Killed for wearing a headscarf


hadhoud
#1
Let me break down this story to see if I have it right (if anything, for my own sanity).
A 31-year old, headscarf-wearing Egyptian Muslim woman, Marwa Al-Sherbini, who was about four months pregnant, takes her German neighbor to court for calling her a ďterroristĒ. Now, in the courtroom, the neighbor, Alex W., stabs her 18 times right in front of her 3-year old son.
Her husband, a research fellow, tries to come to her rescue and ends up not only getting stabbed as well by the attacker, but is actually mistaken for the attacker and shot by the security guard.
This case was so mind-baffling when I read it a few days ago and I still havenít been able to wrap my mind around it. Many questions and thoughts have been floating around in my head, and I hate to admit it but the most pertinent one that rests right at the foreground of my brain is based on two words: 18 times.

I am not a forensic scientist but Iíve seen enough Hollywood movies to know that stabbing someone 18 times isnít a task that you get done in 5 or 10 seconds unless youíre the cyborg or a robot sent from the future. 18 times.
How long did it take for people in the courtroom to realize this woman was being stabbed and that someone should do something about it?
18 times.
Seriously, try stabbing the wind 18 times right now as quickly as possible.
Go ahead.
Iíll wait.
See what Iím saying?
Oh, and add to that her husband getting stabbed three times by the same guy before the tragedy came to an end (with the husband being shot).
Now I know this is a question that might seem silly or even absurd in light of this event. I know a better debate is being framed elsewhere . I know that a great deal of the conversation that centers around this case has been with regards to the lack of western coverage (what did they expect?) and the outrage in Egypt (what did they expect?) and the outrage to come from the perhaps various parts of the Muslim world (what did they expect?) or the rising Islamophobia in the West (what did they expect?), but while all these conversations are valid and have their own time and context to consider, for some reason, I remain mesmerized by this number: 18.
18 times.
Strictly on a human level, how long does it take for someone to react. To move. To say ďstopĒ. To say ďenoughĒ. Strictly on a human level. No religion. No gender. Just a human being watching one human being slaughtered by another.
How long does it take?
How does that number reach 18?
See, this is whatís been getting to me lately. In my head, this number, 18, rings incredibly significant. I recognize that thereís evil in this world, and that there always will be. There are breaking limits in this world and I recognize that too. There are numbers that weigh heavy on the human soul, and every one has one. Itís unmistakable. Itís undeniable. Often times we have absolutely no control over them and we relieve ourselves of any responsibilities. Like Tolstoy would put it, we pretend to simply be kings who are slaves to the whims of history. But often times, we do.
Often times, and not all the time, but some of the time, we do.
Often times these things happen right in front of us.
On our watch.
On our watch, these numbers take shape.
For Marwa Al-Sherbini that magical number was eighteen.
But whatís the body count in Iraq today?
What about the West Bank or Gaza?
What about in Darfur?
Whatís their magic number? Whatís their breaking limit?
At what point do we say ďenoughĒ?
More importantly.
At what point will we mean it?
 
earth_as_one
#2
Welcome to the forum Hadhoud.

Quote:

Is Europe really Islamophobic?

Anger over the killing of the 'martyr of the hijab' is understandable – but are Muslims right to say they are targeted in Europe?

"The martyr of the hijab" is what Egyptians are now calling Marwa al-Sherbini. The 31-year-old veiled Egyptian wife of a postgraduate student in Germany was fatally stabbed – in court – by a German man identified only as Axel W, who had been prosecuted for calling her a terrorist (among other things) while she was playing with her three-year-old son in a park. Marwa's body was interred in Cairo yesterday and her wake was attended by thousands, some of them chanting: "There is no God but God and the Germans are the enemies of God."

Is Europe really Islamophobic? | Nesrine Malik | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

I doubt many Germans support killing Muslim women for wearing headscarves. This case is a tragedy and an extreme example of intolerance. BTW, so is saying "Germans are the enemies of God".

Notably, this story had gotten little to no coverage. Let's put it this way. If a Muslim man killed a German women in Egypt for not wearing a Hijab, and Egyptian police shot the husband by mistake, I'm sure it would have gotten more coverage by western media.
 
Cliffy
#3
I can see why this weighs heavy on your mind. That it happened in a court room is mind boggling. All I can think is that the western media has done such an efficient job of vilification of Muslims to justify their invasion of sovereign Arab nations. I expect we have not seen the last of western barbarity.
 
Cliffy
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by earth_as_one View Post

Welcome to the forum Hadhoud.



I doubt many Germans support killing Muslim women for wearing headscarves. This case is a tragedy and an extreme example of intolerance. BTW, so is saying "Germans are the enemies of God".

Notably, this story had gotten little to no coverage. Let's put it this way. If a Muslim man killed a German women in Egypt for not wearing a Hijab, and Egyptian police shot the husband by mistake, I'm sure it would have gotten more coverage by western media.

The circle goes round and round. What is it going to take to break the circle of hate? Armageddon? Man, I'm getting tired of waiting for humans to grow up!
 
hadhoud
#5
The nazism will never leave off in Germany .
 
petros
#6
And yet in this part of the world men are being killed for wearing pink. Go figure.
 
Cliffy
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by hadhoud View Post

The nazism will never leave off in Germany .

What makes spreading hate from your end any different? People are people no matter where they are or what they believe. In any given location you have people who run the full spectrum from saints to barbarians. Are suicide bombers any more or less insane than a guy who stabs a woman in a court room? We can either view humanity as a bunch of lunatics or saints in progress. If they are lunatics with no hope of redemption, then we may as well nuke the whole lot and let god sort it out. I don't think you should judge an entire nation by the actions of a few.
 
hadhoud
#8
I just want to remind some people that she was 4 months pregnant .
In the court , they said that the killer was a 'crazy' man as usual .
If this crime took place in an Egyptian court and a blond German woman lost her life by an Egyptian man, all the medias would talk about it .
 
Unforgiven
#9
Gee you were sooo close too.
I was really interested in working out how she got stabbed 18 times and then the husband was shot and all but then you went and turned it into a stupid rant and painting Germans as Nazis.

People are people dude, some are assholes some a not. Try to get on with things.
 
earth_as_one
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by Cliffy View Post

The circle goes round and round. What is it going to take to break the circle of hate? Armageddon? Man, I'm getting tired of waiting for humans to grow up!

After 9/11, I noticed people in general were more polite. At least for a while.
 
mt_pockets1000
#11
Recently, a man stabbed another man multiple times on a crowded bus in Manitoba. Then he proceeded to cut off parts of the body including the head. In the meantime, the people on the bus exited the vehicle and locked the crazy MF inside. When humans witness an atrocity like this or the one in Germany they are temporarily stunned and horrified by the act before them. I can see the crazy fool stabbing the victim 18 times while the people around do a double take. You'll find these crazies anywhere, not just in Germany.
 
karrie
#12
mt_pockets, I immediately turned to the McLean case in my mind too.

I'd like to point out that the court had prosecuted him for his crime of calling her a terrorist.

Germany, the German courts, had said that even calling her names was not acceptable. He was a rogue lunatic, and obviously his actions don't reflect upon the German people. They are not excused, they are not applauded.
 
Liberalman
#13
Didn't the Jews have problems with the Germans?
 
Ron in Regina
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by Liberalman View Post

Didn't the Jews have problems with the Germans?


Quote: Originally Posted by hadhoud View Post

The nazism will never leave off in Germany .



 
mt_pockets1000
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by Liberalman View Post

Didn't the Jews have problems with the Germans?

...and the Myans had trouble with the Spanish, and the N.A. aboriginals had trouble with the Europeans, and Americans had trouble with the British, and on and on. A man goes nuts in a courtroom and all of Germany is responsible? C'mon...
 
Matthiew
#16
 
Cliffy
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by Ron in Regina View Post

Those are Belugas. You can't fool me. Giving Dolphins a bad name! You should be ashamed!
 
Ron in Regina
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by Cliffy View Post

Those are Belugas. You can't fool me. Giving Dolphins a bad name! You should be ashamed!


Yeah I know Cliffy. I was just try'n to inject some humor as a way to point
out the utter stupidity of racism...and as a way to show that fear or hatred
of anyone based on their ethnicity or nationality is just plain dumb.
 
AnnaG
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by Cliffy View Post

The circle goes round and round. What is it going to take to break the circle of hate? Armageddon? Man, I'm getting tired of waiting for humans to grow up!

Yup, all over the world there are people that belong in institutions for the ignorant, intolerant, and inhuman.
 
Downhome_Woman
#20
I dunno - maybe the people in the courtroom were dumbfounded to see this happen before their eyes - but sorry , responding to a wrong by attacking someone who merely physically represents what you feel is wrong? BIG wrong.
Call me a cockeyed whatever, but I'm not going to attack a woman wearing hijab in order to address the wrongs I feel done to the west by the Muslim countries, I don't thin I should be attacking anyone who hasn't attacked me personally - and even then, I'd rather talk first.
And on another level? Attacking someone for what I FEEL they represent, gives license to all those extremists - the islamists, the aryan nation types, the followers of meir kahan - to do the same. Sorry - won't even giv this guy a 'ok - maybe he had issues' pass ....
 
Cliffy
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by Downhome_Woman View Post

I dunno - maybe the people in the courtroom were dumbfounded to see this happen before their eyes - but sorry , responding to a wrong by attacking someone who merely physically represents what you feel is wrong? BIG wrong.
Call me a cockeyed whatever, but I'm not going to attack a woman wearing hijab in order to address the wrongs I feel done to the west by the Muslim countries, I don't thin I should be attacking anyone who hasn't attacked me personally - and even then, I'd rather talk first.
And on another level? Attacking someone for what I FEEL they represent, gives license to all those extremists - the islamists, the aryan nation types, the followers of meir kahan - to do the same. Sorry - won't even giv this guy a 'ok - maybe he had issues' pass ....

Hi Downhome Woman. Long time no see and I agree with ya.
 
mt_pockets1000
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by Downhome_Woman View Post

I dunno - maybe the people in the courtroom were dumbfounded to see this happen before their eyes - but sorry , responding to a wrong by attacking someone who merely physically represents what you feel is wrong? BIG wrong.
Call me a cockeyed whatever, but I'm not going to attack a woman wearing hijab in order to address the wrongs I feel done to the west by the Muslim countries, I don't thin I should be attacking anyone who hasn't attacked me personally - and even then, I'd rather talk first.
And on another level? Attacking someone for what I FEEL they represent, gives license to all those extremists - the islamists, the aryan nation types, the followers of meir kahan - to do the same. Sorry - won't even giv this guy a 'ok - maybe he had issues' pass ....

Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?
 
AnnaG
#23
The Shadow knows. My Dad has all the episodes and I have the movie disk. Alex Baldwin was a real hottie back then. He's still pretty good-looking.
 
mt_pockets1000
#24
Ha...good stuff. I don't know the story or the characters but I always like that line.
 
AnnaG
#25
Try the movie sometime. It's cool. It's called "The Shadow". IMDB link:

The Shadow (1994)

There was also a neat movie called "Rocketman" modeled after oldtime radio or comics, too. One of the James Bond guys was in it.

Um, I have no idea where you could get copies of the radio show, though.
 
mt_pockets1000
#26
Thanks Anna. Some big names in the show. I'll be sure to check it out.
 
hadhoud
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by Ron in Regina View Post

i am agape
 
EagleSmack
#28
[quote=Matthiew;1117644]

Well at least we know where the noob Mathiew stands on this issue.
 
EagleSmack
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by hadhoud View Post


I am not a forensic scientist but Iíve seen enough Hollywood movies to know that stabbing someone 18 times isnít a task that you get done in 5 or 10 seconds unless youíre the cyborg or a robot sent from the future. 18 times.
How long did it take for people in the courtroom to realize this woman was being stabbed and that someone should do something about it?
18 times.
Seriously, try stabbing the wind 18 times right now as quickly as possible.
Go ahead.
Iíll wait.
See what Iím saying?

What about sawing someones head off with a knife...in front of a camera...posting it on the Inet so everyone can see.

How long does that take?

Hate is hate.
 
YukonJack
#30
How many were beheaded, cut to pieces, hung on bridges for being Jewish or American? Or just for NOT being Muslim?
 

Similar Threads

20
Iraqis killed for wearing shorts
by Kreskin | May 28th, 2006
45
what are you wearing right now
by peapod | Jul 26th, 2005