Back to Winnipeg


Cannuck
+1
#1  Top Rated Post
Seriously, it really is time to give up on the sunbelt

2010 Nhl Attendance Report Nhl's Return To Winnipeg On Near Horizon

I believe all this talk of a new buyer for the Yotes is just that....talk. I believe Matthew Hulsizer is a strong ownership possibility and I'm sure he knows how to play the game. If the league announced tomorrow that the Yotes were going back to The Peg, you wouldn't sell 1000 tickets in Phoenix for the rest of the year. I don't believe Matthew has any intention of buying the Yotes and keeping them in Phoenix. His job is to string along the fans as long as possible so the league can still sell some tickets in that market. One Phoenix is relocated (and because he was such a good team player) Hulsizer will be next in line for one of the floundering teams. Atlanta is probably next.

Call me jaded but why would any successful businessman sink any more money into the current situation in Arizona

YouTube - OTR Discussion on more NHL teams in Canada
 
talloola
#2
I can't figure that out either, they didn't make their money by being stupid, but they sure can lose
it that way.

There are more teams suffering in the u.s. than we ever get told about. I feel sure that winnipeg and
quebec will eventually have teams back in their cities, and I can never figure out why seattle doesn't
have an NHL team, pacific northwest, right on the coast in the middle of the travel route for all of the coastal teams, and calgary and edmonton.
Large population, and would bring fans from portland as well, (and vancouver),hockey knowledge is allready there.
 
Cannuck
#3
I know a guy that winters in Phoenix and he says he walks up to the rink, buys $15 nosebleed seats and then once the game starts, walks down to the lower bowl. So, even at 6-8000 the ticket revenue has to be 20-40% of what you could do in many Canadian cities. I have Medicine Hat Tigers season tickets and I'm sure they generate more money at the gate than the Yotes....and The Hat has a 4000 seat arena
 
damngrumpy
#4
All the fighting for the extra Ontario team already cost Winnipeg a year in the NHL.
The time would have come to move Phoenix then the debate over location started
and the league had to stay where they were. You can't politically deny one city and
then begin discussing a move to another. Optics would be terrible. The league is
looking to move it despite all the rhetoric they can't afford to leave it there.
 
shadowshiv
+1
#5
If the Coyotes couldn't get a decent attendance when they had an excellent record(and make it into the playoffs) last year, I certainly don't expect them to have any attendance worth mentioning this season due to their downturn in on-ice play.

One of the biggest hurdles for the team to get relocated is Gary Buttman. His Royal Buttness doesn't want his grand vision of hockey in all American venues to be seen as a failure(which it is). I have heard rumours that he wants teams in Las Vegas and Kansas. If it was up to him, we would see a team there before we would see one in Winnipeg(which is ironic since the Coyotes were originally FROM Winnepeg for crying out loud!).

Even though I root for the Leafs, I would love for there to be another Canadian NHL team. Heck, I would love to see 3 new teams. Ones in Hamilton, Quebec, and Winnipeg.
 
TenPenny
#6
As long as the team can draw fans, and make money, and no government dollars are required, I'm all for it.
 
Cannuck
#7
I don't think government dollars are an issue, at least in Winnipeg

True North's billionaire player - Winnipeg Free Press
 
talloola
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by TenPenny View Post

As long as the team can draw fans, and make money, and no government dollars are required, I'm all for it.

canadian government doesn't put dollars into NHL hockey.
 
TenPenny
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by talloola View Post

canadian government doesn't put dollars into NHL hockey.

So, no arenas used for NHL hockey have been subsidized by tax dollars?
 
talloola
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by TenPenny View Post

So, no arenas used for NHL hockey have been subsidized by tax dollars?

not sure about arenas, I don't think so, but would have to hear from more knowledgeable people on that,
maybe it depends if they are multiple use buildings or if they are 'just' for NHL hockey, which is
odd these days, buildings are usually for all sorts of things, not just hockey.
 
wulfie68
#11
Sorry to rain on the parade(s) guys but QC and Winnipeg are dreams when it comes to the NHL, not reality. There just isn't the population base (and more importantly the business base) in either of those two cities to sustain it. It was why they lost their teams in the first place. The recovery in the Canadian dollar hasn't changed the numbers that much. While the populations of both QC and Winnipeg have grown modestly, the costs of operating an NHL franchise have soared...even with the salary cap that saved teams like Edmonton, Calgary and Ottawa. This isn't meant as a slight on those two cities, just an honest admission that they are much smaller than any of the current crop of NHL cities, in Canada or the US.

That being said I do think the NHL should allow the next owner of the Coyotes to admit Phoenix is a dud as far as the NHL is concerned and allow them to move to some place that can and will support a healthy NHL franchise. Southern Ontario could be home to a team but I'm not sure too many other unserviced Canadian markets could. Unfortunately, the last time this was bandied about, Jim Balsillie wanted to try and circumvent the will of the other NHL owners to make it happen and pissed them off to a point where they don't want him in the picture at all. With a different owner, who shows some deference and respect to the league and other owners, this could happen.
 
Cannuck
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by wulfie68 View Post

Sorry to rain on the parade(s) guys but QC and Winnipeg are dreams when it comes to the NHL, not reality. There just isn't the population base (and more importantly the business base) in either of those two cities to sustain it.......

Sorry but I'll take the word of David Thomson over you. If the richest man in Canada (top 25 in the world) says he can make money on the venture then I'm guessing he probably can...naysayers like yourself notwithstanding.
 
#juan
#13
Funny.
When Vancouver was trying to get an NHL team, the biggest drawbacks were Toronto and Montreal. They didn't want to share the TV revenue. I don't imagine that they want another team in Ontario, Quebec. or Winnipeg. Bettman would rather there were no more teams in Canada.
 
Cannuck
#14
The owners want a teams wherever they can generate revenue. That isn't in the sun belt
 
talloola
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by wulfie68 View Post

Sorry to rain on the parade(s) guys but QC and Winnipeg are dreams when it comes to the NHL, not reality. There just isn't the population base (and more importantly the business base) in either of those two cities to sustain it. It was why they lost their teams in the first place. The recovery in the Canadian dollar hasn't changed the numbers that much. While the populations of both QC and Winnipeg have grown modestly, the costs of operating an NHL franchise have soared...even with the salary cap that saved teams like Edmonton, Calgary and Ottawa. This isn't meant as a slight on those two cities, just an honest admission that they are much smaller than any of the current crop of NHL cities, in Canada or the US.

That being said I do think the NHL should allow the next owner of the Coyotes to admit Phoenix is a dud as far as the NHL is concerned and allow them to move to some place that can and will support a healthy NHL franchise. Southern Ontario could be home to a team but I'm not sure too many other unserviced Canadian markets could. Unfortunately, the last time this was bandied about, Jim Balsillie wanted to try and circumvent the will of the other NHL owners to make it happen and pissed them off to a point where they don't want him in the picture at all. With a different owner, who shows some deference and respect to the league and other owners, this could happen.

winnipeg allready has the building, just needs some small upgrades, and I would think, as we speak, many
meetings have taken place to prove, or not, that that city will support a team coming back, and I'm sure
we will know by the end of this season.

Don't know anything about quebec city.
 
Kreskin
#16
They should also put a team in Saskatoon. Give them green uniforms (heck, call them the Whalers for a good laugh). The rink would be a gong show every game.
 
Cannuck
#17
It really is looking more and more like Winnipeg is back. As much as the league may want a team in Phoenix the Goldwater Institute may provide the final nail.

Winnipeg still waiting on NHL, Glendale
 
talloola
#18
I would think bettman would not want to leak anything till phoenix is 'done' for the season. Then
make big announcement about the move to Winnipeg, (at least I'm hoping thats it.)

It's been a circus in phoenix/glendale and a real embarrassment to the NHL, and bettman, who may
lose his job in the near future, if he doesn't settle this mess.
 
Cannuck
#19
NHL rejects report that Coyotes sale in doubt
 
bill barilko
#20
And in Quebec city they think the NHL is coming back there too.

FYI-it isn't/it never will and someone has been inhaling their own farts for far too long.
 
Cannuck
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by bill barilko View Post

And in Quebec city they think the NHL is coming back there too.

FYI-it isn't/it never will and someone has been inhaling their own farts for far too long.

The richest man in Canada said he wants to buy a team and can make money in Winnipeg. Do you doubt him?

The NHL BOG say they are not willing to drop another 30 million into the Yotes. Do you doubt them?

The new prospective owner of the Yotes wants 100 million from Glendale immediately and 97 million over the next few years for a team that he is only buying for 170 million. There are only four possible outcomes.

1 - The team folds and the NHL loses its 170 million investment - will never happen as long as True North is there and willing to write a cheque.

2 - The prospective owner closes this deal and the team stays in Phoenix - this is looking more and more unlikely considering the bond issue and The Goldwater Institute.

3 - The team is sold to the Winnipeg group.

4 - The team is sold to another group and moved to another city - Current;y, there are no buyers lined up so that option would have to be delayed another year. Given the BOG's reluctance to drop another 30 million into the team, this option is not likely.

Given the time required to move a team, I don't see the NHL waiting much longer. The economics of the game have changed since the mid nineties. Given that half the teams in the NHL are losing money, teams in Canada make a lot of sense.

Which of the four options do you think is most likely.
 
bill barilko
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by Cannuck View Post

Which of the four options do you think is most likely.

Inhaling.....farts......
 
talloola
#23
yeah, returning to winnipeg makes sense, they have the building, just need a few changes, nothing
major.
If the NHL had of helped winnipeg to begin with, as they have done for phoenix, maybe they would
not have had to move anywhere, when they did.

Why would they put so many millions into phoenix, but nothing into winnipeg when they were floundering.
They actually own phoenix coyotes now, and lose money each and every day, which means that the money
they are losing belongs to the rest of the teams who pay pay pay for a team no one in 'glendale' give
a hoot about.

Bettman would continue making stupid decisions, by putting teams in kansas city and las vegas, wonder
what is going on(that none of us know about,) in those cities.
 
Cannuck
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by bill barilko View Post

Inhaling.....farts......

I thought there was an age limit on this site.

Quote: Originally Posted by talloola View Post

Bettman would continue making stupid decisions, by putting teams in kansas city and las vegas, wonder
what is going on(that none of us know about,) in those cities.

The problem is that it takes time to make a deal like that. If you are the BOG and you have a guy in Winnipeg with his check book out willing to pay the asking price, are you wiling to gamble and throw another 30 million at the Yotes in hopes that another buyer pops up elsewhere. I have my doubts that there is already another buyer waiting in the wings. It didn't take any time at all for the True north interest to become public

Coyotes saga has governors demanding answers - Winnipeg Free Press
 
wulfie68
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by talloola View Post

Bettman would continue making stupid decisions, by putting teams in kansas city and las vegas, wonder
what is going on(that none of us know about,) in those cities.

Talloola. Stop.

Bettman doesn't make the calls, he just funnels ideas to the owners/BOG. He gets a lot of crap, especially here in Cannuckistan, but he's more a figurehead than anything else. Everyone wants to hate on the dwarf lawyer, and he does get paid millions to take the shots, but most of what he gets blamed for isn't on him.

I would LOVE to see more NHL teams in Canada: I think it would be great for Canadians, but I am scepitcal of moving back to places that have lost them. If billionaires think they can make things work then great! But there's also a billionaire in Edmonton, with a larger fanbase and area than the 'Peg and QC combined, involved in a lot of negotiations right now. Yes, its about a building, which Winnipeg has (although I do want to find out more...) but the fact remains that smaller markets in Canada aren't a guarantee and they usually require concessions from municipal and provincial gov'ts.
 
talloola
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by wulfie68 View Post

Talloola. Stop.

Bettman doesn't make the calls, he just funnels ideas to the owners/BOG. He gets a lot of crap, especially here in Cannuckistan, but he's more a figurehead than anything else. Everyone wants to hate on the dwarf lawyer, and he does get paid millions to take the shots, but most of what he gets blamed for isn't on him.

I would LOVE to see more NHL teams in Canada: I think it would be great for Canadians, but I am scepitcal of moving back to places that have lost them. If billionaires think they can make things work then great! But there's also a billionaire in Edmonton, with a larger fanbase and area than the 'Peg and QC combined, involved in a lot of negotiations right now. Yes, its about a building, which Winnipeg has (although I do want to find out more...) but the fact remains that smaller markets in Canada aren't a guarantee and they usually require concessions from municipal and provincial gov'ts.

there is no one else but bettman to complain to. he gets paid well, and that is part of his job, he
is out there, it is his responsibility to hear the complaints, and if he can't do anything about it, then
he can pass along the message.

the building will be filled in winnipeg, canadians care, and if they do have any
financial problems, at least it won't be from empty buildings, as it is in those
parts o the u.s., where they should never have thought to have hockey to begin with.
 
bill barilko
#27
It must be the dead of winter where you all live.

This has been beaten to death-US team owners don't want anymore Canadian teams and that's that.
 
talloola
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by bill barilko View Post

It must be the dead of winter where you all live.

This has been beaten to death-US team owners don't want anymore Canadian teams and that's that.

wish the u.s. team owners had 'thought' to say that to bettman long ago.
 
bill barilko
#29
NHL commissioner Gary Bettman said he's "aware of what's going on" in the contentious Quebec City arena debate and repeated the league's stance that it has no current plans to expand or relocate.
 
talloola
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by bill barilko View Post

NHL commissioner Gary Bettman said he's "aware of what's going on" in the contentious Quebec City arena debate and repeated the league's stance that it has no current plans to expand or relocate.

that doesn't mean a thing, just keeps people waiting a little longer to see just what is around the
next corner.

hopefully this phoenix thing will finally come to an end, it has been an embarassing journey for
the NHL, and we'll see if they can finally do the 'right' thing, or at least something that makes
a bit of sense.
 

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