I am beginning to like Chavez

Jersay

House Member
Dec 1, 2005
4,837
2
38
Independent Palestine
CARACAS, Venezuela - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez said the U.S. ambassador was "provoking the Venezuelan people" and threatened Sunday to expel the American diplomat, whose convoy was chased by pro-government protesters on motorcycles.

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Chavez condemned the crowd of protesters for pelting U.S. Ambassador William Brownfield's car with eggs and tomatoes, saying his government "rejects any kind of aggression."

But he suggested Brownfield, who was returning from a visit to a ballpark in Caracas' poor Coche neighborhood, a Chavez stronghold, sought a confrontation by failing to advise authorities adequately of his travel plans and venturing into a place where his presence was unwelcome.

"I'm going to throw you out of Venezuela if you continue provoking the Venezuelan people," Chavez said in a nationally televised speech addressed to Brownfield.

Chavez's incendiary comments came after Washington warned of "severe diplomatic consequence" if a similar incident repeats itself.

"If the Washington government takes some measure against Venezuela motivated by provocations, you will be responsible, you will have to leave here, sir. I will declare you persona non grata in Venezuela," Chavez responded Sunday in the address to Brownfield.

Chavez accused Washington of seeking to escalate tensions and threatening Venezuela.

"With your imprudence and provocation, you could one of these days cause a grave incident because (you walk) around with people who are armed, with security forces," Chavez said.

U.S. Embassy spokeswoman Salome Hernandez said the embassy refused to respond to "hypothetical" scenarios but added, "the ambassador will continue to travel and we will not be intimidated."

Relations between the United States and Venezuela, the world's fifth largest oil producer, have deteriorated sharply in recent months.

Chavez has threatened repeatedly to halt oil exports to the United States, and in February, Washington expelled a Venezuelan diplomat in response to Chavez's expulsion of a U.S. embassy official for alleged spying.

In the incident Friday, Chavez said Brownfield failed to advise the local mayor's office or the foreign ministry of his travel plans. Hernandez said the embassy is not required to advise those institutions but that it takes adequate precautions by regularly coordinating with law enforcement authorities for such events.

The response to his visit Friday was the third time in three weeks that Brownfield has been met by protests. Earlier, demonstrators burned tires and torched an American flag.

The State Department said the incident Friday "clearly was condoned by the local government," with local officials handing out snacks to perpetrators at the stadium. U.S. officials accused police of doing nothing, saying a single city police car stayed well behind the convoy while motorcyclists pounded and kicked the ambassador's car.

The Caracas mayor's office denied involvement,

Chavez says the United States of plotting against him, an accusation American officials deny.

Washington, however, has raised concern about the health of democracy under Chavez and has accused him of destabilizing Latin America. Chavez has responded by saying his government is democratic and it is the U.S. that is a destabilizing force.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060409...VF.7OSs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3ODdxdHBhBHNlYwM5NjQ-

The American diplomat should know, provoked from local government or not that he and America isn't liked in America especially in core Chavez areas. So what was he trying to prove accept a confrontation. Luckily no one was hurt.
 

FiveParadox

Governor General
Dec 20, 2005
5,875
43
48
Vancouver, BC
Order • Agree with Chavez

:!: [deleted] On a Point of Order

Due to deprecation — and outrage — this point of order is deleted.

:!: Agree with Chavez

I would agree with His Excellency Hugo Chavez, President of the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela, in that perhaps the United States of America seems to be employing a strategy that could perhaps cause more instability than it could improve diplomatic relations between the two countries. I would suggest that, despite recent events in Venezuela, the United States should take a stance that would promote a friendlier atmosphere between the two nations, instead of this somewhat-confrontational stance that seems to be put forward so often.
 

Nuggler

kind and gentle
Feb 27, 2006
11,596
140
63
Backwater, Ontario.
Bushies will probably try a "battleship Maine" on them and invade.

"Ambassador will continue to travel":..........Arrogant knob!.

Chavez trying to destabilize South America.....right :roll:

Kinda makes one want to puke :x
 

cortezzz

Electoral Member
Apr 8, 2006
663
0
16
that wont happen paradox

chavez is the real deal
a socialist
who works for his own people
with a vision for latin america

moreover a socialist with DEEP pockets
the terrorist commanders in washington have reason for concern--
 

I think not

Hall of Fame Member
Apr 12, 2005
10,506
33
48
The Evil Empire
Re: RE: I am beginning to lik

darkbeaver said:
I love Hugo Chavez, he's a real person.

Of course he is, especially when he changes the constitution to ensure he remains in power. A true socialist, remove power from the people and place it where it belongs, the government.
 

cortezzz

Electoral Member
Apr 8, 2006
663
0
16
oldnugly said:
Bushies will probably try a "battleship Maine" on them and invade.

"Ambassador will continue to travel":..........Arrogant knob!.

Chavez trying to destabilize South America.....right :roll:

Kinda makes one want to puke :x

i dont think the states could pull off an invasion there-- too and big complex
and theyve got enough to chew on right now
i think chavez is safe for now

go for it hugo!!
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
Re: RE: I am beginning to lik

I think not said:
darkbeaver said:
I love Hugo Chavez, he's a real person.

Of course he is, especially when he changes the constitution to ensure he remains in power. A true socialist, remove power from the people and place it where it belongs, the government.

Modesty prevents me from countering with a constitutional tampering story of my own about a superpower we both know.
 

I think not

Hall of Fame Member
Apr 12, 2005
10,506
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The Evil Empire
Re: RE: I am beginning to lik

darkbeaver said:
I think not said:
darkbeaver said:
I love Hugo Chavez, he's a real person.

Of course he is, especially when he changes the constitution to ensure he remains in power. A true socialist, remove power from the people and place it where it belongs, the government.

Modesty prevents me from countering with a constitutional tampering story of my own about a superpower we both know.

You couldn't make a cohesive intelligent argument about the US constitution if you tried, but give it a shot, I'm all ears.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
RE: I am beginning to lik

I said a story, not a cohesive intelligent argument, Chomsky has a nice story out now, it's called Failed States, Rougue States and America, it promises to be a good read. Goodevening my esteemed foreign cocontributor, I must get my beauty sleep.
 

Hank C

Electoral Member
Jan 4, 2006
953
0
16
Calgary, AB
Re: RE: I am beginning to lik

darkbeaver said:
I love Hugo Chavez, he's a real person.

......... :lol:

Hugo Chavez has rewrote the constitution to give him more power, and now he controls legislature, the supreme court, two armys, oh yea and he controls the institutions that stage elections.

Chavez has passed laws which give him the power to throw you in prison for disagreeing with his government officials. He also passed laws which allows his government to screen the content of the news media. To make things worse he uses Venezuela's oil to fund leaders from other South American nation who agree with him (as long as they hate America).

In addition to his passing of these undemocratic & fascist laws, humans rights groups such as Amnesty International and others have documented many humans rights violations, such as torture. And he has passed laws allowing for government censorship......if you were to speak against one of Chavez's cronies, he could jail you under his new revision of the criminal code.

Funny how you hold the US, Bush or Americans up to every single candle with doubt but you willfully ignore actions taken by Hugo Chavez because he is a left wing extremist who hates the US, much like yourself.
 

aeon

Council Member
Jan 17, 2006
1,348
0
36
Re: RE: I am beginning to lik

I think not said:
darkbeaver said:
I love Hugo Chavez, he's a real person.

Of course he is, especially when he changes the constitution to ensure he remains in power. A true socialist, remove power from the people and place it where it belongs, the government.


Come on your governement is tearing apart your consitution, patriot act is a good exemple, the wire tapping is another one, actually your governement act like they are dictators , chavez look like gandhi to compare with your governement, they have incredible control on the media,

Noam Chomsky said:
Any dictator would admire the uniformity and obedience of the U.S. media

After all this administration did, still we dont see massive protest in the street to make your governement impeach, not even close to it.

Only in dicatators country you see like in iraq under saddam hussein, where their son would have become leaders if there was no invasion, just like in america, where we have seeen 2 bush as president.
 

aeon

Council Member
Jan 17, 2006
1,348
0
36
Re: RE: I am beginning to lik

darkbeaver said:
I love Hugo Chavez, he's a real person.

I love chavez too, but he still has done pretty nasty things when he was in the military, well not even close to what the bush familiy has done though.
 

I think not

Hall of Fame Member
Apr 12, 2005
10,506
33
48
The Evil Empire
Re: RE: I am beginning to lik

aeon said:
Come on your governement is tearing apart your consitution, patriot act is a good exemple, the wire tapping is another one, actually your governement act like they are dictators , chavez look like gandhi to compare with your governement, they have incredible control on the media,

Provisions of the Patriot Act have been struck down as being unconstitutional. And the ACLU has filed a suit with the Supreme court regarding wiretapping. Can anyone do that in Venezuela?
 

diaeagle

Diaeagle
Apr 6, 2006
158
0
16
I think not
but ithink the democratic doesnt found only in the usa but make sure chavez love his folks and he never harm them..... but american mustnt be conceit and they stop hating all of one who resist its policy...... but chavez still hugo 8O
 

I think not

Hall of Fame Member
Apr 12, 2005
10,506
33
48
The Evil Empire
diaeagle said:
I think not
but ithink the democratic doesnt found only in the usa but make sure chavez love his folks and he never harm them..... but american mustnt be conceit and they stop hating all of one who resist its policy...... but chavez still hugo 8O

Chavez has done plenty for the poor, I respect any leader who does this for his country. But, changing the constitution around to ensure he remains in power, leaves very little for me to appreciate his motives.
 

sanch

Electoral Member
Apr 8, 2005
647
0
16
Gaddafi tried to do the same thing in Africa. It’s almost the identical strategy. While the message is populist and there are some good programs in the end nothing will change. This is because for Chávez to become a regional force he has to work through the existing class structure in the Latin American countries he is courting. This in essence exacerbates socio-economic inequalities in countries like Argentina where Chávez paid off the IMF debt.

Chávez has a very simple strategy. Spend money throughout the continent to increase his visibility and popularity. Intensify the anti-American rhetoric and this will rally people as well as divert attention from the way he is using old class structures to cultivate a new political presence. The structure of inequality can accommodate many different varieties of chameleons and puppeteers.
 

sanch

Electoral Member
Apr 8, 2005
647
0
16
I think not said:
diaeagle said:
I think not
but ithink the democratic doesnt found only in the usa but make sure chavez love his folks and he never harm them..... but american mustnt be conceit and they stop hating all of one who resist its policy...... but chavez still hugo 8O

Chavez has done plenty for the poor, I respect any leader who does this for his country. But, changing the constitution around to ensure he remains in power, leaves very little for me to appreciate his motives.

Poverty in Venezuela is still in the 30 to 50% range which is very high considering the country's wealth. Polls are showing that people in Venezuela are becoming a little weary of the spending spree.

This is from last weeks NYT which requires a subscription. Article is by Juan Forero

While the president enjoys the support of a majority of Venezuelans, polls by Greenberg Quinlan Rosner Research, a Washington polling company that has worked for Venezuela's opposition movement, show that fewer than 30 percent of Venezuelans believe the country should spend its oil revenue abroad.
 

sanch

Electoral Member
Apr 8, 2005
647
0
16
A more interesting political model is Delegate Zero's (formerly Comandante Zero) of the Zapatistas in Chiapas. Of course this gets little attention as he focuses on indigenous rights and development which is boring to people who have to be fed a daily dose of anti-American pablum.