Norway promises 'humane' conditions for mass killer ahead of sentencing for massacre
That is adding insult to injury for the families of the victims.
That is adding insult to injury for the families of the victims.
Norway Build A Ward For Breivik
- Thread starter MapleDog
- Start date
...humane prison treatment and rehabilitation that forms the bedrock of the Scandinavian penal system.
The Norwegians don't believe punishment serves any purpose. I disagree. While I also support humane prison treatment and rehabilitation, I also believe that justice requires an element of punishment, when the crime has victims. This nutjob deliberately and maliciously killed people. The victims should be able to decide what his punishment would be from a variety of "humane" options. Certainly his victims should be able to seize all of nutjob's assets.
Also, most Canadians still don't know why nutjob murdered all these people and who influenced him. The answer is in nutjob's manifest and its been discussed at length here:
http://forums.canadiancontent.net/i...0-2083-european-declaration-independence.html
The Norwegians don't believe punishment serves any purpose. I disagree. While I also support humane prison treatment and rehabilitation, I also believe that justice requires an element of punishment, when the crime has victims. This nutjob deliberately and maliciously killed people. The victims should be able to decide what his punishment would be from a variety of "humane" options. Certainly his victims should be able to seize all of nutjob's assets.
Also, most Canadians still don't know why nutjob murdered all these people and who influenced him. The answer is in nutjob's manifest and its been discussed at length here:
http://forums.canadiancontent.net/i...0-2083-european-declaration-independence.html
He should be given a short rope and a long step. Or a weekend of fun and games with the victim's families.
Norway is pretty much a socialist country. So no trash cause they are all equal. Some just need a time out.
I was thinking,should the world take example on that Arizona sherrif who put prisoners in tents,with none of what the other prisons give them,they should really be punished for the crimes commited,the way it currently is,where if the punishment?
and the "debt paid to society" what is the joke?
and the "debt paid to society" what is the joke?
I'm generally against the Death Penalty.. but even the Catholic Church allows it is justifiable in cases where a society is fighting for its own survival.. against elements that have declared total war on civilized society.
I can think that might be true of some of the Narco-states in Mexico.. with drug lords offering bounties for political, police and military murders and where gang killings and torture are rampant.. OR.. perhaps in a case of mass terrorism and murder aimed at destabilizing even a secure and prosperous country like Norway.
In order to be effective that would have to be quick, sure and equitably delivered.. hence the problem. It seems to me a supermax.. with 23 hrs a day in isolation would be sufficient deterrent.
I can think that might be true of some of the Narco-states in Mexico.. with drug lords offering bounties for political, police and military murders and where gang killings and torture are rampant.. OR.. perhaps in a case of mass terrorism and murder aimed at destabilizing even a secure and prosperous country like Norway.
In order to be effective that would have to be quick, sure and equitably delivered.. hence the problem. It seems to me a supermax.. with 23 hrs a day in isolation would be sufficient deterrent.
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Your statement regarding Norwegian prison philisophy is incorrect - do you have a link to support that point.
Could you expand on your point of family and or community justice and what constitutes humane treatment?
The Norwegians took a good look at their country and decided that they were doing a good job of it.
They saw Breivik and realized that even their society was not proof against the creation of monsters.
They shook their heads and stoically moved forward with a society that the majority of the world looks up to.
To Norway, justice is not vengeance. Their refusal to change one of the world's best justice systems because of a single event is all the more noble because of the atrocity of that event.
They saw Breivik and realized that even their society was not proof against the creation of monsters.
They shook their heads and stoically moved forward with a society that the majority of the world looks up to.
To Norway, justice is not vengeance. Their refusal to change one of the world's best justice systems because of a single event is all the more noble because of the atrocity of that event.
Norway also has the highest per capita gun ownership in western Europe and the lowest murder rate.
Yes, the highest per capita rate in western Europe... beaten only by Sweden, Finland and Switzerland.
Switzerland is the country you want to use to prove your point though, but it belongs in a much different thread.
But due to this murderous rampage they are also considering changing a Life Prison Sentence from the max which I believe is presently 20 years to a longer term. Spain I think is 30.
Thanks for the info. Maybe that is why they consider the ward option; do you know if they have limits to the time a person can be held as criminally insane?
I understand it would be if they constituted a danger to society- But I am not sure on that. That would be the same as in most EU countries - and Canada as well.
I also understand they have prison shall was say on an island- open cottages- prisoners - come and go- work duties etc-Prisoners are given a phone number to call if they swim off as that is the only way to escape- the Warden just wants to know they are safe and he does not have to spend time looking for someone injured or dead.
Rehab is the goal-
No I won't. Please read the link in the opening post which is where I copied that statement.
No limit... until the person is deemed no longer a threat to society.
Being in Jail is still a punishment- Now how you are treated by the State differs- But the Jail sentence is a punishment that the majority of that particular society agree with. No way around that. Same with Rehab, job training and other programs for Prisoners - it is all based on how that society has agreed to address a problem.
Just wondering why legions of various types of shrinks do not have a bunch of peeps who were judged and or certified criminally insane to hold out as shining examples of "rehabilitation"? Not necessarily publicly but registered judicially and attested to for at least several years when out among the public. It would do wonders for their credibility.
IMO, a trial's outcome should assure the perp's never being able to do it again in a case of no question of guilt in a horrendous atrocity like this. Either life without parole or preferably saving the country money by terminating him.
IMO, a trial's outcome should assure the perp's never being able to do it again in a case of no question of guilt in a horrendous atrocity like this. Either life without parole or preferably saving the country money by terminating him.
Could you expand on your point of family and or community justice and what constitutes humane treatment?
Which ones? He killed over 70 people. Im sure each family would have a different idea on what to do. Also, I'd hate to live in a society which allowed victims families instead of a judge to pass sentence on people. Many may see it as alright in this case but it likely wouldnt take long to fall into tribalism. Victim impact statements, sure. Sentencing? No.
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