Re: Man dies after Taser shock by police at Vancouver airportApr 18th, 2008
They should just skip the tasers and throw them on the 3'rd rail in the subway stations, both usually end in death anyways.
Tasering a fleeing man? Isn't that a lot like shooting them in the back? I thought the taser, even before the scandals, was touted mainly as a self defense weapon. Most of these cases make it sound more like they're using them because they're too lazy to actually do their job, you know, pull the off the handrail or, I don't know, chase down the fleeing fare dodger.
A Taser gun doesn't routinely kill people, although the conducted energy weapon delivers electric current up to 85 times what's lethal, an American electrical engineer told a public inquiry in Vancouver Monday.Quote has been trimmed
The Taser sends out a high jolt of electric current, but the charge from the weapon isn't deadly on its own because it's pulsed and not constant, said J. Patrick Reilly, the first person to testify at the two-phase inquiry prompted by the death of Polish immigrant Robert Dziekanski at the Vancouver airport last October.
The Taser is not a "benign device" but it has a "low, small probability" of causing injury or even death, said Reilly, a researcher at Johns Hopkins University in the U.S., who studied the Taser for the Department of Defense and the Department of Justice four years ago.
In a slideshow presentation, Reilly walked the inquiry commissioner, retired B.C. Appeal Court justice Thomas Braidwood, through a lesson in electricity, and explained why the Taser doesn't routinely kill people.
Reilly documented a variety of human and animal studies that demonstrated the Taser's effect on blood chemistry and respiration, but said he was unable to determine why some people die after being stunned.
It is real simple.
The Taser should be classified as "lethal force", therefore it can ONLY be used when the officer or another is in "Immediate danger of death or grievous bodily harm".........in other words, the Taser should only be deployed in the same situation where one could legally use the firearm...........
Then just remove it completely and resort back to the firearm, clubs and pepper spray and the problem is still solved.
Your option also works, so meh.
Yeah I heard about him.... I never understood why that knife/sword kiosk was right smack dab near the main entrance of the mall / middle of the hallway.
But of course, they could have just shot the guy in the arm or leg and then the problem's solve too.... and he's got a nice scar for memory-sake.... perhaps some tissue and muscle damage too.... that'll teach him to not be so stupid next time.
I am consistently amazed at the number of people that think shooting someone in the arm or leg is easy..........it isn't, not by a long shot. AND you are responsible for the bouncing, ricocheting bullets that miss or pass through...........
Open fire in a mall, especially trying to hit an arm or leg?.........NOT a good idea......as well as the fact that shooting someone in the upper leg would be more apt to kill them than a tasering.....the femoral artery you know.
You ONLY fire centre mass with a firearm......
which means you always shoot at the centre of what you can see.......in this case, the entire man, so you shoot for the middle of is chest....or you don't shoot. Too much chance of missing or over-penetration.
No argument about their right to shoot at the point this guy started waving a sword around......and had he attempted in any serious way to escape the corner they had him in, she was quite willing to shoot him.....as a last resort.
I was branch training officer in NB for Brinks....I taught armed self-defense to armoured car guards......I carried a handgun every working day for 11 years.....and I saw how poorly people shoot on a range at a stationary target. How much less so on the street, at a moving target, when you are under stress. Centre mass is how it is taught, and done........everywhere.
BTW, I haven't heard of police using warning shots in 35 years at least....it is simply not done today, trust me on this one.
A court ruling in the United States about Tasers is causing concern in Canada's medical community.
The U.S.-based manufacturer of the controversial stun guns, Taser International, has won a court order in Ohio that forces a medical examiner to change autopsy reports.
Dr. Lisa Kohler had found that electrical shocks from Tasers were partially to blame for the deaths of three men in separate confrontations with police.
Taser International launched and won a civil suit, forcing Kohler to delete any reference to the deaths being related to electric shocks, and to term them "accidental deaths."
Dr. Matthew Stanbrook of the Canadian Medical Association (CMA) says the decision doesn't take into account the difficult of determining an exact cause of death in almost every case.
"If we were required to have at the level of scientific and medical certainty that something was the cause of death, before we were permitted to declare it, most of the people who died in North America would have died of unknown causes," Stanbrook said.
"It is a physician making their best judgment given all the facts available."
Stanbrook is deputy editor of the CMA Journal, which last week carried an editorial that expressed discontent with the current research into the effects of Taser use on suspects. The editorial said most of that work was done at the behest of Taser International and needed to be verified by independent researchers.
"New and independent research, both epidemiologic and biological, into whether Tasers can kill is essential to settle this issue," the editorial said.
Doctors and medical examiners in the United States have also expressed unease over the Ohio court decision.
Dr. Jeff Jentzen of the National Association of Medical Examiners said the case could affect other autopsy results.
"The physician shouldn't be threatened by individual companies attempting to preserve the reputation of their project," Jentzen said.
Taser International CEO Rick Smith told CBC News in January that medical examiners had to be sure of their facts because if they made what he called a careless opinion, they will be held accountable in court.
In submissions to the court in Ohio, Taser International said 68 wrongful-death or injury lawsuits involving Taser use have been dismissed or found in favour of the company.
An elderly man in Kamloops, B.C., was zapped three times on the torso by a police stun gun while lying on his hospital bed, CBC News has learned.
Frank Lasser, 82, appeared fragile Thursday when he showed the Taser marks on his body and talked about the ordeal he went through Saturday.
"They [police] should have known I had bypass surgery," Lasser told CBC News.
Lasser has had heart surgery and needs to carry an apparatus to supply oxygen at all times. He was in the Royal Inland Hospital Saturday due to pneumonia but has since been released.
RCMP said nurses called police after Lasser became delirious and pulled a knife out of his pocket.
Lasser told CBC News that he sometimes becomes delusional when he can't breathe properly. He said he couldn't explain why he refused to let go of the knife even after the Mounties arrived.
"I was laying on the bed by then and the corporal came in, or the sergeant, I forget which it was, and said to the guys, 'OK, get him because we got more important work to do on the street tonight,'" Lasser said.
"And then, bang, bang, bang, three times with the laser, and I tell you, I never want that again."
Kamloops RCMP said Thursday that officers had no other option but to deploy the conducted energy weapon when Lasser refused to drop his knife.
"Whether the person is 80 or 20, we are dealing with a person who had a deadly weapon in their hand," Cpl. Scott Wilson told CBC News.
"We could not deploy our … pepper spray, because we could potentially contaminate the entire hospital."
Lasser said there were three RCMP officers in his hospital room and believes they could have easily handled him without the use of a Taser.
"They could have gone in there and taken an old man without any trouble at all," said Lasser, who is an ex-prison guard.
And what would have been the outcome if they'd simply used a folded blanket to cover him and disable his "knife-hand"? Our RCMP has turned into a brainless gang of thugs hiding under the cover of "legislation"...... just like our phoney corrupt government!
Maybe they should serve a duty in the local Tim Horton's where they could use the taser to guard tim-bits!
Our country is a joke and our police are the new modern Keystone Kops!
A former prison guard with a knife..just devil's advocate here,
But one wrong slash with a knife can be lights out , permenently, if the delerious guy gets a lucky slash.
A better question, is why does a guy getting out of bypass surgery have a knife in his pocket?