definition of religion

triken

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What is your definition of religion and belief?
What does religion provide us with? and what does belief provide us with? Why does it have to be a discussion of "both/and" rather than "either/or",...like why are the two necessary in faith development rather than one or the other?
 

SirJosephPorter

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I don’t know a definition of religion, but there are several features common to most religions. A Messiah, a Holy book, Commandments, Creed, promise of rewards for believers and threat of torture, damnation to nonbelievers.

By this criteria, it is not only Christianity, Islam, Buddhism etc, that are religions. Communism, Nazism fully qualify as religions, same Christianity or Islam.
 

Cliffy

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Nov 19, 2008
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I don’t know a definition of religion, but there are several features common to most religions. A Messiah, a Holy book, Commandments, Creed, promise of rewards for believers and threat of torture, damnation to nonbelievers.

By this criteria, it is not only Christianity, Islam, Buddhism etc, that are religions. Communism, Nazism fully qualify as religions, same Christianity or Islam.
Most politics is religion. Liberals, Conservatives, Green, NDP, Democrats, Republicans....
devotees cannot be differentiated from religious devotees. Hell, hockey fanatics can be considered religious.
 

china

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What is your definition of religion and belief?


Belief is corrupted ( why do we believe in anything ), because behind belief and idealistic morality lurks the `me', the self - the self which is constantly growing bigger, more powerful. We think that belief in God is religion. We consider that to believe is to be religious. If you do not believe, you will be regarded as an atheist and condemned by society. One society condemns those who do not believe in God, and another society condemns those who do. They are both the same.
So religion becomes a matter of belief, and belief acts as a limitation on the mind; and the mind then is never free. But it is only in freedom that you can find out what is true, what is God, not through any belief; because your belief projects what you think God ought to be, what you think ought to be true. If you believe God is love, God is good, God is this or that, your very belief prevents you from understanding what is God, what is true. But, you see, you want to forget yourself in a belief; you want to sacrifice yourself; you want to emulate another, to abandon this constant struggle that is going on within you and pursue virtue.
Your life is a constant struggle in which there is sorrow, suffering, ambition, transient pleasure, happiness that comes and goes, so the mind wants something enormous to cling to, something beyond itself with which it can become identified. That something the mind calls God, truth, and it identifies itself with it through belief, through conviction, through rationalization, through various forms of discipline and idealistic morality. But that vast something, which creates speculation, is still part of the `me', it is projected by the mind in its desire to escape from the turmoils of life.
We identify ourselves with a particular country - Canada , Poland ,China , India, Russia, America. You think of yourself as an American .
Why? Why do you identify yourself with America? Have you ever looked at it, gone behind the words that have captured your mind? Living in a city or a small town, leading a miserable life with your struggles and family quarrels, being dissatisfied, discontented, unhappy, you identify yourself with a country called America. This gives you a sense of vastness, of importance, a psychological satisfaction, so you say, "I am an American; and for this you are willing to kill, to die or be maimed.
In the same way, because you are very petty, in constant battle with yourself and others, because you are confused, miserable, uncertain, because you know there is death, you identify yourself with something beyond, something vast, significant, full of meaning, which you call God. This identification with what you call God, gives you a sense of enormous importance, and you feel happy. So the identifying of yourself with something vast is a self-expansive process; it is still the struggling of the `me', the self.
Religion as we generally know it, is a series of beliefs, dogmas, rituals, superstitions; it is the worship of idols, of charms and gurus, and we think all this will lead us to some ultimate goal. The ultimate goal is our own projection; it is what we want, what we think will make us happy, a guarantee of the deathless state. Caught in this desire for certainty, the mind creates a religion of dogmas, of priestcraft, of superstitions and idol worship; and there it stagnates. Is that religion? Is religion a matter of belief, a matter of accepting or having knowledge of other people's experiences and assertions? Is religion merely the practice of morality? You know, it is comparatively easy to be moral - to do this and not to do that. You can just imitate a moral system. But behind such morality lurks the aggressive self, growing, expanding, dominating. And is that religion?
You have to find out what truth is, because that is what really matters - not whether you are rich or poor, or whether you are happily married and have children, for all these things come to an end; and there is always death. So, without any form of belief, you must have the vigour, the self-reliance, the initiative to find out for yourself what truth is, what God is. Belief will not free your mind; belief only corrupts, binds, darkens. The mind can be free only through its own vigour and self-reliance.
Surely it is one of the functions of education to create individuals who are not bound by any form of belief, by any pattern of morality or respectability. It is the `me' that merely seeks to become moral, respectable. The truly religious individual is he who discovers, who directly experiences what God is, what truth is. That direct experiencing is never possible through any form of belief, through any ritual, through any following or worshipping of another. The truly religious mind is free of all gurus. Us as an individuals,we can discover the truth from moment to moment, and therefore we are capable of being free. Most people think that to be free from the material things of the world is the first step towards religion.Bull ,it is not. That is one of the easiest things to do. The first step is to be free to think fully, completely and independently, which means not being bound by any belief or crushed by circumstances, by environment, so that you are an integrated human being, capable, vigorous and self-reliant. Only then can your mind, being free, unbiased, unconditioned, find out what God is. Surely, that is the basic purpose of religion and for which any educational centre should exist: to help each individual who comes there to be free to discover reality. This means not following any system, not clinging to any belief or ritual, and not worshipping any guru. The individual has to awaken his intelligence, not through any form of discipline, resistance, compulsion, coercion, but through freedom. It is only through the intelligence born of freedom that the individual can discover that which is beyond the mind. That immensity - the unnameable, the limitless, that which is not measurable by words and in which there is the love that is not of the mind - must be directly experienced.
 
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Niflmir

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Dec 18, 2006
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'Like all the words'...it's how capable you are to go beyond them .

All in proportion to your conditioning .

Yes, well that is language and life for you. Feel free not to use language, if it suits you, I expect I won't understand you at all. Further, trying to escape one's conditioning is the best way to deceive one's self, though many people are conditioned to believe otherwise.
 

taxslave

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Nov 25, 2008
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Here is another question- What is the difference between belief and superstition? Most religious people believe in an after life in heaven. Some believe in reincarnation, where you may come back as a person or animal depending on how you lived your life. Which is superstition?
 

SirJosephPorter

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Nov 7, 2008
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Here is another question- What is the difference between belief and superstition? Most religious people believe in an after life in heaven. Some believe in reincarnation, where you may come back as a person or animal depending on how you lived your life. Which is superstition?

Taxslave, as far as I am concerned, there is no difference between superstition and religion, it is the same thing. It is all superstition.
 

Spade

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Nov 18, 2008
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Looking at the word RELIGIONS, I realized it is simply an anagram for LIER, GO SIN!
Hope this helps!
Brother Spade
PS
A lier is one in the prone position, as in "She is prone to sin!"
 

talloola

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Nov 14, 2006
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Religion in my view is no different than any large company advertising for your
business, and of course 'your money', and they dwell on the 'guilt' side of one's life, and
promise unrealistic rewards for you after you die, it is no better than the circus
taking your money and your character for their own profits, from some silly game
that you have no chance of winning.

Belief comes from the individual, and one doesn't necessarily have to be part of a
religion, but I'm sure the majority are connected to a church of some sort.
Whatever god, one believes in, has originated from some religion, so both are
intertwined, as, if there were no religions or churches, one wouldn't know what
they are suppose to believe in to begin with.
 

Spade

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Nov 18, 2008
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Religion in my view is no different than any large company advertising for your
business, and of course 'your money', and they dwell on the 'guilt' side of one's life, and
promise unrealistic rewards for you after you die, it is no better than the circus
taking your money and your character for their own profits, from some silly game
that you have no chance of winning.

Belief comes from the individual, and one doesn't necessarily have to be part of a
religion, but I'm sure the majority are connected to a church of some sort.

Yep, religion is like a large department store chain. Every employee starts out being an "assistant manager" with the promise of promotion if they are dutiful and compliant. Of course, not all employees are so rewarded - there's always the threat of being "fired." Hell fired I guess...
 

SirJosephPorter

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Religion in my view is no different than any large company advertising for your
business, and of course 'your money',


Right you are, talloola. Pope is not unlike CEO of a large corporation like IBM or Microsoft. I don’t know how the assets of Catholic Church compare with those of IBM or Microsoft, but basically Catholic Church is not any different from any big corporation (and prone to similar abuses and malpractices).