Little Tori's murderers Charged.

There are times when I come to understand (although not condone) the spirit of vigilantism. There are times when I can understand why a parent would simply blow away a piece of scum they know is cutting deals and slipping through the system.

karrie said:

There are times when I come to understand (although not condone) the spirit of vigilantism. There are times when I can understand why a parent would simply blow away a piece of scum they know is cutting deals and slipping through the system.

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Generally, I do not support Capital Punishment - but in cases like this, it makes me question my stance too.

Personally, I think death is too good a punishment for those that perpetrated these crimes.

karrie said:

what bugs me is that SHE lured her away. She should be held just as accountable for the death as him. Yet she is apparently not facing murder charges. Pisses me off.

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Yes and no old wise one, I don't think a person should be charged with murder if they didn't commit murder BUT IF she did lure her for the purpose and intent of murder then she should be charged with a crime that carries an equally severe penalty. (Sorry maybe that should have been "young" wise one.)

Polygong said:

They have not even been put to trial yet. How can I say they are guilty? All I know is that they have been arrested, we have yet to see a shred of the evidence. So of course, at this point, they are presumed innocent. That's a fundamental element of western democracy.

I mean, chances are that the police have arrested the right people, but we don't know that for sure.

Guy Paul Morin, David Milgaard and Donald Marshall were found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt at their trials even. So there is always doubt really.

If I thought for a second that instituting capital punishment would significantly reduce violent crime, I would support it. But it doesn't, that's very clear. It doesn't even reduce crime by an insignificant amount.

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The one thing it does, beyond any doubt, though, is cut back on reoffending (capital punishment as self-defense).

#juan said:

I think support for capital punishment is strongest just after a crime like this. I don't normally lobby in favour of capital punishment but with some animals like Olsen and Bernardo, I would gladly bring the rope. Any case like this involving children brings my blood to a boil. Obviously, Tori trusted this woman who led her to her death. At this moment I don't see any excuse for keeping either of these two scumbags alive.

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Absolutely and DON'T forget sweet little Karla Homolka (who may well have been the most nefarious of the whole works)

Juan, to be quite open, as a parent I would want the following:

1) 1 hour with each offender alone, in a room with no windows, cameras or questions asked before or after,
2) Each offender castrated, without pain killers of any sort,
3) the offenders either lobotomized and turned into living vegetables so they can live out their days drooling OR crippled in the way where their brain is fine, but all they can do is blink (personally, I think the second choice is worse).

In short - I would want them to suffer...and for a long time. Tori's parents and brother will suffer every day for the rest of their lives - why should these monsters have the privilege of not suffering the same length of time?

Any thing that hurts a child (I can't call them people or human) is beyond despicable to me.

Is what I suggested Justice? No - but it is revenge, and when something like this happens, I understand the desire for it.

JLM said:

Yes and no old wise one, I don't think a person should be charged with murder if they didn't commit murder BUT IF she did lure her for the purpose and intent of murder then she should be charged with a crime that carries an equally severe penalty. (Sorry maybe that should have been "young" wise one.)

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true enough.... it's not the word I want, it's the accountability, the sentencing.

pegger said:

Juan, to be quite open, as a parent I would want the following:

1) 1 hour with each offender alone, in a room with no windows, cameras or questions asked before or after,
2) Each offender castrated, without pain killers of any sort,
3) the offenders either lobotomized and turned into living vegetables so they can live out their days drooling OR crippled in the way where their brain is fine, but all they can do is blink (personally, I think the second choice is worse).

In short - I would want them to suffer...and for a long time. Tori's parents and brother will suffer every day for the rest of their lives - why should these monsters have the privilege of not suffering the same length of time?

Any thing that hurts a child (I can't call them people or human) is beyond despicable to me.

Is what I suggested Justice? No - but it is revenge, and when something like this happens, I understand the desire for it.

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I sometimes feel exactly the same way, but then I get to wondering if after awhile I would really get the satisfaction out of it I thought- probably not. The man (woman) is likely already "damaged" far more than you could damage him/her.

Punish the Beast 2 tame the human

karrie said:

what bugs me is that SHE lured her away. She should be held just as accountable for the death as him. Yet she is apparently not facing murder charges. Pisses me off.

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I agree. wtf ever happened to the motherly instinct in this person?

L Gilbert said:

I agree. wtf ever happened to the motherly instinct in this person?

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My guess? It was either never taught to her, or it was chemically stripped out of her.

Along with no sense of right or wrong, I guess.

L Gilbert said:

Along with no sense of right or wrong, I guess.

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No... she knew it was wrong. For whatever bizarre reason, she just didn't care that it was.

Punish the beast to tame the Humans

Tory stafford..O.M.G..Just heard they're looking for her . ..in my home town...O.M.G...Too close to home.....Want Somethin strange..This issue bothered me from day 1..I am a lucid dreamer...1st night story bothered me so much ..Had a bad dream..about my kid and I at a party at neigbours...Told my kid to stay outside while I went in to say high to new neigbours(didn't want to bring him into party)...When I came out a sec later..Son was gone..Looked everywhere...finally found him on next street up from my parents place..Was bizzare...He said he was playing with a girl.She had to go..He got lost...

Sorry to share this ..Hope it's appropriate...What ever you believe about dreams..Police are searching the north end of town,..My parents live 2 streets away from end of town.....

Freakin me out...

Not saying it was some magical premonition...I will say the news and all the info turnng in my head when lucid...Sometimes make for some bizzare happenings...

Again ..I will remember Tory's smile...the Happy Child..Will tell her to go home to her mother tonight if I see her...

She will always live on in our minds ...So Let her be happy...

Give it your best..Never give it all..Enjoy what you have..Or you'll never know till it gone.

Don't feed the fear .. it will defeat itself...

Hug your kid...

In the end ..People are mostly good...

Punish the animal to tame the beast..

And so many more...

Enough from me..I gotta go...Don't want to dwell here to long..No offense..Juan ..Good thread ..Go discusion

shadowshiv said:

Back to the OT, I must admit that I am shocked. I thought for sure that the mother had something to do with it(her continual mind-boggingly weird actions after Tori had disappeared for example)! I was wrong about that, and I wish I was wrong about my feeling that Tori was dead(I had that feeling almost right from the beginning). The female suspect is apparently going to lead the police to where the body is located.

I really hate cases where children are involved.:-(

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Which ones do you like??

JBeee said:

Already pretty pictures are being painted around the female abductor involved in this case.

Next we`ll be hearing sad stories about how she was a victim from the get-go....drugged and forced to comply by the male suspect, a history of psychiatric problems, given a lighter sentence for helping police find the body.....whatever can be conjured up by the courts and media to get her off and charges dropped.:roll:

I say hang the both of em.

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Isn't this somewhat what happened with Karla Holmoka. She talked her face off and got a much lighter sentence. Not to mention three square meals a day, all medical, dental paid for even a education. Who paid for that? I think it is disgusting how those in prison have it a lot better than many Canadians do.
I sincerely hope that everyone that had anything to do with the abduction and murder of little Tori are dealt with and they get the maximum sentence that can possibly happen. I know and can understand all the bleeding hearts who are against the death penalty. There have been a lot of cases where it was found that someone was innocent after the fact. But with todays forensics and DNA and other ways of finding evidence it the guilt should be well proven . In that case I believe the death penalty should be used. The people who took Toris life and who may or may not of done terrible things to her before her death should be punished. Get as good as they gave that little girl, who had her life snuffed out because of them.

karrie said:

No... she knew it was wrong. For whatever bizarre reason, she just didn't care that it was.

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She still doesn't care. She is un-doubtedly helping police to find the little one's body so she can reduce her own sentence.
How did she lure the little girl away? Did she know her at one time? Was she a babysitter or something? Seems odd she would walk out of the school with her. I guess she could have just chosen her to strike up a conversation with and little Tori felt safe with her because the woman? was at the school walking around like she belonged there. A couple of years ago I was at the school waiting to pick up my grandkids and at that time I wasn't known at the school. I was just walking around the halls trying to find the right classroom. I had 2 teachers come out of their classrooms and ask me why I was there. I was really quite pleased with that. I felt a little safer about the kids being there.

Dive team searching for body of Tori Stafford

Police looking for the body of Victoria (Tori) Stafford have called in a dive team to help search lakes in Guelph and Fergus, Ont.

The OPP Underwater Search and Recovery Unit arrived in Fergus, about an hour-and-a-half northwest of Toronto, early Monday and searched part of the Belwood Lake.

The dive team also went to Guelph Lake for a search.


http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/loc...25?hub=Toronto