A Federalist Country Demands Parties In Several Provinces, Dump The BQ

[dumpthemonarchy]

The federal election commission killed the Rhino and other parties some years back, and they ran candidates in several provinces. Yet we cannot rid ourselves of the Bloc Quebecois which runs candidates in only one province. This is nuts.

The existence of the BQ prevents majority gov'ts in Canada which encourages instability. And the BQ is a separatist party. Why do we put up with this?

 

[Machjo]

Because we believe in equality for all. Either all parties are allowed, or none. If we don't like this, we could always legislate that all candidates run as independents. But to start saying that only parties that adhere to ideology X can run starts to become worrying. Hmm... this party is too right wing; that one too left wing. This one here is too environmentalist, and that one not enough. This party here has the wrong colours, and that one there speaks the wrong language. And this party here is too ethnic, and that one there not ethnic enough. Scary innit?

 

[Liberalman]

Did the Rhinos ever get anybody elected?

In federal elections people do not vote for political parties, people vote for the candidate that is running for the position in their riding.

People will vote for a candidate that have joined a political party but they still vote for the candidate.

When MP either get kicked out of the party or resign from the party will make the decision to give up his seat, the Prime Minister cannot force the person from their seat.

Some MPs either cross the floor and join the opposition parties or sit as independents.

Even the voters from the riding can’t force their MP to give up his seat they have to wait until the next federal election.

The Conservatives have to be reminded that in their glory days when they were known as The Reform party, a federal national political party, refused to run any Reform candidates in Quebec as punishment for Quebec trying to use a “Not Withstanding Clause” on the rest of Canada.

I think the Reform/Conservatives should be kicked out of federal politics before the Bloc don’t you agree Dumpthemonarchy?

 

[Cliffy]

The Rhinos were THE only political party to make sense EVER! I wasn't aware that they had been killed by government decree. If that is true, then the Rhinos were really becoming a threat to those mindless, spineless Cretans. I wish someone would resurrect them.

 

[taxslave]

One would think that as a matter of principal a separatist would not accept money from the federation. But then this is quebec we are talking about. As a matter of principal I try to avoid buying anything made in Quebec , just like made in China. And I will not go to Cuba as long as it is a communist country.

 

[Liberalman]

Quebec has good maple syrup

 

[AnnaG]

The federal election commission killed the Rhino and other parties some years back, and they ran candidates in several provinces. Yet we cannot rid ourselves of the Bloc Quebecois which runs candidates in only one province. This is nuts.

The existence of the BQ prevents majority gov'ts in Canada which encourages instability. And the BQ is a separatist party. Why do we put up with this?

Because a majority gov't would have us gritting our teeth to stubs for being so foolish. I like minority gov'ts simply for the fact that we don't have runaway idiocy like 20 gun registries instead of one, aren't spending more than $18 billion/year on the military, etc.

 

[taxslave]

I like minority governments too, but not the way ours is run with a none confidence vote being able to force an election. An elected government must be able to serve out its four or five year term without wasting our money on elections and constant electioneering. Takes too much time away from doing their job. A simple vote on each bill as it comes up would work just fine. Either it passes or it doesn't.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Because we believe in equality for all. Either all parties are allowed, or none. If we don't like this, we could always legislate that all candidates run as independents. But to start saying that only parties that adhere to ideology X can run starts to become worrying. Hmm... this party is too right wing; that one too left wing. This one here is too environmentalist, and that one not enough. This party here has the wrong colours, and that one there speaks the wrong language. And this party here is too ethnic, and that one there not ethnic enough. Scary innit?

To be ideologically free. How dreamy. Canada is an idea, like most countries. So having an ideology to keep Canada unified is perfectly okay. We believe this. Treason against the state can be against the law. There are limits to everything, Wall Street thought they had none but they were wrong.

Independents running for political office are okay. But not parties that run in only one province and believe in breaking up Canada.

Even if the BQ were not separatists, they should have to run candidates outside Quebec. Canada is a federalist country, with provinces and the separation of constitutional powers. The opposite of a federalist is not a separatist/sovereigntist, the opposite of a federalist state is a unitary state. A unitary state like France has no provinces, Paris runs all ministries.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Did the Rhinos ever get anybody elected?

In federal elections people do not vote for political parties, people vote for the candidate that is running for the position in their riding.

People will vote for a candidate that have joined a political party but they still vote for the candidate.

When MP either get kicked out of the party or resign from the party will make the decision to give up his seat, the Prime Minister cannot force the person from their seat.

Some MPs either cross the floor and join the opposition parties or sit as independents.

Even the voters from the riding can’t force their MP to give up his seat they have to wait until the next federal election.

The Conservatives have to be reminded that in their glory days when they were known as The Reform party, a federal national political party, refused to run any Reform candidates in Quebec as punishment for Quebec trying to use a “Not Withstanding Clause” on the rest of Canada.

I think the Reform/Conservatives should be kicked out of federal politics before the Bloc don’t you agree Dumpthemonarchy?

I vote for the party first usually and the candidate later.

No, I do not think the Reform Party be kicked out of federal politics. They had candidates running in nine provinces. So they omit one, big deal, that was their misguided choice because it lessened the number of seats they could get. And they also lump Quebeckers together as a group, another political mistake.

The Reform Party is a federalist party in both senses of the word, one, in that they oppose separatism, and two, they run candidates in more than one province.

I think advocating separating from Canada is treason.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

The Rhinos were THE only political party to make sense EVER! I wasn't aware that they had been killed by government decree. If that is true, then the Rhinos were really becoming a threat to those mindless, spineless Cretans. I wish someone would resurrect them.

Yes, bureaucratic gov't decree and the federal parties stood by watching. There is something wrong in Canada when the Rhino party can be killed and the BQ can prosper.

 

[L Gilbert]

Yup. It's the ridiculous electoral system and the fact that we are so diverse that we are extremely difficult to appease from one end of the country to the other. What works in the maritimes, may not apply so wqell in the prairies, what works in Nunavut, may not be so good for BC, etc.
The answer? Delegate federal power to the provinces and keep the feds out of those parts. Let the feds deal with stuff they should be dealing with, like foreign relations, standardized nationwide healthcare, federal police, etc.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

One would think that as a matter of principal a separatist would not accept money from the federation. But then this is quebec we are talking about. As a matter of principal I try to avoid buying anything made in Quebec , just like made in China. And I will not go to Cuba as long as it is a communist country.

We give money to separatists to possibly fund separation. Makes no sense to me.

Putting the BQ out of business would take some serious political effort, something our current federalist parties are not willing to do. If there is something the Liberals and PCs could agree on, this would seem to be it. It would pave the way for future majoriities for one of these parties. Yet the fear offending Quebec is greater than the desire for power. Kind of fascinating sometimes.

 

[Liberalman]

dumpthemararchy

I think advocating separating from Canada is treason.

Under s46 of the Criminal Code, a person commits "high treason" who
a) kills, attempts to kill, wounds, imprisons, or restrains the sovereign,
b) wages war against Canada or does any act preparatory thereto, or
c) assists an enemy at war with Canada or any armed force against whom Canadian forces are engaged in hostilities, even if no state of war exists.
The punishment for high treason is life imprisonment, without parole eligibility for 25 years.

A person commits "treason" who
a) uses force or violence for the purpose of overthrowing the government of Canada or a province,
b) discloses, without lawful authority, military or scientific material to agents of a foreign state, if he or she knows or should know that the material may be used to impair Canada's safety or defence, or
c) engages in certain listed conspiracies or attempted offences. The punishment for treason is life imprisonment; normal parole rules apply. Canadian citizens and persons owing allegiance to Her Majesty in right of Canada who commit acts of high treason or treason are punishable under Canadian criminal law even if the acts were performed outside Canada.

You can discuss separation and you can elect MPs that believe in separation and as long as people are doing this within the law nothing can be done until it leads to violence then you can go for high treason.

We can’t forget Louis Riel his conviction was recently overturned with an apology from the Canadian Government

Since Canada is a confederation of provinces who joined Canada can opt out of the confederation if the federal government isn’t meeting their obligations as promised when the province came in as I understand it

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

dumpthemararchy

Under s46 of the Criminal Code, a person commits "high treason" who
a) kills, attempts to kill, wounds, imprisons, or restrains the sovereign,
b) wages war against Canada or does any act preparatory thereto, or
c) assists an enemy at war with Canada or any armed force against whom Canadian forces are engaged in hostilities, even if no state of war exists.
The punishment for high treason is life imprisonment, without parole eligibility for 25 years.

A person commits "treason" who
a) uses force or violence for the purpose of overthrowing the government of Canada or a province,
b) discloses, without lawful authority, military or scientific material to agents of a foreign state, if he or she knows or should know that the material may be used to impair Canada's safety or defence, or
c) engages in certain listed conspiracies or attempted offences. The punishment for treason is life imprisonment; normal parole rules apply. Canadian citizens and persons owing allegiance to Her Majesty in right of Canada who commit acts of high treason or treason are punishable under Canadian criminal law even if the acts were performed outside Canada.

You can discuss separation and you can elect MPs that believe in separation and as long as people are doing this within the law nothing can be done until it leads to violence then you can go for high treason.

We can’t forget Louis Riel his conviction was recently overturned with an apology from the Canadian Government

Since Canada is a confederation of provinces who joined Canada can opt out of the confederation if the federal government isn’t meeting their obligations as promised when the province came in as I understand it

There's law and there's law.

Say Quebec separates, then Ontario would be near 50% of the population with about 50% of the seats in Parliament. Our perception of how we govern ourselves would change drastically because that is not the deal we have now. I would be extremely unhappy with one province having the power to control Parliament.

Suddenly things go wonky in Ottawa and Quebec separates. Now we have new laws, real fast. New ways of looking at Canada, a brand new arrangement we didn't have two months before, and no procession of boring, endless, constitutional meetings to work out the fine points of a new Canada, sans Quebec. Our politics could go from placid to volatile overnight.

Anything can change in this world, and to Canada's detriment, perhaps fairly quickly in a world of internet time. We play with fire letting separatist parties smoulder for years and not tackle them head on.

 

[Trex]

We give money to separatists to possibly fund separation. Makes no sense to me.

Putting the BQ out of business would take some serious political effort, something our current federalist parties are not willing to do. If there is something the Liberals and PCs could agree on, this would seem to be it. It would pave the way for future majoriities for one of these parties. Yet the fear offending Quebec is greater than the desire for power. Kind of fascinating sometimes.

Well your completely wrong about the above statement because its exactly what Harper and the Cons tried to do.
When Harper introduced the bill to cut the $1.95 per vote subsidy to Federal Political parties it was expected to have the following result.
Slightly cut funding to the Cons but they did not care because they have an effective fundraising machine.
Slightly cut funding to the Libs but at the time Dion was the main Liberal fundraising problem for the Lib's anyway.
A bit bigger cut to the NDP but keep in mind the dippers have a small group of die- hard supporters who will always keep them funded, and of course the unions to fall back on.
The big cut was going to be the BQ. it pretty much would have starved them of funding and would have been the beginning of the end for them.
The BQ is not funded much by donations and instead relies on the Federal Government(taxpayers)for its funding, plus the seperatists get a chuckle out of making the taxpayers of the rest of Canada pay for their efforts at destroying Canada.

It was understood that when the BQ started to fold from lack of funding those Federal votes would have gone to the Libs and the NDP. The Conservatives knew that ex Bloq voters would never jump ship to the Conservative party but it was worthwhile giving the Libs and the Dippers a few more seats to get rid of the BQ Federal seperatists for good .

Quote:CBC
Federal parties currently receive $1.95 for every vote they receive in a federal election, provided they win at least two per cent of the nationwide popular vote. The annual subsidy is used to pay for staff and expenses.
Cutting the subsidies would effectively gut the opposition parties, who are far more dependent on them than the Conservative party.
The Liberals and New Democrats quickly rejected the proposal and launched a series of discussions about forming a potential coalition government if the confidence motion fails to pass and the government is defeated. Former prime minister Jean Chrétien and former NDP leader Ed Broadbent are steering the talks, according to reports.
Unquote;


So the idiot Liberals lead by that dimwit Dion had a shot at just letting the BQ get wiped out by the Cons. In return they would have picked up a bunch of Quebec Federal ridings that would have had to go either Lib Or NDP. But it would have cost them a few funding bucks from the taxpayers that they could have simply replaced by more effective fundraising and seats in more ridings in Quebec.


But no.
They had to go and try to overthrow the elected minority government over the bill.
When, in the long haul, the Conservatives were trying to do the taxpayers and the Liberal Party of Canada a favour.
So Harper freaks out, rolls over and gives up and Federal spending goes right through the roof.
And the BQ gets to laugh their guts out over the whole charade.
And I sure wouldnt hold my breath waiting for one of the Fed political parties to try that again any time soon.
I have lots of problems with Harper.
But the Liberals will wear this one for a long time.
They saved the party thats whole existence is dedicated to the destruction of Canada.
Great move Dion.


Trex

 

[L Gilbert]

Seems to me, Turdeau declared martial law once and that didn't stop the FLQ. They kinda faded in the 70s due to lack of public support. What would you suggest we stop the Bloq with?

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Well your completely wrong about the above statement because its exactly what Harper and the Cons tried to do.
When Harper introduced the bill to cut the $1.95 per vote subsidy to Federal Political parties it was expected to have the following result.
Slightly cut funding to the Cons but they did not care because they have an effective fundraising machine.
Slightly cut funding to the Libs but at the time Dion was the main Liberal fundraising problem for the Lib's anyway.
A bit bigger cut to the NDP but keep in mind the dippers have a small group of die- hard supporters who will always keep them funded, and of course the unions to fall back on.
The big cut was going to be the BQ. it pretty much would have starved them of funding and would have been the beginning of the end for them.
The BQ is not funded much by donations and instead relies on the Federal Government(taxpayers)for its funding, plus the seperatists get a chuckle out of making the taxpayers of the rest of Canada pay for their efforts at destroying Canada.

It was understood that when the BQ started to fold from lack of funding those Federal votes would have gone to the Libs and the NDP. The Conservatives knew that ex Bloq voters would never jump ship to the Conservative party but it was worthwhile giving the Libs and the Dippers a few more seats to get rid of the BQ Federal seperatists for good .

Quote:CBC
Federal parties currently receive $1.95 for every vote they receive in a federal election, provided they win at least two per cent of the nationwide popular vote. The annual subsidy is used to pay for staff and expenses.
Cutting the subsidies would effectively gut the opposition parties, who are far more dependent on them than the Conservative party.
The Liberals and New Democrats quickly rejected the proposal and launched a series of discussions about forming a potential coalition government if the confidence motion fails to pass and the government is defeated. Former prime minister Jean Chrétien and former NDP leader Ed Broadbent are steering the talks, according to reports.
Unquote;

So the idiot Liberals lead by that dimwit Dion had a shot at just letting the BQ get wiped out by the Cons. In return they would have picked up a bunch of Quebec Federal ridings that would have had to go either Lib Or NDP. But it would have cost them a few funding bucks from the taxpayers that they could have simply replaced by more effective fundraising and seats in more ridings in Quebec.

But no.
They had to go and try to overthrow the elected minority government over the bill.
When, in the long haul, the Conservatives were trying to do the taxpayers and the Liberal Party of Canada a favour.
So Harper freaks out, rolls over and gives up and Federal spending goes right through the roof.
And the BQ gets to laugh their guts out over the whole charade.
And I sure wouldnt hold my breath waiting for one of the Fed political parties to try that again any time soon.
I have lots of problems with Harper.
But the Liberals will wear this one for a long time.
They saved the party thats whole existence is dedicated to the destruction of Canada.
Great move Dion. Trex

All western govts fund political parties. Harper made such a goof. To do an act when you are a minority govt shows Harper is a mediocrity and a second banana. The elephant is the room is the BQ, not to talk about it is a lack of leadership.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Seems to me, Turdeau declared martial law once and that didn't stop the FLQ. They kinda faded in the 70s due to lack of public support. What would you suggest we stop the Bloq with?

At the minimum the fed govt has to pass a law saying all political parties in Ottawa must run candidates in at least 3-5 regions of the country because we are a federal state and all parties must recognize this constiitutional and cultural fact of the country. Most Cdns would support this I believe because Cdns don't want the country to split.

Conditions must be created to sap the BQ's strength, because now, we look weak.

 

[AnnaG]

Do you really think the Bloq has no support besides in Kebek?
Most Canadians are too lazy to get off their behinds to even vote let alone research the issue. lmao The country could split and a lot of people wouldn't know it'd been brewing till after it was done and hit the news. lol