Should Shawn Thornton face more than a suspension?

BornRuff

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I imagine that anyone who cares has seen the video of Shawn Thornton attacking Brooks Orpik this past weekend. For a quick recap though, after play had stopped, Thornton came up behind Orpik, pulled him to the ice and started pummeling his head against the ice before Orpik had any chance to defend himself. Other players immediately called for medical staff and he left on a stretcher.

Hockey is a physical sport and a whole lot of violence is handled within the rules of the game, but I think at some point a suspension or fine really doesn't fit.

There is some precedent for players facing criminal charges for crossing the line on the ice. Both Marty McSorley and Todd Bertuzzi faced criminal charges for assault for their on ice incidents.

Even in that very same play, there were other very dirty actions taken by other players, but this is different. There are cheap shots that happen during the course of play, and then there is just a full on attack and attempt to seriously injure a player well outside the normal course of play.

What do you guys think?

Brooks Orpik Scary Injury After Sucker Punch by Shawn Thornton (12/7/13) - YouTube
 

damngrumpy

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See the play a few moves before that? I say he got what he deserved he thumped
someone else on the way to the players box. Thornton did his job you don't allow
the other side to mess with your teammates. Good old fashioned hockey in my view.
 

Ron in Regina

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Huh. I think Football is a very physical game too, and you don't see that
sort'a nonsense very often....and it's stopped ASAP with big fines, ect....

I think Basketball is a very physical game too, and you don't see that
sort'a nonsense very often....and it's stopped ASAP with big fines, ect....

With effective Ref's, I don't see where this kind'a shenanigans should
be allowed at all in Hockey.
 

karrie

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That's adrenaline and aggression, it's a challenge to start and stop it at appropriate points, especially when someone you know and care about gets a low blow.


One thing that jumped out at me is, when we were growing up in the hockey culture, you don't cheer or bang your stick on the ice unless someone walks off on their own, or waves from the stretcher. Otherwise, you maintain a respectful silence until they are gone, and the game resumes. Lifting someone onto a stretcher is not an appropriate time to cheer.
 

petros

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Nov 21, 2008
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Wednesday I'm taking 4 of my nieces and nephews to their first WHL game. They are between 5 and 8 years old. All of them are anticipating seeing a fight. It wasn't me who said they might see one but their friends at school. Fighing is a huge part of the hockey culture.
 

BornRuff

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See the play a few moves before that? I say he got what he deserved he thumped
someone else on the way to the players box. Thornton did his job you don't allow
the other side to mess with your teammates. Good old fashioned hockey in my view.

I didn't see the whole game, so I don't really know the play you are talking about. Are you talking about what happened in that video I posted where James Neal got Marchand in the head with his knee? The only incident that I saw with Orpik from earlier in the game was his questionable hit on Eriksson.

Proponents of the "good old" rules of hockey would generally suggest that he should have turned him around and engaged him in a fight, not sneak up behind him and attack him while he is defenseless.

Wednesday I'm taking 4 of my nieces and nephews to their first WHL game. They are between 5 and 8 years old. All of them are anticipating seeing a fight. It wasn't me who said they might see one but their friends at school. Fighing is a huge part of the hockey culture.

This wasn't a fight. Sneaking up behind someone and pummeling their head into the ice is simply an attack.

A fight implies some sort of participation on both sides.
 

petros

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Funny how we never see a hockey game break out in a bar-room brawl

I watched my cousin knock Jordan Tootoo out with one punch in Houston's in Brandon MB. The entire bar cheered and several bought my cousin beer.

Tootoo was being an assshole to the wrong ladies that night.
 

damngrumpy

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I used to do play by play on radio years ago and fighting was very much a part of
the game. In the old day Bobby Orr could take care of himself as could a number
of others. Gretzky could not never did like the guy. Today we have too many
people who want to change the game to something like chess on ice.
A high brow sport it is not, Vancouver is a prime example of a team that can't win
because they can't fight back in tough games. I hate Boston as I am a Habs fan
but they can defend themselves and their teammates. When fighting goes I won't
be watching hockey anymore. I have seen football fights too. The only useless
sport is soccer little refs in short pants handing out yellow and red cards good god
get real. We can't have real gladiators anymore so we have to settle for sports eh
 

BornRuff

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I used to do play by play on radio years ago and fighting was very much a part of
the game. In the old day Bobby Orr could take care of himself as could a number
of others. Gretzky could not never did like the guy. Today we have too many
people who want to change the game to something like chess on ice.
A high brow sport it is not, Vancouver is a prime example of a team that can't win
because they can't fight back in tough games. I hate Boston as I am a Habs fan
but they can defend themselves and their teammates. When fighting goes I won't
be watching hockey anymore. I have seen football fights too. The only useless
sport is soccer little refs in short pants handing out yellow and red cards good god
get real. We can't have real gladiators anymore so we have to settle for sports eh

Again, how on earth can you consider that a "fight"?
 

damngrumpy

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kerri as for the video of the bench clearing brawl I've seen lots of those
Years ago I saw one start at the beginning of a game in a series final
made it a long night for the refs but it was really entertaining
 

EagleSmack

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Feb 16, 2005
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Like this?

That was a good one Karrie

I imagine that anyone who cares has seen the video of Shawn Thornton attacking Brooks Orpik this past weekend. For a quick recap though, after play had stopped, Thornton came up behind Orpik, pulled him to the ice and started pummeling his head against the ice before Orpik had any chance to defend himself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuVq-TZ7AJM

Pummeling his head against the ice? Did you watch it?

The knee to the head by Neil was worse IMO.
 

damngrumpy

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That was what you get when you take a cheap shot a few plays before if you were
watching the entire game. Its called evening things up. You knee someone in the
head a few plays before and you get what you deserve. Like Bertuzzi a few years
back. The guy he pounded was a guy who took a run at a Canuck two weeks before
then refused to fight Bertuzzi and he got nailed that was a sweet bit of revenge too.
Its how the game is played, don't follow the unwritten rules you get hurt. And by the
way I don't like Vancouver either.
 

damngrumpy

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I used to belong to a group of fans called the CCF Counter Canuck Fans.
we would bring our booze and snacks and cheer for any team except the
Canucks. The only time I felt torn was when the Canucks played Boston
as I wasn't sure who I hated more.
 

BornRuff

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That was what you get when you take a cheap shot a few plays before if you were
watching the entire game. Its called evening things up. You knee someone in the
head a few plays before and you get what you deserve. Like Bertuzzi a few years
back. The guy he pounded was a guy who took a run at a Canuck two weeks before
then refused to fight Bertuzzi and he got nailed that was a sweet bit of revenge too.
Its how the game is played, don't follow the unwritten rules you get hurt. And by the
way I don't like Vancouver either.

If you are talking about the knee to the head of Marchand that wasn't Orpik, that was James Neal.

You are definitely in the minority if you think that what Bertuzzi did to Steve Moore was part of the game. The game is not about actually trying to kill people.
 

petros

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I used to belong to a group of fans called the CCF Counter Canuck Fans.
we would bring our booze and snacks and cheer for any team except the
Canucks. The only time I felt torn was when the Canucks played Boston
as I wasn't sure who I hated more.
I had a really good chuckle when you told me about that. There is a group called the Hab Haters as well.