Russia Prepared To Fight War Over Ukraine, Senior Government Official Admits


MHz
#31
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

2002 – Bolivia (Morales; leftist/MAS): success (SE)

Good news, you can fade into Bolivia and oblivion all at once. Giddy up gaucho.

Actually Bolivia got rid of the US installed death squads, that is why they are not in the news much anymore, you raelly should keep up to date on this stuff. Oh I forgot, you like to look stupid to the world

(in part)
News that Lozada's government was selling off the country's one great prospect for wealth, its recently discovered gas reserves, to multinationals brought the ferment to a head in October 2003. What began as spasmodic agitation suddenly erupted into mass strikes and confrontations after the police shot down scores of protesters marching towards La Paz. It was then that El Alto became the centre of the movement. It was then too that the miners rediscovered their old traditions and their old militancy by marching with gelignite in clenched fists to join the masses in the capital.

The spontaneous October rising caused President Lozada to flee the country in a helicopter (the third Latin American president to do so in three years). But there was neither the consciousness nor the organisation among the hundreds of thousands of protesters in La Paz and El Alto to determine who replaced him. His deputy, Mesa, took his place in the presidential palace, the mass of demonstrators departed believing they had won a great victory and the neo-liberal policies continued as before. The next day delegate after delegate at an expanded meeting of the COB union lamented the fact that they had not been able to raise the question of a workers' and peasants' government.

As is often the case in revolutionary upheavals, the first successful uprising was followed by a period of precarious stability. There were attempts to divert popular anger into a nationalist agitation against Chile, which had annexed Bolivia's coastal region and blocked its access to the sea more than a century before. Mesa held a referendum over the gas issue and managed to get away with phrasing the issue in such a way as to get a majority. Attempts at new mobilisations never seemed to get the head of steam to repeat the October events.

The Bolivian Uprising
 
EagleSmack
+1
#32
MHz loves totalitarian regimes.
 
coldstream
+1
#33
All of the Ukraine runs on Russian Oil. All they have to do is turn off the spigots on the Pipelines and Ukraine freezes in the dark.

About half of the Ukraine is atleast partly ethnic Russian.. within a couple of generations or so.. which is what derailed the 'Orange Revolution' of 10 years ago in its attempt to reinvent the country as a 'Western' European nation.

It's what will de-rail it again. At most half of the country was represented on the streets of Kiev. If there is a war.. it will be a Civil War.. with the old Cold War alliances as provisioners and spectators only. The further East you go, the more slavic, orthodox and oriental the population.. and the more they are in the Russian sphere.

It's best hope is to develop a sovereign identity consisting of all constituencies, unique to itself.. and forge ties both ways. Joining the EU (which is in economic decline and political crisis anyway) or Nato is pure fantasy. It's just not going to happen.
Last edited by coldstream; Feb 25th, 2014 at 02:32 PM..
 
MHz
#34
WOW, did the Pope just tell the 'Christians' to create a civil war?? Those ****ers never quit. They could give them the money and take it out of Sunday donations. I doubt they would have a problem with that, .. right?
Ukraine Religious Leader Voices Civil War Fears — Naharnet

The main cleric in Ukraine's Greek Catholic Church on Tuesday warned about the risks of civil war and separatism in his homeland during a visit to Rome.
The Major Archbishop of Kyiv-Halych, Sviatoslav Shevchuk, also appealed for the European Union to offer "economic aid and above all diplomatic support".
The risk of civil war "comes from abroad because when you cannot eat the whole cake, you eat just a slice," the clergyman said, in an apparent reference to Russia.
 
MHz
#35
(in part)
Russian military vehicles have been photographed in the main square of Sevastopol, and there are fears that Ukraine is about to plunge into a very bloody civil war. The pro-Russian eastern half of Ukraine is in a state of shock, and many living there are openly calling on Russia to militarily intervene to protect them against the protest groups that have seized power in Kiev. Down in the Crimea, where approximately 60 percent of the population is ethnically Russian, militia groups have formed to protect their region from the “fascist scum running around in Kiev with swastikas“. That quote is from a recent Time Magazine article, and it demonstrates the extreme level of tension that exists between the two halves of Ukraine right now. Perhaps a peaceful resolution can still be achieved, but at the moment a civil war seems quite likely. And if war does erupt, the truth is that it is going to be exceedingly difficult for Russia to stay out of it.
And Russia is not just sitting back and waiting to see what will happen. They are actively moving military forces into position for a potential conflict. Just check out this excerpt from an International Business Times article entitled “Russian Ships Arrive On Ukraine’s Crimean Coast As Fears Mount Over Russian Invasion In the Region“…
According to Russian news site flot.com, Russian military ships carrying soldiers have arrived on Ukraine’s Crimean coastin what some are claiming could be the early signs of a Russian coup in the hotly disputed autonomous region of the Crimea.
Read more at Russian Troops Take Up Positions In Sevastopol As Ukraine Teeters On The Brink Of Civil War | InvestmentWatch

I assume this is their standard SUV.
At least this riot-tank won't tear up the pavement. That is a sniper rifle (20mm ???)on top, what range do you think it has and is it optically guided from deep inside the vehicle?


PressTV - US 'supports neo-Nazis' group Svoboda in Ukraine: Investigative journalist
US investigative journalist Wayne Madsen says American officials complimented the opposition party of Svoboda in Ukraine that is a “neo-Nazis organization.”

“The American government supports neo-Nazis, but I just find it absolutely ironic that those who are neoconservative and pro-Israel are also supporting neo-Nazis who made a large portion of Ukrainian illegal government,” he told Press TV on Tuesday.
The most controversial element of the anti-government alliance in Ukraine is Svoboda.
The group is an extreme right-wing political party that not only has representation in parliament, but has been dubbed by its critics as a neo-Nazi organization.
During a press conference on Monday, White House press secretary Jay Carney refused questions about whom Washington recognized as the leader of Ukraine.

Last edited by MHz; Feb 26th, 2014 at 10:00 AM..
 
Locutus
#36
Allah ackbar and cream of tatar

'Allahu Akbar' 'Ukraine is not Russia'

Violence breaks out on streets of Crimea as 10,000 Muslim supporters of Ukraine's new government clash with smaller pro-Russian group

Vladimir Putin 'orders immediate test of Russian troops' combat readiness' | Mail Online
 
EagleSmack
+2
#37
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Read more at Russian Troops Take Up Positions In Sevastopol As Ukraine Teeters On The Brink Of Civil War | InvestmentWatch

I assume this is their standard SUV.
At least this riot-tank won't tear up the pavement. That is a sniper rifle on top, what range do you think it has and is it optically guided from deep inside the vehicle?



That is the standard Russian Sports Utility Vehicle? You're such a retard.

It is an APC... Armored Personnel Carrier... one of their many BTR variants.

That is NOT a sniper rifle. It is a machine gun... most likely a 14.5mm.

You don't know a damned thing do you?
 
petros
#38
Quote: Originally Posted by EagleSmack View Post


That is the standard Russian Sports Utility Vehicle? You're such a retard.

It is an APC... Armored Personnel Carrier... one of their many BTR variants.

That is NOT a sniper rifle. It is a machine gun... most likely a 14.5mm.

You don't know a damned thing do you?

“Corsar” light portable antitank missile system
 
Locutus
#39
Just a machine gun and amphibious air intake.
 
MHz
+1
#40
Quote: Originally Posted by EagleSmack View Post

That is the standard Russian Sports Utility Vehicle? You're such a retard.

It is an APC... Armored Personnel Carrier... one of their many BTR variants.

That is NOT a sniper rifle. It is a machine gun... most likely a 14.5mm.

You don't know a damned thing do you?

Just for the ones sent to put down an insurrection. With the slopy front end does that mean the (3) operators face backwards, make it a seat with a ejection system and you get out when the hull is broken in combat. Small ammo means many shots and storage is small and very protected. Better than the torch a tank is when it carries the big shells. Not saying they have this but wouldn't the machine gunner want an 'up periscope' option when you are entering hostile territory that scans the area with lots of sensors so that any shots fired are traceable and retaliation fire is only seconds away. Being Russian they probably know that when a body falls a certain way then the projectile came from a certain direction. and that area can be scoured for lifeforms. (rather than todays tanks that rely on being able to take a hit and keep moving) I'm also thinking they have various attachments like dozers and sweepers and detectors that can help on the number of 'flats' they get while on duty.
Once it has all the reactive armor on I'll bet it can pull more than a tank of the same size. If those middle wheels are actually inthe middle there should be back steering and then it could spin on a dime rather than needing a 3-point turn at least.

What else is there, oh yeah, if one rolls up to a disruptive gathering it means the gathering has just ended and the ones there should scatter in all 360 degrees, that about sums it up.

Literally they will be escorted into certain exits and name rank and serializing will take place when you just became a Russian Sitizen till you leave the area, that also means you are expected to obey Russian Laws

Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

“Corsar” light portable antitank missile system

With the SUV version does it come in a 6-pak? (and reloads are fast and easy once those are gone because there is another 6 on the other side on the machine and since all 6 in the group carry the same stuff that is 72 he rounds that are sighted in from launch to target including direction corrected in the last 10% of the flight via forward sensors via GPS or laser or whatever so each shell is a direct hit and the crew is only taking up station and Headquarters has all the video feeds from all the ones in the area and 64 targets can be targeted at once without drones being counted.

I hear they also make smaller ones that can be left on 'auto fire' once a 'victim' is selected by computer or HQ, probably just a rumor.

Quote: Originally Posted by Locutus View Post

Just a machine gun and amphibious air intake.

No 1080 screens?? How barbaric.

Lets hope they adapt better 'in the field attachments' than the Syrian Rebel Armored Car



BTW you all missed the Pope and his statement about civil war and wanting the whole cake or none. (also pretending to be so broke they can't help the 'Christians" in the area.

What is the range of a 14.5mm sniper round that has a scope sighting capability" 2Miles? and 6 in a row before vehicle shake is an issue, meaning deploy hydraulic rams that also helps in tire changing.
Last edited by MHz; Feb 26th, 2014 at 03:12 PM..
 
EagleSmack
+1
#41
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Just for the ones sent to put down an insurrection. With the slopy front end does that mean the (3) operators face backwards, make it a seat with a ejection system and you get out when the hull is broken in combat. Small ammo means many shots and storage is small and very protected. Better than the torch a tank is when it carries the big shells. Not saying they have this but wouldn't the machine gunner want an 'up periscope' option when you are entering hostile territory that scans the area with lots of sensors so that any shots fired are traceable and retaliation fire is only seconds away. Being Russian they probably know that when a body falls a certain way then the projectile came from a certain direction. and that area can be scoured for lifeforms. (rather than todays tanks that rely on being able to take a hit and keep moving) I'm also thinking they have various attachments like dozers and sweepers and detectors that can help on the number of 'flats' they get while on duty.
Once it has all the reactive armor on I'll bet it can pull more than a tank of the same size. If those middle wheels are actually inthe middle there should be back steering and then it could spin on a dime rather than needing a 3-point turn at least.

What else is there, oh yeah, if one rolls up to a disruptive gathering it means the gathering has just ended and the ones there should scatter in all 360 degrees, that about sums it up.

Literally they will be escorted into certain exits and name rank and serializing will take place when you just became a Russian Sitizen till you leave the area, that also means you are expected to obey Russian Laws

Well if you can't get us with facts I guess you will try to dazzle us with idiocy.


Quote:

With the SUV version does it come in a 6-pak? (and reloads are fast and easy once those are gone because there is another 6 on the other side on the machine and since all 6 in the group carry the same stuff that is 72 he rounds that are sighted in from launch to target including direction corrected in the last 10% of the flight via forward sensors via GPS or laser or whatever so each shell is a direct hit and the crew is only taking up station and Headquarters has all the video feeds from all the ones in the area and 64 targets can be targeted at once without drones being counted.

I hear they also make smaller ones that can be left on 'auto fire' once a 'victim' is selected by computer or HQ, probably just a rumor.

SUV... Sports Utility Vehicle!

This is a SUV...



This is an APC... a Russian BTR variant.










Quote:

Lets hope they adapt better 'in the field attachments' than the Syrian Rebel Armored Car

They are the same ones.

You don't know a thing.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#42
14.5 mm sniper round would be about 2 miles for the round - 100 feet for the sniper
 
taxslave
Free Thinker
+1
#43
Quote: Originally Posted by EagleSmack View Post



That is the standard Russian Sports Utility Vehicle? You're such a retard.

It is an APC... Armored Personnel Carrier... one of their many BTR variants.

That is NOT a sniper rifle. It is a machine gun... most likely a 14.5mm.

You don't know a damned thing do you?

Which he loudly and proudly displays every day.
 
EagleSmack
+1
#44
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslave View Post

Which he loudly and proudly displays every day.

Geez... his is so far out in left field in all this. THEN he compounds it by building on his outlandish posts with even more strange, bizarre, and lengthy posts.
 
Locutus
+1
#45
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Just for the ones sent to put down an insurrection. With the slopy front end does that mean the (3) operators face backwards, make it a seat with a ejection system and you get out when the hull is broken in combat. Small ammo means many shots and storage is small and very protected. Better than the torch a tank is when it carries the big shells. Not saying they have this but wouldn't the machine gunner want an 'up periscope' option when you are entering hostile territory that scans the area with lots of sensors so that any shots fired are traceable and retaliation fire is only seconds away. Being Russian they probably know that when a body falls a certain way then the projectile came from a certain direction. and that area can be scoured for lifeforms. (rather than todays tanks that rely on being able to take a hit and keep moving) I'm also thinking they have various attachments like dozers and sweepers and detectors that can help on the number of 'flats' they get while on duty.
Once it has all the reactive armor on I'll bet it can pull more than a tank of the same size. If those middle wheels are actually inthe middle there should be back steering and then it could spin on a dime rather than needing a 3-point turn at least.

What else is there, oh yeah, if one rolls up to a disruptive gathering it means the gathering has just ended and the ones there should scatter in all 360 degrees, that about sums it up.

Literally they will be escorted into certain exits and name rank and serializing will take place when you just became a Russian Sitizen till you leave the area, that also means you are expected to obey Russian Laws


With the SUV version does it come in a 6-pak? (and reloads are fast and easy once those are gone because there is another 6 on the other side on the machine and since all 6 in the group carry the same stuff that is 72 he rounds that are sighted in from launch to target including direction corrected in the last 10% of the flight via forward sensors via GPS or laser or whatever so each shell is a direct hit and the crew is only taking up station and Headquarters has all the video feeds from all the ones in the area and 64 targets can be targeted at once without drones being counted.

I hear they also make smaller ones that can be left on 'auto fire' once a 'victim' is selected by computer or HQ, probably just a rumor.


No 1080 screens?? How barbaric.

Lets hope they adapt better 'in the field attachments' than the Syrian Rebel Armored Car



BTW you all missed the Pope and his statement about civil war and wanting the whole cake or none. (also pretending to be so broke they can't help the 'Christians" in the area.

What is the range of a 14.5mm sniper round that has a scope sighting capability" 2Miles? and 6 in a row before vehicle shake is an issue, meaning deploy hydraulic rams that also helps in tire changing.


Your imaginary vehicle is the SPV sir.

 
MHz
#46
Quote: Originally Posted by EagleSmack View Post

Well if you can't get us with facts I guess you will try to dazzle us with idiocy..

You understood every word didn't you? What better place than here and on this type of thread?



Quote: Originally Posted by EagleSmack View Post

SUV... Sports Utility Vehicle!

This is a SUV...



This is an APC... a Russian BTR variant.












They are the same ones.

You don't know a thing.

When going to a violent event I choose the green one. 8 wheels would be center steering also wouldn't it. How many troops 20 with their goodies? That would mean you would need 10 for troops, 1 for a kitchen, 2 for bulk fuel and 4 for food and ammo, and a park to stage in. If Crimea was a financial district it would be the Russian version of the occupy movement. (by invitation)

Quote: Originally Posted by Locutus View Post

Your imaginary vehicle is the SPV sir.

Even got the color right.
Surely they must be some seal accessories for it so they can range from mobile command to being the front-line weapons controlled either on their own or from a base command as part of a large operation.

They have probably also heard of drones but I have yet to see any pics of theirs, hint, hint.
 
Zipperfish
No Party Affiliation
+1
#47
Quote: Originally Posted by Colpy View Post

That is a lovely speech.............now, what do you think we should do if Putin's boys invade Ukraine and proceed to shoot everyone they don't like??

Suddenly it all falls apart, doesn't it??

This is what happens when you have a spineless moron for President in the USA. Russia thinks she can get away with anything.

Move to Russia. Problem solved.
 
MHz
#48
Actually it is only the, wait for it, US supported side that is saying they reserve the right to shoot anybody they want, go figure
 
Tecumsehsbones
+1
#49
Quote: Originally Posted by Zipperfish View Post

Move to Russia. Problem solved.

Maybe we could get another "Bring it on" president who would start pointless wars to show what a hard man he is.
 
MHz
#50
Who was the last one?
 
Tecumsehsbones
+1
#51
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

Who was the last one?

Whoever the voices in your head tell you, dear.
 
EagleSmack
#52
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

You understood every word didn't you?

I understand that you know nothing about any of this.

Quote:

What better place than here and on this type of thread?

You see...this doesn't even make sense.




Quote:

When going to a violent event I choose the green one. 8 wheels would be center steering also wouldn't it. How many troops 20 with their goodies? That would mean you would need 10 for troops, 1 for a kitchen, 2 for bulk fuel and 4 for food and ammo, and a park to stage in. If Crimea was a financial district it would be the Russian version of the occupy movement. (by invitation)


Even got the color right.
Surely they must be some seal accessories for it so they can range from mobile command to being the front-line weapons controlled either on their own or from a base command as part of a large operation.

 
MHz
#53
That varies with the subject and how much printed material has passed before my peepers. Oddly enough the more there is the easier the narrowing things down gets.
The ringing (in my ears) is good ideas being rejected some of the time so it isn't a race in that speed is the winner.

You can race up and down the trunk of a mustard tree but unless you have been to the ends of all the branches you don't know how one differs from another when you find a group of them.

Welcome to a FEMA Kamp (open air) coming to a county near you in TheNotToDistantFuture.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1A5DftXzIqs

I need you report this one to your handlers, you know like in the 'memo'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lf7lln_siXE
Last edited by MHz; Feb 26th, 2014 at 04:55 PM..
 
MHz
#54
(Reuters) - Days after his ally Viktor Yanukovich was ousted as Ukraine's leader, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered a 150,000 troop Russian military exercise on Ukraine's border. The fall of Yanukovich - and Putin's potential response to it - has reignited a debate in Washington on how to respond to the assertive Russian leader.
For Obama administration officials, Vladimir Putin is a concern but not a threat. Any talk of renewed Cold War-like Russian-American rivalry, they say, is reckless and counterproductive.
"This is a world where we need to work with the Russians," a senior State Department official said on Tuesday. "This not about the United States versus Russia."
For Republicans, Mitt Romney's 2012 campaign declaration that Moscow was Washington's "number one geopolitical foe" is being proven correct. Now is the time, they say, to confront Putin.
"Romney's analysis of the Russian threat was actually spot on," said Nile Gardiner, a senior fellow at the Heritage Foundation and former Romney adviser. "That has been demonstrated amply over Ukraine, Syria and Russia as well."
Experts say Putin is still determined to include Ukraine in Russia's self-declared "sphere of influence." And he will continue to re-assert Moscow's place on the world stage by obstructing American diplomatic efforts in Syria, Iran and other countries.


Yahoo News Canada - Latest News & Headlines
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
+2
#55
Funny how these experts never have names....
 
Goober
Free Thinker
#56
Quote: Originally Posted by MHz View Post

(Reuters) - Days after his ally Viktor Yanukovich was ousted as Ukraine's leader, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered a 150,000 troop Russian military exercise on Ukraine's border. The fall of Yanukovich - and Putin's potential response to it - has reignited a debate in Washington on how to respond to the assertive Russian leader.
For Obama administration officials, Vladimir Putin is a concern but not a threat. Any talk of renewed Cold War-like Russian-American rivalry, they say, is reckless and counterproductive.
"This is a world where we need to work with the Russians," a senior State Department official said on Tuesday. "This not about the United States versus Russia."
For Republicans, Mitt Romney's 2012 campaign declaration that Moscow was Washington's "number one geopolitical foe" is being proven correct. Now is the time, they say, to confront Putin.
"Romney's analysis of the Russian threat was actually spot on," said Nile Gardiner, a senior fellow at the Heritage Foundation and former Romney adviser. "That has been demonstrated amply over Ukraine, Syria and Russia as well."
Experts say Putin is still determined to include Ukraine in Russia's self-declared "sphere of influence." And he will continue to re-assert Moscow's place on the world stage by obstructing American diplomatic efforts in Syria, Iran and other countries.


Yahoo News Canada - Latest News & Headlines

If the Ukraine signs with the EU, this weakens Putin.
 
petros
#57
Ukraine isn't unarmed this time. They even have the high ground of space.
 
Goober
Free Thinker
#58
Quote: Originally Posted by petros View Post

Ukraine isn't unarmed this time. They even have the high ground of space.

I read somewhere the new Govt passed a law stating that the Ukraine has one Official Language. Really good way to reach out to those on the other side.
FFn dumb move, pandering, when inclusive leadership is needed.
 
MHz
#59
Should be an interesting campaign.
Does Egypt set the example, a new government twice a year whether they want it or not?
60% of Crimea is Russian so you can be pretty sure it is going to be as valuable is Bahrain is to Saudis and the the US, only the tanks this time are to protect the majority. The rest of the Ukraine can join NATO and even have patriots installed as part of the deal for the 'loans'. There was one headline I saw where the gas import from Russia was cut to about 30 from 150 units. (the released product was simply shipped to a different nation rather than hurting Russian exports)

Quote: Originally Posted by Goober View Post

I read somewhere the new Govt passed a law stating that the Ukraine has one Official Language. Really good way to reach out to those on the other side.
FFn dumb move, pandering, when inclusive leadership is needed.

Forked tounge if the west is running things
 
Locutus
#60
Knowitallbetting.com

Russia -180
Ukraine +445

Putin is as a huge favorite no matter what the prefight hype and weigh-in drama shows.
 

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