Canadian 'beaten' as Gaza-bound ships boarded

Liberalman

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Canadian 'beaten' as Gaza-bound ships boarded

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/world/Canadian+beaten+Gaza+bound+ships+boarded+supporter/5664038/story.html

Israel stops more boats from reaching Gaza to deliver medical supplies and probably weapons of mass destruction and the terrorists are using misguided peaceniks as human shields is just icing on the cake.





 
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darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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Medical supplies and weapons of mass destruction delivered by terrorists who announced their intentions and dates of departure weeks in advance. That is sooo stupid that I think you must be Israeli.
 

Locutus

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Canadian 'beaten' as Gaza-bound ships boarded

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/world/Canadian+beaten+Gaza+bound+ships+boarded+supporter/5664038/story.html

Israel stops more boats from reaching Gaza to deliver medical supplies and probably weapons of mass destruction and the terrorists are using misguided peaceniks as human shields is just icing on the cake.




From the article:

“There is one Canadian, from London, Ont., who was harshly beaten,” said Jeremy Penner, an Ottawa-based spokesman for the group Canadian Boat to Gaza.

On Friday, Penner said the boats are carrying medical supplies for Palestinians, but “it was primarily a mission to demand more freedom for the people of Gaza.”But Penner said he'd been told some activists — including David Heap, a Canadian from London, Ont. — were "roughed up" when they refused to leave their vessel.

Gaza Flotilla: Canadian Activist 'Roughed Up' When Ship Taken Over By Israeli Troops



Who knows whether it was a slap, an elbow to the chops or the Judge Williams belt.


Either way, no sympathy from me.
 

MHz

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... and probably weapons of mass destruction .....

Perhaps Israel should supply a full list of what it considers 'weapons' rather than waiting till the goods are right there in front of them and then making up an impromptu list. (not the partial list that is less than 100 items long, the full list that is some 3500 items, or so, long)

But Israel has never published a list of banned items, saying it approves requests on a case-by-case basis. Items allowed have changed over time, which has left humanitarian organisations and commercial importers constantly attempting to guess what will be approved.
The court case has been brought by the Israeli human rights group, Gisha.
The group has been trying, for more than a year, using freedom of information legislation, to squeeze information from the state about what exactly is allowed for import to Gaza, and why.
In January, Gisha, took the Israeli authorities to court, to try to force them to provide the information.
Gisha's director, Sari Bashi, says she is no security expert, "but preventing children from receiving toys, preventing manufacturers from getting raw materials - I don't see how that's responsive to Israeli security needs." And she says that some of the prohibitions appear to be absurdly arbitrary: "I certainly don't understand why cinnamon is permitted, but coriander is forbidden. Is there something more dangerous about coriander? Is coriander more critical to Gaza's economy than cinnamon? This is a policy that appears to make no sense."
The list of goods allowed into Gaza Strip (April 2010)
[/FONT][/FONT]

Either way, no sympathy from me.
I doubt very much that your approval or disapproval weighed on anybodies (IDF or Blockade Runner) mind.
 

taxslave

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These so called blockade runners should consider themselves fortunate not to find themselves and their boats on the bottom of the ocean. This is not about getting medical supplies to Gaza, there is a proper means of doing just that. Rather it is a bunch of Jew haters making a political statement and looking for their 15 minutes of fame.
 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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Are these blockade running ships flying a countries flag or the red cross flag?

It does not matter - The blockade is just that and legal to boot, regardless of what flag is flying. And the Red Cross would not engage in this.
 

MHz

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These so called blockade runners should consider themselves fortunate not to find themselves and their boats on the bottom of the ocean.
Letting them live a keeping the boats floating was probably the last option in Israel's list.

This is not about getting medical supplies to Gaza, there is a proper means of doing just that. Rather it is a bunch of Jew haters making a political statement and looking for their 15 minutes of fame.
What are the proper rules? (rather than it being anything Israel says it is) Diversion is only allowed if there is a danger to a search art sea (which would not be the case for a few boxes of Medical supplies) and it needs the permission of the ships Captain. Barring those conditions diversion is an illegal act. (so was keeping the ships and passengers in the first floatilla)

San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994

SECTION III : ENEMY VESSELS AND AIRCRAFT EXEMPT FROM ATTACK

Classes of vessels exempt from attack

47. The following classes of enemy vessels are exempt from attack:

(a) hospital ships;
(b) small craft used for coastal rescue operations and other medical transports;
(c) vessels granted safe conduct by agreement between the belligerent parties including:
(i) cartel vessels, e.g., vessels designated for and engaged in the transport of prisoners of war;
(ii) vessels engaged in humanitarian missions, including vessels carrying supplies indispensable to the survival of the civilian population, and vessels engaged in relief actions and rescue operations;
(d) vessels engaged in transporting cultural property under special protection;
(e) passenger vessels when engaged only in carrying civilian passengers;
(f) vessels charged with religious, non-military scientifc or philanthropic missions, vessels collecting scientific data of likely military applications are not protected;
(g) small coastal fishing vessels and small boats engaged in local coastal trade, but they are subject to the regulations of a belligerent naval commander operating in the area and to inspection;
(h) vessels designated or adapted exclusively for responding to pollution incidents in the marine environment;
(i) vessels which have surrendered;
(j) life rafts and life boats.

Conditions of exemption

48. Vessels listed in paragraph 47 are exempt from attack only if they:

(a) are innocently employed in their normal role;
(b) submit to identification and inspection when required; and
(c) do not intentionally hamper the movement of combatants and obey orders to stop or move out of the way when required.

SECTION II : VISIT AND SEARCH OF MERCHANT VESSELS

Basic rules

118. In exercising their legal rights in an international armed conflict at sea, belligerent warships and military aircraft have a right to visit and search merchant vessels outside neutral waters where there are reasonable grounds for suspecting that they are subject to capture.

119. As an alternative to visit and search, a neutral merchant vessel may, with its consent, be diverted from its declared destination.

Merchant vessels under convoy of accompanying neutral warships

120. A neutral merchant vessel is exempt from the exercise of the right of visit and search if it meets the following conditions:

(a) it is bound for a neutral port;
(b) it is under the convoy of an accompanying neutral warship of the same nationality or a neutral warship of a State with which the flag State of the merchant vessel has concluded an agreement providing for such convoy;
(c) the flag State of the neutral warship warrants that the neutral merchant vessel is not carrying contraband or otherwise engaged in activities inconsistent with its neutral status; and
(d) the commander of the neutral warship provides, if requested by the commander of an intercepting belligerent warship or military aircraft, all information as to the character of the merchant vessel and its cargo as could otherwise be obtained by visit and search.

Diversion for the purpose of visit and search

121. If visit and search at sea is impossible or unsafe, a belligerent warship or military aircraft may divert a merchant vessel to an appropriate area or port in order to exercise the right of visit and search.

Measures of supervision

122. In order to avoid the necessity of visit and search, belligerent States may establish reasonable measures for the inspection of cargo of neutral merchant vessels and certification that a vessel is not carrying contraband.

123. The fact that a neutral merchant vessel has submitted to such measures of supervision as the inspection of its cargo and grant of certificates of non-contraband cargo by one belligerent is not an act of unneutral service with regard to an opposing belligerent.

124. In order to obviate the necessity for visit and search, neutral States are encouraged to enforce reasonable control measures and certification procedures to ensure that their merchant vessels are not carrying contraband.
 

Goober

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Letting them live a keeping the boats floating was probably the last option in Israel's list.


What are the proper rules? (rather than it being anything Israel says it is) Diversion is only allowed if there is a danger to a search art sea (which would not be the case for a few boxes of Medical supplies) and it needs the permission of the ships Captain. Barring those conditions diversion is an illegal act. (so was keeping the ships and passengers in the first floatilla)

San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994

SECTION III : ENEMY VESSELS AND AIRCRAFT EXEMPT FROM ATTACK

Classes of vessels exempt from attack

47. The following classes of enemy vessels are exempt from attack:

(a) hospital ships;
(b) small craft used for coastal rescue operations and other medical transports;
(c) vessels granted safe conduct by agreement between the belligerent parties including:
(i) cartel vessels, e.g., vessels designated for and engaged in the transport of prisoners of war;
(ii) vessels engaged in humanitarian missions, including vessels carrying supplies indispensable to the survival of the civilian population, and vessels engaged in relief actions and rescue operations;
(d) vessels engaged in transporting cultural property under special protection;
(e) passenger vessels when engaged only in carrying civilian passengers;
(f) vessels charged with religious, non-military scientifc or philanthropic missions, vessels collecting scientific data of likely military applications are not protected;
(g) small coastal fishing vessels and small boats engaged in local coastal trade, but they are subject to the regulations of a belligerent naval commander operating in the area and to inspection;
(h) vessels designated or adapted exclusively for responding to pollution incidents in the marine environment;
(i) vessels which have surrendered;
(j) life rafts and life boats.

Conditions of exemption

48. Vessels listed in paragraph 47 are exempt from attack only if they:

(a) are innocently employed in their normal role;
(b) submit to identification and inspection when required; and
(c) do not intentionally hamper the movement of combatants and obey orders to stop or move out of the way when required.

SECTION II : VISIT AND SEARCH OF MERCHANT VESSELS

Basic rules

118. In exercising their legal rights in an international armed conflict at sea, belligerent warships and military aircraft have a right to visit and search merchant vessels outside neutral waters where there are reasonable grounds for suspecting that they are subject to capture.

119. As an alternative to visit and search, a neutral merchant vessel may, with its consent, be diverted from its declared destination.

Merchant vessels under convoy of accompanying neutral warships

120. A neutral merchant vessel is exempt from the exercise of the right of visit and search if it meets the following conditions:

(a) it is bound for a neutral port;
(b) it is under the convoy of an accompanying neutral warship of the same nationality or a neutral warship of a State with which the flag State of the merchant vessel has concluded an agreement providing for such convoy;
(c) the flag State of the neutral warship warrants that the neutral merchant vessel is not carrying contraband or otherwise engaged in activities inconsistent with its neutral status; and
(d) the commander of the neutral warship provides, if requested by the commander of an intercepting belligerent warship or military aircraft, all information as to the character of the merchant vessel and its cargo as could otherwise be obtained by visit and search.

Diversion for the purpose of visit and search

121. If visit and search at sea is impossible or unsafe, a belligerent warship or military aircraft may divert a merchant vessel to an appropriate area or port in order to exercise the right of visit and search.

Measures of supervision

122. In order to avoid the necessity of visit and search, belligerent States may establish reasonable measures for the inspection of cargo of neutral merchant vessels and certification that a vessel is not carrying contraband.

123. The fact that a neutral merchant vessel has submitted to such measures of supervision as the inspection of its cargo and grant of certificates of non-contraband cargo by one belligerent is not an act of unneutral service with regard to an opposing belligerent.

124. In order to obviate the necessity for visit and search, neutral States are encouraged to enforce reasonable control measures and certification procedures to ensure that their merchant vessels are not carrying contraband.

And Israel diverts ships - What is your point
 

MHz

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And Israel diverts ships - What is your point
Did you not read the post? consent is a key word, not Israel's consent, the consent of the ship is needed. Do you even know there is a difference?

119. As an alternative to visit and search, a neutral merchant vessel may, with its consent, be diverted from its declared destination.

Next time Canada can inspect the cargo herself and then send a warship alopng and boarding and diversion are avoided. I suppose you have a problem with that legal solution also?

120. A neutral merchant vessel is exempt from the exercise of the right of visit and search if it meets the following conditions:

(a) it is bound for a neutral port;
(b) it is under the convoy of an accompanying neutral warship of the same nationality or a neutral warship of a State with which the flag State of the merchant vessel has concluded an agreement providing for such convoy;
(c) the flag State of the neutral warship warrants that the neutral merchant vessel is not carrying contraband or otherwise engaged in activities inconsistent with its neutral status; and
(d) the commander of the neutral warship provides, if requested by the commander of an intercepting belligerent warship or military aircraft, all information as to the character of the merchant vessel and its cargo as could otherwise be obtained by visit and search.
 

taxslave

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Letting them live a keeping the boats floating was probably the last option in Israel's list.


What are the proper rules? (rather than it being anything Israel says it is) Diversion is only allowed if there is a danger to a search art sea (which would not be the case for a few boxes of Medical supplies) and it needs the permission of the ships Captain. Barring those conditions diversion is an illegal act. (so was keeping the ships and passengers in the first floatilla)

San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994

SECTION III : ENEMY VESSELS AND AIRCRAFT EXEMPT FROM ATTACK

Classes of vessels exempt from attack

47. The following classes of enemy vessels are exempt from attack:

(a) hospital ships;
(b) small craft used for coastal rescue operations and other medical transports;
(c) vessels granted safe conduct by agreement between the belligerent parties including:
(i) cartel vessels, e.g., vessels designated for and engaged in the transport of prisoners of war;
(ii) vessels engaged in humanitarian missions, including vessels carrying supplies indispensable to the survival of the civilian population, and vessels engaged in relief actions and rescue operations;
(d) vessels engaged in transporting cultural property under special protection;
(e) passenger vessels when engaged only in carrying civilian passengers;
(f) vessels charged with religious, non-military scientifc or philanthropic missions, vessels collecting scientific data of likely military applications are not protected;
(g) small coastal fishing vessels and small boats engaged in local coastal trade, but they are subject to the regulations of a belligerent naval commander operating in the area and to inspection;
(h) vessels designated or adapted exclusively for responding to pollution incidents in the marine environment;
(i) vessels which have surrendered;
(j) life rafts and life boats.

Conditions of exemption

48. Vessels listed in paragraph 47 are exempt from attack only if they:

(a) are innocently employed in their normal role;
(b) submit to identification and inspection when required; and
(c) do not intentionally hamper the movement of combatants and obey orders to stop or move out of the way when required.

SECTION II : VISIT AND SEARCH OF MERCHANT VESSELS

Basic rules

118. In exercising their legal rights in an international armed conflict at sea, belligerent warships and military aircraft have a right to visit and search merchant vessels outside neutral waters where there are reasonable grounds for suspecting that they are subject to capture.

119. As an alternative to visit and search, a neutral merchant vessel may, with its consent, be diverted from its declared destination.

Merchant vessels under convoy of accompanying neutral warships

120. A neutral merchant vessel is exempt from the exercise of the right of visit and search if it meets the following conditions:

(a) it is bound for a neutral port;
(b) it is under the convoy of an accompanying neutral warship of the same nationality or a neutral warship of a State with which the flag State of the merchant vessel has concluded an agreement providing for such convoy;
(c) the flag State of the neutral warship warrants that the neutral merchant vessel is not carrying contraband or otherwise engaged in activities inconsistent with its neutral status; and
(d) the commander of the neutral warship provides, if requested by the commander of an intercepting belligerent warship or military aircraft, all information as to the character of the merchant vessel and its cargo as could otherwise be obtained by visit and search.

Diversion for the purpose of visit and search

121. If visit and search at sea is impossible or unsafe, a belligerent warship or military aircraft may divert a merchant vessel to an appropriate area or port in order to exercise the right of visit and search.

Measures of supervision

122. In order to avoid the necessity of visit and search, belligerent States may establish reasonable measures for the inspection of cargo of neutral merchant vessels and certification that a vessel is not carrying contraband.

123. The fact that a neutral merchant vessel has submitted to such measures of supervision as the inspection of its cargo and grant of certificates of non-contraband cargo by one belligerent is not an act of unneutral service with regard to an opposing belligerent.

124. In order to obviate the necessity for visit and search, neutral States are encouraged to enforce reasonable control measures and certification procedures to ensure that their merchant vessels are not carrying contraband.

All very nice on paper but only an idiot or someone wanting to make a political statement would attempt to run a legal blockade.
 

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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Did you not read the post? consent is a key word, not Israel's consent, the consent of the ship is needed. Do you even know there is a difference?

You already shot yourself in the foot...

48. Vessels listed in paragraph 47 are exempt from attack only if they

(a) are innocently employed in the their normal role

Running a legal blockade, is neither innocent, nor normal.

 
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MHz

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All very nice on paper but only an idiot or someone wanting to make a political statement would attempt to run a legal blockade.
So now they also get to make up any rules they feel like and still get 100% support? That will bite them in the ass somewhere down the road, if it hasn't already.

Watch how ball-less Canada is on this 'little point of law'.
 

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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So now they also get to make up any rules they feel like and still get 100% support? That will bite them in the ass somewhere down the road, if it hasn't already.

Watch how ball-less Canada is on this 'little point of law'.
Ummm, just in case you were wondering how wrong you were.


You already shot yourself in the foot...



48. Vessels listed in paragraph 47 are exempt from attack only if they

(a) are innocently employed in the their normal role
Running a legal blockade, is neither innocent, nor normal.



 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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Did you not read the post? consent is a key word, not Israel's consent, the consent of the ship is needed. Do you even know there is a difference?

119. As an alternative to visit and search, a neutral merchant vessel may, with its consent, be diverted from its declared destination.

Next time Canada can inspect the cargo herself and then send a warship alopng and boarding and diversion are avoided. I suppose you have a problem with that legal solution also?

120. A neutral merchant vessel is exempt from the exercise of the right of visit and search if it meets the following conditions:

(a) it is bound for a neutral port;
(b) it is under the convoy of an accompanying neutral warship of the same nationality or a neutral warship of a State with which the flag State of the merchant vessel has concluded an agreement providing for such convoy;
(c) the flag State of the neutral warship warrants that the neutral merchant vessel is not carrying contraband or otherwise engaged in activities inconsistent with its neutral status; and
(d) the commander of the neutral warship provides, if requested by the commander of an intercepting belligerent warship or military aircraft, all information as to the character of the merchant vessel and its cargo as could otherwise be obtained by visit and search.

Read the law - If they refuse consent - Then they can be boarded or turned away. That is their choice. Not running the blockade if they refuse consent.
 

MHz

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Diversion still only means 'inspection' it does not mean confiscation of boat and goods, after the consent to be diverted the ship and crew should be free to continue onto their original destination, the port in Gaza City. Boarding and inspection can take place at sea, especially on such a small boat it would take only a few hours, on the Mavi Marmara there still would have been no danger to an inspection at sea.

Next time they should try UPS to deliver.
Why a legal blockade doesn't cover medical supplies or humanitarian goods. All Israel has to do is provide a complete list of banned items so the ships know what they can and cannot carry. What's the big deal for them to not do that?
 

petros

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If you mean Jew as in cheap? Yeah! Humanitarian? Yeah!

What is cheapest and easiest? Buying a boat and shipping from Turkey or Greece or get a truck and go to Cairo or Amman if you won't buy from the Heebs?