Residential Schools....Are You Kidding me


Albertabound
#1
Now they are finding deaths are occuring to former residential school students that have received payouts. They are now asking for the government to step in with programs for those who have recieved the payouts......What the F....

First of all good for you....anyone that thought money would be the answer to their false problems as a result of the residential schooling is living in a magical world. Money does not and can not heal these issues. Now that people that received this funding are parishing because of over drinking, the native community want the govl. to pay for a cure to the problem. How about you take it out of the money that was given to you and pay for your own education on the subject.

The fact that none of these people are putting their new fund monies into anything other than boozing burns me right up. Are they puting this money towards schooling to better them selvs....no. Are they puting towards health issues...no. Are you puting towards your home...no. You wanted the evil thing known as money as a cure .....well now you have. Deal with it, and quit asking the government to bail you out all the time. Especially for something you demanded.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#2
Quote: Originally Posted by Albertabound View Post

The fact that none? of these people are putting their new fund monies into anything other than boozing burns me right up. Are they? puting this money towards schooling to better them selvs....no. Are they? puting towards health issues...no. Are you puting towards your home...no. You wanted the evil thing known as money as a cure .....well now you have. Deal with it, and quit asking the government to bail you out all the time. Especially for something you demanded.

Well if that isn't the most broadstroked thing I've heard in ages. none are doing anything with it, and 'they' aren't using it as you'd see fit. Wow. While I can understand the frustration in seeing things stay exactly the same, or even decline, I suspect you need to get a broader view of the way some lives were torn apart by the residential schools. And you need to stop lumping everyone together into one broad category.
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#3
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

Well if that isn't the most broadstroked thing I've heard in ages. none are doing anything with it, and 'they' aren't using it as you'd see fit. Wow. While I can understand the frustration in seeing things stay exactly the same, or even decline, I suspect you need to get a broader view of the way some lives were torn apart by the residential schools. And you need to stop lumping everyone together into one broad category.

I have a friend who lived briefly in a little town called Whitecourt (near Edmonton, Alberta). She couldn't walk the streets at night because she had had two attempts on her life. Her crime - being Native. She had even been warned by some locals not to try and live there, that she wasn't welcome.

Anyway, it seems to me that most Albertans don't know the Indian wars are over.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

Anyway, it seems to me that most Albertans don't know the Indian wars are over.

most huh? I've lived in a lot of northern alberta towns, and I can tell you it's not 'most' albertans who don't realize that. All it takes is a few morons to make life unsafe and unhappy.

Broadstrokes abound in this thread it seems.
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

most huh? I've lived in a lot of northern alberta towns, and I can tell you it's not 'most' albertans who don't realize that. All it takes is a few morons to make life unsafe and unhappy.

Broadstrokes abound in this thread it seems.

Well I traveled through Alberta with my friend and it is my experience that most (majority) were very rude to her because she was native.

Broad stroke or not that is my experience. They might tell you otherwise to your face but I saw with my own eyes what a native person can really expect there.

So yeah - most Albertans are prejudice f**ks - deal with it.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

So yeah - most Albertans are prejudice f**ks - deal with it.

lol... ah, the irony. bigotry is such a neat thing.
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

lol... ah, the irony. bigotry is such a neat thing.

and ignorance is bliss huh
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

and ignorance is bliss huh

No ignorance Scott, just basic knowledge of human perception issues. You walk into a room full of _____ (insert word of choice here... blacks, natives, albertans), and one mistreats you or your acquaintance, so you decide that all are the same as the one that mistreated you. It's typical stereotyping, even if it's based on 'experience', because our minds love to stick on the few stark examples and don't hold onto the dozens of people we encounter who don't fit the stereotype (ie, the ____ who isn't a jerk is just another person, not a ____, and fades away in our minds).
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

No ignorance Scott, just basic knowledge of human perception issues. You walk into a room full of _____ (insert word of choice here... blacks, natives, albertans), and one mistreats you or your acquaintance, so you decide that all are the same as the one that mistreated you. It's typical stereotyping, even if it's based on 'experience', because our minds love to stick on the few stark examples and don't hold onto the dozens of people we encounter who don't fit the stereotype (ie, the ____ who isn't a jerk is just another person, not a ____, and fades away in our minds).

But you see that isn't what happened. There were four of us. Three white and one native. Again and again she was treated abhorrently while the rest of us watched in stunned amazement. We noticed before she did.

The world isn't comprised of all good people with a few bad apples karrie, it's full of mostly bad apples that pretend to be good when someone is watching. That's why we need a sky god, stupid laws and police; not to watch the few bad apples, society could take care of them easily enough if it weren't for the fact that society is mostly all bad apples, but they are needed to keep all the bad apples in line.

You've heard the old saying: locks only keep honest people honest? Well, I've seen enough to know that's true.
 
gerryh
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

But you see that isn't what happened. There were four of us. Three white and one native. Again and again she was treated abhorrently while the rest of us watched in stunned amazement. We noticed before she did.

The world isn't comprised of all good people with a few bad apples karrie, it's full of mostly bad apples that pretend to be good when someone is watching. That's why we need a sky god, stupid laws and police; not to watch the few bad apples, society could take care of them easily enough if it weren't for the fact that society is mostly all bad apples, but they are needed to keep all the bad apples in line.

You've heard the old saying: locks only keep honest people honest? Well, I've seen enough to know that's true.


Glad I don't live in your world, and I'm sure Karrie would concur with me.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryh View Post

Glad I don't live in your world, and I'm sure Karrie would concur with me.

Hi gerry. You're right, I tend to pity the cynical sorts as much as I'm sure they pity me for my optimism and bright cheery ways.
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryh View Post

Glad I don't live in your world, and I'm sure Karrie would concur with me.

What world is that?

I don't need a sky god, police and stupid laws to keep me good. That's a pretty great place to be I think.

I wouldn't want to be in your world.
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

Hi gerry. You're right, I tend to pity the cynical sorts as much as I'm sure they pity me for my optimism and bright cheery ways.

I mean no offense karrie but to assume that only a few people are prejudice is well.. naive and especially so when you live in a country that was forcibly stolen from the indigenous people.

Of coarse non of us is prejudice just as long as all the Indians get off our land huh? Or stop bitching that we still owe them something; or get jobs... Nudge nudge, wink wink,

I mean what do you suppose has happened to turn everyones attitude around? Some friendly government propaganda adds on TV can undo the North American genocides that made Rwanda look like a picnic; that made Hitler look like a pretty nice guy? Some print adds of smiley brown and white faces has made everyone in Canada see the error of their ways?

Get real.

Now that there is some hard scientific evidence that prejudice is hardwired into our brains. What happens to your sunshine and lollipop world then?
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

I mean no offense karrie but to assume that only a few people are prejudice is well.. naive and especially so when you live in a country that was forcibly stolen from the indigenous people.

Of coarse non of us is prejudice just as long as all the Indians get off our land huh? Or stop bitching that we still owe them something; or get jobs... Nudge nudge, wink wink,

I mean what do you suppose has happened to turn everyones attitude around? Some friendly government propaganda adds on TV can undo the North American genocides? Some print adds of smiley brown and white faces has made everyone in Canada see the error of their ways?

Get real.

Now there is some hard scientific evidence that prejudice is hardwired into our brains. What happens to your sunshine and lollipop world then?

It's clearly hardwired into our brains... you're proof positive in the fact that you refuse to listen to someone who actually lives here, has lived in a broad cross section of towns in Alberta, and has dealt with the issue of racism from various angles all through my life, because you've decided that 'the majority' of Albertans think a certain way due to your snapshot view. It's an easy trap to fall into. And trust me, Albertans are prejudiced about a great many things, and a great many of them are indeed prejudiced towards natives (oh, the fights I've had... lol)... but the majority? No.
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

you refuse to listen to someone who actually lives here, has lived in a broad cross section of towns in Alberta,

Oh, I get it.

Sorry karrie, your wonderful and everything you do is perfection... you even cried during Dances With Wolves, right?

What could I have been thinking talking about my experience when you have so much opinion backing you up.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

Oh, I get it.

Sorry karrie, your wonderful and everything you do is perfection... you even cried in Dances With Wolves, right?

What could I have been thinking talking about my experience when you have so much opinion backing you up.

oh, so for you it's experience, for me it's mere opinion?
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

oh, so for you it's experience, for me it's mere opinion?

Basically, or more accurately, emotional investment.

I do commend you on your efforts though. Maybe someday Alberta will be a somewhat reasonable place for native people.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

Basically, or more accurately, emotional investment.

I do commend you on your efforts though. Maybe someday Alberta will be a somewhat reasonable place for native people.

How many native relatives do you have living in Alberta? When your number tops 15, then you can talk to me about who's coming from a place of opinion, and who's coming from a place of experience.
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

How many native relatives do you have living in Alberta? When your number tops 15, then you can talk to me about who's coming from a place of opinion, and who's coming from a place of experience.

Oppressed people don't usually know they're oppressed. The fact that you have family there is irrelevant in negating my experience but my experience still makes sense in the context of your opinion since you have an emotional investment in your community, where I do not. All I have is my experience with how my native friend was treated and as I said, she wasn't the first to notice the prejudice - that is typical of oppressed people. So while my friend would have said everything is fine, we her three white friends, would have said they were not. Since apparently we were more able to know what being treated normally was like then she was; we noticed the prejudice first and pointed it out to her.

Now I am pointing it out to you.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post


Now I am pointing it out to you.

Bigotry and prejudice... yes, you've done a fine job of pointing out its existence, and most importantly, illustrating its formation. It was a neat lesson. Thanks Scott.
 
Scott Free
Free Thinker
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

Bigotry and prejudice... yes, you've done a fine job of pointing out its existence, and most importantly, illustrating its formation. It was a neat lesson. Thanks Scott.

This strikes me as sarcastic.

So if I'm so wrong what would you recommend I do about my experience?

Am I to pretend I didn't see the things I saw in Alberta? Or pretend that it wasn't almost everyone I encountered that exhibited a dislike for my native friend?

What point is it that you think I'm missing?
 
Lester
No Party Affiliation
#22
Indigenous would infer that natives evolved here, they did not. There are piss tanks and dope addicts from all races and all walks of life, the last Job I was on a Native was in charge (Superintendent because he is the sharpest knife in the drawer) he went to powwows every weekend, he has a great house and family and lives on the reserve in cold lake. I also have two greatnephews and one greatneice that are half and half they are bright and articulate and I love them dearly,drunken indian is a stereotype. I have never been a racist and never will be, different cultures fascinate me to no end. The residential schools were from an antiquated era that is far behind us. On the otherhand don't natives already get counselling for drug abuse? free education? housing?they get lots of perks the rest of us don't. So on that point I agree with Albertabound they should not receive any counselling.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by Scott Free View Post

This strikes me as sarcastic.

So if I'm so wrong what would you recommend I do about my experience?

Am I to pretend I didn't see the things I saw in Alberta? Or pretend that it wasn't almost everyone I encountered that exhibited a dislike for my native friend?

What point is it that you think I'm missing?

The point that I think you're missing? I went over that way back... the issue of those who treat us poorly standing out in our minds, while those who don't fade away and don't register. So if I walked past 60 people in a day, and 3 treated me badly, it might seem like everyone I saw that day treated me badly. "Those____ are all a rude bunch of ____."

That, and the fact that you probably haven't seen 'the majority' of Alberta. You've seen a handful of the people who populate Alberta. But, your handful of bad apples become your defining factor. They become 'them' when you discuss Albertans in general, just as the OP used a broadstroke to discuss all those who received settlements in terms of those who've drank themselves to death or done nothing with their money.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by Lester View Post

I have never been a racist and never will be, different cultures fascinate me to no end. The residential schools were from an antiquated era that is far behind us. On the otherhand don't natives already get counselling for drug abuse? free education? housing?they get lots of perks the rest of us don't. So on that point I agree with Albertabound they should not receive any counselling.

What strikes me from seeing all the programs in place is that the only true solution would be to force people to attend the existing ones. And frankly, that's not a solution at all. That's just government nannying, stripping people of their rights. I don't know where in the bouts of alcoholism and drug abuse I've seen, someone could draw that line for someone else and essentially say 'we're locking you up in a program now.'
 
gerryh
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by Lester View Post

Indigenous would infer that natives evolved here, they did not. There are piss tanks and dope addicts from all races and all walks of life, the last Job I was on a Native was in charge (Superintendent because he is the sharpest knife in the drawer) he went to powwows every weekend, he has a great house and family and lives on the reserve in cold lake. I also have two greatnephews and one greatneice that are half and half they are bright and articulate and I love them dearly,drunken indian is a stereotype. I have never been a racist and never will be, different cultures fascinate me to no end. The residential schools were from an antiquated era that is far behind us. On the otherhand don't natives already get counselling for drug abuse? free education? housing?they get lots of perks the rest of us don't. So on that point I agree with Albertabound they should not receive any counselling.


The comment in red.....I'll educate you there:

Quote:

Eleven hundred students initially attended 69 schools across the country. In 1931, at the peak of the residential school system, there were about 80 schools operating in Canada. They were in every territory and province except Newfoundland, Prince Edward Island and New Brunswick. There were a total of about 130 schools from the earliest in the 19th century to the last, which closed in 1996.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/ab...alschools.html


The comment in blue....... educate yourself before you start spewing anymore bullshyte.
 
Lester
No Party Affiliation
#26
As far as Natives blowing all their dough on drugs and booze, I know a few whites that have done the same thing (one guy I knew blew eighty grand on dope in six months)They shouldn't have given people that kind of money if they don't know how to handle it, maybe financial counselling would have been a better idea, help them start a business maybe- but it is about free will and they were entitled to the money, so who are we to tell them how to spend it. I can't think of any solution that would be acceptable or appropriate.
 
Lester
No Party Affiliation
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryh View Post

The comment in red.....I'll educate you there:



http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/ab...alschools.html


The comment in blue....... educate yourself before you start spewing anymore bullshyte.

What, you googled it ten minutes ago and now your an expert. anyway it was a question not a statement.
 
gerryh
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by Lester View Post

What, you googled it ten minutes ago and now your an expert. anyway it was a question not a statement.

Considering my heritage and my wifes heritage..... I knew about res schools a LONG time ago.... and your comment concerning the school's themselves was not a question, it was a statement. Your other comments are typical uneducated, bigoted BS.
 
Lester
No Party Affiliation
#29
That is not the question in Blue you will notice there are question marks, does that not denote a question? as far as residential schools go I will apologize for that as I thought such a thing would have been gone in the fifties. There is native blood in my family as well gerry and I take offence at being called a bigot.
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by Lester View Post

That is not the question in Blue you will notice there are question marks, does that not denote a question? as far as residential schools go I will apologize for that as I thought such a thing would have been gone in the fifties. There is native blood in my family as well gerry and I take offence at being called a bigot.

Race issues are just one of those subjects where it's almost impossible to talk, from either side, without setting people's teeth on edge in some way shape or form.
 

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