not on a chunk of land anyway.
 
petros
#55
Quote: Originally Posted by darkbeaver View Post

Oh the twisting of truth into thick knots made of fathoms of lies. Israel never existed and never will, not on a chunk of land anyway.

Jews aren't from Israel. They are from Judea. Israelites in Isreal became the Christians, Muzzies, those who stayed with Mosaic Law and others in Palestine.

That thick book lays it all out really damn clearly.
 
darkbeaver
#56
Erasing Palestine from the Map
The second major problem with this map is that Palestine—both historic and contemporary—is erased from it. A white dotted line traces the border between the West Bank and Israel but the line is barely visible beneath the yellow-shaded ring. Moreover, “West Bank” (not “occupied West Bank,” or “occupied Palestinian territory,” or “Palestinian West Bank” or “Palestine,” mind you) appears in font so small that it seems to designate some tiny city northeast of Jerusalem, not the Palestinian territory occupied by Israel since 1967. And while Israeli municipalities such as Arad, Ashdod, Holan, and Hrzliya, among others, are included, nowhere can one find the Palestinian cities of Ramallah, Nablus, Bethlehem, or Jericho, much less al-Bira, Jenin, or Qalqilia. Only Jerusalem and Hebron, West Bank cities that are significant to both Israelis and Palestinians, are featured. Even Jaffa, the coastal Palestinian city north of Tel Aviv, has been replaced by the Israeli-Hebrew version, “Yafo.”
So what does this map tell us about the Israel-Palestine conflict? It’s not apparent what or where Palestine is, or that it even exists, but the map suggests that an ever-menacing, Iranian-supported Islamist group threatens more than half of Israel. And therefore, Israel is “concerned.” Presumably, the reader might conclude, that “concern” forces Israel to periodically defend itself, launching its own counter-attacks into the Gaza Strip. The West Bank, meanwhile, appears for all intents and purposes, part of Israel and in no way related to the Gaza Strip or the cartographically cleansed “Palestine.” So Israel’s geography is simplified into a need to defend itself and Palestine is wiped off the map.Erasing Palestine From the Map » CounterPunch: Tells the Facts, Names the Names


Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Jews aren't from Israel. They are from Judea. Israelites in Isreal became the Christians, Muzzies, those who stayed with Mosaic Law and others in Palestine.

That thick book lays it all out really damn clearly.

Israel exists in the mind only and ever. It is not material. The glory has been expropriated. The word never meant a piece of land until relatively recent time. We could have called Nova Scotia heaven but that would be very wrong as well.
 
eh1eh
#57
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Jews aren't from Israel. They are from Judea. Israelites in Isreal became the Christians, Muzzies, those who stayed with Mosaic Law and others in Palestine.

That thick book lays it all out really damn clearly.

LOL. Let's rest the maps to 3000BC
 
darkbeaver
#58
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Jews aren't from Israel. They are from Judea. Israelites in Isreal became the Christians, Muzzies, those who stayed with Mosaic Law and others in Palestine.

That thick book lays it all out really damn clearly.

I fogot to ask, which thick book? and what do you mean by thick?

and damn clearly?
 
petros
#59
Quote: Originally Posted by eh1eh View Post

LOL. Let's rest the maps to 3000BC

Gee whiz. There wasn't even Israelitesat that time. 900 years before Abraham left Iraq for Egypt.
 
BaalsTears
#60
How did the Palestinians come to consider themselves to be Arabs?