Obesity epidemic forcing use of large animal MRIs for human patients

[Tonington]

Yikes, this won't help the ballooning costs of healthcare:

By Stephen Adams, Medical Correspondent
10:00PM GMT 01 Nov 2012

Many hospitals have failed to invest in 'supersize’ equipment suited to morbidly obese patients, they said.

Investigations by surgeons at North Bristol NHS Trust found only one in six hospitals had access to MRI or CT scanners capable of taking the heaviest patients, weighing over 35 stone.

As an emergency measure, they will need to rely on scanners usually operated by vets as Britain’s obesity crisis means dealing with severely overweight patients becomes more routine.

Hospitals in the US are already calling zoos to use their scanners - built for lions, gorillas, horses and cattle.
​

Obesity crisis 'will force hospitals to use super-size MRI scanners at zoos' - Telegraph

I know that it has cut both ways however. I know that Veterinary radiologists will use hospital radiology equipment outside of clinic hours.

 

[taxslave]

What ever makes that expensive equipment get used. The more use the lower the unit costs.

 

[L Gilbert]

It isn't just morbidly obese people. I'm medically considered to be active, if not athletic, yet when I went to Kelowna for an MRI the poor little dude that operated the machine had to squish me in because the opening was about 16" in diameter and I am over 24" wide. Scrunched up inside that piece of crap aggravated the tendonitis in both shoulders and they bothered me for weeks afterwards. The operator had an even worse time getting me out of the machine. I told my doc never again.
And the idiotic cuts to healthcare have had a pretty vast impact on equipment besides MRI machines here. A couple nurses told me that if they drop a pair of scissors or clamps on the floor, they usually break. And they have to dry them if they get wet or else they rust. Decent stainless steel doesn't break or rust that easily and will last a very long time. But these morons that make decisions don't seem to have a clue about cost effectiveness ..... just cost.

What ever makes that expensive equipment get used. The more use the lower the unit costs.

Really? Usage usually requires increasing amounts of maintenance.

 

[damngrumpy]

There are a few problems here, first we are super sizing the population that is a given by
just walking through Super Store and Walmart (we have all seen the picks the Walmart people)
Somehow we must encourage the people to look after their own health needs and to be in
better shape. Instead of encouragement we ban pop in machines at school, instead of education
we use force, no chips or bars in schools and in some cases public buildings. What a solution.
Of course we create other problems. The kids go to the store after school and buy the treats
they were denied at school. Two problems here. one is we didn't solve the real problem we
postponed it until the afternoon that in turn means if they had the treat during school hours they
would work it off in PE Class.
The second problem is those who treat the after effects will use more and more and more expensive
methods to treat a problem that could be treated with incentives. First incentive, ever Provincial
Government should find tax deductions for those enrolled in recognized exercise programs and have
a chart demonstrating their activity. The Federal Government should also participate in a tax reduction
system for such activities. This could be done through community groups like the Y so it would keep
costs down and not create a large government department of fat reduction.
We use the pocketbook to hammer people with fines for speeding, seat belts, and other offences.
Why can't we use the pocketbook for a a positive purpose. Oh how does this affect young people?
Do the program through the Y and or the school system and if students follow the program of good
health education they would earn points toward tuition reduction for post secondary for one thing.
Just a thought something has to be done differently before we build bigger doors and buses and
planes, and, well you get the BIG Picture.

 

[petros]

It isn't just morbidly obese people. I'm medically considered to be active, if not athletic, yet when I went to Kelowna for an MRI the poor little dude that operated the machine had to squish me in because the opening was about 16" in diameter and I am over 24" wide. Scrunched up inside that piece of crap aggravated the tendonitis in both shoulders and they bothered me for weeks afterwards.

Same goes for a CT, I had one of those 2 weeks ago. First you get wedged in and then they want you to exhale for 2 minutes. it wasn't as tight after exhaling. I have an MRI later this week. I'd rather do a CT as it's fast in comparison.

There are a few problems here, first we are super sizing the population that is a given by
just walking through Super Store and Walmart (we have all seen the picks the Walmart people)
Somehow we must encourage the people to look after their own health needs and to be in
better shape. Instead of encouragement we ban pop in machines at school, instead of education
we use force, no chips or bars in schools and in some cases public buildings. What a solution.
Of course we create other problems. The kids go to the store after school and buy the treats
they were denied at school. Two problems here. one is we didn't solve the real problem we
postponed it until the afternoon that in turn means if they had the treat during school hours they
would work it off in PE Class.
The second problem is those who treat the after effects will use more and more and more expensive
methods to treat a problem that could be treated with incentives. First incentive, ever Provincial
Government should find tax deductions for those enrolled in recognized exercise programs and have
a chart demonstrating their activity. The Federal Government should also participate in a tax reduction
system for such activities. This could be done through community groups like the Y so it would keep
costs down and not create a large government department of fat reduction.
We use the pocketbook to hammer people with fines for speeding, seat belts, and other offences.
Why can't we use the pocketbook for a a positive purpose. Oh how does this affect young people?
Do the program through the Y and or the school system and if students follow the program of good
health education they would earn points toward tuition reduction for post secondary for one thing.
Just a thought something has to be done differently before we build bigger doors and buses and
planes, and, well you get the BIG Picture.

I'm just genetically big. I'm six foot 200lb and I'm the small male of the family.

 

[Tonington]

What ever makes that expensive equipment get used. The more use the lower the unit costs.

If a hospital has to order new equipment to offer the service it's expected to offer, then specialty equipment for either heavy, or large people will increase the operating costs of the hospital. Now they need to perform preventative maintenance on extra equipment, not to mention the upfront capital costs of acquiring the equipment. Similarly, if the hospital has to send a patient to another facility, that involves costs too. Vets aren't exactly known for low margins on the diagnostic tests they perform.

 

[petros]

If a hospital has to order new equipment to offer the service it's expected to offer, then specialty equipment for either heavy, or large people will increase the operating costs of the hospital. Now they need to perform preventative maintenance on extra equipment, not to mention the upfront capital costs of acquiring the equipment. Similarly, if the hospital has to send a patient to another facility, that involves costs too. Vets aren't exactly known for low margins on the diagnostic tests they perform.

Did you know they have health insurance for pets these days? To me the best cure for an ill pet is a 3 cent .22 long.

 

[Tonington]

Did you know they have health insurance for pets these days? To me the best cure for an ill pet is a 3 cent .22 long.

Yep, it's crazy expensive too, and the devil is in the fine print. A lot of pet owners are shocked when they find out that their very expensive pet insurance doesn't cover what they thought it does.

 

[L Gilbert]

The second problem is those who treat the after effects will use more and more and more expensive
methods to treat a problem that could be treated with incentives. First incentive, ever Provincial
Government should find tax deductions for those enrolled in recognized exercise programs and have
a chart demonstrating their activity. The Federal Government should also participate in a tax reduction
system for such activities. This could be done through community groups like the Y so it would keep
costs down and not create a large government department of fat reduction.

Then the gov'ts should give me tax breaks for staying fit just by working. I don't exercise and have not exercised since high school. When I am not working, I go for hikes, ride bike, and play rugby. No exercising, just normal activities for pleasurable or income experiences. I'd love to get benefits from gov't for that. lol

We use the pocketbook to hammer people with fines for speeding, seat belts, and other offences.
Why can't we use the pocketbook for a a positive purpose. Oh how does this affect young people?
Do the program through the Y and or the school system and if students follow the program of good
health education they would earn points toward tuition reduction for post secondary for one thing.
Just a thought something has to be done differently before we build bigger doors and buses and
planes, and, well you get the BIG Picture.

Yeah, preventative rather than reactionary is usually a better operating procedure.

Same goes for a CT, I had one of those 2 weeks ago. First you get wedged in and then they want you to exhale for 2 minutes. it wasn't as tight after exhaling. I have an MRI later this week. I'd rather do a CT as it's fast in comparison.

Yep

I'm just genetically big.

Ditto.

I'm six foot 200lb and I'm the small male of the family.

Sometimes I wish I were. Same height but I'm crowding 265. Developed a little paunch lately. I blame the weather for that. lol

Did you know they have health insurance for pets these days? To me the best cure for an ill pet is a 3 cent .22 long.

hhmmm People as pets? Interesting idea.

 

[damngrumpy]

I farm I work hard every day tree fruit farming is labour intensive year round pruning,
thinning, picking, and a host of other things. I am six foot one and two hundred and
twenty five pounds but most of it is muscle, I said most of it.
The point is the health care system would be being pro active rather than re-active.
And yes if you were in fit shape and didn't avoided being a drain on the system there
could be a mechanism where you might get a reduction in taxes for looking after yourself.
After all the health care system is an Insurance system of sorts and there are deductions
for other things as well. If your health outlook is proactive perhaps incentives are required
for people doing the right thing it is more positive than punishment.

 

[darkbeaver]

Did you know they have health insurance for pets these days? To me the best cure for an ill pet is a 3 cent .22 long.

Or a 410 bird shot used to work for me, close range of course, nobody felt anything but me. It's hard sometimes to provide medical assistance for a much loved but not that much pet. I was engaged to shoot an old clydesdale one time

Ahyeah the death ray machines. I won't get in another, I'm sure there just fancy cookers.

If they cut the big people in half would they fit better?

 

[bill barilko]

...when I went to Kelowna for an MRI the poor little dude that operated the machine had to squish me in because the opening was about 16" in diameter and I am over 24" wide. Scrunched up inside that piece of crap aggravated the tendonitis in both shoulders and they bothered me for weeks afterwards

Something similar happened to me a few years back I couldn't believe how poorly set up the whole place was.

 

[Kreskin]

Implement a 50% tax on junk food.

 

[damngrumpy]

A fifty percent tax will not work, the people most addicted to junk food will pay the same
as druggies, or alcoholics, or smokers for that matter. Face it the only way to get people
to change is through education and incentives and the pocket book is a good head start.

 

[petros]

Implement a 50% tax on junk food.

Define junk food.

 

[darkbeaver]

Something that junk likes to eat. Forward the prize please.

 

[petros]

Something that junk likes to eat. Forward the prize please.

I'm all out of Toblerone.

 

[Serryah]

There are a few problems here, first we are super sizing the population that is a given by
just walking through Super Store and Walmart (we have all seen the picks the Walmart people)
Somehow we must encourage the people to look after their own health needs and to be in
better shape. Instead of encouragement we ban pop in machines at school, instead of education
we use force, no chips or bars in schools and in some cases public buildings. What a solution.
Of course we create other problems. The kids go to the store after school and buy the treats
they were denied at school. Two problems here. one is we didn't solve the real problem we
postponed it until the afternoon that in turn means if they had the treat during school hours they
would work it off in PE Class.
The second problem is those who treat the after effects will use more and more and more expensive
methods to treat a problem that could be treated with incentives. First incentive, ever Provincial
Government should find tax deductions for those enrolled in recognized exercise programs and have
a chart demonstrating their activity. The Federal Government should also participate in a tax reduction
system for such activities. This could be done through community groups like the Y so it would keep
costs down and not create a large government department of fat reduction.
We use the pocketbook to hammer people with fines for speeding, seat belts, and other offences.
Why can't we use the pocketbook for a a positive purpose. Oh how does this affect young people?
Do the program through the Y and or the school system and if students follow the program of good
health education they would earn points toward tuition reduction for post secondary for one thing.
Just a thought something has to be done differently before we build bigger doors and buses and
planes, and, well you get the BIG Picture.

Honestly I agree with this; get Government to help support the healthy lifestyle by making it easier/cheaper for people to get these physical classes or get this help changing their lives through exercise and/or diet. And have more compassionate doctors/dieticians. Sorry but having your health professional tell you "you need to lose weight", when someone already knows this, doesn't help. A lot of factors go into weight gain and they should know better. Docs and dieticians need to be more supportive, not judgmental.

Food also needs to be addressed, not just junk food, but good, healthy food. It's wrong that pop is cheaper than milk or juice (at least it is here). It's wrong that pasta is cheaper than fruit and veg. It's wrong meat can be sold on sale for five bucks one week, and double it or more the next. Tax breaks or less taxes on our healthy food - food we need to live - needs to be seriously looked at.

If people do get the junk stuff over the healthy when it's cheaper, THEN you can say "it's that person's fault for not taking care of themselves". But when junk is cheaper than good food, why buy the good food?

 

[petros]

If you need somebody to tell you that you are fat, lazy, smoke too much, drink too much. and have piss poor nutritional habits you're a basket case and there is no point in bothering "helping" you.

Financial incentives are a joke if you are that far gone.

If people do get the junk stuff over the healthy when it's cheaper, THEN you can say "it's that person's fault for not taking care of themselves". But when junk is cheaper than good food, why buy the good food?

It's not about price, it's about taste and laziness.

Cabbage is dirt cheap, beans are dirt cheap, rice, oats, fruit, are all cheap. Eating those 5 items will keep you in excellent health and fat will burn off like gasoline.

I'm not your dad, go find one if you need one to give you ****, but don't look to me for sympathy if you are too lazy and ignorant to take care of yourself.

 

[taxslave]

It isn't just morbidly obese people. I'm medically considered to be active, if not athletic, yet when I went to Kelowna for an MRI the poor little dude that operated the machine had to squish me in because the opening was about 16" in diameter and I am over 24" wide. Scrunched up inside that piece of crap aggravated the tendonitis in both shoulders and they bothered me for weeks afterwards. The operator had an even worse time getting me out of the machine. I told my doc never again.
And the idiotic cuts to healthcare have had a pretty vast impact on equipment besides MRI machines here. A couple nurses told me that if they drop a pair of scissors or clamps on the floor, they usually break. And they have to dry them if they get wet or else they rust. Decent stainless steel doesn't break or rust that easily and will last a very long time. But these morons that make decisions don't seem to have a clue about cost effectiveness ..... just cost.

Really? Usage usually requires increasing amounts of maintenance.

Maintenance cost per unit of operation remain the same. It is the fixed costs that come down with better usage.

There are a few problems here, first we are super sizing the population that is a given by
just walking through Super Store and Walmart (we have all seen the picks the Walmart people)
Somehow we must encourage the people to look after their own health needs and to be in
better shape. Instead of encouragement we ban pop in machines at school, instead of education
we use force, no chips or bars in schools and in some cases public buildings. What a solution.
Of course we create other problems. The kids go to the store after school and buy the treats
they were denied at school. Two problems here. one is we didn't solve the real problem we
postponed it until the afternoon that in turn means if they had the treat during school hours they
would work it off in PE Class.
The second problem is those who treat the after effects will use more and more and more expensive
methods to treat a problem that could be treated with incentives. First incentive, ever Provincial
Government should find tax deductions for those enrolled in recognized exercise programs and have
a chart demonstrating their activity. The Federal Government should also participate in a tax reduction
system for such activities. This could be done through community groups like the Y so it would keep
costs down and not create a large government department of fat reduction.
We use the pocketbook to hammer people with fines for speeding, seat belts, and other offences.
Why can't we use the pocketbook for a a positive purpose. Oh how does this affect young people?
Do the program through the Y and or the school system and if students follow the program of good
health education they would earn points toward tuition reduction for post secondary for one thing.
Just a thought something has to be done differently before we build bigger doors and buses and
planes, and, well you get the BIG Picture.

Those of us that work for a living do not require an expensive exercise program. We are already fit. Those are for office drones and retired people.