#metoo

Mowich

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Christie Blatchford: Unlike Canada, U.K. has learned sex assault 'victims' aren't always victims

Hooray for Cressida Dick, the commissioner of the Metropolitan Police in London, who has formally led her force in abandoning its policy of automatically believing victims of sexual assault.

As The Times of London reported Monday, since taking over the Met about a year ago, Dick has told her officers that of course they are to keep an open mind, treat complainants with respect and dignity and “we should listen to them. We should record what they say.”

But, Dick said, “From that moment on, we are investigators.”

What seems so elementary — that the first job of police isn’t to “support” victims or anyone else, but rather to investigate complaints — got lost in 2014, when the notional acceptance of victims as inherently “being truthful” went to a flat-out recommendation that “The presumption that a victim should always be believed should be institutionalized.”

This “we believe” mindset was in part responsible for the Operation Midland scandal, which saw a number of prominent men ruined (though never criminally charged) by allegations they were involved in a VIP pedophile ring, all on the say-so of a single alleged victim known as “Nick.”

That was the finding of a report into Operation Midland by retired high court judge Sir Richard Henriques, who found that the presumption of innocence was “set aside” by detectives in their eagerness, and what they felt was their duty, to believe Nick.

Henriques said this protocol of automatically believing victims “perverts our system of justice, strikes at the very core of the criminal justice process, will generate miscarriages of justice on a considerable scale,” and should be scrapped. And scrapped, thanks to Dick, it has been.

Henriques went even further, and rued the use of the word “victim” in U.K. legislation and said, “since the investigative process is similarly engaged in ascertaining facts which will, if proven, establish guilt, the use of the word ‘victim’ at the commencement of an investigation is simply inaccurate and should cease.”

Interestingly, there was another development Monday in U.K. justice, with the director of public prosecutions, Alison Saunders, reported to be stepping down when her five-year contract ends next fall.

The announcement of her resignation came after several recent rape trials collapsed when prosecutors apparently failed to disclose evidence — much of it text messages — to the defence, as they’re obliged to do, just as Canadian prosecutors are. The Crown Prosecution Service is now reviewing all current rape cases.

In Canada, meantime, the pendulum continues to swing the other way.

Despite huge pushback from defence lawyers and legal organizations, Bill C-51 is almost but not quite law — having passed in the House and on its way to second reading in the Senate.

It’s this bill, colloquially known as the new Ghomeshi rules, which expands the definition of sexual activity to include communications made “for a sexual purpose or whose content is of a sexual nature.”

As the Canadian Bar Association said in a letter to the justice committee which, last fall, was studying the bill, the amendments mean that “an accused with records that could impeach complainants or witnesses” can’t use those records unless they first get a judge’s OK.

It was precisely this sort of communication — emails from the complainants to the accused — that was used so effectively in cross-examination by Ghomeshi’s main lawyer, Marie Henein.

What these messages showed in the case of all three complainants was that despite their testimony in court that after their alleged attacks they were so traumatized and wary they never saw Ghomeshi again except in public, they had all either tried to (in one instance) and/or actually done so.

In one instance, the complainant forgot to disclose to police or prosecutors that she’d had dinner, post-alleged attack, with Ghomeshi, taken him home in a cab and given him a hand job and, in the other, the complainant had actively courted him for about a year after the purported assault, once telling him she had wanted to “—- your brains out” on the very night of the alleged assault.

In other words, the messages revealed that there were great gaps between what the complainants told the judge (and before him, police and prosecutors) and their private messages to Ghomeshi.

As Ottawa lawyer Michael Spratt wrote for Canadian Lawyer magazine last year, as C-51 was introduced, and this was about 15 months after Ghomeshi was acquitted, “People did not like that.

“So now, if the defence has a record that shows the complainant is lying or misrepresenting the evidence, that record must be disclosed in advance.

“A lawyer is then appointed for the complainant, who is granted standing to argue for suppression of the defence evidence.

“In other words, the legislation will tip off a liar that records exist exposing their lie and then gives them a chance to come up with an explanation.”

Worth noting is that at the time Ghomeshi was charged, the Toronto Police sex crimes unit was headed by a woman, Insp. Joanna Beaven-Desjardins, who deeply believed all complainants from the get-go.

As she put it at a press conference announcing that three (later discredited) women had come forward with allegations against Ghomeshi, “We believe victims when they come in, 100 per cent. We are behind them 100 per cent … We believe them right from the onset.”

“We” were on the wrong track.

It was, for the record, a lousy investigation, the complainants only minimally and tepidly questioned, and never challenged, of course, lest they have felt disrespected or, God forbid, disbelieved.

Christie Blatchford: Unlike Canada, U.K. has learned sex assault ‘victims’ aren’t always victims | National Post
 

White_Unifier

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So if a woman accuses a man of sexually assaulting her and he counter-accuses her of having sexually assaulted him, do the Ghomeshi rules apply to both?
 

Mowich

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So if a woman accuses a man of sexually assaulting her and he counter-accuses her of having sexually assaulted him, do the Ghomeshi rules apply to both?

Hmmn.........interesting question WU. I have no idea. However, considering our current excuse for a government appears bent on changing the rules to benefit women - victim or not - I doubt it.
 

White_Unifier

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Hmmn.........interesting question WU. I have no idea. However, considering our current excuse for a government appears bent on changing the rules to benefit women - victim or not - I doubt it.

That's an important question since I remember reading something like that from the US a few years ago. The woman accused the man of having sexually assaulted her and he turned around to say that no, not only did he not sexually assault her but that she in fact had sexually assaulted him. I don't know how that case turned out, but I'm sure you can see how 'rape shield' laws can get really muddy in such a scenario.
 

Mowich

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That's an important question since I remember reading something like that from the US a few years ago. The woman accused the man of having sexually assaulted her and he turned around to say that no, not only did he not sexually assault her but that she in fact had sexually assaulted him. I don't know how that case turned out, but I'm sure you can see how 'rape shield' laws can get really muddy in such a scenario.

Expect they will get a whole hell of a lot 'muddier' here in Canada, WU.
 

White_Unifier

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Expect they will get a whole hell of a lot 'muddier' here in Canada, WU.

Well if we follow rape shield laws to their logical conclusion, then if A accuses B of having sexually assaulted A and B not only denies this but then counter-accuses A of having sexually assaulted B, then technically both should be protected from rape shield laws. Then if the judge can't ask either party too many questions, then how is he to get to the bottom of it?

Worse yet, I can definitely see a lawyer using rape shield laws themselves as a defense. For example, A rapes B and then accuses B of raping A. B counters in his defense that A raped him and then accused him of raping her as a way to benefit from rape shield laws as a preemptive tactic in case he made a criminal complaint against her.

All fine up to that point. But what happens if B in fact did rape A, A makes a criminal complaint, and B then says that A raped him and then made the complaint as a pre-emptive tactic for protection against rape shield laws. Suddenly the judge starts to have doubts about whether A might really have raped B and then had a legal motive to accuse B. Suddenly, rape shield laws backfire against the very person they were to protect.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Hmmn.........interesting question WU. I have no idea. However, considering our current excuse for a government appears bent on changing the rules to benefit women - victim or not - I doubt it.

That's OK, Robin Camp stands foursquare for blaming the victim.

Reminds me of a time in Boston a while back. A man shot his wife to death in the car, then shot himself in the leg, and told the cops "A black man did it."

The Boston cops rousted 5000 black men before somebody thought to check his story.

So, no, it's not just female victims of sexual assault who enjoy the presumption of truthfulness.
 

White_Unifier

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That's OK, Robin Camp stands foursquare for blaming the victim.

Reminds me of a time in Boston a while back. A man shot his wife to death in the car, then shot himself in the leg, and told the cops "A black man did it."

The Boston cops rousted 5000 black men before somebody thought to check his story.

So, no, it's not just female victims of sexual assault who enjoy the presumption of truthfulness.

Hey, you're a lawyer. So, if A rapes B and then accuses A of raping B, and B not only denies the accusation but then counter-accuses A of raping B, do rape shield laws apply to both? How does that work?
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Hey, you're a lawyer. So, if A rapes B and then accuses A of raping B, and B not only denies the accusation but then counter-accuses A of raping B, do rape shield laws apply to both? How does that work?

Rape shield laws apply only at trial, and they vary state by state. If you want a full summary, it'll cost you $850 an hour.

The short answer is the rape shield laws would only apply in the trial where one was the accused and the other the victim. That's free.

Odd things I encountered on the internet.


Is everyone aware that the # symbol actually means "pound"?


So the line added to tweets that looks like this: #metoo should correctly be read as "Pound Me Too"


I do not think that is what they had in mind.



LOL

.

It doesn't "actually mean 'pound'". Some countries and groups use it to mean pound. Others use it to mean "numbers."

The British call it "hash," as in "Enter your number and press 'hash'."

Presumably that's where the term "hashtag" came from.

The British also call the "slant" or "slash" mark (/) the "stroke." As in "My birthdate is 02 stroke 02 stroke 1977."
 

Mowich

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Not an auspicious start for the Weinstein trial.

"Disgraced Hollywood producer Harvey Weinstein has asked a New York judge to dismiss multiple sexual assault charges against him, according to a motion filed Friday by his attorney.

In the 159-page motion, Weinstein's lawyer Benjamin Brafman argues that the Manhattan district attorney withheld “exculpatory evidence” from a grand jury that indicted the movie mogul, who faces six charges, including rape in the first and third degrees. The motion cites “more than 400 warm, complimentary and solicitous” emails between Weinstein and an unnamed woman accusing him of raping her in 2013.

According to the court filing court filing, the emails were sent between April 2013 and February 2017, a period that followed the alleged rape. The motion includes dozens of emails, including one allegedly sent on February 8, 2017, in which the unnamed woman tells Weinstein, “I love you, always do. But I hate feeling like a booty call.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...nsensual-relationship/?utm_term=.3a9f69f82cb2
 

Blackleaf

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Is everyone aware that the # symbol actually means "pound"?

Not in the United Kingdon. In the United Kingdom it never used to denote pounds. Here, the symbol for the pound sterling currency is £ and the symbol for the pound weight is lb or lbs.

It does mean "number" in the UK, but not as commonly as in America.
 

spaminator

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Tribunal rules against Canadian woman in Scottish harassment case
Canadian Press
Published:
August 16, 2018
Updated:
August 16, 2018 1:10 PM EDT
DeeAnn Fitzpatrick is seen, in an handout image, during an alleged incident where her coworkers taped her to a chair for complaining about harassment in the office.HO / The Canadian Press
ST. JOHN’S, N.L. — The family of a Newfoundland-born woman who alleges she suffered a decade of harassment at her civil service office in Scotland — including once being taped to a chair — say they are disappointed that a tribunal has ruled against her claim.
The BBC reports the Scottish Employment Tribunal ruled against DeeAnn Fitzpatrick’s complaints of a racist and misogynistic workplace culture.
A statement from her family says they are “hugely disappointed” by the result, although they are not surprised, given a judge had decided some evidence would not be allowed.
The family says the tribunal did however highlight that the human resources department could have been more proactive in dealing with the matter by launching an investigation, questioning staff and reminding staff that such matters might be regarded as grounds for disciplinary action.
Fitzpatrick, a fisheries officer originally from Bell Island, N.L., claims co-workers mocked her for having a miscarriage, used racist language, and threatened female staff members.
A photo published by the BBC in May showed Fitzpatrick taped to a chair with tape over her mouth — an incident she claims was a response from two male co-workers at Marine Scotland’s office in Scrabster for “1/8speaking3/8 out against the boys.”
The image prompted an outcry in the U.K. — Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said she was “absolutely horrified” by the photo, and ordered a review of Fitzpatrick’s case.

http://bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-45200869
http://torontosun.com/news/national...st-canadian-woman-in-scottish-harassment-case
 

spilledthebeer

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Tribunal rules against Canadian woman in Scottish harassment case
Canadian Press
Published:
August 16, 2018
Updated:
August 16, 2018 1:10 PM EDT
DeeAnn Fitzpatrick is seen, in an handout image, during an alleged incident where her coworkers taped her to a chair for complaining about harassment in the office.HO / The Canadian Press
ST. JOHN’S, N.L. — The family of a Newfoundland-born woman who alleges she suffered a decade of harassment at her civil service office in Scotland — including once being taped to a chair — say they are disappointed that a tribunal has ruled against her claim.
The BBC reports the Scottish Employment Tribunal ruled against DeeAnn Fitzpatrick’s complaints of a racist and misogynistic workplace culture.
A statement from her family says they are “hugely disappointed” by the result, although they are not surprised, given a judge had decided some evidence would not be allowed.
The family says the tribunal did however highlight that the human resources department could have been more proactive in dealing with the matter by launching an investigation, questioning staff and reminding staff that such matters might be regarded as grounds for disciplinary action.
Fitzpatrick, a fisheries officer originally from Bell Island, N.L., claims co-workers mocked her for having a miscarriage, used racist language, and threatened female staff members.
A photo published by the BBC in May showed Fitzpatrick taped to a chair with tape over her mouth — an incident she claims was a response from two male co-workers at Marine Scotland’s office in Scrabster for “1/8speaking3/8 out against the boys.”
The image prompted an outcry in the U.K. — Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said she was “absolutely horrified” by the photo, and ordered a review of Fitzpatrick’s case.

http://bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-45200869
http://torontosun.com/news/national...st-canadian-woman-in-scottish-harassment-case










Here is an ABSURD article that will be swiftly buried by LIE-beral friendly and quite hypocritical news media. With some comments of my own in brackets):

California #MeToo leader accused of groping man

Associated Press. Published: February 8, 2018. Updated: February 8, 2018 10:18 PM EST

Filed Under:

Toronto SUN/ News/ World

By Kathleen Ronayne, THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

SACRAMENTO, Calif. — California Democratic Assemblywoman Cristina Garcia, the head of the Legislative Women’s Caucus and a leading figure in the state’s anti-sexual harassment movement, is accused of groping a male staffer from another lawmaker’s office.

(So- as a lot of men have suspected all along- most of the MeToo leaders are grand standers and publicity Hogs more interested in finding a soap box to attract publicity rather than real seekers after honest justice! These hypocrites think it is justice to ruin a man with innuendo. Actual evidence that can be brought into a law court and judged honestly is NOT NEEDED! Such hypocrites!)

Daniel Fierro told The Associated Press on Thursday that Garcia stroked his back, squeezed his buttocks and attempted to touch his crotch in a dugout after a legislative softball game in 2014.

Fierro didn’t report it at the time but in January told his former boss, Democratic Assemblyman Ian Calderon, who reported it to Assembly leaders. The Assembly is now investigating Garcia.

Politico first reported Fierro’s accusation.

Garcia’s spokeswoman Teala Schaff said the assemblywoman learned Jan. 23 a complaint was filed but was given no details and only learned the specifics of the allegations from Politico.

“Every complaint about sexual harassment should be taken seriously and I will participate fully in any investigation that takes place,” the Los Angeles-area lawmaker said in a statement Thursday. “I have zero recollection of engaging in inappropriate behaviour and such behaviour is inconsistent with my values.”

The investigation into Garcia is one of many in statehouses nationwide following a wave of sexual misconduct allegations against men in power since an October expose of movie mogul Harvey Weinstein by the New York Times.

Fierro said he decided to tell Calderon about the incident because of Garcia’s outspokenness in the #MeToo movement, which references the social media campaign used by millions to tell personal experiences with sexual harassment.

“If the person leading the charge on it isn’t credible it just ends up hurting the credibility of these very real stories,” Fierro told the AP.

Assembly Speaker Anthony Rendon, a Democrat, said in a statement he is directing human resources to reach out to Garcia’s staff to make sure they feel safe.

“I trust that while the investigation proceeds, Assemblymember Garcia will respond appropriately and in a way that fortifies the Legislature’s effort to create a new climate,” he said.

Fierro, who was 25 at the time, said he was interviewed by an outside law firm hired by the Assembly Rules Committee last Friday. Politico also reported that a lobbyist who declined to be named claimed Garcia made crude sexual comments and tried to grab his crotch at a 2017 fundraiser.

(OH! Now we have multiple accusers! And in the latest news we have new allegations of sexual impropriety from 4 other staffers who quit for various reasons. SHE is apparently a criminal! AND HYPOCRITE!)

Garcia was elected in 2012 and has carved out a name as a champion of women’s issues and environmental health for poor communities and chairs the Women’s Caucus.

(Author Christina Hoff-Somers details the hypocrisy of these “champions of women`s issues” in her book “Who Stole Feminism”. Hoff-Sumers details numerous instances of falsified statistics and radically altered interpretations of law and the rules of evidence by feminists in order to create the appearance of a crisis! U of T professor Jordan Peterson is under personal attack for pointing out that the values being taught in various colleges and universities are entirely at odds with main stream public opinion! And a teaching assistant at Laurier University was nearly fired for daring to present a fair and open clip of a debate played on TVO/The Agenda- the rather popular talk show that does a fine job of discussing events in an open and honest fashion! To condemn The Agenda as morally wrong for merely discussing a contentious issue is to condemn western civilization and democracy! Refusing even to allow honest discussion is the hallmark of Fascists- exactly the kind of people now infesting our schools!)

Democratic Sen. Connie Leyva, co-chair of the women’s caucus, said she was “shocked and disturbed” at the allegations and she will ask the group to meet soon to discuss Garcia’s fate as leader.

Garcia’s photo was featured in Time Magazine’s Person of the Year issue on being one of the “Silence Breakers” on sexual harassment.

“I refuse to work with (Assemblyman Raul Bocanegra) and anyone who takes part in harassment or assault,” she tweeted in October after it was reported Bocanegra had been disciplined in 2009 for groping a colleague. Bocanegra later resigned after more women made public accusations.

Garcia was a fierce advocate for legislation signed by Gov. Jerry Brown on Monday giving legislative staff members whistleblower protections for reporting sexual misconduct or other misbehaviour, speaking at a rally on the Capitol steps after its passage. She’s tweeted repeatedly about the importance of sexual consent in recent days.

Fierro and the lobbyist said it appeared Garcia was inebriated at the time of the encounters.

(It occurs to me to ask: ”just how damned ENTITLED do all these horn dog politicians think they are anyway” Apparently these Hogs see nothing wrong with wining and dining on the govt gravy train and then grabbing at any erogenous zone that catches their eye! How PIGGISH are they? And why should we put up with them at all? Replace them all- there are LOTS of other new candidates waiting in the wings! Vote early and vote often-SCREW ALL THE HOGS!)

In a November interview with AP about alcohol-fueled fundraisers and other after-work events that are a part of regular business in Sacramento, Garcia said blaming alcohol isn’t an acceptable excuse for sexually inappropriate behaviour. It’s men who chose to misbehave, not the social events themselves, that create the problems, she said.

(And what about the women who also misbehave? Oh we don’t want to discuss them- it might make women look bad! Women trading on their looks is as old as time!)

“I would say that most of the public realizes that our job is based on relationships, and so we are expected to go out there and socialize,” she said. “I think our public also expects us to hold ourselves to a higher standard.”

The Assembly committee said last week that eight allegations of sexual harassment are pending in the Assembly but did not divulge any names. Debra Gravert, the chief administrative officer, didn’t respond to an email from AP seeking clarifation whether Fierro’s allegation is one of the eight pending. Fierro said he was contacted by Rules several days after telling Calderon about the incident for an initial interview before speaking with outside lawyers for more than an hour last week.

Fierro, of Cerritos, left the Assembly in 2016 and now runs a communications firm. Calderon, his former boss, is now the majority leader. Lerna Shirinian, Calderon’s communications director, said Fierro told her about the incident right after it happened.

“He was in shock, I was in shock — but the culture was very different back then,” Shirinian told Politico.
 

Mowich

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Asia Argento, a #MeToo Leader, Made a Deal With Her Own Accuser



The Italian actress and director Asia Argento was among the first women in the movie business to publicly accuse the producer Harvey Weinstein of sexual assault. She became a leading figure in the #MeToo movement. Her boyfriend, the culinary television star Anthony Bourdain, eagerly joined the fight.

But in the months that followed her revelations about Mr. Weinstein last October, Ms. Argento quietly arranged to pay $380,000 to her own accuser: Jimmy Bennett, a young actor and rock musician who said she had sexually assaulted him in a California hotel room years earlier, when he was only two months past his 17th birthday. She was 37. The age of consent in California is 18.

That claim and the subsequent arrangement for payments are laid out in documents between lawyers for Ms. Argento and Mr. Bennett, a former child actor who once played her son in a movie.

The documents, which were sent to The New York Times through encrypted email by an unidentified party, include a selfie dated May 9, 2013, of the two lying in bed. As part of the agreement, Mr. Bennett, who is now 22, gave the photograph and its copyright to Ms. Argento, now 42. Three people familiar with the case said the documents were authentic.

The Times has tried repeatedly since Thursday to get a response to the matter from Ms. Argento and her representatives. She did not reply to messages left on her phone, sent by email and sent to two of her agents, who agreed to forward it to her. Carrie Goldberg, her lawyer who handled the matter, read email messages from The Times, according to two people familiar with the case, but she has not responded. A woman who answered the phone at Ms. Goldberg’s office on Friday said the lawyer would not be available to discuss this article.

More: www.nytimes.com/2018/08/19/us/asia-argento-assault-jimmy-bennett.html