Canadians Pick Human Rights Over Trade With China


Liberalman
Free Thinker
#1
Human Rights in Tibet Trump Trade with China (SES Research Survey)

On the issue of Tibet, research shows that faced with the choice between human rights and trade with China, Canadians believe standing up for human rights is more important. Likewise, an overwhelming majority of Canadians support the Prime Minister meeting the Dalai Lama.The findings are not surprising, Canadians traditionally place a high premium on human rights and freedoms. In the final analysis human rights trump trade.For more detailed information on the methodology and the statistical results visit the SES website at www.sesresearch.com.This survey was completed by SES Research and commissioned by the Canada-Tibet Committee.If you would like to discuss this topic and are interested in sharing your opinions visit my blog at www.nikonthenumbers.com.Cheers, Nik Nikita James Nanos, CMRP President email: nnanos@sesresearch.com phone: 613-276-2731 web: http://www.sesresearch.com



All lip service what would Canadians do without all the Chinese goods they buy for cheap prices at Wal Mart value for your money trumps human rights any day.

We have to remember that a lot of Chinese products are made by children’s sweat shops and if any child doesn’t make the quotas they are severely whipped so that little Johnny can have that all important gift
under the tree in time.
Last edited by Liberalman; Oct 26th, 2007 at 05:54 PM..Reason: ....
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#2
Quote: Originally Posted by Liberalman View Post


We have to remember that a lot of Chinese products are made by children’s sweat shops and if any child doesn’t make the quotas they are severely whipped so that little Johnny can have that all important gift
under the tree in time.

Saddest part is, there's another side to that coin. If that sweat shop kid doesn't earn his measly bit of pay, he and his family may not have enough to eat. Child labour violates human rights. That's undeniable. Starvation violates life. Give them an alternative before you close down the sweatshop.

Woof!
 
Northboy
#3
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolf View Post

Saddest part is, there's another side to that coin. If that sweat shop kid doesn't earn his measly bit of pay, he and his family may not have enough to eat. Child labour violates human rights. That's undeniable. Starvation violates life. Give them an alternative before you close down the sweatshop.

Woof!

True, but ya gotta put the pressure on sometime and its not like the Chinese government isn't sitting on 2 Trillion US...Maybe they should put some of that to good use for their people....

If not, how can you fault us from abstaining from supporting their little pyramid building efforts???
 
#juan
No Party Affiliation
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolf View Post

Saddest part is, there's another side to that coin. If that sweat shop kid doesn't earn his measly bit of pay, he and his family may not have enough to eat. Child labour violates human rights. That's undeniable. Starvation violates life. Give them an alternative before you close down the sweatshop.

Woof!

Aside from the fact that a majority of Chinese products are garbage/knock-offs and that our patent laws mean zilch to the Chinese government, what more would we want? Part of the cost of selling our products to China is that we have to buy their crap. I don't think it's worth it.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#5
Wasn't there another outfit like that? You know - showed up on the circuit just after the War.... J. A. Pan and Co....

Woof!
 
Colpy
Conservative
#6
Liberalman, you aren't going to hear this often:

I completely agree with you.

Now for the partisan shot:

You will notice that the government formed by the Conservative Party of Canada dares defy China to some extent, while you would have needed a crowbar to get the Liberal gov't's lips off China's ass.
 
Liberalman
Free Thinker
#7

Quote:

Liberalman, you aren't going to hear this often:

I completely agree with you.



Thanks Colpy

Now for my partisan shot back

Conservative Harper has all his lips glued tightly to the American president George W’s ass that there is no space to put a crowbar.

Whatever George does, the Harper government does as well.

Honouring the Dalai Lama in spite of China’s objections like Bush did so does Harper.

I find it interesting that Mulroney kissed American president Reagan’s ass as well.

Anytime Reagan had a major announcement, Mulroney had a press release a couple of days later making the same announcement.

Therefore Canadian Conservative prime ministers like American president’s cowboy’s ass.

Colpy do you know if Harper belonged to the Skull and Bones club or is he still trying to get in?

 
DurkaDurka
No Party Affiliation
#8
Not that I am a fan of Hapers, but I do like the "**** you salut" he gave to China.

It amazes me what consumers will tolerate in regards to rape for aZellers prices...
 
Colpy
Conservative
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by Liberalman View Post


Thanks Colpy

Now for my partisan shot back

Conservative Harper has all his lips glued tightly to the American president George W’s ass that there is no space to put a crowbar.

Whatever George does, the Harper government does as well.

Honouring the Dalai Lama in spite of China’s objections like Bush did so does Harper.

I find it interesting that Mulroney kissed American president Reagan’s ass as well.

Anytime Reagan had a major announcement, Mulroney had a press release a couple of days later making the same announcement.

Therefore Canadian Conservative prime ministers like American president’s cowboy’s ass.

Colpy do you know if Harper belonged to the Skull and Bones club or is he still trying to get in?

Now, here is my problem with the left in general and Liberals in particular......

Bush is the elected leader of a free country, our biggest trading partner, our greatest friend in the world, a nation that shares much of our political heritage, and our dedication to democracy, and individual rights. Flawed as Bush is, he will be gone in 15 months, and replaced by a perrson chosen by the people.

China is a growing threat to the western world, the worst human rights abuser on earth, ruled by the same party that has, over the last 58 years, murdered tens of millions of its own citizens, by FAR the worst regime in the sad, bloody history of mankind.......they leave Stalin and Hitler in the dust.......

Only a Liberal would delude themselves that kissing the butt of the USA is on the same level as kissing the butt of Red China.

AND that is if the accusation of US butt-kissing was even true, which it most definitely is NOT. Harper has kept a pretty good balance in his relationship with the States, not only IMHO, but in the opinion of most of the polical commentators I have read.

Harper doesn't kiss their butt, he simply doesn't believe that it is necessary to constantly have your thumb in Uncle Sam's eye, a la the Liberals.
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by Colpy View Post

Now, here is my problem with the left in general and Liberals in particular......

Bush is the elected leader of a free country, our biggest trading partner, our greatest friend in the world, a nation that shares much of our political heritage, and our dedication to democracy, and individual rights. Flawed as Bush is, he will be gone in 15 months, and replaced by a perrson chosen by the people.

China is a growing threat to the western world, the worst human rights abuser on earth, ruled by the same party that has, over the last 58 years, murdered tens of millions of its own citizens, by FAR the worst regime in the sad, bloody history of mankind.......they leave Stalin and Hitler in the dust.......

Only a Liberal would delude themselves that kissing the butt of the USA is on the same level as kissing the butt of Red China.

AND that is if the accusation of US butt-kissing was even true, which it most definitely is NOT. Harper has kept a pretty good balance in his relationship with the States, not only IMHO, but in the opinion of most of the polical commentators I have read.

Harper doesn't kiss their butt, he simply doesn't believe that it is necessary to constantly have your thumb in Uncle Sam's eye, a la the Liberals.

You sir are completely wrong, and as such a danger to society at large and children in particular.

Bush was not elected
The USA is not a free country
There is no American dedication to democracy
There is only enslavement by Capital
No nation has murdered as many humans as the USA.
The majority of this planet condemns the USA as the single biggest danger to the human race.
 
Zzarchov
#11
China isn't that bad Colpy. I mean, in regards to Tibet..that was one of the few places in the world were it was better to be ruled by Mao than the sociopathic theocratic dictatorship that was in place before. I wonder if the Dalai Lama at his young age even knew his palace was upkept by slaves.

Not everyone thats worse than us is "worse than stalin or hitler". Perspective. Bad does not always equal worst.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#12
Drama always has been the cornerstone of propaganda. Win the heart. The head will follow blissfully along. China has a bad record on human rights. China is allegedly a socialist state. Canada allows the poor to starve slowly. Canada lets the money talk. We're a lot closer than anyone cares to believe....

Woof!
 
Zzarchov
#13
We let our poor starve? since when did that happen, last I checked people die of too much food , not too little.
 
Colpy
Conservative
#14
Okay, guys, this is silly.

The Chinese regime that still rules China came to power in 1949. According to some estimates, between 50 and 70 MILLION Chinese have died as a direct result of that government's actions. AND in case you have forgotten, the Chinese murdered thousands of peaceful protesters in Tianamen Square in 1989, an act that made recent moves by the Burmese gov't look like a beach party in comparison.

Hitler only murdered about 10 to 12 million people under his rule. Stalin managed a solid second place in the kill-as-many-as- you- can competition, with a score of between 20 and 25 million.

I'm not talking through my hat.

To compare China to the USA on any pretense of moral equivalency is simply ludicrous.

To compare China's policies with Canada's policies on poverty is insane.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#15
Quote:

To compare China's policies with Canada's policies on poverty is insane.

Not insane ... merely a reminder to make sure your own doorstep is perfectly clean. Just be disabled in Canada and trying to make ends meet with a relative amount of dignity.... Provincial jurisdiction? Agreed. Under whose flag?

Woof!
 
Colpy
Conservative
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolf View Post

Not insane ... merely a reminder to make sure your own doorstep is perfectly clean. Just be disabled in Canada and trying to make ends meet with a relative amount of dignity.... Provincial jurisdiction? Agreed. Under whose flag?

Woof!

Fair enough

But, as Plato said "Perfection exists only in the mind of God"

This is a relative thing.
 
JoeSchmoe
#17
Harper's doing the right thing. Good on him. I hope he can learn something about compassion and tolerance from His Holiness.

I hope that we boycott the olympics in China... the olympics are supposed to stand for something. They don't represent anything good any more. They represent dollars and corporate control.

Quote:

According to the Olympic Charter, established by Pierre de Coubertin, the goal of the Olympic Movement is to contribute to building a peaceful and better world by educating youth through sport practised without discrimination of any kind and in the Olympic spirit, which requires mutual understanding with a spirit of friendship, solidarity and fair play. http://www.olympic.org/uk/organisation/index_uk.asp

I'm sure that I'll be sued by the IOC for quoting their website....
 
JoeSchmoe
#18
Quote:

Just be disabled in Canada and trying to make ends meet with a relative amount of dignity....

Absolutely agreed. Provincial disability's mandate (from what I have seen, not what their glitzy pamphlets say) is to remove you from their payroll however they can. It's a very poor way to treat the disabled.
 
Unforgiven
#19
What have Chinese people done for me lately? So much so I should be concerned enough to damage myself economically in order for them to have some meager support to make changes in the way their own government treats them?
 
Zzarchov
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by Colpy View Post

Okay, guys, this is silly.

The Chinese regime that still rules China came to power in 1949. According to some estimates, between 50 and 70 MILLION Chinese have died as a direct result of that government's actions. AND in case you have forgotten, the Chinese murdered thousands of peaceful protesters in Tianamen Square in 1989, an act that made recent moves by the Burmese gov't look like a beach party in comparison.

Hitler only murdered about 10 to 12 million people under his rule. Stalin managed a solid second place in the kill-as-many-as- you- can competition, with a score of between 20 and 25 million.

I'm not talking through my hat.

To compare China to the USA on any pretense of moral equivalency is simply ludicrous.

To compare China's policies with Canada's policies on poverty is insane.


Oh , I don't know.

If you are going to count all the deaths caused by China in almost 60 years to the deaths caused by hitler in a far smaller period of time..

Then lets run with that method, the US regime in place has been in place for almost 250 years now hasn't it? We start counting all the dead in those instances..you'll outpace China.

Time is an important factor. Hell, to concider the current Chinese regime the same as Mao (considering it was pretty much a coup when things shifted) is a bit daft.

Sorry, China just aint that bad when you consider it to scale. Oh its far worse than the USA, but to compare it to Stalin or Hitler, utter madness.

Now, you wanna consider Mao VS Stalin, ok..thats fair. Or even China and the USSR for the same length of time.

But your standards are pretty well manipulated there.
 
Colpy
Conservative
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by Zzarchov View Post

Oh , I don't know.

If you are going to count all the deaths caused by China in almost 60 years to the deaths caused by hitler in a far smaller period of time..

Then lets run with that method, the US regime in place has been in place for almost 250 years now hasn't it? We start counting all the dead in those instances..you'll outpace China.

Time is an important factor. Hell, to concider the current Chinese regime the same as Mao (considering it was pretty much a coup when things shifted) is a bit daft.

Sorry, China just aint that bad when you consider it to scale. Oh its far worse than the USA, but to compare it to Stalin or Hitler, utter madness.

Now, you wanna consider Mao VS Stalin, ok..thats fair. Or even China and the USSR for the same length of time.

But your standards are pretty well manipulated there.

Well, I would at least accept the idea that applying numbers in an attempt to quantify absolute evil is a little useless. The regimes of Stalin, Hitler and Mao were exactly that, evil incarnate.

The regime in the USA is not. Indeed, I would bet good money that the sum of all the casualties caused by Americans in every war the Americans participated in would not approach 50 million. Or even 20 million. And, we weren't talking about foreign wars, we were talking about the murder of civilian populations ruled by the regime.

I also understand your point about the Chinese regime of today as opposed to that of Mao.......but, to split a hair, it is STILL the Communist Party, still the People's Liberation Army, Mao is still treated as an icon (although a stained one)......it is still the same system.
 

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