Kenya prepared to kick out white colonists

Jersay

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Dec 1, 2005
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GILGIL, Kenya - Hundreds attended the burial Thursday of a black man shot by one of Kenya's wealthiest landowners, a killing that has revived resentment against the descendants of white colonists.

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One government official promised to deport "white settlers and investors." Another threatened retaliation against Thomas Patrick Gilbert Cholmondeley if he was released from custody in the case, the second time in little more than a year that he fatally shot a black Kenyan on his property.

Cholmondeley, the grandson of one of the country's first European settlers, told police he shot Robert Wambugu in self-defense after finding him poaching an animal on his ranch. Last year, he was charged with murder in the shooting a Massai game warden investigating reports of illegal wildlife trading. The charge was dropped for lack of evidence.

"If the government releases Cholmondeley, this will be the last death he will have caused. We will take it into our hands and deal with him personally," said Koigi wa Wamwere, Kenya's assistant minister of information.

Kenya's minister for immigration, Gideon Konchellah, told the mourners: "We are aware of some white settlers and investors who are oppressing our people, and very soon we are going to act by deporting them."

Kenyan police said Cholmondeley was detained and under investigation for murder in last week's shooting but has not been charged.

Cholmondeley, a descendent of Britain's Lord Delamere, is heir to 100,000-acre farm in Kenya's Rift Valley. His family has been in Kenya since the early 20th century. His grandfather was one of the key promoters of colonialism in East Africa.

Last year more than 1,000 Maasai carrying spears, clubs, long knives and placards blocked a main road to Cholmondeley's ranch after Kenya's attorney general dropped the charge that he had murdered the game warden.

Cholmondeley expressed deep remorse for the shooting, and told police he thought the warden was an armed robber.

The Maasai claim that land occupied by Kenya's white settlers and their families was stolen from them in 1904, soon after Britain colonized the country.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060518...j9vaA8F;_ylu=X3oDMTA5aHJvMDdwBHNlYwN5bmNhdA--

With this man, if they have the option of deporting him, he has killed two people, I think he should be deported. For his own safety it seems. However, other white colonists should not be deported because of the colour of their skin.
 

#juan

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Aug 30, 2005
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Another Zimbabwe coming up

The blacks haven't a clue how to run a farm, or a country. Kenya was once a beatiful country, with farms and manufacturing and mining concerns that were run by blacks and whites. With the election of black governments, the blacks have demanded more of the farms, they Have scared off investors, and the place is going to hell. Kenya was once a showplace but it takes more than the biggest tribal chief to run a country successfully.
 

Jersay

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And it is so easy to forget what occured under white rule in most of these places. In Kenya the Mau Mau rebellion where thousands of civilians were killed by British Troops. Aparthaid, and other forms of repressive government.

This guy in the article I believe sould be kicked out of the country if no charges are filled.
 

Jay

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Jan 7, 2005
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Why? So the state can have the farm, that's why....
 

Johnny Utah

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Mar 11, 2006
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#juan said:
Another Zimbabwe coming up

The blacks haven't a clue how to run a farm, or a country. Kenya was once a beatiful country, with farms and manufacturing and mining concerns that were run by blacks and whites. With the election of black governments, the blacks have demanded more of the farms, they Have scared off investors, and the place is going to hell. Kenya was once a showplace but it takes more than the biggest tribal chief to run a country successfully.
Wasn't Zimbabwe once a great vast farm land then after the white farmers were run out it all went to hell?
 

Daz_Hockey

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Nov 21, 2005
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RE: Kenya prepared to kic

I dont get this, is it because their white?...If I were to suggest we kick out asians in our country because they might be related to Ghengis Khan that would be deemed racist, theyre not coming back, they are citizens of that country now, like it or lump it
 

#juan

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Wasn't Zimbabwe once a great vast farm land then after the white farmers were run out it all went to hell?

Zimbabwe was once Rhodesia, a shining example of what African countries could be. The Whites stuck to their promise of Black rule and that eventually got them Mugabe. The whites were thrown off farms that those white families had lived on for two hundred years and more. Friends of the Mugabe government were given the farms and the farms went to ruin. The country's biggest income is now foreign aid. The blacks have always chanted "one man, one vote". What they got was "One man, one vote, once." Once in power, the elected governments didn't want to give up that power. Mugabe simply shoots the opposition.

Kenya will go down that same road.
 

sanch

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Apr 8, 2005
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#juan said:
Another Zimbabwe coming up

The blacks haven't a clue how to run a farm, or a country. Kenya was once a beatiful country, with farms and manufacturing and mining concerns that were run by blacks and whites. With the election of black governments, the blacks have demanded more of the farms, they Have scared off investors, and the place is going to hell. Kenya was once a showplace but it takes more than the biggest tribal chief to run a country successfully.

Anywhere you see the hand of the British you have patronage systems of government broken down along ethnic lines that have very self-serving dysfunctional bureaucracies. Some countries like Kenya have more people and fewer resources to squander than Canada but it is all the same formula.

I tell my African friends that corruption is out of control in Canada but that Canadians don’t mind because there is so much wealth they are able to maintain a livable lifestyle in spite of it. This is not true in Africa where there are severe shortages and government pillaging does make a more notable difference. Also there is a suspicious ability of corrupt African leaders to be able to deposit hundreds of millions of their countries money in private bank accounts in Switzerland.
 

Daz_Hockey

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Nov 21, 2005
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RE: Kenya prepared to kic

cant keep blaming the english though....it's pretty much been a lifetime, shall we blame the current german generation for the nazi's??
 

sanch

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To elaborate more it is the neo-colonial strcutures that have produced the disparities in Africa. Nationalizing these resources has not improved matters. Still Africans have not been served well by either European or African leaders.

There seems to be some correlation being drawn between skin colour and intelligence in this thread. I know Africans who speak 10 or more languages. Most Canadians speak only one and that is so so in many cases.
 

Daz_Hockey

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Nov 21, 2005
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RE: Kenya prepared to kic

and quite frankly....who ran Rwanda?, the Congo, Algeria, Mozambique?...I'm sorry, Robert Mugabe might be bad, but the british by no means were the worst in Africa....look at the germans in Zambia.....I'm sorry, I know a few black South Africans, from Zimbabwe (now the corruption there has little or nothing to do with the whites, it's more about tribal warfare between the Mstambili tribe and the Shona, pretty much the same all over africa..tutsii's and Hutu's e.g.)

I'm sorry, I might have tinted glasses, but the british were no worse than anyone else in their day...probably better than most...if they are so bad why stay in the commonwealth?
 

sanch

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Re: RE: Kenya prepared to kic

Daz_Hockey said:
cant keep blaming the english though....it's pretty much been a lifetime, shall we blame the current german generation for the nazi's??

Not certain of this analogy. I am referring to the British Empire and the types of social and political structures it left in its wake. And there are certain Brits who are still milking this legacy, a young Thatcher among them. The average Brit obviously is not responsible.
 

Daz_Hockey

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Nov 21, 2005
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RE: Kenya prepared to kic

and I agree Sanch, the head of my computing course at college was from Cameroon, skin colour has little or nothing to do with intellegence. but the fact is the rush for africa was wrong, it's caused a lot of damage and the effects are still there......I think it has more to do with a Kashmir sort of situation, where the colonial whites left without effectivly giving a stuff about what happened afterwards
 

sanch

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Apr 8, 2005
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Re: RE: Kenya prepared to kic

Daz_Hockey said:
and quite frankly....who ran Rwanda?, the Congo, Algeria, Mozambique?...I'm sorry, Robert Mugabe might be bad, but the british by no means were the worst in Africa....look at the germans in Zambia.....I'm sorry, I know a few black South Africans, from Zimbabwe (now the corruption there has little or nothing to do with the whites, it's more about tribal warfare between the Mstambili tribe and the Shona, pretty much the same all over africa..tutsii's and Hutu's e.g.)

I'm sorry, I might have tinted glasses, but the british were no worse than anyone else in their day...probably better than most...if they are so bad why stay in the commonwealth?

I agree with this but the thread is about Kenya. There were much worse that the British in Africa. And they weren't Americans.

Maybe they stay in the commonwealth in the hope that the British start handing out passports again to all citizens of former colonies.
 

Daz_Hockey

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Nov 21, 2005
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RE: Kenya prepared to kic

fact is sanch, systems change, countries are invaded, it's a fact of life, if that wernt true there would be no America, infact we'd all still be in africa..the systems the british left behind were usually much better than other colonial countries....little example though...Ethiopia..never coloniased by anyone and look at the state of it? explain that
 

Jersay

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Yeah 100 million dead because of the slave trade is really good. Now Spanish, Dutch, Portugese, Americans and British did the trading, but the majority was the British and Americans. Before pressure ended slavery.
 

Colpy

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Jersay said:
Yeah 100 million dead because of the slave trade is really good. Now Spanish, Dutch, Portugese, Americans and British did the trading, but the majority was the British and Americans. Before pressure ended slavery.

Slavery has never ended, I'm sorry to say.
 

Jersay

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You are correct. Slavery does continue in places in Africa and other places as well. But western style slavery has ended. And in that time period the British and others, Spanish and Portugese included killed at least 100 million people.
 

Daz_Hockey

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RE: Kenya prepared to kic

I'm not gonna get into the rights and wrongs of slavery Jersay, frankly because there can never be any "rights" about it, but actually the french, spanish and portugese were responsible for much more than the US or UK I'm afraid.

Just an observation, but Flys and the bugs they carry have caused much more than 100 million human deaths...should we kill all the flys or stigmatise flys for the amount of deaths attributed to them?, no, because they were unaware of the effects they had on the human population, but the moral of that little deviation was this: ok so they killed a great many, but at the time and to them was this in any way inherrently wrong?, did other animals not kill that number too?

yes would be the answer, now ok, you can dismiss this arguement, but the fact is, when slavery was rife, it was the norm, you wernt "normal" if you didnt do it, so to them, there was nothing inherrently wrong with what they did.

All I'm saying is this, from todays perspective, yes it was all wrong...but then it wasnt, not for a long time it wasnt, we cannot go back and change it so I'm afraid thats the way it's gonna stay, and calling out britian as the main instigator in this is simply nit-picking