Suspected U.S. strike kills up to 20 in Pakistan

Praxius

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And here's some more:

Suspected U.S. strike kills up to 20 in Pakistan
CTV.ca | Suspected U.S. strike kills up to 20 in Pakistan

DERA ISMAIL KHAN, Pakistan -- A suspected U.S. missile strike inside Pakistan on a compound used by Taliban militants near the Afghan border killed up to 20 people early Monday, Pakistani officials said.

U.S. missile strikes into Pakistan's border region have escalated sharply in recent months in the search for militants, despite protests from the Pakistani government.

Two Pakistani intelligence officers, speaking on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to talk to the media, said Monday's strike occurred the South Waziristan region.

The targeted house was frequented by followers of a Taliban commander, but that the identity of the victims is not immediately clear, the officials said.

Meanwhile, Taliban fighters who tried unsuccessfully to kidnap a tribal militia leader beheaded one of the man's rescuers in front of a crowd, then fought a running battle with tribesmen on Sunday that left as many as 30 people dead, police said.

The assailants grabbed militia chief Pir Samiullah at his home in the Swat region and were hustling him to a getaway car when dozens of local tribesmen confronted them and snatched him back, regional police chief Dilawar Bangash said.

Bangash said hundreds of Taliban later returned, seized three members of the militia and beheaded one of them on a road before a large crowd.

The militias, known as lashkars, have been compared to the so-called awakening councils that have helped U.S. forces turn the tables against al-Qaida in Iraq. Pakistan's government has cited them as proof it can root out militants waging an insurgency in both Pakistan and Afghanistan.

At the beheading, Taliban commander Mullah Shamsher told onlookers "this was a lesson for anyone who tried to oppose them," Bangash said, citing witnesses. The militia gathered men from the surrounding area who engaged the Taliban in an hours-long gunbattle.

Bangash said 20 militants including Shamsher, six militiamen and four bystanders were killed and another police official said several tribesmen were reported missing.

Muslim Khan, a militant spokesman contacted by telephone, confirmed a clash but said only three Taliban died. He claimed 12 tribesmen were killed and 62 were abducted.

"Our tribal brothers, those who are patriots, have broken with them (the militants), and lashkars are fighting against those involved in terrorism," Pakistani Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani said Sunday.

Yet many doubt the ramshackle forces can face down heavily armed insurgents who have seized swaths of Pakistan's border belt, forged ties with al-Qaida, and targeted pro-government elders with suicide bombings and kidnappings.

Officials deny they are arming the militias, though observers suspect that they at least receive government funding.

Insecurity and government restrictions make it virtually impossible to verify accounts of the fighting raging mainly in Swat and nearby regions on the Afghan border.
 

Colpy

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And every militant they kill in Pakistan will not be crossing the border to attack Canadian troops........

Go USA missiles!
 

Colpy

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Have you had your rabies shots?

Not recently.....but then I haven't been in close contact with you, so they are probably unnecessary.....:p

I prefer Canadian soldiers serving their nation to survive...........and I don't much care who's toes get stepped on to help that happen, and I appreciate the help from the Yanks.
 

lone wolf

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Nov 25, 2006
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I bet those Canadian soldiers would prefer not to hear the ravings of a warmonger cheering on the rockets that surely will incite rage and create even more recruits for the other side. You're the one who wrote the thesis. Do you recall the events of Vietnam?

Don't worry Colpy. If perchance I was rabid ... I wouldn't bite you ... lest what you write is how you taste.
 

Avro

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Feb 12, 2007
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....and now a word from cowardly cons.

Kill all the innocents as long as you get all the terrorists so I will feel safe and sound under my blankies.

......now back to your normal programing.

This missile strike was a mistake.:roll:
 

Praxius

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And every militant they kill in Pakistan will not be crossing the border to attack Canadian troops........

Go USA missiles!

Great logic.... one or two "Suspected Militants" got killed and won't fight our forces.

And if they were actually militants, chances are, their friends and families will take up arms against us and continue the fight.

And if they wern't militants, then innocent have died at the hands of the US, therefore their friends and families will take up arms against us and continue to fight.

Wonderful.... yeah, just brilliant.....

Therefore, in killing one "Suspected Militant" you just sprouted up at least 5 more "Suspected Militants" ~ Whether they were Militants or Innocent to begin with.

Then you may not just have Taliban/Militants to fight, but Pakistanis who held loyalty to their own nation and had nothing to do with the current conflict. There is already hatred in Pakistan for the US.... with these types of attacks against their nations' collective anger against them and continued requests to cease their attacks, then more are going to have the desire to take up arms against the US and the rest of NATO.

Thereby making the situation worse then better.

smart one.
 

Praxius

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Not recently.....but then I haven't been in close contact with you, so they are probably unnecessary.....:p

I prefer Canadian soldiers serving their nation to survive...........and I don't much care who's toes get stepped on to help that happen, and I appreciate the help from the Yanks.

Well I prefer Canadian Soldiers serving their nation for the right reasons and principles.... I do care who's toes get stepped on because it seems many of those toes now seem to be innocent civilians.

And I sure as fok don't appreciate a damn thing from the Yanks, because all of this is their doing.
 

Colpy

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Well I prefer Canadian Soldiers serving their nation for the right reasons and principles.... I do care who's toes get stepped on because it seems many of those toes now seem to be innocent civilians.

And I sure as fok don't appreciate a damn thing from the Yanks, because all of this is their doing.

I said I didn't care who got their toes stepped on in the process of helping Canadian soldiers survive............killing civilians doesn't help that process.

I meant I don't care if the Pakistani gov't and/or military or the peace movement or the international community get their noses out of joint.........

Canadian soldiers are serving for the right reasons.....fulfilling their obligations under both the NATO treaty and our mutual defense treaties with the USA, in a UN sanctioned mission.

I don't know how that could be any clearer.........
 

Praxius

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I said I didn't care who got their toes stepped on in the process of helping Canadian soldiers survive............killing civilians doesn't help that process.

And yet that is what is being done. If the US was going about it's operations with some brains and actually put some effort in not killing civilians, then I might be in the same position you are in.... but they're not, they have continually shown they don't give a rats ass for the people they claimed they wished to protect, and in doing so, they are putting us and every other ally at risk.

I meant I don't care if the Pakistani gov't and/or military or the peace movement or the international community get their noses out of joint.........

Canadian soldiers are serving for the right reasons.....fulfilling their obligations under both the NATO treaty and our mutual defense treaties with the USA, in a UN sanctioned mission.

I don't know how that could be any clearer.........

The moment our "Allies" begin to act like vikings and having a total disregard for civilians, women/children, etc... then we should be either pulling our support, or fighting against them in order to protect those civilians in question, or else we are no better then those dropping the bombs as we sit by and allow it to continually happen.
 

Colpy

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And yet that is what is being done. If the US was going about it's operations with some brains and actually put some effort in not killing civilians, then I might be in the same position you are in.... but they're not, they have continually shown they don't give a rats ass for the people they claimed they wished to protect, and in doing so, they are putting us and every other ally at risk.



The moment our "Allies" begin to act like vikings and having a total disregard for civilians, women/children, etc... then we should be either pulling our support, or fighting against them in order to protect those civilians in question, or else we are no better then those dropping the bombs as we sit by and allow it to continually happen.

Funny, I see no mention of dead civilians in the article..........

But yes, far too many Afghan civilians are killed in airstrikes.

Air power is used liberally because of a lack of ground forces.....or so not to risk casualties of allied soldiers......especially from countries that are "casualty-adverse"

Want to stop killing Afghan civilians with air strikes?

Stop using air power so liberally......which means you would have to Commit a hell of a lot more ground troops, especially highly trained special forces, and prepare to accept sharply increased allied casualties.......

Or foolishly abandon our allies, the Afghans, and any hope of preventing Afghanistan from becoming a base once again for terror attacks in North America. We are on the list, you know....and by "we" I mean Canada.

No easy solution.
 

Praxius

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Funny, I see no mention of dead civilians in the article..........

But yes, far too many Afghan civilians are killed in airstrikes.

Air power is used liberally because of a lack of ground forces.....or so not to risk casualties of allied soldiers......especially from countries that are "casualty-adverse"

Want to stop killing Afghan civilians with air strikes?

Stop using air power so liberally......which means you would have to Commit a hell of a lot more ground troops, especially highly trained special forces, and prepare to accept sharply increased allied casualties.......

What I am against is the rampant useage of air strikes. I have no major issues with air strikes being using during a combat mission where there are allied troops involved and they know from first hand that they are targeting people with weapons who are directly shooting at them..... I do have major issues when air strikes are used where no allied forces are located to confirm the target and the air strikes seem to be done based on "Military Intelligence" which more often then not, is wrong.

I have an issue where air strikes are used accross borders and into the lands of our allies, when it was specifically agreed to that they wouldn't be used. I have an issue with air strikes being used accross the borders of our allies when they specifically and repeatedly demanded that they be stopped..... esspecially when they have been showing evidence and signs that they are doing what was requested of them.

I have an issue with air strikes being used in very close quaters to civilians.

In a few examples a few years back, one taliban head was hanging around a village for days.... he was targeted and tracked for the whole time. As soon as he got into his car to head back to the mountains to meet, while on the highway, he was blown up by an air strike..... very far away from the Village of civilians. It was confirmed it was the target, they followed and tracked him until it was safe to take him out.

^ Maybe the US isn't as patient to continue to do this, but in the long run, it'll save a hell of a lot more lives, protect the innocent and reduce the amount of people taking up arms later on due to innocent family members losing their lives from a faceless forign attacker in the sky.

Either remove the useage of air strikes or only use air strikes when there are people on the ground to confirm the target and that it is safe to attack the target, away from civilians.

If we are supposed to be there for the Afghans and to protect them, then do so..... don't use them as simple collateral for your own selfish agendas. And at the same time, don't treat Pakistan the same way.... they are afterall, our allies too.

And when your allies start attacking your own people with their own agendas.... then where's the trust? Who's next?

...... Or foolishly abandon our allies, the Afghans, and any hope of preventing Afghanistan from becoming a base once again for terror attacks in North America. We are on the list, you know....and by "we" I mean Canada.

No easy solution.

No solution is easy, but there are solutions none the less. If our allies can't figure out their begin-game and end-game, have no clear objectives or goals, with no time tables and no clear way out, and continually contradict their messages with their actions..... then how long do you tag along until you understand what is being done is wrong and we shouldn't be a part of it?

I couldn't care if we're a target of the Taliban or the Keebler Elves.... if we are attacked, we shall respond in kind in an appropreate approach for equal justice.... but attempting to overthrown a soverign nation based on faulty information to suit an pissed off ally's objectives was, is and always will be wrong.

Abandon our allies? Many of our allies already have done so based on similar reasons.... only Canada is too chicken sh*t to say no to the US, and hide around some age-old contract of some defunked organization to ward off the Soviet Union...... a group that should have been abolished when the Soviets were.

Added:

But if we are going to continually be sucked into this BS war and fight it out because our buddies want to peer pressure us into doing the "Cool Thing" then meet us half way and try to reduce the amount of retaliation against us and be more cautious on who you're blowing up..... seems simple enough to me.

We are unfortunatly a part of NATO, but that doesn't mean we don't get a say in how things are done. We don't just sign a contract to go blow stuff up when other nations want us to, and then have no say or complaint about how things are conducted.

If we have no say on how to come to an end-game in this war, then wtf are we in it? Just to fight in the front lines for those creating the people we're fighting? Me thinks not.

The US is creating and causing the increase of forces our troops are fighting, not reducing them.... and if they're not going to put their allies' and afghan's best interests at heart, then why should we have the US's best interests at heart?

It's a two way relationship.... we are not simple pawns for the US..... at least I sure as hell ain't.