Discussion open - Tuesday, Dec. 2: Are you in favour of the government being brought


CBC News
#1
Gov. Gen. Michaëlle Jean is returning home three days early from a state visit to Europe to deal with the upheaval on Parliament Hill.

She will now return to Ottawa on Wednesday.

"I have decided to return to Canada and I'll leave tomorrow," Jean told CBC News Tuesday in Prague.

"The role of the Governor General is to ensure that our governance is on the right path, so as soon as I'm back I will fulfil my duties in total sound judgment."

Late Monday, the Liberals and New Democrats inked a deal to form an unprecedented coalition government if they succeed in ousting the minority Conservative government in an upcoming confidence vote scheduled for Dec. 8.

Jean said she had not spoken with Prime Minister Stephen Harper and made the decision herself to cut the visit short.

Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion, who would head the proposed coalition, said on Monday that he has sent the governor general a letter stating he has the confidence of the House of Commons to form the government should the Conservatives be defeated.

But Jean gave no hint about whether she might approve such a coalition.

"The message in the letter is clear. It is part of the whole context," Jean said. "I think my presence is required in the country."

The governor general could decide to send Canadians to the polls. There is also talk that Prime Minister Stephen Harper could block coalition efforts by proroguing Parliament, suspending it without dissolving.

Are you in favour of the government being brought down and replaced by a coalition government over the fiscal update?



More...
 
scratch
#2
Yes, I am in favour.
 
Scott Free
#3
Yes.
 
Spade
#4
Absolutely!
 
Zan
#5
I think it had to be done. If it wasn't this incident that was the catalyst, it would have been another in short order. I just wish I could get past the palpable, gleeful smugness on the faces of the 3 leaders of the coalition. It's just as disgusting as Harper's bullying. This is not a time for gloating - it's a solemn time for Canada and it should be treated as such. What a gong show. It's embarrassing is what it is.

Rex Murphy called it plain and simple as far as I'm concerned. Take a couple minutes to watch this - he sums up the situation pretty succinctly.


Text Version

All Politics, No Government

Rex Murphy Point of View
December 1, 2008

Political scientists will stagger gibbering witless to their graves trying to figure out why the Prime Minister decided to kick off a brand new session of a civil parliament, in the middle of a world economic crisis, by the most lethal partisan jab at the opposition in the history of Confederation.
It's either or. He's either dumb or arrogant. Those are the only options to explain why he pitched a live grenade into the underwear of the opposition parties last Thursday, within, as it were, five seconds of the new Session starting. Either too dumb to know the furies he was releasing, or too arrogant to care...

...remainder here
 
scratch
#6
Oh Zan,

I really understand.

PO & Co. passage to hell?

Just an observation.

sincere regards,
scratch
 
Colpy
#7
Okay.....let's get something straight here.

the coalition has been presented to the Canadian people on a false pretext.

IMHO, the economic update is not the reason, only the excuse......the entire fiasco set off by the promise to remove gov't subsidies for political parties......

My evidence......As of the end of the third quarter of this year Canada was not in recession. Indeed, we were showing 1.3% growth on an annual basis.

Unemployment is very low.

There was indication that Canada would not do so well in this quarter: but the worst thing for the economy would be increased panic. And, as the loss of growth would be mostly in the export sector, and 80% of that goes to the USA, and we have an integrated economy, it was prudent and correct for Harper et al to wait for the Obama administration to take office, so that a common strategy could be worked out, especially in the auto sector.

The CPC did move to speed up investment in infrastructure.....yet could still tentatively predict a balanced budget. They did announce, however, that in a worsening situation they would be prepared to create a small deficit in favour of a stimulus package......something that would be seen in a budget.....

Prudent, sensible, responsible.

Absolutely no reason to fly off the handle and start throwing tens of billions around uselessly, to further destroy the use of English in Quebec, and to undermine the future of the nation by bringing the Separatists into gov't.

this is serious enough that it needs to go before the people..........NOW!!!!

What are the NDP and Liberals afraid of?????????
 
lone wolf
#8
Lets get something else straight. Our economy is sound and nobody is going to go into a recession....
 
Colpy
#9
Rex is dead on.

Wrote the above post before I watched.....

Glad Rex agrees with me.
 
scratch
#10
Hey lw you are pretty intuitive you just may be right!
 
Praxius
#11
Yes I do.

As they used to always say "Minority Governments Don't Work" and they clearly don't.

If the majority of the government wishes to work together and the minority of the government just wants to screw everybody over for their own amusment, then throw the minority (Conservatives) to the wolves and let's get some work done for once in our lives.

If not, well all we got left if this fails is Revolution.... win win.
 
Kreskin
#12
If those parties really cared about Canadian economics they wouldn't be chasing away foreign investment through political charades like this. I'm appalled at this stupidity. They are thieves..plain and simple..and good at it obviously.
 
lone wolf
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by Kreskin View Post

If those parties really cared about Canadian economics they wouldn't be chasing away foreign investment through political charades like this. I'm appalled at this stupidity. They are thieves..plain and simple..and good at it obviously.

How much confidence does a Prime Minister whose word means next to nothing generate in foreign investors?
 
Kreskin
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolf View Post

How much confidence does a Prime Minister whose word means next to nothing generate in foreign investors?

Who are you talking about, the weakling Carbon Tax Man? His own party can't stand him. Why would anyone else?
 
JLM
#15
No- I'm not in favour of the three stooges running the ship. I wonder if Rhinocerus had a seat if Layton & Dion would bring him on board too. Saw Dion on the news today ranting like an incoherent banshee.
 
Kreskin
#16
The Liberals were sent a resounding "get lost" message by the voters, 8 weeks ago. The Conservatives gained seats. The Cons have 142 seats. The combined seats of the NDP/Libs is 114. Now the balance of power will be held, and ruled, by the separatists. The coalition can't do anything without their support. What a freakin joke. I hope the GG tells them to pound salt, or sends this back to the polls so the Conservatives can get their majority.
 
JLM
#17
You talk sense Kreskin.
 
Praxius
#18
Geez, a lot of you guys should be watching the National right now..... no wait you missed it all. I'll post it tomorrow when it is available.

But it explained in very plain english how our democracy works, that there is nothing illegal about what the parties are doing, Harper has been exaggerating and either lying or just doesn't know how our government works.

The Bloc are not a part of the coalition, they support it apparently.

And one of the few other options available for the Conservatives and Harper, is for Harper to resign or be replaced..... or we get the coalition...... or we goto the election.

But you guys should stop listening to your favorite parties and their propaganda, and read up a bit on our history and how our democracy actually works.

And don't worry, I'll post the section of the National they just had on so you all can watch it and find out some very interesting things. Call it bias, but try and refute the truth.
 
Praxius
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by Kreskin View Post

The Liberals were sent a resounding "get lost" message by the voters, 8 weeks ago. The Conservatives gained seats. The Cons have 142 seats. The combined seats of the NDP/Libs is 114. Now the balance of power will be held, and ruled, by the separatists. The coalition can't do anything without their support. What a freakin joke. I hope the GG tells them to pound salt, or sends this back to the polls so the Conservatives can get their majority.

K, you do realise that the conservatives, as well as every other party, for a very long time, got many of their motions, budgets and bills/laws passed with Bloc support..... it's nothing new.

If the Conservatives could get the Bloc's support in their budget, how much do you want to bet that they'd take them?

Exactly.

They did it countless times before, they'll do it countless times again, and many of the other parties will need or get support from the Bloc..... it's nothing new, just fearmongering over nothing.
 
Momathome
#20
the left feminists have taken away my rights as a woman because I don't wear a power suit. I will not vote left until the view me as an equal human being.
 
Kreskin
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by Praxius View Post

K, you do realise that the conservatives, as well as every other party, for a very long time, got many of their motions, budgets and bills/laws passed with Bloc support..... it's nothing new.

If the Conservatives could get the Bloc's support in their budget, how much do you want to bet that they'd take them?

Exactly.

They did it countless times before, they'll do it countless times again, and many of the other parties will need or get support from the Bloc..... it's nothing new, just fearmongering over nothing.

It's different because this coalition is designed to require the Bloc's support for everything. It can't survive without it, by design. Can you think of a time when the Liberals and NDP will vote against each other in Parliament? A change of PM is based on the assumption that those three parties will agree on everything. When all four parties were independent in Parliament it was more difficult to be extorted. Now it's easy.
 
lone wolf
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by Kreskin View Post

Who are you talking about, the weakling Carbon Tax Man? His own party can't stand him. Why would anyone else?

No ... I'm talking about Harper. That needle nose of his can't be a natural thing. Do you really think anyone who was going to invest foreign capital here would believe the word of a man who conned people into believing Canada would be exempt from a recession?
 
Scott Free
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by Kreskin View Post

The Liberals were sent a resounding "get lost" message by the voters, 8 weeks ago. The Conservatives gained seats. The Cons have 142 seats. The combined seats of the NDP/Libs is 114. Now the balance of power will be held, and ruled, by the separatists. The coalition can't do anything without their support. What a freakin joke. I hope the GG tells them to pound salt, or sends this back to the polls so the Conservatives can get their majority.

Most people didn't vote for the conservatives. I like this better, in that for example, I'll be getting a better representation.

The only people crying sour grapes are conservative supporters - luckily though, there aren't a lot of them
 
Colpy
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by Praxius View Post

Geez, a lot of you guys should be watching the National right now..... no wait you missed it all. I'll post it tomorrow when it is available.

But it explained in very plain english how our democracy works, that there is nothing illegal about what the parties are doing, Harper has been exaggerating and either lying or just doesn't know how our government works.

The Bloc are not a part of the coalition, they support it apparently.

And one of the few other options available for the Conservatives and Harper, is for Harper to resign or be replaced..... or we get the coalition...... or we goto the election.

But you guys should stop listening to your favorite parties and their propaganda, and read up a bit on our history and how our democracy actually works.

And don't worry, I'll post the section of the National they just had on so you all can watch it and find out some very interesting things. Call it bias, but try and refute the truth.


I've not heard one person call the coalition illegal.....nobody that knows anything about Parliamentary democracy thinks this is illegal......but it is stupid, grossly incompetent, and detrimental to the country as a whole.

You spoke of The National.....did you see Duceppe speaking about how good this is for the cause of Quebec sovereignty???? Read separation and the destruction of Canada.

I'm beginning to think the polls are the only place to settle this. The people will have a clear choice.....Harper and the CPC......or a left-wing coalition that includes the political enemies of the Confederation.

Take your pick.
 
Machjo
#25
Are you in favour of the government being brought down and replaced by a coalition government over the fiscal update?

I'm not in favour of it per se, but democracy is based on the majority, and the Conservatives failed to create a co-alition to ensure that majority. The Libs, NDP and Bloc have managed to create a majority coalition and so they win. Had the Conservatives been more competent they would have averted disaster by creating a Conservative-Liberal co-alition to avert this. The Conservatives failed to form a majority, the coalitio has succeeded, and so democracy wins out, unfortunately.
 
Kreskin
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

Most people didn't vote for the conservatives. I like this better, in that for example, I'll be getting a better representation.

The only people crying sour grapes are conservative supporters - luckily though, there aren't a lot of them

Even less voted for the Liberals and NDP combined. Now the NDP, Liberals and Bloc are all one and the same. They have to think and act the same with no independence from each other. Talk about selling your soul to the devil.

I've never been a conservative supporter, but I dislike this episode enough to write the others off completely. It doesn't leave much choice for me.
 
darkbeaver
#27
Yes.
 
SonsOfWaldorf
#28
No- Sounds like it's just a power grab to me. Harper can't be all that bad when Canada's economy is growing when most others are shrinking.
 
In Between Man
#29
No I'm not.

Now, I may have aligned myself with western separatism in certain aspects, but it seems to me that if I were a leader of federal party, whose supposed interest lied with the nation, I would NEVER align myself with a separatist party. A man's gotta have standards. Right off the bat, Duceppe beaked about how this is great for QUEBEC! NOT CANADA! Its pretty clear what he thinks of the rest of the country.

So why should he have any influence in a coalition government whose so-called interest is the entire nation? WHY?!

The whole world is affected by current uncertainties, and these knuckleheads want play power stuggle?! Its hardly the right time. It really makes them look bad, in my eyes.

As I was saying last nite, if the left wants my vote under said coalition, their gonna have to come up with a kick-ass, organized vision for Canada, and prove that one among them is a true leader. Not three jabronis' acting like children taking revenge on the bigger boy in the neighborhood.
Last edited by In Between Man; Dec 2nd, 2008 at 11:39 PM..Reason: c
 
Just the Facts
#30
I'm on the fence on this one, but I think we may as well get used to it. With our votes being diluted between more party's it's going to be hard to elect a majority. It's the way of the future.

In a relatively short time we've gone from a two party system with NDP being a third straggler, to a four party system with the Greens being a fifth straggler. Coalitions are inevitable.