No UN Support from US

I think not

Hall of Fame Member
Apr 12, 2005
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The Evil Empire
U.N. Resolution on Human Rights Council Does Not Deserve U.S. Support

Last week, U.N. General Assembly President Jan Eliasson released of the text of a resolution establishing a new Human Rights Council to replace the discredited U.N. Commission on Human Rights. U.S. Ambassador to the UN John Bolton is right that the resolution, supported by U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan and much of the U.N. establishment, is a major disappointment. Any proposal that maintains the existing Commission’s relativism on human rights, including allowing despotic regimes to serve as members, does not deserve U.S. support.

A Continuing Embarrassment
The United Nations’ record on promoting basic human rights has come under well deserved criticism in recent years. Members of the Commission on Human Rights (CHR), the U.N.’s primary human rights body, include some of the world’s worst human rights violators, such as China, Cuba, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Venezuela, and Zimbabwe. Even Secretary-General Kofi Annan has acknowledged, “The commission’s declining credibility has cast a shadow on the reputation of the United Nations system.”

The embarrassment of an ineffective CHR led the United States and other countries to call for the abolition of the Commission and its replacement with a new Human Rights Council. Over months of negotiation, these efforts to create a credible human rights body have been strongly opposed by human rights abusers in the U.N. Such states have sought to perpetuate their hold on the CHR in order to block scrutiny of their policies.

The resolution’s text demonstrates that the abusers have succeeded in thwarting the goal of democratic societies to build an international human rights institution worthy of a leadership role in the 21st century.

U.S. support for this proposal is especially unwarranted because approving the new Council will erroneously suggest fundamental change.

Coming Up Short
Among the many disappointing aspects of the Feb. 23 resolution:

There are no criteria for membership on the Council. The proposal merely suggests a state’s human rights record be “taken into account” “when electing members.” Even states under Security Council sanction would not automatically be excluded. While there is a provision for suspending a Council member that commits gross and systematic violations of human rights, that step can be taken only with the agreement of two-thirds of the members of the General Assembly. Not even 50 percent of the General Assembly could agree that Sudan was guilty of human rights violations in November 2005.

All member states are eligible for Council membership. While there is a periodic review requirement, there is no guarantee that even those countries found complicit in massive and sustained human rights abuses would be censured. The review is not tied to a mandatory outcome and takes place only after the elections.

Instead of a much smaller body designed to attract the best citizens of each regional group, the proposal would make only a minimal reduction in membership, from 53 members to 47.

The proposal significantly shifts the balance of power away from the Western regional group. The African and Asian groups will hold 55 percent of the votes. The proportional representation of the Asian group will see the greatest increase, and the Western group, the greatest decline.

States that are elected must rotate off every two terms. The United States, which had been a member of the Commission every term since 1947, with one exception, and has played a leadership role in efforts to promote human rights throughout its history, as well as contributing 22 percent of its costs, would be ineligible for Council membership every six years.

Special sessions of the Commission can be called by only one-third of the Council’s membership. Hailed as an improved capacity to deal with urgent human rights situations, the composition of the new Council will make it more likely that special sessions will be about the United States and Israel than about China or Sudan.

The Council is given a mandate to follow up on goals and commitments “emanating from U.N. conferences and summits,” many of which have been specifically rejected by the United States.

A last-minute addition in response to the Organization of the Islamic Conference and the Danish cartoons affair places an emphasis on roles and responsibilities rather than explicitly endorsing freedom of speech.
More of the Same and Something Different

The Eliasson proposal will not create a credible U.N. human rights body. On the contrary, it will give rise to a new agency just as likely to operate against the interests of the United States and fellow democracies as the prior Commission. The difficulties in negotiating a credible international human rights body in an institution which gives serial human rights abusers a veto over the result are a systemic U.N. problem. But that does not justify democracies capitulating to the pressure to make newness an end in itself.

The United States is right to resist the clamor to approve this proposal without a complete overhaul. It is far better to say no than to grant unwarranted credibility to an institution that unlikely to improve upon the disgraced Commission.

The time is right for the United Stated to pursue a two-track strategy on human rights. Disengaging from the U.N.’s human rights apparatus, not matter how flawed it is, would weaken U.S. influence. But it may be that the U.N. is unable to hold its members accountable for their human rights abuses. For that reason, the U.S. should establish an independent human rights body outside of the U.N., drawing in other nations that are dedicated to promoting basic human rights and freedoms. This new institution could promote basic human rights when the U.N. falls short and hold the U.N.’s human rights body to account. As the Eliasson proposal proves, the U.N. is too heavily influenced by the human rights abusers to serve as the sole authority on human rights.
 

zoofer

Council Member
Dec 31, 2005
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Same old rot.
The West should abandon the UN and start over.
Exclude non democracies. Let them organize their own axis's of evils.
:twisted:
 

Finder

House Member
Dec 18, 2005
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Toronto
www.mytimenow.net
zoofer said:
Same old rot.
The West should abandon the UN and start over.
Exclude non democracies. Let them organize their own axis's of evils.
:twisted:

thats a good way to make conflic zoofer... lets all build alliances along how we view the world. hmmmmm... It worked during the 19th centry... didn't. I mean all those alliances ended up not costing a single soul. riiiight... I mean as we went into the 19th centry this type of stregity worked out? riiiight!!! god I hope it did.


Well lets see, lets go with two conflics which came from these alliances. Let's see the first alliances between two different factions of the world..... ah yes ww1

First World War (1914-18): 15 000 000 [make link]

* This is the only major bloodletting which has pretty much the same body count no matter which source I check: 8,500,000 military deaths. It all goes back to a report issued by the U.S. War Dept. in Feb. 1924, amended by the Statistical Services Center, Office of the Secretary of Defense on 7 Nov. 1957, which everyone ("everyone" = Brzezinski, Britannica, Norman Davies, Encarta, Gilbert, Hammond, Small & Singer, Wallechinsky) more or less agrees with. Among my major sources, only Eckhardt and Urlanis diverge from the mainstream. In The Defeat of Imperial Germany 1917-1918, Rod Paschall cites a study by Arthur Banks. I've also consulted John Ellis & Michael Cox, The World War I Databook ("E&C"):
o Austria-Hungary: 1,100,000 (Urlanis); 1,200,000 (everyone, Paschall); 2,300,000 (Eckhardt)
+ E&C cite two different tables in the Austrian Official History, giving total killed as either 1,016,200 k. or 539,630 k. Neither includes 478,000 who died as POWs.
o Belgium: 13,716 (Britannica, Compton's, Daivies, Hammond, Tucker); 38,000 (Urlanis); 87,500 (S&S -- although it seems to me that they have confused "Belg." with "Bulg."; see 2 lines down.); 88,000 (Eckhardt)
o Britain & Empire: 908,371 (everyone); 997,000 (Paschall)
+ Africans: 38,723 laborers and porters died in hospital in East Africa 1917-18 (E&C)
+ Australia: 53,560 KIA + 6,300 other deaths = 59,860 (E&C); 60,000 (Eckhardt; Urlanis); 61,720 (AWM)
+ Canada: 55,000 (Eckhardt); 61,000 (Urlanis); 58,990 KIA + 3,830 other deaths = 62,820 (E&C)
+ India: 25,000 (Eckhardt); 54,000 (Urlanis)
+ New Zealand: 16,000 (Eckhardt; Urlanis); 16,710 (E&C)
+ UK: 702,410 (E&C); 715,000 (Urlanis); 1,000,000 (Eckhardt)
+ South Africa: 7,000 (Urlanis); 7,120 (E&C: whites only)
o Bulgaria: 14,000 (S&S-c.f. Belgium); 28,000 (Eckhardt); 75,844 (Tucker); 87,500 (Britannica, Davies, Compton's); 88,000 (Urlanis); 90,000 (Hammond); 95,000 (Paschall); 77,450 KIA + >24,500 other deaths = 101,950 (E&C)
o France & Empire: 1,327,000 (Urlanis); 1,357,800 (everyone); 1,385,300 (E&C); 1,390,000 (Paschall); 1,630,000 (Eckhardt)
+ French Colonies: 58,000 (E&C); 114,000 (Urlanis)
o Germany: 1,773,700 (everyone); 1,850,000 (Paschall); 2,037,000 (E&C, Urlanis); 2,400,000 (Eckhardt)
+ Africans: 14,000 (E&C)
o Greece: 5,000 (everyone; Eckhardt, E&C); 26,000 (Urlanis)
o Italy: 460,000 (Paschall); 462,391 (Tucker); 462,400 (E&C); 578,000 (Urlanis); 600,000 (Hammond); 650,000 (Britannica, Davies, Compton's, S&S); 950,000 (Eckhardt)
o Japan: 300 (everyone)
o Montenegro: 3,000 (everyone)
o Portugal: 7,000 (Urlanis); 7,220 (E&C, incl. 5,550 in Africa); 7,222 (everyone); 13,000 (Eckhardt)
o Romania: 219,800 (E&C: incl. 70,500 who died as POWs); 250,000 (Urlanis); 340,000 (Paschall); 335,706 (everyone); 375,000 (Eckhardt)
o Russia: 1,700,000 (everyone, Paschall); 1,800,000 (E&C); 1,811,000 (Urlanis); 2,950,000 (Eckhardt)
o Serbia: 45,000 (Tucker, Hammond, Britannica, Compton's), 48,000 (S&S), 70,000 (Davies); 127,500 (E&C: incl. sickness); 128,000 (Eckhardt: "Yugoslavia"); 278,000 (Urlanis: "Serbia + Montenegro")
o Turkey: 236,000 (E&C); 325,000 (everyone); 350,000 (Paschall); 450,000 (Eckhardt); 804,000 (Urlanis)
o USA: 50,585 (Tucker, Hammond, Britannica); 51,822 (E&C); 53,407 (Compton's); 116,000 (Paschall); 53,402 KIA + 63,114 other deaths = 116,516 (DoD; 1991 Info. Please); 126,000 (S&S; Eckhardt)
o TOTAL: 8,364,712 (E&C); 8,500,000 (everyone); 8,513,000 (Paschall); 9,442,000 (Urlanis); 12,599,000 (Eckhardt)

Hmmm because of further destabilization of Russia and the Empire, Russia was dragged into a civil war.

# Russian Civil War (1917-22): 9 000 000 [make link]

* Eckhardt: 500,000 civ. + 300,000 mil. = 800,000
* Readers Companion to Military History, Cowley and Parker, eds. (1996) [http://college.hmco.com/history/readerscomp/mil/html/mh_045400_russiancivil.htm]:
o Combat deaths: 825,000
o Ancillary deaths: 2,000,000
o TOTAL: 2,825,000
* Davies, Norman (Europe A History, 1998)
o Civil War and Volga Famine (1918-22): 3,000,000 to 5,000,000
* Brzezinski, Z:
o 6 to 8 million people died under Lenin from war, famine etc.
* Mastering Twentieth Century Russian History by Norman Lowe (2002)
o TOTAL: 7,000,000 to 10,000,000
o Red Army
+ Battle: 632,000
+ Disease: 581,000
o Whites: 1,290,000 battle + disease
o White Terror: "tens of thousands"
o Red Terror
+ Executed: 50-200,000
+ Died in prison or killed in revolts: 400,000
o Typhoid + typhus
+ 1919: 890,000
+ 1920: >1M
* Urlanis:
o Military deaths: 800,000
+ Battle deaths, all sides: 300,000
+ Dead of wounds: 50,000
+ Disease: 450,000
o Civilians: 8,000,000
o TOTAL: 8,800,000
* Dyadkin, I.G. (cited in Adler, N., Victims of Soviet Terror, 1993)
o 9 million unnatural deaths from terror, famine and disease, 1918-23
* Richard Pipes, A concise history of the Russian Revolution (1995): 9 million deaths, 1917-1922
o Famine: 5M
o Combat: 2M
+ Reds: 1M
+ Whites: 127,000
o Epidemics: 2M
o not incl.
+ Emigration: 2M
+ Birth deficit: 14M
* Rummel:
o Civil War (1917-22)
+ War: 1,410,000 (includes 500,000 civilian)
+ Famine: 5,000,000 (50% democidal)
+ Other democide: 784,000
+ Epidemics: 2,300,000
+ Total: 9,494,000
o Lenin's Regime (1917-24)
+ Rummel blames Lenin for a lifetime total of 4,017,000 democides.
* Figes, Orlando (A People's Tragedy: A History of the Russian Revolution, 1997)
o 10 million deaths from war, terror, famine and disease.
+ Including...
# Famine (1921-22): 5 million
# Killed in fighting, both military and civilian: 1M
# Jews killed in pogroms: 150,000
+ Not including...
# Demographic effects of a hugely reduced birth-rate: 10M
# Emmigration: 2M
* McEvedy, Colin (Atlas of World Population History, 1978)
o War deaths: 2M
o Other excess deaths: 14M
o Reduced births: 10M
o Emmigration: 2M
* MEDIAN: Of these ten estimates that claim to be complete, the median is 8.8M-9.0M.
* PARTIALS:
o Small & Singer (battle deaths, 1917-21)
+ Russian Civil War (Dec.1917-Oct.1920)
# Russians: 500,000
# Allied Intervention:
* Japan: 1,500
* UK: 350
* USA: 275
* France: 50
* Finland: 50
+ Russian Nationalities War (Dec.1917-Mar.1921)
# USSR: 50,000
o Bruce Lincoln, Red Victory: a History of the Russian Civil War 1918-1921
+ Death sentences by the Cheka: ca. 100,000
+ Pogroms: as many as one in 13 Jews k. out of 1.5M in Ukraine [i.e. ca. 115,000] (citing Heifetz)
o Nevins, citing Heifetz and the Red Cross: 120,000 Jews killed in 1919 pogroms [http://www.west.net/~jazz/felshtin/redcross.html]
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997): Cheka responsible for maybe 250,000+ violent deaths.
o Paul Johnson
+ 50,000 death sentences imposed by the Cheka by 12/20
+ 100,000 Jews killed in 1919
o Green, Barbara (in Rosenbaum, Is the Holocaust Unique?)
+ 4 to 5 million deaths in the famine of 1921-23
o Max Boot, The Savage Wars of Peace
+ North Russia: 244 USAns d. incl. 144 k.battle
+ Siberia: 160 USAns KIA + 168 other d.
+ [US Total: 304 KIA + 268 other = 572 d.]
+ Czech Legion: 13,000 dead.

Which would ultimately lead to a victor, that being Stalin. Now we will never be too sure how many Stalin killed. Figurers go from the conservative 20,000 to the wow I killed all of Russia yet there's still ppl here 60million (I think thats a little nutty personally. but it was alot anyhow.

# Soviet Union, Stalin's regime (1924-53): 20 000 000 [make link]

* There are basically two schools of thought when it comes to the number who died at Stalin's hands. There's the "Why doesn't anyone realize that communism is the absolutely worst thing ever to hit the human race, without exception, even worse than both world wars, the slave trade and bubonic plague all put together?" school, and there's the "Come on, stop exaggerating. The truth is horrifying enough without you pulling numbers out of thin air" school. The two schools are generally associated with the right and left wings of the political spectrum, and they often accuse each other of being blinded by prejudice, stubbornly refusing to admit the truth, and maybe even having a hidden agenda. Also, both sides claim that recent access to former Soviet archives has proven that their side is right.
* Here are a few illustrative estimates from the Big Numbers school:
o Adler, N., Victims of Soviet Terror, 1993 cites these:
+ Chistyakovoy, V. (Neva, no.10): 20 million killed during the 1930s.
+ Dyadkin, I.G. (Demograficheskaya statistika neyestestvennoy smertnosti v SSSR 1918-1956 ): 56 to 62 million "unnatural deaths" for the USSR overall, with 34 to 49 million under Stalin.
+ Gold, John.: 50-60 million.
o Davies, Norman (Europe A History, 1998): c. 50 million killed 1924-53, excluding WW2 war losses. This would divide (more or less) into 33M pre-war and 17M after 1939.
o Rummel, 1990: 61,911,000 democides in the USSR 1917-87, of which 51,755,000 occurred during the Stalin years. This divides up into:
+ 1923-29: 2,200,000 (plus 1M non-democidal famine deaths)
+ 1929-39: 15,785,000 (plus 2M non-democidal famine)
+ 1939-45: 18,157,000
+ 1946-54: 15,613,000 (plus 333,000 non-democidal famine)
+ TOTAL: 51,755,000 democides and 3,333,000 non-demo. famine
o William Cockerham, Health and Social Change in Russia and Eastern Europe: 50M+
o Wallechinsky: 13M (1930-32) + 7M (1934-38)
+ Cited by Wallechinsky:
# Medvedev, Roy (Let History Judge): 40 million.
# Solzhenitsyn, Aleksandr: 60 million.
o MEDIAN: 51 million for the entire Stalin Era; 20M during the 1930s.
* And from the Lower Numbers school:
o Nove, Alec ("Victims of Stalinism: How Many?" in J. Arch Getty (ed.) Stalinist Terror: New Perspectives, 1993): 9,500,000 "surplus deaths" during the 1930s.
o Cited in Nove:
+ Maksudov, S. (Poteri naseleniya SSSR, 1989): 9.8 million abnormal deaths between 1926 and 1937.
+ Tsaplin, V.V. ("Statistika zherty naseleniya v 30e gody" 1989): 6,600,000 deaths (hunger, camps and prisons) between the 1926 and 1937 censuses.
+ Dugin, A. ("Stalinizm: legendy i fakty" 1989): 642,980 counterrevolutionaries shot 1921-53.
+ Muskovsky Novosti (4 March 1990): 786,098 state prisoners shot, 1931-53.
o Gordon, A. (What Happened in That Time?, 1989, cited in Adler, N., Victims of Soviet Terror, 1993): 8-9 million during the 1930s.
o Ponton, G. (The Soviet Era, 1994): cites an 1990 article by Milne, et al., that excess deaths 1926-39 were likely 3.5 million and at most 8 million.
o MEDIAN: 8.5 Million during the 1930s.
* As you can see, there's no easy compromise between the two schools. The Big Numbers are so high that picking the midpoint between the two schools would still give us a Big Number. It may appear to be a rather pointless argument -- whether it's fifteen or fifty million, it's still a huge number of killings -- but keep in mind that the population of the Soviet Union was 164 million in 1937, so the upper estimates accuse Stalin of killing nearly 1 out of every 3 of his people, an extremely Polpotian level of savagery. The lower numbers, on the other hand, leave Stalin with plenty of people still alive to fight off the German invasion.
* [Letter]
* Although it's too early to be taking sides with absolute certainty, a consensus seems to be forming around a death toll of 20 million. This would adequately account for all documented nastiness without straining credulity:
o In The Great Terror (1969), Robert Conquest suggested that the overall death toll was 20 million at minimum -- and very likely 50% higher, or 30 million. This would divide roughly as follows: 7M in 1930-36; 3M in 1937-38; 10M in 1939-53. By the time he wrote The Great Terror: A Re-assessment (1992), Conquest was much more confident that 20 million was the likeliest death toll.
o Britannica, "Stalinism": 20M died in camps, of famine, executions, etc., citing Medvedev
o Brzezinski: 20-25 million, dividing roughly as follows: 7M destroying the peasantry; 12M in labor camps; 1M excuted during and after WW2.
o Daniel Chirot:
+ "Lowest credible" estimate: 20M
+ "Highest": 40M
+ Citing:
# Conquest: 20M
# Antonov-Ovseyenko: 30M
# Medvedev: 40M
o Courtois, Stephane, Black Book of Communism (Le Livre Noir du Communism): 20M for the whole history of Soviet Union, 1917-91.
+ Essay by Nicolas Werth: 15M
+ [Ironic observation: The Black Book of Communism seems to vote for Hitler as the answer to the question of who's worse, Hitler (25M) or Stalin (20M).]
o John Heidenrich, How to Prevent Genocide: A Guide for Policymakers, Scholars, and the Concerned Citizen (2001): 20M, incl.
+ Kulaks: 7M
+ Gulag: 12M
+ Purge: 1.2M (minus 50,000 survivors)
o Adam Hochschild, The Unquiet Ghost: Russians Remember Stalin: directly responsible for 20 million deaths.
o Tina Rosenberg, The Haunted Land: Facing Europes Ghosts After Communism (1995): upwards of 25M
o Time Magazine (13 April 1998): 15-20 million.
* AVERAGE: Of the 17 estimates of the total number of victims of Stalin, the median is 30 million.
* Individual Gulags etc.
o Kolyma
o Kuropaty
o Vorkuta
o Bykivnia
* Famine, 1926-38
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997): 4.2M in Ukraine + 1.7M in Kazakhstan
o Green, Barbara ("Stalinist Terror and the Question of Genocide: the Great Famine" in Rosenbaum, Is the Holocaust Unique?) cites these sources for the number who died in the famine:
+ Nove: 3.1-3.2M in Ukraine, 1933
+ Maksudov: 4.4M in Ukraine, 1927-38
+ Mace: 5-7M in Ukraine
+ Osokin: 3.35M in USSR, 1933
+ Wheatcraft: 4-5M in USSR, 1932-33
+ Conquest:
# Total, USSR, 1926-37: 11M
# 1932-33: 7M
# Ukraine: 5M

Which leads us to the final kill down from those alliances... You can make the direct link from the 18th centry to the end of ww2, you could push it but I'll stop it here since this one makes the most sence and the creation of the UN came from it.

# Second World War (1937-45): 55 000 000 [make link]

* Total:
o It's the most intensively studied event of the 20th Century, so the margin of error is not quite a wide here as for most of the other wars and oppressions on this page. Most historians agree that the death toll was about 50 million (including wartime atrocities). If you don't believe me, here's just a sampling of the books I have on hand:
+ Haywood: Atlas of World History (1997): 50M
+ Keegan, J., The Second World War (1989): 50M
+ Messenger, The Chronological Atlas of World War Two (1989): 50M
+ The Times Concise Atlas of World History (1988): 50M
+ J.M. Roberts, Twentieth Century (1999): >50M
+ Urlanis: 50M
# Soldiers: 22.0M
# Civilians
* In camps, from Fascist terror: 12.0M
* From hostilites, blockade, epidemics, hunger: 14.5M
* From bombing: 1.5M
+ Dictionary of Military History (1994): 41M
+ Wallechinsky: 40-55M
+ Kinder, The Anchor Atlas of World History (1978): 55M
+ Hammond: 55M
+ Guiness World Records: 56.4M [http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/index.asp?id=46252]
+ Sivard, Ruth Leger, World Military and Social Expenditures 1986 (11th ed.): 38,351,000 (1939-45), not incl. 1.8M in Sino-Japanese War (1937-41)
+ Brzezinski:
# Military: 19M
# Civilians, "actual byproduct of hostilities": 20M
# Civilians, Sino-Japanese War: 15M
# Hitler's murders: 17M
# TOTAL: 71M
+ Rummel:
# European War Dead (1939-45): 28,736,000
# Sino-Japanese War Dead (1937-45): 7,140,000
# War-related Democides
* Hitler: 20,946,000
* Stalin: 13,053,000
* Japanese: 5,964,000
* Chinese Nationalist: 5,907,000
* Allied Bombing: 796,000
* Croatian: 655,000
* Tito: 600,000
* Romanian domestic democide: 484,000
* Chinese Communist: 250,000
* Hungarian democide in Yugoslavia: 78,000
* [TOTAL: 48,733,000]
# [TOTAL (1937-45): 84,609,000]
+ AVERAGE
# The MEDIAN of these estimates is 50M.
# If we add up the country-by-country medians (of total death tolls) we get:
* LEVEL 1: 47.35M
o USSR: 20.0M
o China: 10.45M
o Poland: 5.8M
o Germany: 5.5M
o India: 2.15M
o Japan: 1.9M
o Yugoslavia: 1.55M
* LEVEL 2: ca. 3.8M
* LEVEL 3: ca. 0.25M
* TOTAL: 51.4M
# The country-by-country medians for military personnel killed in the war are:
* USSR: 10.0M
* Germany: 3.5M
* China: 2.05M
* Japan: 1.5M
* USA: 0.4M
* Romania: 0.3M
* Yugoslavia: 0.3M
* UK: 0.28M
* Italy: 0.23M
* France: 0.21M
* Hungary: 0.14M
* Poland: 0.125M
* TOTAL: 19.0M
* Who to Blame:
o Most history books break their WW2 numbers down according to whether the dead are military or civilian and which country they came from. Since I've done that elsewhere, let's try to break it down by guilt. Here are various estimates by various experts of the number of superfluous, non-military deaths during the Second World War.

1. Hitler [make link]:
* Extermination of the Jews:
o Reitlinger, Gerald, The Final Solution (1953): between 4,194,200 and 4,851,200 (this number is accepted by Kinder, The Anchor Atlas of World History (1978))
o Brzezinski: 5,000,000
o Chirot: 5,100,000
+ 3,000,000 in death camps.
+ 1,300,000 massacred.
+ 800,000 by dis./maln. in ghettos
o Rummel: 5,291,000
o Grenville: 5-6M
o Davies, Europe A History (1998): avg. c. 5,571,300 (puts the minimum at 4,871,000 and the maximum at 6,271,500.)
o MEDIAN: ca. 5.6M
o Nuremberg indictment: 5,700,000 (accepted by Britannica)
o Gutman, Encyclopedia of the Holocaust (1990): 5,596,029 to 5,860,129
o P. Johnson: 5,800,000
o Wallechinsky: "nearly" 6,000,000
o Urlanis: 6M
* Country-by-country
* Individual Camps, Massacres etc.
o Auschwitz
o Babi Yar
o Belzec
o Chelmno
o Majdanek
o Mauthausen
o Odessa
o Sobibor
o Treblinka
* Soviet Prisoners of War killed:
o Urlanis: 3,912,000
o 12 March 1995 Times-Picayune: nearly 3.5M
o Our Times: 3,300,000
o Rummel: 3,100,000
o MEDIAN: 3.0-3.1M
o Mazower, Dark Continent: 3M
o Harper Collins Atlas of the Second World War: 3,000,000
o Shirer, The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich (1960): 2,000,000 dead and 1,000,000 never accounted for, presumed dead.
o Britannica: 2,600,000
* Roma (Gypsies):
o Hammond: 250,000.
o Rummel: 258,000.
o Mazower, Dark Continent: 200,000-500,000.
o Porter: 500,000
o Brzezinski: 800,000
o Ian Hancock, "Responses to the Romani Holocaust" in Is the Holocaust Unique? (A. Rosenbaum, ed.) cites these:
+ US Holocaust Memorial Museum: 250,000
+ "several published estimates": >1,000,000
+ Pauwels and Bergier: 750,000
+ Financial Times (London): 500-750,000 in death camps and another million shot outside.
* Homosexuals:
o Chirot: 10-15,000
o Rummel: 220,000
* Euthanasia of Handicapped:
o Hugh G. Gallagher: 275,000, citing Breggin (in Century of Genocide, Samuel Totten, ed., (1997))
o Johnson: 70,000 insane and incurable Germans k.
o US Holocaust Memorial Museum, Historical Atlas of the Holocaust: 70,000 k.in initial phase, 1939-41. 275,000 total k, acc. to Nuremburg Tribunal.
* Air Raids
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997): "an estimated 500,000 Soviet citizens died from German bomb attacks."
o Belgrade
o London
o Stalingrad
* Victims of Wehrmacht:
o Acc2 historical exhibit curated by Hannes Heer: The common soldiers of the Wehrmacht murdered 1.5M Jews, 3.3M POWs + 5-7M non-Jewish civilians (17 May 1995 Agence France Presse; 22 Feb. 1997 AP)
* [Let's make a rough calcultion of the number of Soviet civilians who were victims of excessive German brutality. In the Italian Campaign, for example, where the rules of civilized warfare were generally obeyed, there were some 90T civilians and 125T soldiers killed. The same ratio applied to the ca. 11M soldiers killed in battle in Russia would indicate that some 7.9M Russian civilians would have died if the laws of war had been kept in place, instead of the ca. 17M that did die. The difference of 9 million dead civilians is the cost of the added brutality.]
* General political prisoners:
o Mark Mazower, Dark Continent: Europe's Twentieth Century (1998): over one million died in concentration camps, not counting those deliberately targeted for extermination.
o Rosenburg, The Haunted Land: 26,000 political death sentences passed by German courts.
* HITLER TOTAL:
o Courtois: 25,000,000
o Rummel: 20,946,000 democides
o Brzezinski: 17,000,000
o Urlanis: 15-16,000,000 (11-12M civilians + 3.9M POWs)
o MEDIAN: ca. 15.5M
o Our Times: 13,000,000 (6M Jews + 7M others)
o Compton's: 12,000,000
o Grenville: 10,000,000, including 2M children.
o NOTE: These numbers only include outright murders, but keep in mind that some 28M civilians and 14M soldiers died in the European War. That's 42,000,000 deaths which can probably be blamed on Hitler to one extent or another.
2. Japanese [make link]:
* China and Korea
o Nanking Massacre, 13 Dec. 1937-Feb. 38:
+ Spence, The Search for Modern China: 42,000
+ Gilbert: >200,000 civilians and 90,000 POWs
+ Dict.Wars: 200,000
+ Rummel: 200,000
+ P. Johnson: 200-300,000
+ 27 Aug 2001 Newsweek, quoting Japanese textbook: "The number of dead is said to be over 100,000 and it is estimated to be over 300,000 in China."
+ Palmowski, Dictionary of 20th Century World History: "perhaps as many as" 400,000
+ Iris Chang, The Rape of Nanking (1997) cites these:
# Liu Fang-chu: 430,000
# James Yin & Shi Young: 400,000
# Sun Zhaiwei: 377,400 corpses disposed of
# Wu Tien-wei: 340,000
# District Court of Nanking: 300,000
# International Military Tribunal of the Far East: 260,000
# Fujiwara Akira: 200,000
# John Rabe: 50,000-60,000
# Hata Ikuhiko: 38,000-42,000
+ [Median: 260,000]
o Unit 731, Manchukuo (bio-warfare center: 1937-45)
+ Discovery Channel: "as many as 200,000 people — Chinese soldiers, private citizens and prisoners of war — had died" [http://dsc.discovery.com/anthology/spotlight/bioterror/history/history2.html]
+ Global Security: Up to 3,000 died in this facility. Perhaps as many 200,000 Chinese died from germ war campaign in Yunnan Province, Ningbo, and Changde. [http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/japan/bw.htm]
o Bombing: 71,105 Chinese k. by Japanese bombing (Clodfelter)
* South East Asia and East Indies
o Bataan Death March, 1942
o Burma-Siam Railroad, worker deaths (1941-43)
+ Johnson: 16,000 POWs
+ Our Times, also Gilbert: 50,000 Burmese civilians and 16,000 Allied POWs
+ Grenville: 100,000 Asians and 16,000 Europeans
+ 7 February 2002 AP: 50,000 Asian laborers and 16,000 Allied POWs
o Manila Massacre, 1944-45
o East Timor
+ James Dunn, in Century of Genocide, Samuel Totten, ed., (1997)): 70,000 died under Japanese occupation
+ 19 May 2002 San Gabriel Valley Tribune: "January 1942: Japan occupies the entire island. With support from the local people, Australian commandos in East Timor battle Japan. Japanese reprisals kill 60,000 civilians 13 percent of East Timor's population."
o Dutch East Indies: 25,000 Dutch d. out of 140,000 imprisoned (3 Feb. 1998 Agence France Presse)
o Singapore, citizens (mostly Chinese) massacred, 1942
+ Japan Economic Newswire/Kyodo News Service
# 16 June 2004: 50,000-100,000
# 13 Aug. 1984: Report by Allies after WW2 est. 5,000 k. Families claim 40,000-50,000
+ Associated Press
# 30 July 1995: "The Japanese military said 6,000 were killed. Singaporeans put the death toll at 50,000."
# 12 Sept 1995: 30,000-40,000
+ National Archives of Singapore: 8,600 reported. "[T]here were many more." [http://www.s1942.org.sg/dir_defence7.htm]
+ Grenville: 5,000
+ LC: 5,000-25,000 [http://lcweb2.loc.gov/frd/cs/sgtoc.html]
+ [ANALYSIS: There's no consensus. I have 5 low estimates ranging from 5,000-8,600. I have 5 high estimates ranging from 25,000-100,000. Three sources hedge their bets by offering both a low estimate and a high estimate. Two give a low estimate exclusively, and two give a high estimate exclusively.]
* Rummel blames the Japanese for 5,964,000 democides
o POWs: 539,000 (400,000 Chinese)
o Forced Labor: 1,010,000 (142,000 Chinese)
o Massacres: 3,608,000 (2,850,000 Chinese)
o Bombing/CB warfare: 558,000 (all Chinese)
o Imposed Famine: 250,000 (none in China)
o Rummel also estimates that General/Prime Minister Tojo Hideki was responsible for a lifetime total of 3,990,000 democides.
* Some guy on Internet [http://www.jca.apc.org/JWRC/exhibit/Index.HTM]
o Nanjing Massacre: 155,337 dead bodies
+ Chinese official estimate: >300,000
+ Japanese scholars:100-200,000
o Datong Coal Mine, China: 60,000 slave laborers killed
o Forced labor camps in Japan: 6,830 imported workers died
o Singapore: 5,000 Chinese k -- another estimate: 50,000-60,000 k.
o Burma-Siam RR: 12,400 POWs + 42,000 Asian wkrs
* My estimate is that 11M civilians and 4.5M soldiers died in the Asian/Pacific War. That's 15,500,000 deaths which can probably be blamed on the Japanese to one extent or another.
3. Stalin [make link]:
* Deported nationalities:
o Aleksandr Nekrich, The Punished Peoples (1978): Net population losses, 1939-59, after allowance for wartime losses.
+ Chechens: 590,000
+ Kalmyks: 142,000
+ Ingush: 128,000
+ Karachai: 124,000
+ Balkars: 64,000
+ [TOTAL: 1,048,000]
o Kenneth Christie, Historical Injustice and Democratic Transition in Eastern Asia and Northern Europe: Ghosts at the Table of Democracy (2002)
+ Lithuanian, Latvian and Estonians (1940-41): 85,000 deported, of which 55,000 killed or died
+ Baltics executed during reconquest (1944-45): 30,000
+ Postwar partisan war
# Lithuanians: 40-50,000 k.
# Latvian: 25,000
# Estonians: 15,000
+ [TOTAL: 170,000 ± 5,000]
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997)
+ citing Rummel: 530,000 Chechens and other Black Sea/Caucasus minorities d.
+ citing NKVD archives: 231,000 deaths, 1943-49
o Harff and Gurr:
+ Chechens, Ingushi, Karachai, Balkars, Kalmyks: 230,000 d. (1943-57)
+ Meskhierians, Crimean Tatars: 57,000 - 175,000 d. (1944-68)
o Davies: 1,000,000 Volga Germans, Chechens, Ingush, Crimean Tatars, etc.
o NewsHour: some 200,000 Chechens died during the exile [http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/europe/chechnya/history.html]
* Enemy POWs never returned:
o Brzezinski: 1,000,000 total d. (incl. 357,000 Germans, 140,000 Poles)
o Davies: 1,000,000 d.
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997): official figures released under glasnost
+ Germans: 2,388,000 POWs taken, of which 356,000 died
+ Hungarians, Romanians, etc.: 1,097,000 taken, of which 162,000 died
+ Japanese: 600,000 taken, of which 61,855 died
+ [Total: 4,085,000 taken, of which ca. 580,000 died]
o Katyn Massacre (April-May 1940):
+ Dictionary of 20C World History: 14,000 Polish officers systematically killed. 4,500 bodies discovered by Germans.
+ 30 July 2000 Sunday Telegraph [London]: 15,000 k.
+ Paul Johnson: 15,000 -- a third at Katyn, the rest in Sov. conc. camps.
+ Gilbert: 15,000 Polish POWs sent to 3 camps - Starobelsk, Kozelsk, Ostashkov - all killed. 4,400 from Kozelsk killed at Katyn.
* Returning Soviet POWs killed after the war:
o Harff and Gurr: 500,000 - 1,100,000 repatriated Soviet nationals killed (1943-47)
o Harper Collins: 1,000,000 POWs
o Davies: 5-6M deaths, screening of repatriates and inhabitants of ex-occupied territory
* Soviet soldiers executed:
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997)
+ "latest Russian estimates put the figure as high as 158,000 sentenced to be shot."
+ "442,000 were forced to serve in penal batallions." [These were assigned suicidally dangerous tasks, and the only way out was death or wounds, so figure maybe half dead, half crippled.]
* Gulag during the war years:
o Richard Overy, Russia's War (1997): 2.4M sent to Gulag; 1.9M freed. "Official figures show 621,000 deaths in the Gulag" during WW2
* Total killed by Stalin during the war years:
o Davies: 16-17,000,000 non-war-dead
o Rummel: 18,157,000 democides
o NOTE: Numbers this high are hard to reconcile with the common estimates of 7 million Soviet civilian deaths during WW2. Even if we go with larger, more recent estimates of 17M civilian deaths, these number proposed by Rummel and Davies would leave no room for murders at German hands and deaths as a simple by-product of war.
o My Very Rough Estimate (based largely, but not entirely, on Overy, who seems well-informed and sensible.) In tenths of millions.
+ Axis POWs: 0.6M
+ Soviet Soldiers during war: 0.4M
+ Gulag: 0.6M
+ Black Sea/Caucasus Minorities: 0.2M
+ Baltic Minorities: 0.2M
+ Repatriated Soviets after the war: 1.0M
+ Germans who died fleeing the advancing Red Army: 1.0M
+ TOTAL: 4.0M
4. Anglo-American Allies [make link]:
* Bombing of Germany: >305,000 (1945 US Strategic Bombing Survey); 400,000 (Hammond); 410,000 (Rummel, 100% democidal); 499,750 (Clodfelter); 593,000 (Keegan; also Grenville citing "official Germany"); 600,000 (P. Johnson)
* Bombing of Japan:
o Conventional: 260,000 (Clodfelter (citing an Official US est.); Keegan; P. Johnson); 299,484 (Clodfelter, citing Japanese source)
o Nuclear: 103,000 died outright (Keegan); 130,000 outright (Messenger);120,000 outright, 140,000 later (Our Times); 175,000 outright, 100,000 later (P. Johnson)
o Total: 330,000 (1945 US Strategic Bombing Survey); 363,000 (Keegan, not including post-war radiation sickness); 374,000 (Rummel, incl. 337,000 democidal); 435,000 (P. Johnson); 500,000 (Harper Collins Atlas of the Second World War)
* Bombing of Romania & Hungary: 50,000 (Rummel)
* Individual air raids
o Berlin
o Dresden
o Hamburg
o Hiroshima
o Nagasaki
o Tokyo
o Yokahama: 5,000 (1945 US Strategic Bombing Survey)
* Mistreatment of Axis POWs [I myself don't find these accusations credible, but FWIW, here they are.]
o James Bacque, Other Losses (1989) made the first accusation that Americans deliberately starved German POWs, killing about a million.
+ Bacque [http://www.corax.org/revisionism/misc/970920bacques.html]
o Bacque's 2nd book, Crimes & Mercies, expands the body count to 9.3-13.7M Germans killed by the Allies after the end of the war, incl. some 2.1-6.0M civilians who died being expelled from the East. [http://codoh.com/review/revcrimes.html]
o Stephen Ambrose dismisses these claims as sloppy research. He explains that the total number of German POWs who died from all causes in US hands was 56,000 out of some 5M held. [see also http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi?people/b/bacque.james/] (56,000 might seem like a lot, but this would include those who were captured wounded.)
o The 1956 Maschke Commission counted 4,537 deaths. [see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rheinwiesenlager or http://www.cyberussr.com/hcunn/for/us-germany-pow.html]
o [Letter]
5. Mussolini (r. 1922-1943)
* Mark Mazower, Dark Continent: Europe's Twentieth Century (1998): total of 29 death sentences passed on political prisoners before 1939.
* Rummel, democides by Fascist govt. of Italy:
o Ethiopia and Libya: 200,000 [before WW2]
o Yugoslavia: 15,000
o Greeks: 9,000
o Italians, domestically: 250
o TOTAL: 224,250
6. Yugoslavia:
* 2 March 1999 Agence France Presse
o Number killed in Croatian-run death camp at Jasenovac
+ Acc2 Croatian press: 85,000
+ Official Yugoslav estimate: 700,000
+ Simon Wiesenthal Centre: 500,000
* Alex Dragnic, Serbs & Croats (1992)
o k. by Ustase
+ Serbs: est. range 300,000 to 1,000,000, but 500-700,000 is "generally accepted"
+ Jews: 50,000
+ Gypsies: 20,000
o Massacre by Germans, Oct. 1941: 4-7,000
* John Lampe, Yugoslavia as History (1995)
o 300,000 Serbs k. by Ustasha
o 26,000 Jews k. by Ustasha
o 9,000 Slovenes executed by Italians, summer 1941
o Killed by Tito, 1945-46: 100,000
* Noel Malcolm, Bosnia: a Short History (1994)
o Muslims k. by Chetniks in Foca-Cajnice:
+ Aug. 1942: 2,000
+ Feb. 1943: 9,000
o Killed by Tito, 1945-46: 250,000 in shootings, camps and marches.
* Mazower, Dark Continent
o Serbs k. by Ustase: at least 334,000.
o Collaborators k. by Tito, postwar: up to 60,000
* 9 July 1990 NY Times
o Communist partisans shot 70-100,000 without trial within weeks of the war's end.
o Anti-Communist emigres claim ca. 500,000 killed ("... exaggerations, said Darko Bekic, a historian in Zagreb...")
o "Total of 1,700,000 Yugoslavs were killed, both in combat and in atrocities and reprisals by and against civilians"
* Rummel, democides by perpetrator:
o Axis occupying nations: 718,000
o Chetnik partisans: 100,000
o Communists: 100,000 as partisans, 500,000 shortly after coming to power
o Ustashi government of Croatia: 655,000
o TOTAL: 2,073,000 democides (also 555,000 battle deaths, for a grand total of 2,628,000)
* Fred Singleton, Twentieth-Century Yugoslavia (1976)
o 350,000 Serbs k. by Ustasha
* Marcus Tanner, Croatia: a Nation Forged in War
o Bleiburg massacre: est. range from 30,000 to 200,000 returning POWs k. by Communists (The upper number being favored by Croat nationalists)
o Ustashe camps
+ acc2 Communist govt: 600,000 k. in Jasenovas
+ acc2 Banac 120,000 k. in all camps
+ acc2 "others": 80,000 k. in all camps
+ acc2 Pres. Tudjman: 60,000 k. in all camps
o Total war deaths (according to one study)
+ Serbs: 487,000
# incl. 215,000 in Nazi and Ustase camps
+ Croats: 207,000
+ Muslims: 86,000
+ Jews: 60,000
+ TOTAL: 947,000
* Johan Wüscht, Population Losses in Yugoslavia during World War Two (1963), estimates a total population shortfall of 2,210,000 in the 1948 census. After accounting for emmigration (700,000) and a drop in births (423,000), he reckons the total number of deaths caused by the war and its aftermath to be 1,100,000. He also points out that adding up all the accusations of atrocities commited during the war far exceeds this calculated number of deaths, so one of them is wrong.
* ANALYSIS: Among those events with several estimates, the medians are ...
o Serbs k. by Ustashe: 275,000
o Postwar executions by Communists (and related deaths): 175,000
o Jasenovac
7. Romania:
* Rummel: 484,000 democides under kings Carol & Michael (1938-48) incl. 302,000 Jews.
* Robert Kaplan, Balkan Ghosts (1993): 185,000 Jews from Bessarabia and Moldovia murdered in "the only non-German-run extermination camp in Europe".
8. France:
* Collaborators killed after liberation:
o Grenville: 10,000
o Mark Mazower, Dark Continent: 9-10,000
o Our Times: 9,000 summarily, 700 after trial.
o David Drake, Intellectuals and Politics in Post-War France: 10,000 summary executions and 791 legal executions.
9. Other Western Nations, postwar purges:
* Mark Mazower, Dark Continent
o Italy: 10,000-15,000
o Netherlands: 40 executions
o Norway: 25 executions

# Post-War Expulsion of Germans from East Europe (1945-47): 2 100 000 [make link]

* Died being expelled from Poland:
o Rummel: 1,585,000
o Keegan, John, The Second World War (1989): 1,250,000
o Kurt Glaser and Stephan Possony, Victims of Politics (1979): 1,225,000
* Died, from Czechoslovakia:
o Rummel: 197,000
o Martin Sorge, The Other Price of Hitler's War (1986): 241,000 Sudeten Germans
o Keegan: 250,000
o Glaser & Possony: 267,000
* TOTAL:
o Kinder, Anchor Atlas of World History: 3,000,000
o Britannica: 2,384,000 (This covers the years 1944-46, and it includes Germans who died fleeing while the war was still raging.)
o Glaser & Possony: 2,111,000 (This includes 619,000 from "elsewhere" not listed above)
o Keegan: 2,100,000 (This includes 600,000 from "elsewhere" not listed above; it does not include some 1,000,000 Germans who (by Keegan's estimate) died fleeing while the war was still raging.)
o Rummel: 1,782,000


So..... yeah this looks like a great system to try again. I guess we havn't killed enough people in the second half of the centry for you.
 

Mogz

Council Member
Jan 26, 2006
1,254
1
38
Edmonton
Congratulations Finder, you have made me scroll the most out of anyone on these forums :) I also would like to point out for everyone else that I agree with your post.

This thread reminds me I owe ITN and Jersay a retort in another thread regarding the U.N.....however I forget which once....now i've gotta go spelunking :(
 

aeon

Council Member
Jan 17, 2006
1,348
0
36
I think not said:
Jersay said:
The U.N should get rid of America.

The UN doesn't have the time, the energy or the will, they only care about how much money they will pocket when a crisis comes up.


UN=United states-UK-China-Russia-France
 

cortez

Council Member
Feb 22, 2006
1,260
0
36
I think not said:
Jersay said:
The U.N should get rid of America.

The UN doesn't have the time, the energy or the will, they only care about how much money they will pocket when a crisis comes up.

The UN still has some uses not the least of which is to show how the US make fools of themselves -- and discredit themselves even futher-- oops bashing agian

but i guess UN bashing is oK--

go on ask me what i mean by that!
 

zoofer

Council Member
Dec 31, 2005
1,274
2
38
Thank God for Ambassador Bolton.
He may yet save that rats nest from itself


Reform or re-form?
By John Dodd
Mar 24, 2006

Ambassador John Bolton made headlines around the world when he presented the Jesse Helms Lecture at Wingate University late last fall. In his speech, he opened the public discussion on the possibility that the United States might be forced to withdraw from the United Nations unless persistent problems are resolved.

The Ambassador quickly went on to say that such a move would be an absolute last resort and that withholding US funds as a means of promoting progress in reform was a tool at our immediate disposal. Within days of his speech, the Ambassador demonstrated the sincerity of his call for change by announcing that the United States would withhold UN budget approval unless definitive plans for reform were put into action. The reaction was immediate and predictable. There was wailing and the predictable insistence that Ambassador Bolton’s proposal would lead to chaos and disaster.

In the past, this gloomy rhetoric would have achieved its goal -- the United States would settle for the insistence that progress was being made and reform cannot be done on a deadline.

This time, the only compromise Ambassador Bolton agreed to was an interim budget a few months longer than the one he had initially proposed. The UN is now operating under the first provisional budget in its history and the sky has not fallen. Bench marks for measured change are at last being put in place so reform will be reality. UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan and his staff have a fresh incentive to accelerate change or figure out how to manage on a fraction of their funding now that they have seen the United States stand by its statements.

In February, taking advantage of the United States’ turn to chair the UN Security Council, Ambassador Bolton once again demonstrated that the United States is serious about cleaning up scandalous humanitarian operations. This time the topic is Peace Keeping. In his Helms lecture, the Ambassador shocked the audience with information on reported abuse by UN forces of the very civilians they were sent to protect, and critical of flaws in the management of peace keeping operations. As president of the Security Council, Ambassador Bolton made public a 15-nation audit that revealed “waste, fraud and abuse in peacekeeping procurement” as well as documented “sexual abuse and exploitation” in peacekeeping operations.

The Ambassador and all the other members of the Security Council agreed that these problems are serious and need reform. That is good. They disagreed, though, on how reform might be initiated. This in fact, reveals the single biggest problem at the United Nations, the one that must be acknowledged and resolved if the United States can have any confidence in the value of their investment in the organization.

A group of UN members known as the G-77 have united not to protest the abuses or mis-management, or even the fraud exposed in recent UN investigations, but to protest the fact that the US brought these issues to the Security Council to seek action. The G-77 is distressed that their General Assembly prerogative to handle management and budget issues was infringed on by the Security Council. How dare the Security Council be concerned about that body’s disinterest and inaction? How dare the United States, which contributes no less than 27% of the funds used for the UN’s peacekeeping force and its missions, seek swift remedial action to clean up the undisputable mess?

Their misplaced outrage is emblematic of the failed philosophy that has demanded more and more of the United States in the form of support but has cared less and less about the kind of behavior that Americans find abhorrent.

Emboldened by their collective ability to make noise, these member states are at the center of the latest and frankly most incomprehensible idea coming out of the General Assembly. That body has voted to elect by secret ballot 47 members of a new human rights council whose vague mandate will be to do a better job than the old human rights commission. How this can be possible when any member nation is eligible for a seat on this new council is a mystery. No matter how egregious its own record, any nation that manages to collect secret ballots can put itself in the position of protector.

Over the vigorous objection of the US, the General Assembly has chosen to dismantle rather than reform the existing Human Rights Commission by strengthening its membership rules and its mandate for action. Rather than do the hard work of reform they have scrapped the existing framework to make a bigger, more cumbersome system with no safeguards to prevent rouge nations from simply voting themselves a clean record.

The Assembly should be ashamed and the Secretary General should be challenged on his willingness to go along with this international version of putting the fox in charge of the hen house. No wonder the US, in spite of the abusive and untrue charges leveled against our government, voted against this foolish idea.

Fortunately for the United States, and to be frank, fortunately for the United Nations, Ambassador Bolton is not apt to be silenced by this momentary setback or by the complaints of those who seem to have no interest in ending systemic mismanagement and misbehavior. Secretary of State Rice and the President wisely sent Ambassador Bolton to the United Nations to be a change agent. He is there to see that the promises made as a part of agreements that brought about the historic Helms-Biden Act are truly kept. To the chagrin of his critics, he is doing important work on many fronts, but when it comes to pursuing true reform his work is exceptional. In the case of the Human Rights Council, the members of the General Assembly can be certain that the United States will watch every proceeding to see if the promises made to the Assembly are actually put into practice.

As much as some critics wish it were not true, there is a place -- and an important one -- for an organization of nations that are intent on fostering peace and building cooperation between countries. There is a place for an organization that can work across borders to halt the spread of disease or provide relief for the victims of national disasters. We need an organization just like the one the United Nations was intended to be at its inception. Ambassador Bolton’s leadership in moving forward the reform process that Senator Helms demanded and put in motion must not be weakened. His success on our behalf will help maintain and strengthen all that is of value at the United Nations while ridding the organization of the policies that will otherwise destroy it.
John Dodd is President of The Jesse Helms Center.
http://www.townhall.com/opinion/columns/JohnDodd/2006/03/24/191104.html
 

Kreskin

Doctor of Thinkology
Feb 23, 2006
21,155
149
63
Bolton should insist that the next time a country invades another under the auspices of said country not adhering to the UN resolutions they actually adhered to, the invading country should bring the issue to a vote and not just present a ficticious smokescreen to council.