Man dies after Taser shock by police at Vancouver airport


grumpydigger
#1021
All that is needed is accountability and no double standard .... proper recruitment and training would be nice to.....not lowering the standards as the rcmp has announced ............They just dont seem to grasp how mad the people of canada are.... I guess that is just their arrogant s ...........................
 
Scott Free
#1022
I hope they get charged. The RCMP is the biggest criminal cartel in BC and it needs to be dealt with.
 
Colpy
#1023
Quote: Originally Posted by grumpydiggerView Post

All that is needed is accountability and no double standard .... proper recruitment and training would be nice to.....not lowering the standards as the rcmp has announced ............They just dont seem to grasp how mad the people of canada are.... I guess that is just their arrogant s ...........................

Absolutely!

Criminal negligence causing death

Obstructing justice
 
JLM
#1024
Quote: Originally Posted by ColpyView Post

Absolutely!

Criminal negligence causing death

Obstructing justice

I personally feel that those whose duty it is to uphold and enforce the law, should be subject to double the penalty of the ordinary citizen when they break it. Yep, 28 years for perjury sounds good to me.
 
Ron in Regina
#1025
By accepting the position on the Government Payroll, they're also accepting
the position of having the Public's trust. Violating the Public's trust by committing
a crime should be punished just as anyone else (not double anyone else) as
we do have one Criminal Code for all Canadians. I'm talking in general terms
here and not specificly about the Dziekanski death in trying to take a step back
to see the forest for the trees.

A big part of the problem in this instance is a perceived (real or not) double standard
of one set of laws the Public have to follow, and a different set that the Public that
carry a Badge get to follow....creating the ugly "us against them" mentality on both
sides of the issue. Double the penalty of the non-Badge carry'n Public will not help
eliminate the "us against them" mentality...and a walk on Manslaughter will not
help eliminate the "us against them" mentality.

The RCMP (and other Canadian Law Enforcement Agencies) need to demonstrate
the "You do the Crime, You do the Time" phrase applies to every Citizen in this
country whether they carry a Badge or not....fairly....with the existing laws in the
Criminal Code of Canada to help regain full public trust once again. That's part of
the answer, but only a part of the answer.

Another part of the answer is the "Police policing the Police" but that is fodder
for another Thread as it's a bit off topic from this Thread.
 
#juan
#1026
I have no sympathy for these guys. They tasered the guy unconscious and didn,t try to treat him and wouldn't allow anyone else to treat him. That is reckless disregard for human life, or criminal negligence at the very least......Charge them.
 
VanIsle
#1027
Do any of you read anything other then when it's the RCMP that are in trouble. Over the past few years many "heads" of many Canadian police forces have been fired or forced to retire so having the RCMP being taken care of by leaders from Ottawa isn't the problem. I think having a person in charge (The Commissoner)who has never been a police officer could be a problem. How do you steer the ship when you've never helped or participated in sailing it? From what I see, things have gone from bad to worse since they had a civilian take over. Just look how much China who apparantly lives in China, dictates the threads here on this forum and how everyone jumps to join him. He aids all of you into focusing on 4 members of the police rather than the Force as a whole. He leads you around by the nose helping you to form an opinion that re-enforces his own, rather than anyone looking, again, at the Force as a whole, and no one ever focuses on any of the good that is done. Why does he care if BC gets rid of the RCMP? Years ago it was city police that were all the bad guys. Then they raised the pay level and since they don't transfer people around (something that can be and usually is very disruptive to families)many of the RCMP left and were hired on by the city forces. That is all that would happen now anyway even if the man from China was successful in his quest to destroy the Force which will never happen. Cities cannot afford to start the training process for the numbers they would need for one thing and for another, something would have to give because they would then be responsible for 100% of the costs of paying for their policing and they are not right now.
Pay cuts would have to happen. City police forces usually have unions. City taxes would go up. Who would police the rural areas? Do you think the RCMP are going to send in 2 - 3 members for the little towns without regular members nearby? Gee, we could have it like the USA where some big Bubba comes to look after things wearing his big tin badge on the front of his hat or shirt. I guess you would all be more secure with that?
JLM - are you sure you only want them to get - what was it - 32 years? How about hanging them high. You are for capital punishment aren't you. You want the lives of 4 people when only one man used the taser under the orders of another man. How would all of you see that situation if it was the army? Would you say all 4 were guilty of killing a man. Would you say one man was guilty of killing a man. Would you say the man who ordered the shooting of the taser was the guilty one? Would you say the man who followed orders should be transfered and re-trained on the taser (since it seems right now that all police forces are going to continue it's use), that two of them should just be transfered (maybe a few months without pay for not telling the truth which again was probably ordered by some higher up)and the one who ordered the shooting be the one who is actually charged with the crime. His crime in this case would be abuse of authority (leading to a death)for which he should lose his job and his pension. I don't think you will ever see a repeat of any of this again.
Any police officer worth their salt will not only arrest the Mayor's son but will arrest the Mayor too if need be. That was proven in the Okanagan a couple of years or so ago.
 
darkbeaver
#1028
Quote: Originally Posted by JLMView Post

I disagree, for our law enforcement officers to have any credibility, when they screw up they have to be punished to the fullest extent of the law. Otherwise the whole charade just becomes an exercise in "nudge nudge wink wink".

It's perspective I think, pretend they aren't our cops and the only mistake they made was getting filmed otherwise the lying pieces of chicken dung would have gotten away free and easy without this nasty expose in the media. It has been my opinion for quite some time that the whole exercise has long ago become "nudge nudge wink wink" at every concievable level. It's the preservation of that charade that's important in this case and nothing else not even the appalingly ****ty training these thuggies get nor misuse of police power in general. The facts not being persued are that tazers are extremely dangerous and at present it is a crap shoot wheather the victims live or die.
Further to that and along the lines of control and ownership, the mounties are certainly not in public control and they are most likely not in Canadian control.
The federal police are primary targets in any subversion.
 
Ron in Regina
#1029
Quote: Originally Posted by Ron in ReginaView Post

By accepting the position on the Government Payroll, they're also accepting
the position of having the Public's trust. Violating the Public's trust by committing
a crime should be punished just as anyone else (not double anyone else) as
we do have one Criminal Code for all Canadians. I'm talking in general terms
here and not specificly about the Dziekanski death in trying to take a step back
to see the forest for the trees.

A big part of the problem in this instance is a perceived (real or not) double standard
of one set of laws the Public have to follow, and a different set that the Public that
carry a Badge get to follow....creating the ugly "us against them" mentality on both
sides of the issue. Double the penalty of the non-Badge carry'n Public will not help
eliminate the "us against them" mentality...and a walk on Manslaughter will not
help eliminate the "us against them" mentality.

The RCMP (and other Canadian Law Enforcement Agencies) need to demonstrate
the "You do the Crime, You do the Time" phrase applies to every Citizen in this
country whether they carry a Badge or not....fairly....with the existing laws in the
Criminal Code of Canada to help regain full public trust once again. That's part of
the answer, but only a part of the answer.

Another part of the answer is the "Police policing the Police" but that is fodder
for another Thread as it's a bit off topic from this Thread.


No matter what Police Force (be it RCMP or BCPD?), the
problem (as I see it) isn't who we put in place for Law Enforcement,
but how a question of wrong-doing by Law Enforcement is actually
investigated....and who actually does that investigation...so as to be
(or to be seen to be) truly impartial in the eyes of the Public to remove
the double standard (or appearance of a double standard) of how the
Law is applied.
 
china
#1030
Comment: The growing Dziekanski scandal

National Post Published: Friday, April 24, 2009
More On This Story




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Canwest News ServiceThis screengrab from a bystander's video shows Polish immigrant Robert Dziekanski shortly before he was Tasered by police.

Thanks to the latest testimony at the hearing into Robert Dziekanski's death, we now know the RCMP's sorry mishandling of the 2007 tragedy reached well beyond the four officers who Tasered the Polish traveller until he died.
Corporal Dale Carr, spokesman with a unit tasked with investigating the death, made clear that the four officers are just one link in a chain of command which takes for granted that misleading the public, misinforming journalists and covering up for one another is a routine part of their job.
Consider Cpl. Carr's testimony. He told the inquiry, headed by former Appeal Court justice Thomas Braidwood, that within hours of Mr. Dziekanski's death at Vancouver International Airport, he attended a meeting of homicide investigators, and twice watched an amateur video showing the confrontation that led to Dziekanski's death. Making notes, Cpl. Carr wrote that Dziekanski grabbed a computer, ignored instructions from police, swung at the officers and continued to resist once knocked to the ground by the first Taser strike.
None of that was true. Nevertheless, he passed the imagined narrative on to another RCMP spokesman, and stood by him as he related the falsehoods to reporters. (He claims he wasn't really listening.)When it became evident later that the information was wrong, a superior told him not to correct the record. Nor was he allowed to acknowledge the existence of the damning video, which the force gave up only after its owner went to court.
All of this comes amidst a de-bate about how much latitude officers should be given to use Tasers to subdue victims. In this regard, the Dziekanski revelations have done little to bolster the RCMP's claim that its officers should be able to use such weapons at their own discretion. By brutalizing a confused traveller, and then apparently conspiring to obscure the truth about the encounter, the RCMP has squandered much of the esteem in which Canadians hold this institution.
 
dumpthemonarchy
#1031
Ottawa simply lacks accountability with the provinces, the arm's length relationship with this federal agency is far too remote. Ottawa simply has great trouble taking into account local or provincial sensibilities. The premier of BC or the legislature simply has no power over it.

For a growing, dynamic province like BC, the RCMP is done because it is too stodgy, bureaucratic, and untruthful. We need a provincial police force run by British Columbians and accountable to BCers

Currently, there is no party in Ottawa with the desire and ability to put pressure on the RCMP for BC. Dump'em.
 
lone wolf
#1032
International airports will still be RCMP's beat because they are under federal jurisdiction.
 
dumpthemonarchy
#1033
The airport killing by the RCMP of Robert D is just one of many examples why a BC police force is needed. This was the absolute worst example possible that just raises so many questions that usually never see the light of day.
 
JLM
#1034
Quote: Originally Posted by chinaView Post

By Jon Ferry, The ProvinceApril 22, 2009Comments (27) (external - login to view)



(external - login to view)

Province columnist Jon Ferry

Photograph by: Les Bazso, The Province




It's not often I agree with the B.C. Green Party. In fact, I'm tired of its whole job-destroying granola mindset. However, I do applaud the party's bold, timely call for the RCMP to be replaced in this province by a police force that's more accountable to the people.
Have I been smoking something? No. I just think we should return to having a provincial force in B.C., as we did from 1859 until 1950, and that the scandal-ridden RCMP should stick to being a national police agency, rather like the FBI.
As for the contract policing services the Mounties now provide to various Lower Mainland municipalities, they'd be better done by a single metro police service. The same's true in Metro Victoria.
And I'm far from alone in my view. In fact, retired B.C. provincial court judge Wally Craig has just e-mailed me a new report by Simon Fraser University criminology Prof. Robert Gordon and ex-Vancouver police chief Bob Stewart strongly making the case for a Metro Vancouver police service. The hard-hitting "discussion paper" points out our region is the last large metro area in Canada not to be policed by a single force.
"The police-related problems of the Metro Vancouver area are largely regional problems, not purely local, municipal problems and are best dealt with by a police service that works across the whole area in a co-ordinated way," it says.
Now, given intense public disquiet over the drug-gang war and the RCMP's dishonourable role in Robert Dziekanski's death, I believe there's firm public support for a single regional force with clear lines of accountability. So-called integrated units of officers from a hodge-podge of RCMP detachments and municipal forces simply don't cut it.
Sure, Surrey Mayor Dianne Watts, Burnaby Mayor Derek Corrigan and other mayors outside the City of Vancouver favour the status quo. So do some residents, especially in cozy communities like Port Moody, Delta and West Vancouver.
Many ratepayers, though, want change. And it's an issue that's resonating in this election campaign, especially since high-profile former West Van police chief Kash Heed is running for the Liberals.
Heed hit the headlines in 2007 when he urged public debate on police amalgamation, only to draw a reprimand from Jon Les, then B.C.'s solicitor-general. But Les first backed down, then stepped down. And Heed now is being touted as a future solicitor-general, in position to make long-overdue changes before the RCMP contract with B.C. expires in 2012.
Heed tells me his Vancouver-Fraserview constituents are very concerned about crime, and regional policing is part of the discussion: "I very well think that we need to seriously look at whether or not that's going to deliver a better police service for us."
For this, Heed would appear to have wide support, including from NDP crime critic Mike Farnworth and Liberal Attorney-General Wally Oppal, who said years ago the police patchwork made no sense. It still doesn't.
jferry@theprovince.com (external - login to view)
Copyright (c) The Province











What? Another level of bureaucracy? Fix what we have before bringing more on board.
 
Francis2004
#1035
The talk of a new police force in BC is all great an dandy until people will have to fork out the money for that force..

It was but a few years ago that Surrey was looking at kicking the RCMP out of Surrey and now they are looking at putting the centre for all RCMP operations in Surrey. Why, because the cost of operations was too great for the city to handle and when it really came down to it, tax payers made it clear they were NOT going to pay extra for policing we already have.

Now back to my younger days on living in Quebec where the QPP and across the bridge the OPP would had officers that looked like Mafia enforcers. Often the day when you were pulled over to have a front or tail light smashed after being followed on darn roads by these goons.. All knew they made sure you knew "Who was the law" in the back roads..

The same can be said of the VPD, Port Moody police and many other small departments that report to a city hall that has little control over the Police Chief.

OK now that I have trashed them let me say that most Police officers are for the most part doing a good job and honest and that I still have the most respect for them.. The few that have the power of the badge go to their heads will always be part of our system regardless of them being RCMP or Independent Police departments.

Do you really think changing the uniforms will change the officers attitudes.. I highly doubt that and in fact may make it worse..

My opinion..
 
lone wolf
#1036
Quote: Originally Posted by dumpthemonarchyView Post

The airport killing by the RCMP of Robert D is just one of many examples why a BC police force is needed. This was the absolute worst example possible that just raises so many questions that usually never see the light of day.

It will still be RCMP patrolling the airports. International ports of entry are federal.
 
Francis2004
#1037
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

It will still be RCMP patrolling the airports. International ports of entry are federal.

Agreed
 
Cannuck
#1038
How can anybody not like these guys

YouTube - On the Great White Trail 1938

 
L Gilbert
#1039
DB's right. The Royal Mickey Mouse Police are but a caricature of what they used to be.
 
dumpthemonarchy
#1040
Quote: Originally Posted by SirFrancis2004View Post

The talk of a new police force in BC is all great an dandy until people will have to fork out the money for that force..

It was but a few years ago that Surrey was looking at kicking the RCMP out of Surrey and now they are looking at putting the centre for all RCMP operations in Surrey. Why, because the cost of operations was too great for the city to handle and when it really came down to it, tax payers made it clear they were NOT going to pay extra for policing we already have.

My opinion..

Surrey residents shouldn't have to pay more for the same policing. That's inept. Surrey, along with the rest of Metro Vancouver need a regional police force.

Secondly, the money that went to Ottawa for the RCMP will go to Victoria instead, it will be a wash.

You'd think with the Robert D case and gangs shooting all over Vancouver, something like this would be a priority in the BC election. Our policing patchwork is no help these days.
 
china
#1041
Those in charge of the RCMP must be held accountable




Vancouver SunApril 29, 2009



Ian Mulgrew ("RCMP backtracking comes too late," April 27) is right on. It is quite clear that the RCMP has had one false, unified answer to cover up the inexcusably brutal treatment of Robert Dziekanski, an innocent newcomer to Canada. It has deceived the public and has expected everyone to move on and forget.
Thanks to the media for pursuing this story and seeking answers from those in charge of the RCMP, who must be held accountable.
Olga Kudyba
North Vancouver
Copyright (c) The Vancouver Sun
Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 6th, 2009 at 10:56 PM..Reason: Removed the prtion of the newspaper not relevant to the Opening Post
 
china
#1042
RCMP backtracking comes too late
High-ranking Mounties should be made to answer for coverup after death of Robert Dziekanski
By Ian Mulgrew, Vancouver sunApril 27, 2009
(external - login to view)

RCMP Assistant Commissioner Peter German should be called to testify at the Braidwood Commission.

Photograph by: Ian Lindsay, Vancouver Sun, Vancouver sun
Slowly, but surely, the Braidwood Commission into the Taser-related death of Robert Dziekanski is climbing the RCMP chain of command to determine who in authority countenanced the coverup that occurred.
Just as Watergate began with an inept burglary and grew to ensnare the president, so the inept response by four dumb cops at Vancouver Airport on Oct. 14, 2007 is being eclipsed by the revelations of what followed.
The testimony last week of the RCMP "media relations" officers who left falsehoods uncorrected for more than a year was startling.
In the hours after Dziekanski's death, RCMP Sgt. Pierre Lemaitre, the initial spokesman in the case, told reporters the Polish immigrant had been stunned twice when, in fact, the Taser had been deployed five times.
He went on to describe Dziekanski threatening the officers, swinging an object at them and struggling violently after the first Taser jolt had no effect -- even though a bystander's video showed otherwise.
Lemaitre said he only repeated what he was told by Cpl. Dale Carr, who was working with the investigators at the scene.
So embarrassing was Lemaitre's testimony, it prompted current senior RCMP spokesman Sgt. Tim Shields to quickly apologize for the force.
Like the rest of the RCMP's backtracking during these proceedings, however, it comes 19 months too late.
Carr, who took over from Lemaitre as spokesman, said he never corrected the initial statements because he was following orders from Supt. Wayne Rideout, the man then in charge of the Integrated Homicide Investigation Team.
The inaccuracies were corrected 14 months later, in December 2008, when Crown counsel announced it would not lay charges against any of the four Mounties.
Rideout ran the investigation into Dziekanski's death and was responsible for the report used to make that charge decision.
When he appears before the inquiry, he faces some tough questions.
For instance, why were the four officers not confronted with the amateur video and asked to explain the blatant contradictions between it and their version of events?
After 18 years as an investigator, Rideout could not help but notice the glaring incongruities. Not to go back and re-interview the Mounties in light of the video appears incompetent.
I am curious to see whether this veteran career cop is prepared to wear this botch-up or whether he will point upwards, too. That's why it's not just Rideout we should hear from.
I'd like to see on the stand former RCMP superintendent Ward Clapham, hired in the summer of last year to run the BC Transit cops.
He was in charge of the Richmond detachment, whose officers were involved, and, at 49, he retired suddenly last April, less than six months after the Dziekanski incident.
Did he agree with the strategy to leave the public record uncorrected? How does he feel about the conduct of his men? I bet he could shed a lot of light on these events.
But let's cut to the chase.
The man ultimately responsible for the RCMP response to this tragedy was Assistant Commissioner Peter German.
He's the only Mountie whose ambition to one day occupy the Commissioner's office in Ottawa was threatened by the Dziekanski scandal. If there is a Richard Nixon in this drama, it is German.
I'd like to see him on the stand explaining his role. Or is he going to say this outrageous incident didn't warrant his personal interest?
He must have approved Rideout's don't-tell-the-public strategy given the international furore Dziekanski's death was generating. The RCMP is a paramilitary organization and no one does anything that isn't approved by the officer in charge.
This was German's watch. The buck stopped with him.
So I say come on down, Assistant Commissioner, and tell us about your role in this entire sordid affair. Inquiring minds would love to know.























Last edited by china; May 6th, 2009 at 11:36 PM..
 
china
#1043
So I say come on down, Assistant Commissioner, and tell us about your role in this entire sordid affair. Inquiring minds would love to know.
imulgrew@vancouversun.com (external - login to view)
We should demend that he tells about the role he played in this cover up .
 
china
#1044
RCMP's pink slip

Coverup in Dziekanski's death has shaken Canada's faith in the Mounties, the justice system and law and order
By GREG WESTON (external - login to view)
Last Updated: 26th April 2009, 3:21am


As the inquiry into the shameful RCMP stun-gun death of Robert Dziekanski at Vancouver airport increasingly becomes a parade of Mounties up to their tunics in horse manure, at issue is far more than shocks, lies and videotape.
It is about just how badly broken the federal force has become, and the lasting damage to both our justice system and the public's faith in law and order.
For most Canadians, the Dziekanski inquiry long ago stopped being about what four Mounties armed with 250,000 volts did to a hapless Polish traveller who arrived at Vancouver Airport on Oct. 14, 2007, to visit his mom.
All those sickening details of his final seconds with the RCMP welcoming party are on the now famous amateur video shot by a private citizen who thankfully happened on the scene.
Instead, the inquiry is all about the Mounties trying to explain why they repeatedly zapped a confused man holding a stapler, and writhing on the floor.
And when it was all over and Dziekanski was dead, how was it the national police force, sworn to uphold the truth, "misinformed" the public about the deadly encounter?
Last month, the inquiry heard RCMP testimony so at odds with the video of Dziekanski's death that most ordinary folk must have wondered, just how stupid do they think the public is?
This past week, the force finally admitted what has been apparent since the video was first pried from RCMP clutches (under the threat of legal action) weeks after the tragedy.
"We found that there was some information that was provided and made public that was not accurate," RCMP Sgt. Tim Shields told reporters outside the inquiry room last week.
"For those inaccuracies, we apologize and we are sorry." Talk about too little too late.
Some of those "inaccuracies" included such minor issues as depicting Dziekanski as a raging crazy person who had been struggling with three police officers, swinging an object over his head, when he was downed by two jolts from the Taser.
Turns out he had a stapler at his side (not overhead), and his only contact with the Mounties was after he was on the floor in pain from the first of five (not two) 50,000-volt hits, and four (not three) burly cops piled on him, one on his neck.
So much misinformation from police involved in the incident might have explained how the RCMP media relations officers came to feed the same crock to reporters and the public.
But last week, one of those officers admitted he and a colleague from the PR department had watched the video before briefing the media.
RECORD NOT CORRECTED
They were later ordered by a superior officer not to correct the record, supposedly to protect potential evidence, including the video.
RCMP Commissioner William Elliott recently asked the public not to jump to any conclusions, and to have sympathy for his position.
All of which can only damage the image and morale of a force already in the dumps after years of misguided management from the commissioner's office down.
Imagine how embarrassing and demoralizing the flimflam from the Dziekanski inquiry must be for all the devoted men and women who serve with distinction on the national force.
But the effects of this sordid affair go far beyond the RCMP.
Every day in courtrooms across the country, citizens accused of all manner of wrongdoing have their fates decided in large part by the word of the cops.
Police being truthful is obviously a cornerstone of our legal system, essential to keep the scales of justice balanced and fair to accused, victims and society alike.
It is equally important that the cops be seen to be telling the truth -- a society that loses trust in the police, quickly loses respect for the law.
Unfortunately, no matter how the Dziekanski inquiry ends, it is unlikely most Canadians will take away a lasting impression of cops telling the whole truth and nothing but.
Let's face it: Were it not for the amateur video, there is a good chance Dziekanski's death would have been quietly filed as another routine case of police using a Taser to defend themselves in the line of duty.
Last fall, on the eve of the inquiry, Commissioner Elliott said his force was "anxious to participate to the fullest extent possible.
"We cannot provide effective policing services to communities without the support of those communities ... We have to be held accountable."
A good place to start might be a shower of pink slips, or one obvious resignation.
 
china
#1045
Two senior Mounties to testify at inquiry into Dziekanski's Taser death

By Neal Hall, Vancouver SunApril 14, 2009




(external - login to view)

Polish immigrant Robert Dziekanski is seen in the arrivals area of the Vancouver airport in this video footage October 14, 2007.

Photograph by: Paul Pritchard, Reuters Files




VANCOUVER – Two senior media relations Mounties will have to testify at the Braidwood Inquiry, which is probing the Tasering and subsequent death of Robert Dziekanski at Vancouver International Airport in 2007.
Helen Roberts, the lawyer representing the RCMP at the inquiry, suggested that the inquiry did not need call Cpl. Dale Carr and Sgt. Pierre Lemaitre as witnesses because they had no direct knowledge of the events leading to Dziekanski’s death at about 1:30 a.m. on Oct. 14, 2007.
The lawyer also pointed out to Commissioner Thomas Braidwood, a retired judge, that he earlier said he was not interested in probing the adequacy or quality of the homicide investigation done by the Integrated Homicide Investigation Team – Carr does media relations for IHIT.
Roberts pointed out that the two media relations officers are under investigation after complaints were filed with the Commission for Public Complaints Against the RCMP.
One complaint was filed by the BC Civil Liberties Association, she said, and the other was initiated by Paul Kennedy, chair of the RCMP complaints commission.
“I think we need them,” Braidwood decided.
The inquiry has heard that Lemaitre, while speaking on behalf of the RCMP shortly after Dziekanski’s death, told reporters the man had been Tasered twice.
In fact, Dziekanski received five shocks from a Taser, which was only made public last Dec. 12 when the Crown announced there would be no charges against the four RCMP officers involved in the death at the airport.
Carr is expected to testify Wednesday and Lemaitre is scheduled to testify Thursday.
Earlier in the day at the inquiry, lawyer Walter Kosteckyj, who is representing Dziekanski’s mother, Zofia Cisoski, called for B.C. Attorney General Wally Oppal to reopen the investigation of a fatal incident involving police.
He said new evidence has emerged at the Braidwood inquiry to warrant the investigation being reopened.
“Decisions were made in terms of charges on the basis of an IHIT report, which included the statements various police officers,” Kosteckyj told reporters during a break in the inquiry.
“In fact, they have recanted on three or four important points,” he added, “so it makes some sense that this matter should be looked at again.”
Kosteckyj also urged that a independent special prosecutor be assigned to oversee the renewed investigation.
“This is a criminal investigation that needs an independent prosecutor to look at it completely,” Kosteckyj said. “It is high time we have completely independent oversight. The police shouldn't be investigating themselves.”
The Braidwood inquiry resumed Tuesday after a two-week break. The second part of the inquiry began last January.
A number of witnesses are scheduled to testify today, including RCMP Cpl. Nycki Basra.
She is expected to testify about an RCMP “debriefing” about the fatal incident that involved four Mounties who attended the airport to respond to a 911 report of a man throwing luggage around.
Seconds after the officers arrived, they confronted Dziekanski, 40, who spoke no English. The man threw up his arms and grabbed a stapler, prompting an officer to deploy a Taser five times.
Dziekanski died at the scene after the four officers struggled to handcuff his hands behind his back. Cause of death was “sudden death during restraint.”
Dziekanski had left his home in Poland more than 24 hours earlier and wandered around the secure international arrivals area for about nine hours, looking for his mother.
The mother and son never connected at the airport.
Dziekanski remained in an area of the airport inaccessible to the public. The mother waited for hours for her son but finally returned home when officials were unable to locate her son, who had come to Canada to live with his mother.
A video of the incident taken by a bystander at the airport sparked an international outcry at how the man was welcomed to Canada. All four officers changed their version of events after watching the video.
nhall@vancouversun.com (external - login to view)
Copyright (c) The Vancouver Sun











(external - login to view)
Last edited by china; May 8th, 2009 at 11:59 PM..
 
china
#1046
posted 2x
Last edited by china; May 9th, 2009 at 12:01 AM..
 
china
#1047
VanIsle ;


Quote:

Just look how much China who apparantly lives in China, dictates the threads here on this forum and how everyone jumps to join him. He aids all of you into focusing on 4 members of the police rather than the Force as a whole. He leads you around by the nose helping you to form an opinion that re-enforces his own, rather than anyone looking, again, at the Force as a whole, and no one ever focuses on any of the good that is done. Why does he care if BC gets rid of the RCMP? Years ago it was city police that were all the bad guys. Then they raised the pay level and since they don't transfer people around (something that can be and usually is very disruptive to families)many of the RCMP left and were hired on by the city forces. That is all that would happen now anyway even if the man from China was successful in his quest to destroy the Force which will never happen. Cities cannot afford to start the training process for the numbers they would need for one thing and for another, something would have to give because they would then be responsible for 100% of the costs of paying for their policing and they are not right now.
Pay cuts would have to happen. City police forces usually have unions. City taxes would go up. Who would police the rural areas? Do you think the RCMP are going to send in 2 - 3 members for the little towns without regular members nearby? Gee, we could have it like the USA where some big Bubba comes to look after things wearing his big tin badge on the...

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I think you work for RCMP; psychology dept.
 
china
#1048
Robert Dziekanski appeared "dangerous" and posed a potential threat to the public moments before he was Tasered, one of the RCMP officers involved in the incident testified Thursday.
Const. Gerry Rundel said the 40-year-old Polish man who died in the October, 2007 incident at Vancouver International Airport (YVR) released "an incredible amount of energy" when officers shocked and pounced on him.
"It took a Taser – two deployments – and four officers for over a minute struggle to restrain and handcuff Mr Dziekanski," Rundel said under a continued grilling before the Braidwood Inquiry.
He said he did not find out until later the Taser had been used five times – unleashing 50,000 volts through the probes for a total of 31 seconds.
Had officers not contained the disturbed Dziekanski and had he managed to flee, Rundel said he could have got into a variety of public or secure areas at YVR.
"With that amount of energy he had built up inside, I venture to say I don't know where that could have ended," he said. "He could have hurt, injured other members of the public."
Don Rosenbloom, a lawyer representing the government of Poland, suggested Rundel couldn't possibly have been afraid Dziekanski would "run off" somewhere.
"Yes I was," Rundel replied.
Rundel maintained Dziekanski was both "resistant" by raising his hands and heading towards his luggage and later adopting a "combative stance" when he picked up a stapler.
Those determinations meant Taser use was permitted under the rules governing RCMP use of the electroshock weapons at the time.
The officer was also asked if more shouldn't have been done to accommodate someone who clearly couldn't speak English.
"We did everything we could," Rundel replied. "It was Mr. Dziekanski's behaviour that did not allow that to happen."
Rundel maintained the video evidence supported his memory of events and he rejected Rosenbloom's suggestions that the images told a different story and that officers had fallen far short of "prudent conduct."
Asked about his experience with Tasers, Rundel said the Dziekanski incident was his first experience with the use of Tasers in the field, apart from training sessions.
Dziekanski had wandered for hours after failing to connect with his mother from Kamloops.
Although the four RCMP officers involved won't face criminal charges in connection with Dziekanski's death, the lawyer for one officer indicated he's concerned the Polish government will take legal action and asked to restrict access to exhibits and transcripts.
RCMP Const. Bill Bentley began his testimony Thursday afternoon.
Asked if he had anything to say to Dziekanski's mother in the courtroom, he responded: "I'm sorry for her loss... my heart goes out to her and her family."
The inquiry continues.
 
china
#1049
By Ben Meisner (external - login to view)
Monday, May 11, 2009 03:45 AM

There is always the line that the position taken was for the,” greater good”, now that may be applicable in many cases or at the very least some sort of an argument could be made in favour of the move, but look at the testimony of the RCMP at the Braidwood inquiry, and try and explain to me what possibly could be the "greater good" in the their actions in the death of Robert Dziekanski?
From the moment the four officers set foot in the Vancouver airport until they appeared before former Justice Braidwood, the whole affair has the word "smear" written all over it.
Superintendent Wayne Rideout, the senior officer in the investigation testified that, “we withheld the truth to protect the facts”. Instead the RCMP said, Dziekanski had become combative and the police used the tazer twice, wrong, completely wrong, but Rideout didn’t want the facts to get in the way of the investigation. "We would taint the witness account that’s why we withheld the information" Rideout says, again the interest of the greater good for whom?
Who is the police officer who went to Poland to interview neighbours, or anyone who could shed a bad light on Dziekanski to a point that one witness in Poland refused to talk to the RCMP? It was Superintendent Wayne Rideout. What was he trying to obtain in Poland that could possibly have any bearing on what four of his officers had done to Dziekanski, and why his department was lying over the facts?
Can you just image what kind of a line would have been spun had that live video not be taken, or for some unknown reason the camera was returned with the video missing? The problem with that video was that it was shown to a few people before being grabbed up by police and we all know that they didn’t want to return the video until court action was threatened.
Blaming Dzieknaski’s death on the airport staff or other support workers at the airport might get you a casual comment, the reality is that four burley cops decided to tazer a guy five times, hold him on the ground and when he was dead, try and spin a story. It didn’t work in this case, problem is, how many times has it worked in other cases, and were those instances also for the greater good?
I’m Meisner and that’s one man’s opinion.
 
china
#1050
Replace RCMP



Editor: It is high time that the current (or soon to be elected) government of B.C., especially the premier and Attorney-General Wally Oppal, step up to the plate and insist that the four RCMP officers who killed Mr. Dziekanski be charged with at least manslaughter, but preferably second degree murder.
Supt. Wayne Rideout should be fired, along with every senior officer who stood in front of the TV cameras and lied to the public for over a year. As far as I’m concerned, and I am sure I speak for others, the RCMP are no longer to be believed or trusted.
It is time they were replaced with a provincial force, and in the Lower Mainland with a regional force — one we can have faith in to do their job and tell the truth, rather than trying to make the victims look like the criminals.
The RCMP have given B.C. and Canada a black eye as far as our world standing is concerned and they need to be dealt with. I say good riddance to bad policing.
Al Crawford,
 

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