U.S. debt impasse could be 'catastrophic'

Machjo

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Oct 19, 2004
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http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/07/10/debt-ceiling-us-financial-crisis.html

This is worrisome for Canada, seeing how interrelated Canada's economy is to the US one. I say, brace for impact. If the Canadian Federal government were smart, we'd adopt a tax-and-axe policy for the remainder of the coming mandate, the only exception to spending cuts possibly being skills training for the unemployed.

At the provincial level too, tax-and-axe woudl be a wise policy, again possibly excepting education funding, seeing that we still need the skills to maintain a strong economy.

As for social assistance for the poor, we'll likely have to simply deregulate so as to allow them to fend for themselves (e.g. scrap the minimum wage, introduce co-determination legislation to allow them to negotiate fair wages with employers, which may simply mean salay cuts for management, not necessarily salay increases for the workers). We may need to work together with other countries to try to blunt the impact somewhat, such as our ministries of education establishing common educational standards for various trades and professions so as to make our workforce more mobile, promoting more free trade with other countries and possibly freer labour-movement too. In short, if we don't have the money to support the poor anymore, we'll have to remove as many barriers as possible to allow them to fend for themselves, to be fair.

As it stands right now, the Republicans will likely not back away from high military spending, and the Democrats either. On top of that, Democrats will likely refuse to back away from help to the poor too. Add to that that the US has become more protectionist over the years too. That spells disaster for the US economy in the long short and long terms. Brace for impact, Canada, because it will hit us too.
 

Machjo

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Perhaps one should start at the top where the waste is just a normal part of every day life....

That's why I said "tax-and-axe". Axing will hurt the poor the most; taxing will hurt the rich the most. So yes, I am suggesting sharing the burden collectively for the good of the country. I also made an exception for skills-training and education, which naturally will benefit the poor the most, as the rich have no need for skills training.

Co-determination legislation, let's say German-style, whereby workers get to elect 50% of the board of directors (though the chairman of the board must always be elected by the shareholders and holds the tie-breaking vote) would likewise benefit workers more than shareholders in all companies with 500+ employees when we consider that at the moment, workers have no vote on the board of directors in Canada at all.

Ministries of education establishing common educational standards also benefits the poor more than the rich. I doubt most CEOs need to hold to prove any kind of skill to transfer to another country. So again, it's the poor workers that would benefit the most from this as they're the ones most likely to need some kind of proof of the necessary educational standards to work abroad.

Free labour movement agreements too benefit the poor more than the rich, as I doubt it's very difficult for a CEO of a major company to get a visa to transfer to another country, so this too would benefit the poor worker just looking for work more than the rich.

All the proposals above would benefit the poor more than the rich, but all in such a way as to help them not by supporting them financially beyond education and skills training, but rather by removing obstacles to them looking for work by ensuring their diplomas, degrees, etc. are recognized in more countries and that they have a larger market to access internationall when looking for work, especially valuable if a worker's particular skills are more indemand abroad than domestically.

To simply taxes, we could simply agree to residency-based taxation (i.e. you pay your taxes to the government(r) that has (have) jurisdiction over your place of residence), so as to reduce bureaucracy on that front.

A common currency would also help the poor more than the rich. The rich can afford the extra cost of currency conversion, and besides, money brokers usually earn a hefty income anyway.
 

lone wolf

Grossly Underrated
Nov 25, 2006
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Starvation for the good of the country....

You just can't seem to understand the rich have already moved high-paying industry to locations where investors can turn greater profit and to hell with the non-parasites who actually work to make your widgets. Investors don't give a damn if the product label says Made in Canada, Made in the USA or Made in Hong Kong ... or even what the product is ... as long as they make money from it.
 

TenPenny

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Jun 9, 2004
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Location, Location
Starvation for the good of the country....

You just can't seem to understand the rich have already moved high-paying industry to locations where investors can turn greater profit and to hell with the non-parasites who actually work to make your widgets. Investors don't give a damn if the product label says Made in Canada, Made in the USA or Made in Hong Kong ... or even what the product is ... as long as they make money on it.

That's not actually true, many investors want to invest in their local economies, and many industrialists are that way, too.

If you're ever out this way, I'll introduce you to some of the Irvings. They aren't saints by any stretch of the imagination, but they do want to invest and grow the local economy, and provide jobs for local people. That's why, if you investigate their wealth, it's all tied up in more businesses, not in flashy cars and pretending to be movie executives.
 

Machjo

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 19, 2004
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Starvation for the good of the country....

You just can't seem to understand the rich have already moved high-paying industry to locations where investors can turn greater profit and to hell with the non-parasites who actually work to make your widgets. Investors don't give a damn if the product label says Made in Canada, Made in the USA or Made in Hong Kong ... or even what the product is ... as long as they make money from it.

Recently a few companies moved back from China owing to the high cost of fuel.

Likewise about a decade ago some companies had moved back to Canada owing to the high cost of training unskilled mexican workers.

And many also invest in Canadian resources in Canada because... well... the resources are in Canada, so if you want them you have to come here to get them.

So while there are plenty of reasons for companies to move out of Canada, there are also companies that move to Canada for other reasons.

I'm all for helping the poor. In many cases, it's not always their fault they're poor, but rather bad luck, getting caught up in bureaucracy, etc. However, we need to help them in a rational manner. Regardless how much we may want to help them, just throwing money at them is not the way to do so. Instead, we need to help them in a rational manner that will provide them with the foundation necessary to become proud contributors to the economy, especially when our economy is about to buckle under US pressure. We can gloat all we want about how bad the US economy is. But make no mistake about it, a buckled US economy will not be a happy day for Canada either. We can either work together as Canadians and with our neighbours in the international community, or repeat the mistake of the Great Depression, whereby we press the panic button, turn to protectiononist competition, and end up all falling together. Together we stand, divided...
 

Ocean Breeze

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Jun 5, 2005
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CNN Breaking news:

President Obama “cannot guarantee” that Social Security, veterans and disability checks will be issued if Congress cannot agree on a deal that would raise the government’s debt ceiling by August 2nd, he tells CBS News.



"I cannot guarantee that those checks go out on August 3rd if we haven’t resolved this issue because there may simply not be the money in the coffers to do it,” Obama said in an excerpt of the interview released by CBS.


>+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=

the US is in such serious trouble.........it is amazing that there is any bragging and arrogance left.

any nation with that much wealth , human talent , and capabilities that CANNOT MANAGE its money.... by over spending on its grandiose schemes (mainly aggressions on the planet) and living in a delusional financial bubble that money comes from an eternal well of some kind. .....is hardly worth all the flag waving it does.

Time to do some serious domestic housekeeping , financial and other. and stop meddling where you are not wanted.

the tragedy is that should the US "go down".........it will take a lot of really good nations with it. Other nations might learn that becoming too intertwined with a myth can be costly. and dangerous to its own "health".
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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I hope you're all ready for mass immigration.

 

Ocean Breeze

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I hope you're all ready for mass immigration.


well, as long as they leave their flag behind. Learn to speak French and Chinese ( or the many derivatives of) are prepared to live in Igloos , they can populate the nothern most regions of Canada. What a bunch of hypocrits. The "brave" propganda was all a lie / myth along with everything else they would have you believe. Of course they will have to pass the most rigorous screening process........and LEAVE THEIR DAMNED GUNS behind. (there are enough here already).

Better still , stay where you are , and DEAL with the horrific problems YOU (americans) created and allowed to take place. Otherwise they are nothing but the cowards / run away from responsibility blokes / that they despise so much.

the true colors are starting to show and they are not pretty.

One winter here will see them going home.

that is why , if they come.........they might as well be USEFUL......and populate the northern regions. I hear that driving the delivery trucks over blizzard ice- road conditions........pays well. (and being money oriented......they could make a fortune)
 

Machjo

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Oct 19, 2004
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well, as long as they leave their flag behind. Learn to speak French and Chinese ( or the many derivatives of) are prepared to live in Igloos , they can populate the nothern most regions of Canada. What a bunch of hypocrits. The "brave" propganda was all a lie / myth along with everything else they would have you believe. Of course they will have to pass the most rigorous screening process........and LEAVE THEIR DAMNED GUNS behind. (there are enough here already).

Better still , stay where you are , and DEAL with the horrific problems YOU (americans) created and allowed to take place. Otherwise they are nothing but the cowards / run away from responsibility blokes / that they despise so much.

the true colors are starting to show and they are not pretty.



that is why , if they come.........they might as well be USEFUL......and populate the northern regions. I hear that driving the delivery trucks over blizzard ice- road conditions........pays well. (and being money oriented......they could make a fortune)

Ah, that warm welcoming Canadian love for our fellow-men.

Do I detect a wee little bit of anti-Americanism there in your post?
 

Ocean Breeze

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Ah, that warm welcoming Canadian love for our fellow-men.

Do I detect a wee little bit of anti-Americanism there in your post?

Nope.......... what you detect is some REALISM. The "anti americanism" card has been over played, over used and not even relevant. It is a card that far too many hide behind when they refuse to discuss the REALITY of what the US has become.

One cannot in all reality, deny that the US has gone down hill and fast in the past decade. Too many wars for any budget, (let alone the massive destruction scenarios they involve). , mismangement of funds ..on a scale one can hardly phathom or imagine., lack of funds for important issues.....like the basic needs for its own population. The wars are bleeding the US financially......and yet there is no sign of them ending.

Folks are lucky to have jobs. ( two family members in California lost their jobs ......but were LUCKY to find new ones. The stress was incredible. along with the uncertainty )

time to put that "anti americanism" catch all phrase to bed. as it is meaningless
 

Ocean Breeze

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Yup but first American and Canadians need to be as dirt poor as Mexicans.

Lenin called it "levelling".

CPC still calls themselves "Progressives" when it comes to Socialism.

It's the first line of their "Founding Principles"

Founding Principles


Leave Canadians out of it. So far it is hanging in there quite well in the national budget dept. Not great ...but not in the crisis the US is in. But it is very concerning that the US self destruction will affect Canada is a negative way.

What the US has to do ......is FACE REALITY of what it has CREATED due to its greed, mismanagement. , corporate theft etc etc. and learn to balance its books without including so much fantasy.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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Leave Canadians out of it. So far it is hanging in there quite well in the national budget dept. Not great ...but not in the crisis the US is in. But it is very concerning that the US self destruction will affect Canada is a negative way.
Canada has a severe skilled labour and professional shortage. This country is poised to grow faster than it did 100 years ago.