If Your Prime Minister


StephenNesbitt
#1
If Your Prime Minister




If your prime minister lied


Backwards and forwards,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister accepted


Eavesdropping and taping of a private


Telephone conversation - its release


To the nation,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister instigated


Deceitful, vicious, demeaning, personal


Verbal attacks when confronted,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister broke


The very law he enacted,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister fanned


The flames of dissention and division,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister hid


Behind the skirts of the governor general


When called to task by his peers,


Clung to her skirts until she gave


Him the key to lock up your democracy,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




Stephen Nesbitt
 
JLM
No Party Affiliation
#2
Quote: Originally Posted by StephenNesbitt View Post

If Your Prime Minister





If your prime minister lied


Backwards and forwards,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister accepted


Eavesdropping and taping of a private


Telephone conversation - its release


To the nation,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister instigated


Deceitful, vicious, demeaning, personal


Verbal attacks when confronted,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister broke


The very law he enacted,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister fanned


The flames of dissention and division,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister hid


Behind the skirts of the governor general


When called to task by his peers,


Clung to her skirts until she gave


Him the key to lock up your democracy,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?





Stephen Nesbitt

In whose opinion?
 
Walter
#3
I never voted for Turdoh.
 
mit
Free Thinker
#4
For PM Harper - it is about winning - if you ask him if he lied - he will say circumstances changed - wait for the carbon tax! - he already has the deficit
 
Colpy
Conservative
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by mit View Post

For PM Harper - it is about winning - if you ask him if he lied - he will say circumstances changed - wait for the carbon tax! - he already has the deficit

If your would-be Prime Minister signed an alliance to govern with a group that existed only to destroy the country.....then would you still support him?
 
Kreskin
#6
If a party leader lost support of the country during an election, was thrown under the bus by his party during and afterward, offered to hand over the reigns in the spring, had to make back room deals with separatists to get anything done..would you want him to be your Prime Minister?
 
Kreskin
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by StephenNesbitt View Post

If Your Prime Minister





If your prime minister lied


Backwards and forwards,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister accepted


Eavesdropping and taping of a private


Telephone conversation - its release


To the nation,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister instigated


Deceitful, vicious, demeaning, personal


Verbal attacks when confronted,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister broke


The very law he enacted,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister fanned


The flames of dissention and division,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?




If your prime minister hid


Behind the skirts of the governor general


When called to task by his peers,


Clung to her skirts until she gave


Him the key to lock up your democracy,


Would you support him?


Would that be a good example


For the young people in our lives?





Stephen Nesbitt

Unfortunately he's the best Canada has to offer.
 
fubbleskag
No Party Affiliation
#8
i bet none of the politicians currently vying for PM would quote an entire 40 line poem unnecessarily. just saying.
 
elevennevele
#9
All of you who responded never answered the question it raised as to the actions of Steven Harper. All your responses are very much in line with how Steven Harper confronts his own abuses and applies his leadership or lack thereof. That being by redirecting the issue or scapegoating what is being addressed onto someone or something else.

What Nesbitt raised wasn't about Dion. In fact much of everyone who supports this coalition is looking toward the outcome that Dion will step down or be forced down so that other leadership can apply itself.

The coalition is in fact democratic. It would have been well within our Parliamentary Laws. Steven Harper's actions on the other hand are very undemocratic, and he has further conducted himself in ways that are not only contrary to democracy, but are contrary to what is legal relative to our judicial system.

The coalition is between the NDP and the Liberals with only signed support by the Bloc on measures of confidence. In any piece of legislation that is a confidence measure, Harper would required support from the Bloc or the other two parties in order to govern. His very situation in a minority government is to work towards the support and consensus he needs to receive from the other parties. If that really isn't what he is trying to do when the majority of the vote rests with the opposition, then again he doesn't deserve to govern in what is suppose to be a democracy.

Not only that, there is enough evidence out there that shows Harper totally contradict himself when it comes to proroguing Parliament in order to avoid a confidence measure. He shows himself to be a hypocrite and a liar right to our faces in both sound and colour and you folks, who have responded to Nesbitt, have willfully ignored that truth when I know you are all aware of it.

Some of you folks are so deep in your political prejudices that you have sold out your own moral compass at a time when we have reached an alarming impasse in our democracy amid the abuses of power with our current leadership. You folks know what Harper is doing! You know are you are complicit in it. I have totally lost respect for some who post on this message forum.

Dion is not deserving of this country's leadership but where you all miss the point, is the one who is running this country now, is even least deserving of it. Both should step down as that is what decent people would ask of the situation.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGMovAVAzaE


.
 
Colpy
Conservative
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by elevennevele View Post

All of you who responded never answered the question it raised as to the actions of Steven Harper. All your responses are very much in line with how Steven Harper confronts his own abuses and applies his leadership or lack thereof. That being by redirecting the issue or scapegoating what is being addressed onto someone or something else.

Unfortunately, at the moment we are in the situation of picking the best of this sorry lot, so pointing out that the Liberals and NDP leadership are worse than Harper.....well, it is almost necessary.

What Nesbitt raised wasn't about Dion. In fact much of everyone who supports this coalition is looking toward the outcome that Dion will step down or be forced down so that other leadership can apply itself.

Dion is only part of the problem.....I actually liked Dion (past tense) although I couldn't stand much of the Liberal platform, Dion was OK with me.....before he slid between the sheets with the Seperatists. Hard to swallow from the guy that penned the Clarity Act.

The coalition is in fact democratic. It would have been well within our Parliamentary Laws.

All True.

Steven Harper's actions on the other hand are very undemocratic, and he has further conducted himself in ways that are not only contrary to democracy, but are contrary to what is legal relative to our judicial system.

What Harper did is also perfectly legal. I do not think the GG should have prorogued Parliament.....I think she should have forced Harper to stand and them disolved Parliament when (and if) the gov't fell. But it is all legal.......precedent-setting, unfortunately.

The coalition is between the NDP and the Liberals with only signed support by the Bloc on measures of confidence. In any piece of legislation that is a confidence measure, Harper would required support from the Bloc or the other two parties in order to govern. His very situation in a minority government is to work towards the support and consensus he needs to receive from the other parties. If that really isn't what he is trying to do when the majority of the vote rests with the opposition, then again he doesn't deserve to govern in what is suppose to be a democracy.

The Bloc was in it up to their ears, they agreed not to overthrow the gov't for 18 months......what do you think they were offered for that level of support? The Bloc was de facto part of the coalition, if not so de jure. There is a major difference between an agreement on support over a set period of time, and seeking support on a case by case basis. On is a coalition, the other is seeking common ground.

Not only that, there is enough evidence out there that shows Harper totally contradict himself when it comes to proroguing Parliament in order to avoid a confidence measure. He shows himself to be a hypocrite and a liar right to our faces in both sound and colour and you folks, who have responded to Nesbitt, have willfully ignored that truth when I know you are all aware of it.

See above.

Some of you folks are so deep in your political prejudices that you have sold out your own moral compass at a time when we have reached an alarming impasse in our democracy amid the abuses of power with our current leadership. You folks know what Harper is doing! You know are you are complicit in it. I have totally lost respect for some who post on this message forum.

Exactly the same words can be applied to the Liberals and NDP for sharing power with those sworn to destroy Canada.

Dion is not deserving of this country's leadership but where you all miss the point, is the one who is running this country now, is even least deserving of it. Both should step down as that is what decent people would ask of the situation.


YouTube - Stephen Hypocrite


.

Harper will be around for as long as he likes, the Conservative Party owes him too much, it is largely his construct. It appears the man has some personality issues.....Remember though, this is the man that dragged the CA and PC parties together, then dragged the Conservative Party of Canada,(made up mostly of old Reformers, including me) into the middle of the political spectrum, then took us to government. This simply would not have been possible for a man that believes in concensus.....instead of a blunt instrument.

Every time he smiles, he reminds me of Bruce, the animated shark in Saving Nemo.

I don't like a lot of what the CPC is, I don't like mandatory sentencing, and anti-union laws, but I like the NDP and Liberals a whole lot less. Same as a lot of other Canadians, in fact, same as something like 2/3 of Canadians at the moment.
 
Adriatik
No Party Affiliation
#11
If some Canadians:

were being lied to in their faces and believing it,

were being manipulated to hate a certain region of the country,

accepted that a government elected with a minority tries to act as if it has a majority,

and had no idea that all this was going on in front of them despite obvious proof,


Would you trust their judgement and ability to make the right choice for our country?

I think not....


It's funny, but that is exactly what is happening right now......

Kinda scary...
 
iARTthere4iam
#12
Just because something is legal does not mean that it is right.

Many people have been pointing out that the majority of Canadians did not vote for the conservatives. That is true. It is also true that the majority did not vote for Dion and the liberals. A minority government was voted in with the conservatives having far more seats than any of the other parties. So they have formed the government. That is legal that is our tradition. Why can't this government be made to work as they all have said they would?

I am glad that the GG prorogued parliment. It was legal and the right thing to do. Things were progressing too hot and fast. The government may still fall, but at least it will stand or fall on an actual budget and with any luck the Liberals will have a new leader who will have the support of the party and will act for the good of Canada. Thank Dion for stirring the sh*t on the way out the door.

The Conservatives removed the offending proposals, there is no good reason for defeating parliment so soon after an election, especially since Dion is on the way out. If is government defeated I would hope that the GG would insist on a new election. Rae has stated that he will vote down the budget regardless of what is in it. That is very distressing and very wrong.
 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by StephenNesbitt View Post

If Your Prime Minister
If your prime minister lied
Backwards and forwards,
Would you support him?
Would that be a good example
For the young people in our lives?
If your prime minister accepted
Eavesdropping and taping of a private
Telephone conversation - its release
To the nation,
Would you support him?
Would that be a good example
For the young people in our lives?
If your prime minister instigated
Deceitful, vicious, demeaning, personal
Verbal attacks when confronted,
Would you support him?
Would that be a good example
For the young people in our lives?
If your prime minister broke
The very law he enacted,
Would you support him?
Would that be a good example
For the young people in our lives?
If your prime minister fanned
The flames of dissention and division,
Would you support him?
Would that be a good example
For the young people in our lives?
If your prime minister hid
Behind the skirts of the governor general
When called to task by his peers,
Clung to her skirts until she gave
Him the key to lock up your democracy,
Would you support him?
Would that be a good example
For the young people in our lives?

Stephen Nesbitt


There, that's a bit easier to read......

No I would never support him and I never have.... he never got a vote from me.

And the difference between him and the Coalition, is that he is indeed the Prime Minister.... he's supposed to lead the government and make sure things go well and work is done.... regardless of whom the coalition has support from for a short period of time, He has directly lied to the nation on a number of occasions, he has broken his own promises and election pledges, he has kept the conflict in the government between the other parties fresh and constant and he has improperly used resources not designed for avoiding confidence votes in order to keep his power, certainly not for the benifit of the nation.

If Harper had the nation's best interests at play, then he would have listened to the other party's suggestions in the first place and presented a budget he knew they would all agree on. He knew full well what they wanted, they met face to face with him to explain what they want, and he hands them all the total opposite of what they requested. He alone created the situation.

He should be held at a higher standard then other parties, that's why he's the Prime Minister in the first place, and when he is the one who continually creates the problems everybody else is trying to fix, there is no trust, there is no support and there is not one single shred of confidence and he should be removed from the government and his position.

Added:

Oh and for a leader of this country to futher divide the nation for his own political agendas and seeking of power, by bringing up the seperatist fearmongering, when it was clearly on the back burner since the mid 90's, he will never get my support, because he directly attempted and still is attempting to divide west from the east over something that was never a concern, was never the case, and never was going to have a chance of ever becoming a threat in the first place.

For that, he clearly does not have the maturity and ability to run as Prime Minister of this nation.

And as for Dion?

He's not an issue as they are now forcing him to step down now and Michael Ignatieff will be leading the Liberals now until the actual vote for a new leader...

I don't even know why they didn't boot Dion right out after the election and put Iggy in in the first place.... he is afterall the Deputy Leader of the party.
Last edited by Praxius; Dec 8th, 2008 at 10:46 AM..
 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by iARTthere4iam View Post

Just because something is legal does not mean that it is right.

If it wasn't right, it'd be illegal now wouldn't it?

Quote:

Many people have been pointing out that the majority of Canadians did not vote for the conservatives. That is true. It is also true that the majority did not vote for Dion and the liberals.

It is widely accepted that most shot the Liberals down because of two things:

1 - The Green Shift
2 - Dion

1 - The Green Shift was trashed ever since the election and the majority (if not all) the party said the plan is now a dead issue and will never be brought back up for a long time, if ever.

2 - Dion is being replaced by Iggy, so he's no longer an issue..... he never was an issue because he was going to be replaced anyways.

Quote:

A minority government was voted in with the conservatives having far more seats than any of the other parties. So they have formed the government. That is legal that is our tradition. Why can't this government be made to work as they all have said they would?

A Coalition occurs in many other countries around the world quite often and has occured in our country in the past as well.... just because it isn't the norm and something some are not used to, doesn't mean it is wrong.

And when the Conservatives can't manage the government like the last couple of years and just as this one was starting out as, then there is a problem with the "Norm"

And when you have every other political party which represents the rest of the nation agreeing on how to form together in a co-operative fashion and hold more support and faith in one another, opposing the Conservatives...... that's saying something pretty obvious..... Harper and the Conservatives do not have any confidence of the government or the majority of the population who didn't vote for him.

A coalition is justified.

And don't worry, if the tables were turned around and the Conservatives were going to lead a coalition, my position wouldn't change on this, because they would still be working with other parties and therefore more of the population being represented, just like in the current situation with the NDP/Liberals.

Quote:

I am glad that the GG prorogued parliment. It was legal and the right thing to do. Things were progressing too hot and fast. The government may still fall, but at least it will stand or fall on an actual budget and with any luck the Liberals will have a new leader who will have the support of the party and will act for the good of Canada. Thank Dion for stirring the sh*t on the way out the door.

The Conservatives removed the offending proposals, there is no good reason for defeating parliment so soon after an election, especially since Dion is on the way out. If is government defeated I would hope that the GG would insist on a new election. Rae has stated that he will vote down the budget regardless of what is in it. That is very distressing and very wrong.

Not wrong if you already know Harper will just continue to pull these stunts through this entire term. He'll play nice and do what the other parties want this time around, but just like all the other times in the past, he'll go right back to the same mentality of "My way or the highway" and stirr the crap up again..... it doesn't matter if Dion is there or not, the reactions would still be the same.

There is no confidence, there is no trust, therefore the government will fall again.

And the thing I will never get past is Harper going right on camera to the public and out-right lying to everyone on mutiple occasions..... once again, no trust, therefore no confidence.

Remove Harper or Remove the Conservatives.
 
JLM
No Party Affiliation
#15
"If it wasn't right, it'd be illegal now wouldn't it?"- Not necessarily, apparently it's not illegal for politicians (all parties) to lie to and steal from us, but I don't thinks it's right.
 
Adriatik
No Party Affiliation
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by JLM View Post

"If it wasn't right, it'd be illegal now wouldn't it?"- Not necessarily, apparently it's not illegal for politicians (all parties) to lie to and steal from us, but I don't thinks it's right.


The only one who lied was Harper.
 
Socrates the Greek
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by Walter View Post

I never voted for Turdoh.

Hey Walter we know you vote for Scum Cons.......
 
JLM
No Party Affiliation
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by Adriatik View Post

The only one who lied was Harper.

Yeah right, Last time I checked, that bridge in Brooklyn was still for sale.
 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by JLM View Post

Yeah right, Last time I checked, that bridge in Brooklyn was still for sale.

By all means J, please tell us all exactly where each of the party leaders have actually lied to us in regards to the coalition and Harper...... and at the same time, please inform us how Harper didn't lie to us in regards to the other party's "Illegal Back Door Power Grab." How about his lie about the Bloc actually having any relevent power that can be considered a threat? How about the lie that the Bloc are a part of the Coalition?

By all means, how about you back up some of what you claim from time to time?
 
JLM
No Party Affiliation
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by Praxius View Post

By all means J, please tell us all exactly where each of the party leaders have actually lied to us in regards to the coalition and Harper...... and at the same time, please inform us how Harper didn't lie to us in regards to the other party's "Illegal Back Door Power Grab." How about his lie about the Bloc actually having any relevent power that can be considered a threat? How about the lie that the Bloc are a part of the Coalition?

By all means, how about you back up some of what you claim from time to time?

The Bloc was to be part of the Coalition.
 
Vanni Fucci
Free Thinker
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by JLM View Post

The Bloc was to be part of the Coalition.

Excuse me, what???

The coalition was between Liberals and NDP, with an agreement from the Bloc to support the coalition on confidence votes.

The Bloc was not a member of the coalition.
 
JLM
No Party Affiliation
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by Vanni Fucci View Post

Excuse me, what???

The coalition was between Liberals and NDP, with an agreement from the Bloc to support the coalition on confidence votes.

The Bloc was not a member of the coalition.

What's the difference?
 
Tyr
Free Thinker
#23
IF I was PM, I'd resign
 
iARTthere4iam
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by Praxius View Post

If it wasn't right, it'd be illegal now wouldn't it?



It is widely accepted that most shot the Liberals down because of two things:

1 - The Green Shift
2 - Dion

1 - The Green Shift was trashed ever since the election and the majority (if not all) the party said the plan is now a dead issue and will never be brought back up for a long time, if ever.

2 - Dion is being replaced by Iggy, so he's no longer an issue..... he never was an issue because he was going to be replaced anyways.



A Coalition occurs in many other countries around the world quite often and has occured in our country in the past as well.... just because it isn't the norm and something some are not used to, doesn't mean it is wrong.

And when the Conservatives can't manage the government like the last couple of years and just as this one was starting out as, then there is a problem with the "Norm"

And when you have every other political party which represents the rest of the nation agreeing on how to form together in a co-operative fashion and hold more support and faith in one another, opposing the Conservatives...... that's saying something pretty obvious..... Harper and the Conservatives do not have any confidence of the government or the majority of the population who didn't vote for him.

A coalition is justified.

And don't worry, if the tables were turned around and the Conservatives were going to lead a coalition, my position wouldn't change on this, because they would still be working with other parties and therefore more of the population being represented, just like in the current situation with the NDP/Liberals.



Not wrong if you already know Harper will just continue to pull these stunts through this entire term. He'll play nice and do what the other parties want this time around, but just like all the other times in the past, he'll go right back to the same mentality of "My way or the highway" and stirr the crap up again..... it doesn't matter if Dion is there or not, the reactions would still be the same.

There is no confidence, there is no trust, therefore the government will fall again.

And the thing I will never get past is Harper going right on camera to the public and out-right lying to everyone on mutiple occasions..... once again, no trust, therefore no confidence.

Remove Harper or Remove the Conservatives.

Thanks for your response to my post and your support for my arguments. As you said the liberals lost the election mainly due to Dion (and his green shift). If parliment had not been prorogued the government would have fallen and Dion would have been PM. Its hard to believe that the soundly rejected Dion was the right man for PM (and a lame Duck PM an all around wuss). Since the election was voters saying loud and clear that they did not want dion and the party was in the process of replacing him it is clear prorogation was the correct course of action.

The government has been put on notice. Iggy is now in control of the Liberals (as he should have been instead of Dion). The government has time to plan the BIG SPEND to get us back on track (to deficit). The consevatives may still lose their grip on power. So be it.
 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by JLM View Post

The Bloc was to be part of the Coalition.

The Bloc never was and still isn't "A Part of the Coalition" They only promised to support the coalition by voting with them for 18 months..... anything after that is open game..... but they are not a part of the coalition and never were.
 

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