Animal rights group calls on China to respect rats

[Praxius]

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080204/China_rats_080204/20080204?hub=World

BEIJING -- An animal rights group called Monday for China to treat rats with kindness and respect, as millions across the nation begin to celebrate the coming Year of the Rat.

People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, or PETA, said it has asked the Chinese government to consider animal welfare laws for rats used in laboratory experiments. The group also recommended a series of guidelines for animals used in science.

"Rats sing, they dream, and they express empathy for others," Coco Yu of PETA's Asia-Pacific branch said in a statement.

China has increasingly become a place of business for international pharmaceutical companies, the group said.

The country has a shoddy animal rights record. There is little animal welfare legislation, many zoos are poorly run and animal parts are traded for use in traditional Chinese medicine. Activists have called on China to phase out bear farms, where bile is harvested for traditional medicine, complaining that the animals are often raised in inhumane conditions.

The rat is one of 12 animals in the 12-year cycle of the Chinese zodiac, which follows the lunar calendar. The Lunar New Year is Thursday.

I somewhat understand where they're coming from.... but uh.... they're rats. Shall they leave some scraps of food out at night to make them happy? When they see one running around their homes should they just give it a name, rather then stomp the crap out of them? When a child is bitten by one and catches some deathly illness, shall that be considdered a sign from the blessed rat?

And then after this year is up, do things go back to the same as before?

And also, who actually thinks China is gonna give a rats ass? *Pun intended*

 

[karrie]

From the article you posted....


"People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, or PETA, said it has asked the Chinese government to consider animal welfare laws for rats used in laboratory experiments. The group also recommended a series of guidelines for animals used in science."

Frankly, given China's track record, a small beginning with lab animals is a great thing.

 

[Praxius]

Well I was leaning more on the point they made where China doesn't have much of a record for animal rights.... I just kinda think that trying to get them to start on the Rat is kinda a lost cause. Maybe Pandas or something with a cute face to start off on.... but something that's generally seen around the world as a parasitic-loaded pest just doesn't seem to be the best first step.

That's like trying to start an animal rights movement in Paris for Pigeons, or in New York for Cockroaches.

I dunno.... it just seems pretty silly to be trying to make a move on a country for animal rights, esspecially when it's considdered by many a pest, just because it's the year of that animal.

Where were all these people last year for the rat?

And considderation is one thing, acting is another. No wait.... they asked that they considder, it's not even to the point of considderation or acting yet. To me it just seems they're trying to milk this just for the sole reason it's the Year of the Rat, AKA: an animal rights group attempting to expliot a national herritage for their own personal gains.

I appreciate their attempt for certain reasons, but their foundation as to why they took this step is faulty.

 

[karrie]

In many countries, animal rights started off with the industrial and medical arenas, not with public opinion. So how the population in general sees rats is a bit of a moot point. How the researchers see them, when they are in day to day contact, is what's going to matter. They know rats beyond the preconceived notions people in general have of them.

 

[Praxius]

True, but the article isn't just pointing to science labs and related, but also pointed out to China's general treatment of animals, such as in zoos, animals being used in farms for just their bile, etc.

To me, this seemed like the orginizations' first attempt to tackle China's rep on all these cases by starting with the Rat, because it's the Year of the Rat, not just because of how they're used in Labs.

Personally, I feel that if they really wanted to make an impact/impression, that they perhaps shouldn't have just focused on the rat for obvious reasons, but rather form a solid argument towards the Chinese Government for all their general concerns of all animals. Make a template of new proceedures and alternative methods of handling these animals as a whole, rather then just one animal at a time..... this way they'll take forever and I know I wouldn't take them seriously.

As there are certain rights issued to all humans of all genders, races, religious backgrounds, etc.... so to should they have made a list of basic rights for all animals under their control... both in Labs, Zoos or in the everyday household of families. Start off with a transitional system to get people on board to the new concepts and then over 5 years or so, start to increase those rights and treatments to a better quality until they're on par with other countries (by average of course)

Added:

In many countries, animal rights started off with the industrial and medical arenas, not with public opinion. So how the population in general sees rats is a bit of a moot point....

Back to this a bit.... most of those industries and medical arenas never made any changes until what they were doing was exposed to the public, which in turn made them force change, or lose profit/business/become boycotted. Much of this occured in the 60's I believe.

 

[Scott Free]

I'm sorry but this is ridiculous! We're talking about rats. I support the ethical treatment of animals but PETA takes that concept to an entirely ludicrous extreme.

"Rats sing, they dream, and they express empathy for others," so what? They also carry the plague!

What's next? The ethical treatment of the smallpox virus - it's cute and cuddly too under a microscope? Any volunteers?

 

[missile]

As long as they're killing them, I don't give a damn how. I like most animals, too:smile:especially the tasty ones.

 

[karrie]

Well, what PETA is doing, and how the article slants the issue of animal rights in China, aren't necessarily the same thing. I basically ignored the broad comments about animal rights, since they seemed to come from the author, and focused on what PETA has said directly that they are doing. That included guidelines 'for animals used in science', not just rats. While they've taken cues from something that is obviously very meaningful to a lot of their country, the Chinese Zodiac, to help underscore their point, the article didn't say they were doing it one animal at a time. Merely that they were using it to highlight all of their work in pushing for the rights of lab animals. And the guidelines applied to science industries are so different from zoos, slaughter houses, and homes, that trying to do all areas with one set of blanket guidelines doesn't work.

True, but the article isn't just pointing to science labs and related, but also pointed out to China's general treatment of animals, such as in zoos, animals being used in farms for just their bile, etc.

To me, this seemed like the orginizations' first attempt to tackle China's rep on all these cases by starting with the Rat, because it's the Year of the Rat, not just because of how they're used in Labs.

Personally, I feel that if they really wanted to make an impact/impression, that they perhaps shouldn't have just focused on the rat for obvious reasons, but rather form a solid argument towards the Chinese Government for all their general concerns of all animals. Make a template of new proceedures and alternative methods of handling these animals as a whole, rather then just one animal at a time..... this way they'll take forever and I know I wouldn't take them seriously.

As there are certain rights issued to all humans of all genders, races, religious backgrounds, etc.... so to should they have made a list of basic rights for all animals under their control... both in Labs, Zoos or in the everyday household of families. Start off with a transitional system to get people on board to the new concepts and then over 5 years or so, start to increase those rights and treatments to a better quality until they're on par with other countries (by average of course)

Added:



Back to this a bit.... most of those industries and medical arenas never made any changes until what they were doing was exposed to the public, which in turn made them force change, or lose profit/business/become boycotted. Much of this occured in the 60's I believe.

 

[karrie]

I'm sorry but this is ridiculous! We're talking about rats. I support the ethical treatment of animals but PETA takes that concept to an entirely ludicrous extreme.

"Rats sing, they dream, and they express empathy for others," so what? They also carry the plague!

What's next? The ethical treatment of the smallpox virus - it's cute and cuddly too under a microscope? Any volunteers?

You don't think scientists should have to follow guidelines on how they treat their animals, based strictly on their capability to carry disease in the wild?

 

[missile]

I don't imagine PETA would care if China decided to change its medical testing procedures amd go back to doing so on their many political prisoners. PETA goes way overboard in its aims. Reminds me of the group overseeing animal cruelty in the movies: not even a fly is injured during filming[or else]:lol:

 

[karrie]

I see a lot wrong with PETA as well. But, I don't think anything in this article was overboard personally. When you consider that this is essentially pushing for guidelines we enacted decades ago. Also, I don't necessarily judge PETA in China with PETA here. In China there are real goals to meet.

 

[missile]

I've been mad at them ever since Pam Anderson paraded around in a lettuce bikini..thus ruining a good salad.

 

[karrie]

PETA in North America has pretty much done everything it can do. They've graduated from activists to harpies. But, China's a bit of a different ball game, and I don't want to lump the two in together, regardless of how many innocent lettuce plants had to get herpes for Pam's fashion statement.

 

[Praxius]

PETA in North America has pretty much done everything it can do. They've graduated from activists to harpies. But, China's a bit of a different ball game, and I don't want to lump the two in together, regardless of how many innocent lettuce plants had to get herpes for Pam's fashion statement.

Yeah she sure showed her brains over the sealing issue a while back :-?

But in relation to China and their ability to take an approach to rights, I guess I can direct to this thread:

http://forums.canadiancontent.net/odd-news/71111-embattled-nurses-get-bill-rights.html

.....China published rules on Monday guarding the rights of its nurses, seeking to give them protection against sometimes violent attacks by angry patients or their families.....

Seems laid out pretty well and covers many concerns.

This is kinda what I was talking about. Bring the true and real concerns to their attention, provide proper evidence and present it as though it's important. In other words, bring up the case for animal rights properly, not try and start with a rat because it's the year of the Rat..... that's just amateur like something a jr. high kid would present.

"Don't hurt the bunny because he brings easter eggs each year" ~ Basically the same mentality in my books.

 

[missile]

Rats are raised domestically for food in China. You should see the size of some of them!Make our wharf rats seem like baby mice in comparison:smile: I would never ever want to be in the neighbourhood if 35 pound rats got loose8O

 

[Colpy]

Excuse me?

How about we get China to do something REALLY earth-shattering?.....like forget about the ****ing rats and animal rights, and pay a little attention to human rights.......

This is a nation that executes several times the number of people executed in the rest of the wotrld combined.....usually harvesting the organs of those killed, sometimes before their execution.

This is a nation in which peaceful democracy protesters are shot down in the streets.

This is a nation that jails and murders people for simply practising a religious faith.........

Are we really discussing ANIMAL rights in China?

 

[karrie]

Look at the population of China.

I think that , perhaps.... just perhaps... they have enough activists to bring about change on both fronts Colpy.

Unless you can show me a really clear reason that one has to be addressed before the other?

 

[Praxius]

Excuse me?

How about we get China to do something REALLY earth-shattering?.....like forget about the ****ing rats and animal rights, and pay a little attention to human rights.......

This is a nation that executes several times the number of people executed in the rest of the wotrld combined.....usually harvesting the organs of those killed, sometimes before their execution.

This is a nation in which peaceful democracy protesters are shot down in the streets.

This is a nation that jails and murders people for simply practising a religious faith.........

Are we really discussing ANIMAL rights in China?

As linked above, China just placed a new policy on rights for nurses in hospitals, due to the level of violence they encounter.

It's a bit different from how we do things, but it's a start.

 

[Praxius]

Look at the population of China.

I think that , perhaps.... just perhaps... they have enough activists to bring about change on both fronts Colpy.

Unless you can show me a really clear reason that one has to be addressed before the other?

Well logically why would they impose rights for animals over their own species?

 

[karrie]

but they are working on human rights.

why would they have to wait to address animal rights?

why can't work occur on both fronts? Is our scope of understanding that limited?