Jehovah's Witness wants SCC to overturn new law
- Thread starter Praxius
- Start date
I don't know why mama government thinks it has the right to stick its damn nose into everything.
No doubt due to a lack of consequences I suppose.
No doubt due to a lack of consequences I suppose.
I don't understand how the government on one hand can claim they like to protect freedom of religion here in this country, a reconized one at that and exempt people from certain things based on their religion, and on the other hand, throw a religions' beliefs and rights right out the window when it suits their own agendas.
- It's a reconized religion
- they allow families and their children to follow and practice this religion
- they believe they shouldn't have blood transfusions, yet the doctors over ride their religious views on this matter because they think they know what's right.
- If a religion can believe it goes against their practices to have organ transplants, be an organ donor, to have abortions or not, to be placed on life support after a critical accident, and many doctors will abide by these beliefs and wishes, then where do they get off being able to issue blood transfusions or chemo someone when it goes against their own educated and/or religious views on the situation which relates directly and only to themselves.... whom have to live with the decisions made?
If someone can answer me that big contradiction "Properly" then I might be able to sleep a little bit better tonight (I doubt it). And no.... I couldn't give a rats arse if your explination is just simply "It's the Law to Protect Children" ~ Protect them from who? Themselves? Their parents? Why?
Just because the doctors think their "Best" choice is one of the above, that doesn't make it the "Right" choice and if the parents or the child themselves wants to seek an alternative solution/method and there are alternative solutions/methods that can be used, no matter how lower a chance of sucess there might be from them, they are options and their decisions to choose those options should be priority #1.
In all of these cases it has never been a family or child absolutely refusing treatment of any kind and just wanting to sit and wait for death.... in all of these cases, they wanted to seek alternative solutions to what was being pushed onto them, and when they didn't budge, they got court orders to do what they wanted regardless of the family's wishes.
It's pathetic and it's wrong.
- It's a reconized religion
- they allow families and their children to follow and practice this religion
- they believe they shouldn't have blood transfusions, yet the doctors over ride their religious views on this matter because they think they know what's right.
- If a religion can believe it goes against their practices to have organ transplants, be an organ donor, to have abortions or not, to be placed on life support after a critical accident, and many doctors will abide by these beliefs and wishes, then where do they get off being able to issue blood transfusions or chemo someone when it goes against their own educated and/or religious views on the situation which relates directly and only to themselves.... whom have to live with the decisions made?
If someone can answer me that big contradiction "Properly" then I might be able to sleep a little bit better tonight (I doubt it). And no.... I couldn't give a rats arse if your explination is just simply "It's the Law to Protect Children" ~ Protect them from who? Themselves? Their parents? Why?
Just because the doctors think their "Best" choice is one of the above, that doesn't make it the "Right" choice and if the parents or the child themselves wants to seek an alternative solution/method and there are alternative solutions/methods that can be used, no matter how lower a chance of sucess there might be from them, they are options and their decisions to choose those options should be priority #1.
In all of these cases it has never been a family or child absolutely refusing treatment of any kind and just wanting to sit and wait for death.... in all of these cases, they wanted to seek alternative solutions to what was being pushed onto them, and when they didn't budge, they got court orders to do what they wanted regardless of the family's wishes.
It's pathetic and it's wrong.
I don't know Prax. I'm Catholic, but... I don't think I have the right to say that my kids are Catholic until they're old enough to choose it for themselves and be 'confirmed'. Yes, I take them to church and such, but, I really don't think I'd have the right as a parent, to make a decision which could end their life based on my religion.
it is child abuse when parents imposed their religious dogma on kids and expect them to go without medical attention because it violates their "religion" recently a girl in the U.S diet of diabetic complications because her fund parents refuse medical treatments and rely on prayers which don't work. there is nothing educated about refusing medical treatments especially when this is imposed on children by their parents.
I think the JW and whatever religious sect should be able to do whatever the hell they want, and if a kid or old grannie kicks off because of it.........tough sh!t. Look at the OHIP $'s and hospital beds, doctor's time, court time, and money, we're saving.
A pox on their freakin house. Go and die, and quit writing about it, cause it gets the retarded all upset, and the ""media"" something with which to occupy their time and justify their jobs.
Get a transfusion or not........use clean or dirty needles.........have anal unprotected sex.........make all the stupid fukkin decisions you wish.............Then lie in the bed you make.
And get yer hand outa my pocket...........Just like that foreign guy says on TV, eh.
:headbang:
A pox on their freakin house. Go and die, and quit writing about it, cause it gets the retarded all upset, and the ""media"" something with which to occupy their time and justify their jobs.
Get a transfusion or not........use clean or dirty needles.........have anal unprotected sex.........make all the stupid fukkin decisions you wish.............Then lie in the bed you make.
And get yer hand outa my pocket...........Just like that foreign guy says on TV, eh.
:headbang:
Every few years the government has to step in and save the life of some child who's parents are Jehovah's Witnesses, or some other branch of Holy Rollers who for religious reasons won't allow a medical procedure that will save the child's life. The child is not old enough or mature enough to make that decision. I think the government has to step in in these cases. Why should the kid pay with his/her life because of the stupidity of the parents.
I don't see how people can claim that this is a contradiction of Canada's policy of allowing religious freedom. Religious freedom has NEVER been absolute. You aren't allowed to let your kids die because of your religion. When they are adults, they can choose to refuse or allow any treatments their doctor recommends. Denying them routine, needed and highly succesful medical treatments is no different from denying them food or water.
Hi Shinto; what part don't you understand?
OK, sorry, short explanation..................Make any decision you want...........you should be allowed to.............then accept the results of said decision..........up to and including death of a loved one.............. The government should stay out of your decision making process, and should not interfere.................NOR SHOULD THE GOVT. PAY..........i.e. me, the taxpayer............when your decisions go belly up..........
What could be more clear?
Come on Nuggler
I can't figure out why the Jehovah's Witnesses are still around. Hell, their leaders ran off with all their money at least twice. Is there any reason why we should let any religious group, let alone these crazies kill their kids? Denying medical treatment amounts to nothing less than murder of kids who can't make the decision themselves.
Then the other half of the argument lies in the child making their own informed decisions on the matter and those decisions being respected. I knew about death for as long as I can remember, I have had many serious, sometimes life threatening decisions thrown into my hands as a young child, and apparently I ended up making the right ones..... who is to say that a child can not make those type of decisions in certain situations which directly involve themselves?
On average, yes a child wouldn't know much about blood transfusions, or chemotheraphy, or other forms of operations/proceedures.... but when a child has to face those decisions with little choice in the matter, they absorb, they learn and understand what is going on..... just like how one kid will take up drawing, and another chemestry.... what they deem important to themselves is what they absorb and they can very easily make informed decisions.
And although popular opinion might get shocked at thinking a child might actually want to face death, then to go through more prolonged suffering and lowered quality of life.... they have every right to make those deicions..... and parents should have every right to uphold and defend those decisions if they feel their child came to those conclusions of sound mind.
Oh, and my father sure directed what I went through and did during my Catholic upbringing. Perhaps not life and death, but in many other situations around the world, religion can and does come into life and death decisions and sometimes over rules the opinions of doctors.
the govt should intervene when parents deny medical attention for thier kids based on religion.
Prax, in many provinces children can make those decisions when they've been judged to be competent and mature enough by a court.
But in that situation and story, I agreed that the parents were in the wrong... but the thin line of difference in that situation and these situations in paticular is that the above example, the example of the child going through Chemo and other cases, involved the children and parents wanting to seek alternative solutions other then the one's they were forced into...... Not to just refuse any and all treatment all together like the above example you mentioned and then rely on prayer.
If there are other medical options and alternatives available that a family or child can seek, then they should have every right to "Choose" those options over what the doctor has suggested and then demands via court order.
Why don't they just outlaw Holy Rollers? Any "religion" that will break up families in order to get members isn't a real Church anyhow. It's a cult....
I disagree, and it isn't an equivilant to food and water.
When a child is in a coma, or is on life support due to some tragic accident or physical condition, who makes the decision to pull the plug and why?
Makes sense to me, and I agree.
If their religious views go against medical advice and they may face death, it's irrelevent how old the child is or isn't, because they are already born, raised and conditioned into that religion, and chances are that when they do become an adult, their decision will still be the same as it would have been when they were a child..... they feel blood transfusions are wrong..... what exactly will change this later on?
Nothing.... as the girl above who had it forced on her is now fighting the courts:
"It was painful - even physically it was painful - but mentally it was something that I believed shouldn't be happening."
"If it came to the point where I'd die - which I certainly hope not, because I want to live as much as the next person - it's like a decision that I've made already."
^ What makes you think you're going to change someone's mind like this? This isn't her parents speaking for her, this is herself speaking for herself and her personal experience.
I hate to say it to some people in here, but face it.... some people, including children, have already accepted their own mortality and chances of death and many can and will accept the consequences of their own actions which relate to their own health.
As an adult, I personally don't believe in Blood Transfusions, or Vacinations for that matter... not for some religous reason(s) but based on my own path in life I wish to take..... I don't give a sh*t what some doctor thinks it best for me, or if he/she thinks I'm some mentally instable person who can't make the decisions soundly for my own life.... My life, my body, my decision.... hell if I want to commit suicide tomorrow.... who the hell's gonna stop me? (not that I do)
Ok, let's play that scenario out for a second:
Let's say there were no religions in existence.... and someone still refuses treatment proceedures based on some personal reasons they believe a lot in, should the doctors still ignore their own wishes and perform whatever they damn well please on their bodies because they know what's best? Since when have doctors become dictators?
And once again.... you're all still stuck on this "Denial of Treatment" when it's already been shown above and has been explained countless time by myself alone, that they did not deny medical treatment, they sought alternative medical treatment besides the suggested treatments they were forced into.
And once again, children can and do make those decisions.... our laws require change.
And by the time a court does that, the child has most likely been forced into the treatment they're in the courts to fight to begin with. A bit contradicting in my view. Once again, the laws require change.