Race Is Real, It's Just Not A Science

dumpthemonarchy

House Member
Jan 18, 2005
4,235
14
38
Vancouver
www.cynicsunlimited.com
Overall a good, progressive web page against backward, tradtional religion, in this case, Islam. But they lose it on race. We are part of groups, we are not just individuals, how about, we are both. I'm part of Canada and not China. No one in the world would call me Chinese, and why are Chinese different from me? These people never like trying to answer a question like this.

These do-gooding people need to acknowledge race, become racialists because the whole world acknowledges the existence of race. They are part of the PC crowd here, who say, don't even talk or think about race or you are a racist. Nonsense. Racialists acknowledge the existence of race but don't see other races as inferior or his own as superior. Racialists are not automatically hostile to someone who looks different.

To suppress this important topic is dogma and dogma is what this web page is against. They sound like that woman in the Islamic video who is told daily that whatever she does, she is offending Islam. It's not all about controlling thoughts and the body, it's letting it be free responsibly.




TheReligionofPeace - Race, Racism and Islam


From the Editor



Race, Racism (and Islam)
TROP's Case against Race


"Islam is an ideology. It's not a race."
Ibrahim Hooper, CAIR spokesperson

"Whoever resembles a people, he is of them"
Muhammad, Prophet of Islam

Race and Racism
Race is the arbitrary classification of individuals according to physical traits that presumably have a genetic basis. How many races there are and what characteristics are used to determine racial identity is entirely subjective, since there is no such thing as a "race gene" or a series of genes that define race in the absolute sense. Race is therefore a social construct, and not a physical science, even it is grounded in genetics. It is no more meaningful to say that a person is of a certain race than it is to say that they live in Indiana rather than Illinois.
Categorizing people by race is also non-sensible and irrelevant. Consider the entirely feasible example of a girl born to parents who are a white European and a native African. Given the different races involved, which one would she be considered? More importantly, how could it possibly matter? Would being either “black” or “white” or something in between make her any different of a person?
Race also serves as the foundation for racism, which tries to emphasize distinctions between racial categories – arbitrary as they may be. Racism is the “science” of drawing broad conclusions from comparative studies, which are then assumed to apply to all members of a particular group who happen to share a genetic profile.
Racism is deeply flawed because it is fundamentally irrational. Human beings are not groups, they are individuals.
There is not one scientific or cultural fact that can be determined about an individual based on their race. For example, one cannot know what music another person enjoys, how they vote, or how high they are able to jump simply by knowing their race.
In fact, all racial stereotypes dissolve at the individual level. No matter how fast one runs, how quick one thinks, or how moral one’s character, there can always be members of any other race found who better excel at each of these – or any other imaginable measure. There is simply no such thing as a meaningful racial stereotype. People are generally whoever they choose to be.
This makes perfect sense to intelligent people. Since racial identity is arbitrary, it cannot be deterministic. Without determinism, there can be no science. Therefore, neither racism nor the study of race has anything factual to offer.
In addition to being a false science, racism is morally wrong because it is the foundation for racial discrimination, in which different rules and standards are applied to individuals based on their presumed identity. In the past, people suffered tremendously (and unfairly, of course) because of this.
Thus, the artificial system of race serves no positive purpose. Lending legitimacy to the flawed theory of racial distinction leads, almost inevitably, to racism and the justification of racial discrimination. This, along with the inherent absurdity of even classifying people by race, should be enough to merit junking racial identification altogether.

Islam and “Racism”

Those openly critical of Islam are sometimes dubiously slurred as racists, regardless of what their true views on race may be.

In fact, Islam is not a race. Islam has nothing at all to do with genetics. It is an ideology – a set of beliefs about individual behavior and the rules of society.
Neither are Muslims a race of people. In fact, there are Muslims of all races.
Therefore criticizing Islam is not racism. There is no such thing as "anti-Muslim racism" any more than it makes sense to pretend that there is "anti-Christian racism," "anti-Methodist racism," or "anti-Capitalist racism."
So why would anyone claim differently?
It is because the battle over Islam is being fought in the West, the only arena in which this religion can still be critically debated. It is also here that repugnance toward racism is strong and nearly universal. As politicians well know, if one can successfully paint the opposition as “racist,” then the battle for public opinion is all but decided. From high-risk mortgages to illegal immigration, fear of the race card is one of the strongest influences on public policy.
At the same time, it is nearly impossible to defend Islam in its own right - which is why Muslim societies usually rely on threat of violence to suppress intellectual critique of Islam and the freedom of other religion to fairly compete. According to its own texts, Islam was founded in terror, and its political and social code is deeply incompatible with Western liberal values. Frustrated advocates of Islam’s advance are therefore prone to taking the crude and easy path of trying to squash debate by mislabeling criticism of their religion as racism.
Having to sling the worst of all slurs to compensate for deficiency of fact and logic is bad enough, but in this case there is terrible irony in that what is being defended in such cheap fashion is an ideology that is overtly supremacist in nature. In fact, those Muslims who do want to rely on the race card are not thinking very far ahead.
On the surface it would seem that if Islam really were a race, or Muslims a race of people, then any criticism of the common tie which unites them - in this case the religion of Islam – could be dismissed out of hand as racism, thus effectively protecting the religion from tough examination. But everything is not as it seems.
If Muslims are a race because of Islam, then it means that Islam is a racial ideology. What this ideology has to say about its own and other “races” therefore becomes very important.
In fact, the Qur’an posits an enormous qualitative distinction between Muslims and non-Muslims that is hard to miss. Believers are loved by God, whereas infidels are hated to the extent that they are tortured for eternity (3:32, 4:56) merely for not believing. Muslims are told to shun unbelievers (3:118), who are called “helpers of evil” (25:55), “wicked” (4:160), “fond of lies” (5:42) and compared to the worst of animals (8:55, 7:176, 7:179). Members of Islam are told to be merciful to each other, but ruthless to those outside of the faith (48:29). Violence is also sanctioned against those who are obstinate against Islamic rule (8:12-13, 9:5).
No other religion filters perception through group identity to the extent that Islam does. Around the world Christians, Jews and other individuals are routinely targeted merely because they are a member of a non-Muslim group, not because they have done anything to personally deserve having their lives taken, their children maimed or their property torched. Meanwhile, other Muslims are generally indifferent to this violence and reserve their true outrage for circumstances involving Muslim victims of non-Muslim acts, however unintentional or relatively slight.
So, if Muslims are a race, Islam would not only be a racist ideology, but arguably the most hateful and destructive in history. It is bad enough that hundreds of millions of people have been killed in the last fourteen centuries by divinely sanctioned Jihad and slavery, but to retroactively supplant the stated motive of religious supremacy with that of racial superiority is hardly a step in the right direction for a religion seeking the acceptance of an increasingly skeptical audience.

Conclusion
Race is an arbitrary label that has no legitimacy. Therefore anything based on race, including racism and racial discrimination is unsound at best and immoral and inhumane at worst.
Human beings are individuals and should only be judged as such.
Islam is not a race. Muslims are not a race. Islam is an ideology that should be open to critical examination. Muslims, however, are individuals who should be protected from harm or harassment in the same way and for the same reasons as anyone else.
GR
Editor, TROP
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
39,778
454
83
Come back with a better source than thereligionofpeace and will take this thread seriously.
 

DaSleeper

Trolling Hypocrites
May 27, 2007
33,676
1,665
113
Northern Ontario,
That web site has been tagged by many in this forum as a hate site without refuting any content..... even though you can find the same thing that is printed on that site on wikipedia...........go figure:roll:
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
39,778
454
83
That web site has been tagged by many in this forum as a hate site without refuting any content..... even though you can find the same thing that is printed on that site on wikipedia...........go figure:roll:

Meh.

Show me where on wikipedia and I might bite.
 

DaSleeper

Trolling Hypocrites
May 27, 2007
33,676
1,665
113
Northern Ontario,
Meh.

Show me where on wikipedia and I might bite.

First you check this....
Islam: Making a True Difference in the World - One Body at a Time

And most if not all can be found .....

Here... List of terrorist incidents - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I suspect that what they post on the Religion of peace is a compilation of information found all over the internet and placed on one web site...
TheReligionofPeace - About the List of Islamic Terror Attacks
A short quote from that particular page..
The incidents are collected each day from public news sources. There is no rumor or word-of-mouth involved. Although every attempt is made to be accurate and consistent, we are not making the claim that this is a scientific product.

Unlike the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), which publishes a tally of alleged "hate crimes" each year without supporting data, we do provide detail of each incident that we claim as a terror attack and make it available for verification.
Do they concentrate their efforts on islamic wrongdoings??? of course they do....but does that make it a hate web site??...it's an opinion shared by many apologists..
Now if someone would refute what is written there instead of just crying HATE SITE....??????
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
39,778
454
83
Now if someone would refute what is written there instead of just crying HATE SITE....??????

I never said it was a hate site, but the geocities dressing definitely doesn't help.

Also, do we need yet another thread on Islam?

Why don't we have official threads?
 

DaSleeper

Trolling Hypocrites
May 27, 2007
33,676
1,665
113
Northern Ontario,
I never said it was a hate site, but the geocities dressing definitely doesn't help.

Maybe not you...but I was reported by several members (not told who) for using the term Dhimwit not because it was felt the term was insulting but because it hot linked to The Religion Of Peace as a hate site

Also, do we need yet another thread on Islam?

Do we need all those threads on the Israeli/palestinian conflict???
Aversion therapy???:lol:

Why don't we have official threads?

Think that would work????;-)
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
15,441
150
63
Race, arbitrary? For some things, sure. For others? Sickle cell anemia is a disease which has a strong racial component.

As for the conclusions, I haven't seen too many racists criticizing Muslims, not that they don't exist. The words I would use in place are intolerant, bigot, prejudiced, zealot, fanatic, extremist, etc. But I'm sure there are racial components for some people.
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
43,839
207
63
Ontario
That web site has been tagged by many in this forum as a hate site without refuting any content..... even though you can find the same thing that is printed on that site on wikipedia...........go figure:roll:
I have an issue with the Op/Ed pieces there.

The facts on the other hand, are traceable.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
44,850
192
63
Nakusp, BC
I'm thinking that Dump is just a troll. He knows whose buttons to push and how to push them. I'm staying out of it cause I like it here.
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
43,839
207
63
Ontario
I'm thinking that Dump is just a troll. He knows whose buttons to push and how to push them. I'm staying out of it cause I like it here.
Dude, he thinks he's pushing buttons. But his bigotry has him so blind, all he's doing is smudging the stainless.

His kind of dumb is so easily trumped with minimal effort.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
44,850
192
63
Nakusp, BC
Dude, he thinks he's pushing buttons. But his bigotry has him so blind, all he's doing is smudging the stainless.

His kind of dumb is so easily trumped with minimal effort.
More like playing in his diaper. The trouble is that responding to him just makes him post more outrageous nonsense. I prefer to let someone like that dangle in their own ....
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
43,839
207
63
Ontario
More like playing in his diaper. The trouble is that responding to him just makes him post more outrageous nonsense.
Half the fun is watching them make up more nonsense though Cliffy. For me anyways, but I'm twisted like that.

I prefer to let someone like that dangle in their own ....
dumpy wallows.

The sad thing is though, I don't think dumpy is a troll. I think he's actually looking for an agreeable audience.

If he was truly just a troll, he wouldn't ignore people like me. He'd engage and try and provoke. He doesn't. He hides, blindly posts replies, and otherwise avoids addressing me directly. That way he can ignore the facts that expose his stupidity and bigotry.
 

earth_as_one

Time Out
Jan 5, 2006
7,933
53
48
The human genome project exposed the concept of multiple human races as quackery.
...DNA studies do not indicate that separate classifiable subspecies (races) exist within modern humans. While different genes for physical traits such as skin and hair color can be identified between individuals, no consistent patterns of genes across the human genome exist to distinguish one race from another. There also is no genetic basis for divisions of human ethnicity....
http://www.ornl.gov/sci/techresources/Human_Genome/elsi/minorities.shtml

There is only one human race and we are all Africans.
 
Last edited:

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
15,441
150
63
The human genome project exposed the concept of multiple human races as quackery.

Minorities and Genomics: Issues of Race

There is only one human race and we are all Africans.

The pattern isn't in the genome, it's in the geographic distribution of human populations. Different sub-species of any animal won't be entirely unique and distinct from other sub-species. I don't see any reason to define race in that manner either. Biology simply desn't work that way. Some genes are highly conserved in genomes, and some are highly variable.

Biology classifies races in animals as well based on phenotypic differences in the population. Honey bees are one example. Or how about dog breeds? Same species, different phenotypic characteristics. The lines may be blurred when it comes to humans, but that doesn't mean that the idea of different characteristics within populations is quackery, it's ridiculous in the extreme to suggest otherwise.

How about another clear example. Folks hailing from North Europe can have resistance against HIV. A genetic heritage resulting from, well they haven't actually nailed it down yet, likely a prolonged viral infection during one of the episodes of plague. Anyways this population has a high incidence of a particular mutation, a deletion of 32 base pairs in the CCR5 gene. This makes them resistant to the M tropic strains of HIV.

Race is very much a real tangible thing. Before the world got so small, populations of humans were exposed to different evolutionary pressures, and that is clearly evident today.