More the Marry in Bountiful, BC


Cliffy
#241
Quote: Originally Posted by coldstream View Post

I'm not a member of Opus Dei, athough i support the traditionalist FSSP (Fraternal Society of St. Peter) which promotes the reestablishment of the Old Latin Mass and Breviary, its attributes and an undiluted Catechism.

I actually agree with you, but only to a point. The Rise and Collapse of Civilizations, as the West is, was well elucidated, especially by Oswald Spengler, in The Decline of the West, in the last century.

Many of his predictions, almost a century old, are being realized with uncanny accuracy now. Spengler was a dedicated Deist and (perhaps) a Gnostic as well, and was especially critical of the gospels of St. Paul, which defined Christianity's fundamental moral character, and his predictions thus contain an inherent bias.

But there has been an independent Christian strain to the progression of the West, interweaved and supportive through much of its history, but also in dissension with it when a strong Deist and relativistic character started to impose itself at the beginning of the Enlightenment.

That should indicate to you they have separate destinies. The West could well be on the road to ruin, led by a homosexual, hedonistic elite.. but Christianity will continue on.

I'm more like Spengler, Gnostic leanings and I think Paul was a mental deviant who completely messed up JC's message. As far as I'm concerned, the catholic church is the remnant of the old Roman Empire only two thousand years more decadent.

And yes, there are sufficient numbers of people who would rather be sheep than take responsibility for themselves so christianity will probably be around for quite some time to come.
 
lone wolf
#242
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

Anytime someone throws out an insult toward a church, you're insulting its members too. I note that it's not a thread about the church, or the abuses it's tried to cover up. No... it's a thread where people are ticked at cold for his view, so they throw every possible negativity out about the church that they can think of, to injure him. They just don't give a whole lot of thought to the fact that he's not the only Catholic in here.

coldstream is an extremist. Not the whole church. But if you want to slag all of it because of a few, have fun, but make no mistake that it's insulting.

Again.... WHERE is the personal insult? You're hardly of the Church's leadership - and you'll please note, in NO place did I specify Catholic.
 
karrie
#243
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolf View Post

Again.... WHERE is the personal insult? You're hardly of the Church's leadership - and you'll please note, in NO place did I specify Catholic.

fair enough wolf. I will concede over reaction.
 
petros
#244
Yeah, the church has never insulted or harmed anyone. Why pick on it's followers?
 
gerryh
#245
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Yeah, the church has never insulted or harmed anyone. Why pick on it's followers?

 
lone wolf
#246
Quote: Originally Posted by karrie View Post

fair enough wolf. I will concede over reaction.

Not all you.... Uncle Arthur's riding me hard and gonna put me away wet
 
AnnaG
#247
Quote: Originally Posted by coldstream View Post

Good Grief, Anna, that is most immoderate. I'm really taking you off your game, aren't i.

Dream on, Pilgrim; you "ain't seen nuthin yet". I just find puritanical, religious, zealots annoying. Especially when they spew distortions.
 
earth_as_one
#248
Woman defends polygamy:
YouTube - Women Defend Polygamy - Support

She sounds rational to me.
 
gerryh
#249
She's brainwashed..... why do I say she's brainwashed? Because her beliefs are outside the norm for the beliefs held by the majority of western civilizations men and women. Therefore, she must be brainwashed and needs to be saved and liberated from her present situation. Regardless of her feeling that she doesn't need the saving or liberating.

Our way is the best and only way.
 
AnnaG
#250
Quote: Originally Posted by earth_as_one View Post

Woman defends polygamy:
YouTube - Women Defend Polygamy - Support

She sounds rational to me.

Not that I disagree with some of what she said, but I heard a great deal of rationalising going on there. You don't need to jump into a polygamist religion to gain the benefits of supportive families.
My own culture was one where the grandparents did most of the chilrearing while the parent were off working to feed the family (grandparents included). There were aunts uncles, neighbors all willing to help out in dire times and people shared food with those that didn't have enough.
Besides, as there may be similarities to what she described and Bountiful, the fact remains that life at Bountiful is abusive, inequalities abound, and the people don't understand any different kind of life.
Middle-aged men swapping their young teen wives around amongst themselves is not cool. Simple as that.
 
earth_as_one
#251
Quote: Originally Posted by AnnaG View Post

Not that I disagree with some of what she said, but I heard a great deal of rationalising going on there. You don't need to jump into a polygamist religion to gain the benefits of supportive families.
My own culture was one where the grandparents did most of the chilrearing while the parent were off working to feed the family (grandparents included). There were aunts uncles, neighbors all willing to help out in dire times and people shared food with those that didn't have enough.
Besides, as there may be similarities to what she described and Bountiful, the fact remains that life at Bountiful is abusive, inequalities abound, and the people don't understand any different kind of life.
Middle-aged men swapping their young teen wives around amongst themselves is not cool. Simple as that.

I heard someone defending their value/belief system and lifestyle. She wasn't justifying but pointing out some of the unique benefits from being one of multiple wives. My estimation of this woman is that she has an assertive personality and made informed personal lifestyle choices freely based on her morality.

I'm not saying that every women in a polygamous relationship is happy or ended up there by free choice. I agree that middle aged men swapping their daughters is wrong. Starting around 18-20 years old, a woman should be capable of knowing what she wants and many women in polygamous marriages have made this choice freely. I support and respect their right to pursue happiness. I also support their right to change their mind later on. I do not support forcing a young person into either an arranged polygamous or monogamous marriage.

Some other links:

A women from Bountiful defends her lifestyle:
The Truth About Bountiful

Here is a forum for people who practice polyamorous relationships.
Polyamory.com Forum
(Some relationships sound very complicated)

This young woman practices polyamory.
YouTube - Polyamory
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9e6Z2KaNp4g
Last edited by earth_as_one; Oct 2nd, 2009 at 12:16 AM..
 

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