I want good ol' capitalism to KICK IN to provide CHeaper Internet!


YoungJoonKim
#1
High dollar, high value, high level of people using and using Internet..
What's the matter with the Internet service now days?

Rogers and Sympatico...all together just raised their price by $10 dollar average in all services.
5 years ago, I used Sympatico High Speed service, it was middle.
It costed us around $35 monthly.
Now, it is $49.95 and all for 2 mbps (all total 7 mbps) [megabytes per second] more than 5 years ago.
And another lower packaging cost $35.95 for some crappy speed..1 mbps.

What about Rogers?
They ain't offering any better...they are cheaper* though.
The same service they offer cost $44.95 but this is excluding tax AND rental fee of modem.

Now, I want to talk about the rental fee. I think its ridiculous because we are using their service at a cost and want us to PAY for using the system that has is required for the service?

Its like...saying..."I got you're stick, if you want it, give me 5 candies per month for you're joy [service/connect] and also, 1 extra candy for having that stick [physicalness]."


I am BAFFLED.
With the rental fee of Rogers and Bell's offering price which is so similar to another [maybe you will save 1 buck per month if you use Rogers Express connection in Toronto], there is really competitiveness as in term of...price...but more of which has more efficient connection and better service.

Believe it or not, Internet is a necessity in this new age. It is the part of the fuel for globalization and even socialization of population in Western nations. So then, why are we facing price increase when we are suppose to be receiving FREE Internet access?
Its..its like exploiting people's wealth...
Last edited by YoungJoonKim; Oct 30th, 2007 at 10:03 PM..
 
china
#2
Good Ol' Capitalism dooing well in China..

the internet comes automatically with the telephone line,
the price differs across the provinces the highest being 12.7633 / month.
I have a GPS card on in my laptop ,I use it all over China
The cost......153.141 a year.
Last edited by china; Oct 30th, 2007 at 11:58 PM..
 
Niflmir
#3
In Canada the infrastructure that is used to deliver most forms of internet are owned by a small number of companies. I believe the government forced the telephone companies to rent out their infrastructure to competing companies but they are still able to control the prices they rent at to a certain extent. So ISP's are not necessarily price takers.
 
Avro
#4
I recently switched to Primus from Bell and I pay about 68 bucks tax included for high
speed at 7mps with local calling, unlimited longdistance within Canada and the U.S. and 9 calling features.
 
boiler
#5
You lot over the pond certainly pay through the nose I have just signed with TALK-Talk and get a speed of (up to)8mps unlimited calls for free on my land line all for 20-40p per month, ( which i suppose is about 41 dollars Canadian) now you have actual figures and I can hear the groans from here.
 
#juan
#6
I use Shaw high speed cable as well as Shaw cable TV. I still pay around forty bucks a month for my internet which seems reasonable.

http://cable.webworx.ca/xtreme-I.htm
 
warrior_won
#7
I have a Cogeco digital cable/Internet bundle. The cost of the Internet is about $40 per month plus tax. That's not too shabby for three IP addresses, 10 Megabits per second of bandwidth, seven email addresses, and a 60 Gigabyte per month cap. The service is pretty reliable and I haven't much to complain about. I do get service interuptions from time to time, but they appear to be few and far between, and are usually of short duration.

If Cogeco wanted to lower their price, I wouldn't complain. If they were to raise the price though, I'd look elsewhere or downgrade to their basic internet package.
 
darkbeaver
#8
I have Alliant/sympatico thirty bucks or so for dial up 26kbs max two nights ago mice ate a piece of thier infrastructure the line was dead till thismorning.
 
warrior_won
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by darkbeaver View Post

I have Alliant/sympatico thirty bucks or so for dial up 26kbs max two nights ago mice ate a piece of thier infrastructure the line was dead till thismorning.

You pay thirty bucks a month for dialup? That explains why you can't see your spout.
 
gerryh
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by YoungJoonKim View Post

High dollar, high value, high level of people using and using Internet..
What's the matter with the Internet service now days?

garbage deleted


Believe it or not, Internet is a necessity in this new age. It is the part of the fuel for globalization and even socialization of population in Western nations. So then, why are we facing price increase when we are suppose to be receiving FREE Internet access?
Its..its like exploiting people's wealth...


Captitalism has nothing to do with your rant. What I hilighted in red is your real problem. You expect companies to spend the money on equipment and infrastructer, spend the money on maintaining that infrastructure, and give it all to you for free. Just like your bitch about having to rent the cable/DSL modems. You don't want to pay rental on that equipment, then buy the modem.
 
darkbeaver
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by warrior_won View Post

You pay thirty bucks a month for dialup? That explains why you can't see your spout.

HAHAHAHA it does dosen't it.
 
YoungJoonKim
#12
Quote:

Captitalism has nothing to do with your rant. What I hilighted in red is your real problem. You expect companies to spend the money on equipment and infrastructer, spend the money on maintaining that infrastructure, and give it all to you for free. Just like your bitch about having to rent the cable/DSL modems. You don't want to pay rental on that equipment, then buy the modem.

Rant? I agree, it is rant.

But garbage regarding prices?
I agree that companies do- in fact - require substantial amount of money from public to keep up with their infrastructure.
True enough, I am bi*ching thank you very much.

Quote:

You expect companies to spend the money on equipment and infrastructer

Come back..and re-evaluate..
I do expect them to do "that" [Some cases, they neglect those duties..well, its corporations after all] I expect in the future that Canada will be receive better service with reasonable price* for both poor and middle. Recent increase and change of services both by Bell/ Sympatico and Rogers...seemed to me, exploitative. It becomes more confusing to me when small companies can offer cheaper price and sometimes better service, big companies are neglectant about it.

By the way.." cheaper," not "free."
Last edited by YoungJoonKim; Nov 24th, 2007 at 06:00 PM..
 
gerryh
#13
You stated Free.
 
boiler
#14
Now my suggestion to you guys is, get together and have one supplier that is the cheapest, getting them to include the good bits that others already include at a more expensive price. Remember clients can vote with their feet, and the pen is mightier than the sword
 
YoungJoonKim
#15
as I said..exaggeration. In honest heart, hopefully free
 
DurkaDurka
#16
Broadband in Canada is not as bad as it is made out to be. Compared to the US, we are doing quite well price wise and bandwidth wise. If you live in large urban areas, one can easily obtain broadband connections exceeding 15-16mbps.
 
YoungJoonKim
#17
Quote:

one can easily obtain broadband connections exceeding 15-16mbps.

Also some with 10% of their "suggested" speed [up to]
Or maybe during the peak hours, 5% of their "suggested" speed.
Yes, compared to the U.S. [I don't know yet because I can't get the price..]
This one I article which I just researched--here you go http://www.consumeraffairs.com/inter...pricing.html-- holy cow!
$50 bucks [U.S.] for some 3mbps or am I just seeing some illusion?
[Remembers his old country...$30 bucks..extreme speed..same as T1...wooo...]
Last edited by YoungJoonKim; Nov 25th, 2007 at 11:28 PM..
 
DurkaDurka
#18
Remember, you can have the fastest ADSL connection on the planet, but if the source you are downloading from is congested or has a lower peak connection speed, you will never max your connection out. Your ISP cannot guarantee any speeds outside of their network as it is out of their control.

I know with my 8mbps connection, I can easily saturate that via downloads on NNTP, which proves to me that I am getting what I pay for.
 
warrior_won
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by DurkaDurka View Post


I know with my 8mbps connection, I can easily saturate that via downloads on NNTP, which proves to me that I am getting what I pay for.

NNTP? I didn't think anyone really used UseNet anymore?

You have to remember too, that it's *bits per second, not *bytes per second. So with an 8 Megabit per second connection, the most you can expect is 1 Megabyte per second of transfer speed. But usually a little less due to overhead in the TCP/IP protocol. So somewhere between 800 and 1000 Kilobytes per second of throughput would be what you should expect at the top end for an 8 Megabit broadband connection.

Am I wrong?
 
DurkaDurka
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by warrior_won View Post

NNTP? I didn't think anyone really used UseNet anymore?

You have to remember too, that it's *bits per second, not *bytes per second. So with an 8 Megabit per second connection, the most you can expect is 1 Megabyte per second of transfer speed. But usually a little less due to overhead in the TCP/IP protocol. So somewhere between 800 and 1000 Kilobytes per second of throughput would be what you should expect at the top end for an 8 Megabit broadband connection.

Am I wrong?

NNTP is still very alive and kicking, it is by far the most efficient way to download binary files.

The TCP-IP overhead is negligible for the most part I find.

I regularly download at 750+ kilobytes/second when using NNTP... with torrents I am lucky to get 200 on a good day.
 
boiler
#21
He youse guys don't forget I am a foriegner from over the pond who types at 20wph so don't try and get me confused any more than I am
 
YoungJoonKim
#22
DurkaDurka, if I am right, 8 mbps seems outrageously fast..and if you indeed do receive 750 kilobytes per second on torrents, oh Sam Walton, its real..real deal and lucky, very lucky.
But let's speak the cruelty & changes.
First, I've not seen 8 mbps on the packaging [Total Internet Service] on Bell website. In fact, 7 mbps [100 GB capped + $25.00 if unlimited] is the closest to that...which is $49.95 + tax [Couple years (2) ago, my family got [this] Ultra High Speed Connection for similar cost including tax. 5 mbps and "unlimited bandwidth"<- reason why we changed from 10 mbps Cogeco Pro..and since our town was small and never had so-called "peak-hours", speed was amazing]

And...traffic shaping a.k.a. throttle. Comcast is known for this now. They are SERIOUS about it and put actual restriction on Internet file sharing, including among FRIENDS...
I would like FBI spying over my computer better than that!

P.S. I envy you're speed but sometimes I wonder if it is worth it since most of speedy download is possible through torrents and p2p file sharing programs if there is a lot of seeders and leechers
Last edited by YoungJoonKim; Nov 26th, 2007 at 03:05 PM..
 
jimmoyer
#23
We pay a nominal 9.95 USD for Netzero a month.

But...

We end up using one of the unencrypted wireless from neighbors on the block
and get all the speed we need for videos and file transfers.

Or at one of the coffee houses we use their free hot spots
or at work.

So it's a pretty cheap life. We really could get away with turning off the Net zero account.
And use the internet for free.

I suppose it's dangerous for my laptop eh ?
 
DurkaDurka
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by YoungJoonKim View Post

DurkaDurka, if I am right, 8 mbps seems outrageously fast..and if you indeed do receive 750 kilobytes per second on torrents, oh Sam Walton, its real..real deal and lucky, very lucky.
But let's speak the cruelty & changes.
First, I've not seen 8 mbps on the packaging [Total Internet Service] on Bell website. In fact, 7 mbps [100 GB capped + $25.00 if unlimited] is the closest to that...which is $49.95 + tax [Couple years (2) ago, my family got [this] Ultra High Speed Connection for similar cost including tax. 5 mbps and "unlimited bandwidth"<- reason why we changed from 10 mbps Cogeco Pro..and since our town was small and never had so-called "peak-hours", speed was amazing]

And...traffic shaping a.k.a. throttle. Comcast is known for this now. They are SERIOUS about it and put actual restriction on Internet file sharing, including among FRIENDS...
I would like FBI spying over my computer better than that!

P.S. I envy you're speed but sometimes I wonder if it is worth it since most of speedy download is possible through torrents and p2p file sharing programs if there is a lot of seeders and leechers

I have the Rogers Extreme 8meg, which is fairly reliable for everything but torrents. I never claimed to get uber Torrent speeds, what I was referring to is NNTP (network news transfer protocol), which is ancient, but it allows people to post binary files, ie Music, Movies, Apps etc.

If torrents are your thing, you will need to go with a smaller ISP, pretty much all of the major ISP's have bandwidth or traffic shaping policies or combinations of both.
 
DurkaDurka
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by jimmoyer View Post

We pay a nominal 9.95 USD for Netzero a month.

But...

We end up using one of the unencrypted wireless from neighbors on the block
and get all the speed we need for videos and file transfers.

Or at one of the coffee houses we use their free hot spots
or at work.

So it's a pretty cheap life. We really could get away with turning off the Net zero account.
And use the internet for free.

I suppose it's dangerous for my laptop eh ?

It's not particularly dangerous as long as you have a firewall and antivirus. It would be more dangerous for your neighbour with the open wireless though... if he has File Sharing enabled, you could easily rip off anything he has shared or other mischievous pranks.
 
warrior_won
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by DurkaDurka View Post

NNTP is still very alive and kicking, it is by far the most efficient way to download binary files.

I used to grab all sorts of stuff from UseNet back in the mid to late nineties. Back then, I was using an old 68040 based Macintosh computer and an application called MacSOUP to just download the messages automatically. Most of my old warez came from NNTP.

What really annoyed me about NNTP were the binaries that were broken up into 30, 50, or more pieces. You had to get every single piece before you could UUdecode them and get the binary. And it was quite frequently the case that you'd get all but two or three pieces that you needed. That was really frustrating.

Eventually I discovered Hotline and gave up on NNTP.
 
DurkaDurka
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by warrior_won View Post

I used to grab all sorts of stuff from UseNet back in the mid to late nineties. Back then, I was using an old 68040 based Macintosh computer and an application called MacSOUP to just download the messages automatically. Most of my old warez came from NNTP.

What really annoyed me about NNTP were the binaries that were broken up into 30, 50, or more pieces. You had to get every single piece before you could UUdecode them and get the binary. And it was quite frequently the case that you'd get all but two or three pieces that you needed. That was really frustrating.

Eventually I discovered Hotline and gave up on NNTP.

Most nntp programs will combine the files as they download, saving you from having to compile them. I remember using hotline back in the early 2000's, haven't seen that program in years now.
 
YoungJoonKim
#28
Quote:

what I was referring to is NNTP (network news transfer protocol),

Yup, I think I kinda knew that Knowing its a cable, it makes sense hehe.
 
warrior_won
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by DurkaDurka View Post

Most nntp programs will combine the files as they download, saving you from having to compile them. I remember using hotline back in the early 2000's, haven't seen that program in years now.

I'm talking about a time when software wouldn't do that. I mean, before Internet Explorer and Outlook Express were even released. At that time, your only browser options were Netscape and NCSA Mosaic.

Back then, it was a royal pain in the butt to manually grab stuff from NNTP so you just grabbed everything. You then used another application to go through the message spool and extract the binaries. You never knew what you were getting. It was like a box of chocolates as Forrest Gump might say.
 
DurkaDurka
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by warrior_won View Post

I'm talking about a time when software wouldn't do that. I mean, before Internet Explorer and Outlook Express were even released. At that time, your only browser options were Netscape and NCSA Mosaic.

Back then, it was a royal pain in the butt to manually grab stuff from NNTP so you just grabbed everything. You then used another application to go through the message spool and extract the binaries. You never knew what you were getting. It was like a box of chocolates as Forrest Gump might say.

I know of the era you are talking about, I wasn't much into nntp at that point... I remember with netscape having to manually add in "http://" for any site I would visit, thems was the days lol
 

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