Parents pick prayer over doctor; diabetic girl dies

Praxius

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Dec 18, 2007
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Madeline Kara Neumann, of Weston, Wis., is shown working on chalk art last summer during downtown Wausau's Chalk Fest. (AP / Wausau Daily Herald, Butch McCartney)

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNe...328/prayer_diabetes_080328/20080328?hub=World

WESTON, Wis. -- Police are investigating an 11-year-old girl's death from an undiagnosed, treatable form of diabetes after her parents chose to pray for her rather than take her to a doctor.


An autopsy showed Madeline Neumann died Sunday of diabetic ketoacidosis, a condition that left too little insulin in her body, Everest Metro Police Chief Dan Vergin said.


She had probably been ill for about a month, suffering symptoms such as nausea, vomiting, excessive thirst, loss of appetite and weakness, the chief said Wednesday, noting that he expects to complete the investigation by Friday and forward the results to the district attorney.


The girl's mother, Leilani Neumann, said that she and her family believe in the Bible and that healing comes from God, but that they do not belong to an organized religion or faith, are not fanatics and have nothing against doctors.


She insisted her youngest child, a wiry girl known to wear her straight brown hair in a ponytail, was in good health until recently.


"We just noticed a tiredness within the past two weeks," she said Wednesday. "And then just the day before and that day (she died), it suddenly just went to a more serious situation. We stayed fast in prayer then. We believed that she would recover. We saw signs that to us, it looked like she was recovering."


Her daughter -- who hadn't seen a doctor since she got some shots as a 3-year-old, according to Vergin -- had no fever and there was warmth in her body, she said.


The girl's father, Dale Neumann, a former police officer, said he started CPR "as soon as the breath of life left" his daughter's body.


Family members elsewhere called authorities to seek help for the girl.


"My sister-in-law, she's very religious, she believes in faith instead of doctors ...," the girl's aunt told a sheriff's dispatcher Sunday afternoon in a call from California. "And she called my mother-in-law today ... and she explained to us that she believes her daughter's in a coma now and she's relying on faith."


The dispatcher got more information from the caller and asked whether an ambulance should be sent.


"Please," the woman replied. "I mean, she's refusing. She's going to fight it. ... We've been trying to get her to take her to the hospital for a week, a few days now."


The aunt called back with more information on the family's location, emergency logs show. Family friends also made a 911 call from the home. Police and paramedics arrived within minutes and immediately called for an ambulance that took her to a hospital.


But less than an hour after authorities reached the home, Madeline -- a bright student who left public school for home schooling this semester -- was declared dead.

She is survived by her parents and three older siblings.


"We are remaining strong for our children," Leilani Neumann said. "Only our faith in God is giving us strength at this time."


The Neumanns said they moved from California to a modern, middle-class home in woodsy Weston, just outside Wassau in central Wisconsin, about two years ago to open a coffee shop and be closer to other relatives. A basketball hoop is set up in the driveway.


Leilani Neumann said she and her husband are not worried about the investigation because "our lives are in God's hands. We know we did not do anything criminal. We know we did the best for our daughter we knew how to do."

:-? Yeah.... Smooth Move Ex-Lax!

Chop an arm off and see if God will grow it back for you. *shakes head*

I mean sure, I will only goto the hospital if I can't deal with something myself..... But at least I still go.

GGEEEEZZZZZZZ People!
 

karrie

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Jan 6, 2007
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It pisses me off when zealots refuse to see that God also graced you with freewill and brain for crying out loud.
 

Praxius

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Dec 18, 2007
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The last two redded sections really got to me and put a bad taste in my mouth more so.

"We are remaining strong for our children," Leilani Neumann said. "Only our faith in God is giving us strength at this time."

^ Well he sure as hell didn't give your daughter any strength..... but the kicker:

Leilani Neumann said she and her husband are not worried about the investigation because "our lives are in God's hands. We know we did not do anything criminal. We know we did the best for our daughter we knew how to do."

They are not worried about possibly getting charged for neglect or what have you, because their life is in God's hands now.... they seem to truly believe they didn't do anything criminal?

Talk about scapegoating their responsibilities, not acknowledging what they have done to their daughter, throwing the responsibility on God of all things (Which of course is something you can not arrest or charge)..... and on top of that.... They knew they did all they could for her that they knew how to do?

TAKE HER TO THE FRIGGIN DOCTOR YOU NINCOMPOOPS!!!!

FFS, were they raised in a Barn? NO! They're not Marry, Joseph, Jesus & Friends... they came from California!

And what just added to my semi-frustrations on this matter, is that the parents just don't get it! They don't seem to accept that they screwed up big time. The rest of the family knew to call 9/11... they knew something was wrong for a week or so..... yet the parents claim it only started to occur for a day or so before she died..... seriously?

Their daughter died from something treatable, it didn't go against their religious beliefs to take her to a doctor, because they don't claim membership to any registered religion or one that can be identified, except the one they pulled out of their arse. Frig, I can do that.... make up my own religion and then do something stupid or illegal and say "Hey.... it's part of my religion, back off eh!"

Now she's dead, the parents haven't clued the hell in, they are still responsible for 3 other kids... and chances are if something else like this was to happen again, they are expressing the mentality that they would do the exact same thing and no take them to the hospital.
 

Praxius

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Dec 18, 2007
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Oh and before people tag the above comments to the other one in regards to Vaccines or the blood transfusion debate with the Witnesses or whoever.... this isn't quite the same thing.

In both of those other cases the parents still see a friggin doctor for some advice at least.
 

karrie

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Jan 6, 2007
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Like I said Prax, they're not thinking. They've shut their brains down and are leaving all their thinking up to God. That clearly doesn't work in any context.
 

jenn

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Jan 13, 2008
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this isn't the first time this has happened..and won't be the last.. I truely think ALL kids should be required to see a doctor at least once a year....
 

karrie

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Jan 6, 2007
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Frankly, cases like this tend to make me think it's more likely akin to something like Munchausen by proxy than it is to do with any actual religious faith in God. Some people feed off of drama, and will find it at any cost. Having to sit and pray over an ailing child, seek out prayers from others, make a big production of it in church... it would get these people a lot more attention than if they were to just take the kids to the doctor. And now they have the attention of faithfully waiting for God to help them out of their mess (ie, asking for more prayers and support from their church).
 

lone wolf

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Nov 25, 2006
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There comes a time when freedom of religion has to take a back seat. If they want to drink electric kool-aid and go off chasing comets, amen ... but leave the kids out of it. That's just regarding a child as property.

Woof!
 

gerryh

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Nov 21, 2004
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The other children should be removed NOW and they both be charged with child abuse...child neglect....or whatever else they can think of.
 

karrie

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There comes a time when freedom of religion has to take a back seat. If they want to drink electric kool-aid and go off chasing comets, amen ... but leave the kids out of it. That's just regarding a child as property.

Woof!

I wonder why the police didn't step in sooner. There is legal precedent for removing kids from these sorts of situations. Religious freedom doesn't apply to child neglect.
 

Sal

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Sep 29, 2007
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I wonder why the police didn't step in sooner. There is legal precedent for removing kids from these sorts of situations. Religious freedom doesn't apply to child neglect.
Maybe because the father was a cop.

What a disaster.
 

gerryh

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Nov 21, 2004
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riiiiiiiiiight......... cause killing them before is so much better than after.
 

Zzarchov

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Aug 28, 2006
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Remember:

People have a right to freedom of religion, until they actually practice it.


Religions do have unpleasant sides to them, and some have more unpleasantness than others, it always boggles my mind when people talk about religious diversity as if that is automatically a good thing.
 

gerryh

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Nov 21, 2004
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Why did god not respond to anyone's intercessory prayers? I'd be interested to see how they rationalize that one.

Remember:

People have a right to freedom of religion, until they actually practice it.


Religions do have unpleasant sides to them, and some have more unpleasantness than others, it always boggles my mind when people talk about religious diversity as if that is automatically a good thing.


:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:
 

gerryh

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reminds me of a joke..... a vey pious man prayed to God to allow him to win the lottery. The money that he would win could help in so many wonderous ways. Lottery day came and no one won. He again prayed to God to allow him to win the lottery, again Lottery day came and no one won. Again he got down on his knees and eseached the Lord to let him win the Lottery, again, lottery day came and no one won. One last time, he got down on his knees and prayed, he asked God to allow him to win the lottery and asked why God had not answered his prayers, he was a pious man, always abiding by the Lords laws, observing the Lords day, doing everything he could. Then there was a loud clap of thunder and voice boomed down from the Heavens....... You gotta meet me half way...... BUY A LOTTERY TICKET!