Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 4,612 
June 7th, 2008, 08:15 AM
Colpy
Don't bother posting any more criticisms of Canadian gun laws.... It's been made readily apparent that you're exactly the kind of person who shouldn't own firearms. Someone who believes that frontier justice is adquate to the task of social organizing principles. I suppose gangsterism and the KKK had to start somewhere.....
Colpy
Don't bother posting any more criticisms of Canadian gun laws.... It's been made readily apparent that you're exactly the kind of person who shouldn't own firearms. Someone who believes that frontier justice is adquate to the task of social organizing principles. I suppose gangsterism and the KKK had to start somewhere.....
Executive Member
Posts: 9,137
June 7th, 2008, 09:17 AM
Quoting Colpy
Why am I disappointed that there is no eighty year old granny in Australia with a smoking gun and no couple of peckerheads in the hospital suffering from orchidectomies by sharpshooter? Surely, somewhere, somebody has done this. If they haven't they should...
So....I got a little curious after we debated the legal ramifications of shooting the nuts off anybody in Australia.....no matter how squirrelly they were...........
It occured to me that she WOULD have been charged with a number of offenses....full stop.
So I googled her.
Appears the tale is just that.
An urban legend http://www.snopes.com/crime/justice/grambo.asp
(sigh)
Sorry about that.
It occured to me that she WOULD have been charged with a number of offenses....full stop.
So I googled her.
Appears the tale is just that.
An urban legend http://www.snopes.com/crime/justice/grambo.asp
(sigh)
Sorry about that.
Senate Member
Posts: 5,158
Location: Saint John, N.B.
Location: Saint John, N.B.
June 7th, 2008, 10:04 AM
I am NOT fool enough to think that justice can only be dispensed by the institutions of gov't.
I just think in the broader picture the institutions of gov't do it best.
I supported trying the old doll. You know, perhaps it is simply that you don't like the idea of juries......in which case it is you that is in contempt of our system of justice.
I'd find her not guilty in a heartbeat.
So what? That is why English Common Law includes juries.....the jury sits not only in judgement of the accused, but in judgement of the law.'
If that makes me a redneck supporter of the KKK, well cut me out a sheet.
Quoting MikeyDB
What IS your problem?
Colpy
Don't bother posting any more criticisms of Canadian gun laws.... It's been made readily apparent that you're exactly the kind of person who shouldn't own firearms. Someone who believes that frontier justice is adquate to the task of social organizing principles. I suppose gangsterism and the KKK had to start somewhere.....
Don't bother posting any more criticisms of Canadian gun laws.... It's been made readily apparent that you're exactly the kind of person who shouldn't own firearms. Someone who believes that frontier justice is adquate to the task of social organizing principles. I suppose gangsterism and the KKK had to start somewhere.....
I am NOT fool enough to think that justice can only be dispensed by the institutions of gov't.
I just think in the broader picture the institutions of gov't do it best.
I supported trying the old doll. You know, perhaps it is simply that you don't like the idea of juries......in which case it is you that is in contempt of our system of justice.
I'd find her not guilty in a heartbeat.
So what? That is why English Common Law includes juries.....the jury sits not only in judgement of the accused, but in judgement of the law.'
If that makes me a redneck supporter of the KKK, well cut me out a sheet.
Senate Member
Posts: 5,158
Location: Saint John, N.B.
Location: Saint John, N.B.
June 7th, 2008, 10:05 AM
Should have known better.
It was simply TOO perfect.
Quoting #juan
Yeah, I was disappointed too.
Why am I disappointed that there is no eighty year old granny in Australia with a smoking gun and no couple of peckerheads in the hospital suffering from orchidectomies by sharpshooter? Surely, somewhere, somebody has done this. If they haven't they should...
Should have known better.
It was simply TOO perfect.
Executive Member
Posts: 9,137
June 7th, 2008, 11:49 AM
My wife was a registered nurse for over thirty five years. She and I were just discussing this topic and she felt that if one were going to attempt to shoot off someone's testicles, you had better be very accurate because there are several other valuable body parts that if punctured by a bullet or two, would make a truly horrible injury. The bladder, the colon, large intestine, for example could lead to a very painful death.
My wife was a registered nurse for over thirty five years. She and I were just discussing this topic and she felt that if one were going to attempt to shoot off someone's testicles, you had better be very accurate because there are several other valuable body parts that if punctured by a bullet or two, would make a truly horrible injury. The bladder, the colon, large intestine, for example could lead to a very painful death.
House Member
Posts: 2,758
Videos: 3
Location: lincolnshire
Videos: 3
Location: lincolnshire
June 7th, 2008, 12:00 PM
We all smile when we hear of this kind of justice going on shame it got debunked i kinda liked the idea of gun wielding granny's .
We all smile when we hear of this kind of justice going on shame it got debunked i kinda liked the idea of gun wielding granny's .
House Member
Posts: 3,066
June 7th, 2008, 12:01 PM
So, you are suggesting true justice can only be dispensed at the hands of our glorious and infallible government?
Seems an odd turn of concience, I guess Iraq was a good thing afterall, since it was fully legal in US law (a sovereign state, therefore no higher authority or law can exist).
Frontier Justice is often decried as foul and wrong, but there is a reason frontier's don't collapse.
Quoting MikeyDB
Colpy
Don't bother posting any more criticisms of Canadian gun laws.... It's been made readily apparent that you're exactly the kind of person who shouldn't own firearms. Someone who believes that frontier justice is adquate to the task of social organizing principles. I suppose gangsterism and the KKK had to start somewhere.....
Don't bother posting any more criticisms of Canadian gun laws.... It's been made readily apparent that you're exactly the kind of person who shouldn't own firearms. Someone who believes that frontier justice is adquate to the task of social organizing principles. I suppose gangsterism and the KKK had to start somewhere.....
So, you are suggesting true justice can only be dispensed at the hands of our glorious and infallible government?
Seems an odd turn of concience, I guess Iraq was a good thing afterall, since it was fully legal in US law (a sovereign state, therefore no higher authority or law can exist).
Frontier Justice is often decried as foul and wrong, but there is a reason frontier's don't collapse.
NHL Hockey Insider
Posts: 3,171
Location: Vancouver Island
Location: Vancouver Island
June 7th, 2008, 12:26 PM
The victim was injured as well, but, even as we speak, it is shuffled into the background.
Her injury will last her lifetime, it is permanent, but not recognized.
She will have to think about that crime when she is proposed to, when she has children,
and probably sometime during every day of her life.
She will have to wonder if she is pregnant, and what to do about that.
She might not feel the same about having sex again for a long time, and each time she
does, she will think about that crime, if even for a few seconds.
It will never go away, never, till the day she dies.
And, now, so will he.
The victim was injured as well, but, even as we speak, it is shuffled into the background.
Her injury will last her lifetime, it is permanent, but not recognized.
She will have to think about that crime when she is proposed to, when she has children,
and probably sometime during every day of her life.
She will have to wonder if she is pregnant, and what to do about that.
She might not feel the same about having sex again for a long time, and each time she
does, she will think about that crime, if even for a few seconds.
It will never go away, never, till the day she dies.
And, now, so will he.
Electoral Member
Posts: 293
Location: Boonies
Location: Boonies
June 7th, 2008, 02:34 PM
I. like Zan, read this thread when it first came up and have been following it for a bit. I at first was cheering on the old granny but thought that I would think about the situation a bit more before responding. But even after seeing others opinions and considering it myself for some time I find myself really on the fence about it.
I thought about the grandma first. I thought first that her being a grandmother made me think of my grandmother, baking cookies and bread, teaching me how to garden and so on. Could I put my grandmother in jail? Heck no! If this person had been say a brother, father, uncle or even grandfather, I get a whole different feeling and it would be easier understand their sentence.
Then I thought about the rapist. Did he deserve it? I really thought about this and went from side to side. Yes, he deserved every bit of it - well I guess that answer is the problem in the first place. If I think he deserves it then that opens a door and gives myself permission to let things like that happen. No, he didn't deserve being hunted down and shot - well that just makes me think of the woman that he raped... the actual victim... it surprised me that it took this long to get to her which I think is the biggest problem.
The story of granny hunting down the rapist takes everything away from that women. It takes her completely out of the equation.
So lets consider her in this.
Without grannys involvement: Women gets brutally raped. Police take their sweet time finding him but do eventually. Rapist goes to court where the jury hears the women's horrid story about her attack. The jury puts the guy away, hopefully for a long time. The woman will still think of the day that he will eventually be released. She will still have nightmares for a long time. She will think about that man every time she is alone and feels vulnerable. He's in jail, she still loses.
With granny.
Woman gets brutally raped. Police take their sweet time finding him, in the meantime, granny puts down her knitting needles, picks up a gun, hunts the ****** down, blows his balls off (while still missing all vital organs and arteries) goes home to watch Matlock and continue knitting. Rapist heads to hospital where police catch up with him. Police go and arrest granny. granny goes to court - gets off because who aside from Mikey is going to convict her?? Rapist goes to court - gets convicted but probably gets a reduced sentence because he has already suffered. and the woman? Well she gets to know that he will be out of jail a lot sooner, she will still think about him everyday, every time she is alone and vulnerable. She will still have nightmares. She still loses.
So really does it matter either way. She still lost!
I. like Zan, read this thread when it first came up and have been following it for a bit. I at first was cheering on the old granny but thought that I would think about the situation a bit more before responding. But even after seeing others opinions and considering it myself for some time I find myself really on the fence about it.
I thought about the grandma first. I thought first that her being a grandmother made me think of my grandmother, baking cookies and bread, teaching me how to garden and so on. Could I put my grandmother in jail? Heck no! If this person had been say a brother, father, uncle or even grandfather, I get a whole different feeling and it would be easier understand their sentence.
Then I thought about the rapist. Did he deserve it? I really thought about this and went from side to side. Yes, he deserved every bit of it - well I guess that answer is the problem in the first place. If I think he deserves it then that opens a door and gives myself permission to let things like that happen. No, he didn't deserve being hunted down and shot - well that just makes me think of the woman that he raped... the actual victim... it surprised me that it took this long to get to her which I think is the biggest problem.
The story of granny hunting down the rapist takes everything away from that women. It takes her completely out of the equation.
So lets consider her in this.
Without grannys involvement: Women gets brutally raped. Police take their sweet time finding him but do eventually. Rapist goes to court where the jury hears the women's horrid story about her attack. The jury puts the guy away, hopefully for a long time. The woman will still think of the day that he will eventually be released. She will still have nightmares for a long time. She will think about that man every time she is alone and feels vulnerable. He's in jail, she still loses.
With granny.
Woman gets brutally raped. Police take their sweet time finding him, in the meantime, granny puts down her knitting needles, picks up a gun, hunts the ****** down, blows his balls off (while still missing all vital organs and arteries) goes home to watch Matlock and continue knitting. Rapist heads to hospital where police catch up with him. Police go and arrest granny. granny goes to court - gets off because who aside from Mikey is going to convict her?? Rapist goes to court - gets convicted but probably gets a reduced sentence because he has already suffered. and the woman? Well she gets to know that he will be out of jail a lot sooner, she will still think about him everyday, every time she is alone and vulnerable. She will still have nightmares. She still loses.
So really does it matter either way. She still lost!
House Member
Posts: 3,508
Videos: 2
Location: 50° 30' N, 104° 38' W
Videos: 2
Location: 50° 30' N, 104° 38' W
June 8th, 2008, 12:22 AM
I vote with MikeyDB on this one, even though the story's turned out to be fiction. Grambo was absolutely wrong to do what she did in that tale, and anyone who thinks otherwise has failed to understand the legal principles western civilization is built on. In the old 19th century phrase, we have a government of laws, not men. That's a politically incorrect statement these days, as it excludes women, but the principle is perfectly clear: nobody is above the law. The law is the book of rules we've all agreed to live by, and while there's no doubt it's imperfect and sometimes inconsistent, it's miles ahead of a system that'd let Grambo get away with what she did in that bit of fiction. On one level I perfectly understand people who'd support her, I have a daughter and if anyone raped her I'd be murderously angry and strongly tempted to hunt the bastard down, rip him a new asshole, and hope he bleeds to death from it. But I hope I wouldn't do that... unless I happened to encounter him in some dark alley... But that's not the way it's supposed to work. I would of course make every possible effort to bring the full weight of the law down on the bastard, but taking the law into my own hands can't be allowed. That way lies lawlessness and anarchy.
I vote with MikeyDB on this one, even though the story's turned out to be fiction. Grambo was absolutely wrong to do what she did in that tale, and anyone who thinks otherwise has failed to understand the legal principles western civilization is built on. In the old 19th century phrase, we have a government of laws, not men. That's a politically incorrect statement these days, as it excludes women, but the principle is perfectly clear: nobody is above the law. The law is the book of rules we've all agreed to live by, and while there's no doubt it's imperfect and sometimes inconsistent, it's miles ahead of a system that'd let Grambo get away with what she did in that bit of fiction. On one level I perfectly understand people who'd support her, I have a daughter and if anyone raped her I'd be murderously angry and strongly tempted to hunt the bastard down, rip him a new asshole, and hope he bleeds to death from it. But I hope I wouldn't do that... unless I happened to encounter him in some dark alley... But that's not the way it's supposed to work. I would of course make every possible effort to bring the full weight of the law down on the bastard, but taking the law into my own hands can't be allowed. That way lies lawlessness and anarchy.
NHL Hockey Insider
Posts: 3,171
Location: Vancouver Island
Location: Vancouver Island
June 8th, 2008, 01:33 AM
Quoting Dexter Sinister
You are right of course, but if our legal system doesn't move to make the punishment for rape and crimes against children by pedafiles more severe, more granny types will show up and move to make their own judgements.
I vote with MikeyDB on this one, even though the story's turned out to be fiction. Grambo was absolutely wrong to do what she did in that tale, and anyone who thinks otherwise has failed to understand the legal principles western civilization is built on. In the old 19th century phrase, we have a government of laws, not men. That's a politically incorrect statement these days, as it excludes women, but the principle is perfectly clear: nobody is above the law. The law is the book of rules we've all agreed to live by, and while there's no doubt it's imperfect and sometimes inconsistent, it's miles ahead of a system that'd let Grambo get away with what she did in that bit of fiction. On one level I perfectly understand people who'd support her, I have a daughter and if anyone raped her I'd be murderously angry and strongly tempted to hunt the bastard down, rip him a new asshole, and hope he bleeds to death from it. But I hope I wouldn't do that... unless I happened to encounter him in some dark alley... But that's not the way it's supposed to work. I would of course make every possible effort to bring the full weight of the law down on the bastard, but taking the law into my own hands can't be allowed. That way lies lawlessness and anarchy.
House Member
Posts: 3,508
Videos: 2
Location: 50° 30' N, 104° 38' W
Videos: 2
Location: 50° 30' N, 104° 38' W
June 8th, 2008, 01:45 AM
Yes, you're right too, the law is always behind social conditions and is slow and difficult to change. But it's still better than the alternatives.
Yes, you're right too, the law is always behind social conditions and is slow and difficult to change. But it's still better than the alternatives.
